Open 853 - PYP X/Y S_S [game over!]

[Aristeia]

So youre not at all still interested in finding out the result of what you want to do?

is there anyone here who actually thinks this question is trying to sort me in good faith?

[Save The Dragons]

i mean...

kind of

it's a sassy way of putting it

[Aristeia]

that's an interesting mindset. that's why i think you're defensive.

^
scum HEM attacking Town!Prism in

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... er_sort=Go

[Save The Dragons]

are you voting HEM

[Aristeia]

there's very little actual thought in his tunnel on me actually

VOTE: HEM

[Aristeia]

i'm reviewing his ISO from panic room

[Aristeia]

it's just kind of gross the way you are characterizing my behavior.

like incredibly disgusting to me

this is a remark about the way you are playing and your accusation about my play so far this game.

I am not "name calling you"

I do not personally believe you as a person is "gross" or "disgusting" - I do not know you as a person.

I find your implication that "Town!Ari would be an asshole and force everyone to do her number experiment" to be gross and disgusting because it implies you think I'm some kind of asshole who is willing to hijack a game just to do something she wants - I am not really into that for a number of reasons.

If people don't want to do the thought experiment I am fine moving on and doing something else.

[Gamma Emerald]

what am I supposed to pursue

most people said no

they didn't say no, they said it was context-dependent
make them use an arbitrary context and give numbers based on that

[Gamma Emerald]

Thought 1: I would like Dwlee to take some stances on some people.

I was thinking this earlier, he had a scummy pop-in but I wanted to see if he would start scumhunting on his own if he was left alone

Not scumreading implosion anymore

dwlee goes by they/them

[Gamma Emerald]

Thought 1: I would like Dwlee to take some stances on some people.

I was thinking this earlier, he had a scummy pop-in but I wanted to see if he would start scumhunting on his own if he was left alone

Not scumreading implosion anymore

*They sorry I should be much better about this

[Gamma Emerald]

I like that Gamma is immediately trying to make sense of the game.

I like this read from HEM
so I probably won't be voting him rn

I do think his ari push is crossing a line tho

[implosion]

I like that Gamma is immediately trying to make sense of the game.

I like this read from HEM
so I probably won't be voting him rn

I do think his ari push is crossing a line tho

Why do you like it? I know I'd already townread you and iirc someone else had as well (though I might be thinking of hem)

[Gamma Emerald]

he has certain expectations of me so I think that's a sign he's actively measuring me against those

[Aristeia]

it's trivial for scum!him to replicate this to pocket you

[Aristeia]

if you look at the iso it's mostly just blind tunneling and his progression on me doesn't even make any sense

[implosion]

I do think hem potentially having a propensity to push people as scum by calling them defensive is relevant. It's not a be-all-end-all but it does recontextualize his push a bit.

[Aristeia]

he enjoys using aggression to shitpush and get townread because people tend to townread aggression

however his aggression on me lacks a thought process and is hideously bad faith in multiple areas.

[Aristeia]

Spoiler: Explanation of why HEM is scum and his progression on me makes very little sense and is full of lies and gross inaccuracies/lies

initial vote - no explanation on why the vibes are bad or how they are different from other people.



note the timestamps on this - I really doubt town!hem really thinks I can take everyone's answers and give him numerical analysis because

(a) most people didn't respond or joke responded so I don't even have a data set to analyze

(b) it's like 5 hours between these posts.

(c) I don't think it's reasonable for him to expect me to give him an actual answer here so expecting one is kind of bad faith setting me up to fail and so he can continue his push.



this post is about the large number discussion I am having with Ausuka - he thinks it's not worth discussing because it's not great for reads and he wants to move on which is a kind of signaling. I believe scum!him thinks the context of the discussion is pointless - but this shouldn't actually be how town!him thinks because if he thinks I'm scum - then it should be good that Ausuka/Harley are pushing me on this. Instead he doesn't want them to interrogate me on my thoughts for ??? reasons.



here he's digging back in - now it's good for the number discussion because he sees it as something to use to push me. He tries to consolidate based on a narrative that scum!me was doing "false setup spec" on page 1? There's no discussion of actual motivation - he just finds this a covenient thing to attack with because Ausuka has been pushing me for it - you can tell he doesn't actually believe it because he doesn't really explain how it makes sense for scum!me to pursue this.

Notice the slip here - the second sentence implies that it's "bad town strategy to choose high numbers". As in he's thought about whether it'd be good for town to pick high numbers, he's concluded it's bad and thus I am "scummy" for doing this "bad thing" - except he's picked a even larger number than me - which is why he tries to pick up the slip with the idea that 80085 is personally sentimental and he's fine doing things that are not good strategy.

This feels like something self-conscious scum would do rather than town. because if town concluded that picking bad numbers is actually bad strategy - they would just

not do it

.

Here he seems to think it is bad for town to pick large number so i'm bad for picking a large number but he also has to bend himself into a pretzel to attack me for picking the large number while excusing himself for picking an even larger number.




he voted me for vibes. him forgetting what he voted me for originally and instead hijacking ausuka's argument feels like he never really remembered what he voted for me for in the first place.

implying it was bullshit vote he decided to double down on because it happened to have momentum



this is just pure revisionist nonsense.

he did not vote me for my comment about large numbers - he voted me for vibes. he decided to change what he was pushing me for after he saw Ausuka pushing me for "large numbers" he never even mentioned the large numbers thing until AFTER Ausuka started pushing me for it. He had previously stated in 128 that he didn't think the number discussion about large numbers was even useful so he clearly did not CARE about large numbers. He's now changing his story as if he was pushing me for the large number theory to begin with.



this is the first "read" of someone other than me he's made.

it feels conveniently like scum trying to recruit an ally.

I would imagine he would've gotten reads of at least Ausuka for how she's pushing me about Large Numbers but instead he's basically said nothing about anyone's alignment other than tunneling me up to this point.

It does not feel like something organic




This is the part that really triggered me.

He is making the implication that I have not done enough to persuade people because I do not actually care about getting this information.

It's grossly bad faith because I have tried multiple times to convince people to give me three numbers - 45 57 58 76 80 115 121

I have tried to be nice about this. I do care.

For him to misrep me as "not caring" is a ridiculously bad faith interpretation of my efforts this game. It annoys me because either he hasn't read my posting or he doesn't care about my posting and he's just making up whatever fake narrative he thinks will make me look bad instead of actually examining if I actually care about this number guessing thought experiment.

I thought it would be fun to have everyone guess 3 numbers and see if we could get some info out of it because

(1) scum know what they picked(tmi) and they want to make their guesses look like town guesses
(2) town do not know what scum picked
(3) the information could be useful down the line, it might not be useful down the line, I don't really know but if there's some anomaly that pops up it could be cool to think about.

If nobody wants to do it I'm not going to hijack the thread and just rant about it for like 10 days? I can scumhunt fine without it so I was moving on but he comes back and claims its proof that I'm scum because ????




This is him trying to back away and pretending he was actually sorting in good faith/being nice.

Which is kind of ridiculous because as you can see above, roughly 90% of his posts are just shitpushing me with made up narratives and lies.

him claiming that I am "not motivated to solve the game" when I have double the number of posts of anyone else and I'm literally answering any questions sent to me and talking/engaging with multiple slots is ludicrious and a total lie.

also his line about wanting to "help me squeeze out answers" is complete bullshit - I challenge anyone to pick out a single post in his iso prior to this where he is "trying to help me"



this remark makes very little sense because he's trying to placate me and convince me not to come after him because he's refering to a game where we were T/T and we fought for a while - except

(1) he supposedly thinks im lockscum so why is he even worried about this?

(2) if he thinks i'm town where is the reconsideration/evaluation of my alignment? literally every post up to here is just shitpushing me for made up narratives in his head.



this feels like he's trying to de-escalate to prevent this 1v1 from going full nuclear -

but it doesn't actually make sense for town!him to de-escalate if he thinks I'm mafia

Like I'm right here for him to sort but instead of sorting he's trying to placate me and see if he can get me to back off



more fake narrative nonsense. like I'm literally right there for him to sort but instead of asking me about my thoughts or literally anything game relevant he decides he wants to just try different colors of shade and see what works.



literally nothing in HEM's iso makes me think he is trying to sort me in good faith. literally most of his posts are shit tunneling me and I don't even think any of his reasoning is actually believable - his progression on me is literally a lie.



blaming me for this 1v1 is kind of rich because his entire iso is a shit tunnel of me whereas I'm actually engaging with multiple people so it's just a gross misrep of how we got here.

TLDR:

HEM is a player who enjoys using aggression as scum to get townread and push mis-elims. I do not believe his push of me is in good faith, his progression is mostly made up and there are several glaring inconsistencies/outright lies. I have not felt like he is trying to sort me in good faith at any point during my conversation with him.

[Aristeia]

@HEM

if you want to tell me you do this kind of shit tunneling with outright lies as town then pls give me an example of a game where you do this as town and I will do my best to read it and compare it with your actions here.

[Roden]

Wow I hate almost everything that has been posted since I last checked this game

I don't understand why people were so averse to just giving three numbers that it required 6+ pages of arguments

[Roden]

VOTE: HEM

[Save The Dragons]

i didn't get a response to my response to doing the task so :shrug:

[Save The Dragons]

will look at the HEM case when i'm not distracted

[Malakittens]

I don’t get the number discussion I’m on the end of page 6

I do have a possible townread which is weird considering how wrong I was on her last game…?

[Datisi]

beep