Newbie 2096 | Nathan For You | Endgame

For Newbie Games, which have a set format and experienced moderators.
It is suggested, but not required, that you play your first game here.
Signups Here
Forum rules
User avatar
Cheapside
Cheapside
He
Townie
User avatar
User avatar
Cheapside
He
Townie
Townie
Posts: 28
Joined: May 28, 2022
Pronoun: He

Post Post #850 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 5:54 am

Post by Cheapside »

In post 842, whiskey delta wrote:Quick thoughts before work:

@Cheapside - can you explain your read on me more? Also, irt Somnus - my read on D1 was based on them showing what I thought were obvious signs of irritability. Imagine that you’re on you’re fourth or fifth (?) game and have never rolled Town before. Suddenly this time you did. Would you be happy or mad about that? It’s odd to me that we have the same substance for a read but opposite conclusions. Am I wrong or do you just know better?

Also, if you are familiar at all with MU then you know your posts complaining about the game state would probably earn you some SRs. IME players who are mad because others post a lot are typically scum. A busy thread is a hard one to hide and blend into.
Your posts are constructive, reasonably aggressive, and based on solid justification. Nothing jumps out as a reason to sr you. The only reason you're not higher up is because I do not get the sense that you'd readily give something away as scum, so I can't really put a solid tr. It was a short read because I don't have many thoughts on you.

On the fourth game, I'd be resigned - and with a 2:1 winrate, calm and collected. I don't think it's strange that we've come to different conclusions based on psychological considerations, as neither of us know that much about Somnus' thought processes.

Complaints about activity being dubious is definitely fair enough, but it's easy enough to hide if >50% of the day is two people. Until my vote on Vasex, I seem to have been basically invisible to most players. That's precisely the problem with flooding the thread. In any case, people seem to be more interested in my reads than the complaint/vote yesterday, surpisingly enough.
User avatar
Bellaphant
Bellaphant
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
Bellaphant
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 4956
Joined: February 5, 2015

Post Post #851 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 5:59 am

Post by Bellaphant »

Re: vasex, I voted as their read lis/ catch up didn't show progression, they stayed on as the responses to questions were poor. I could've been persuaded on another wagon mid the 600 post mark, but bbt seemed very against other wagons forming (the votes I could've considered were on at least one slot that hadnt been wagoned), and then vasex blew up the thread. Obviously there should've been a claim.

Like I said earlier, I'm not sure the vasex wagon is the best place for info because I think the slot needs reporting. That's when I went looking at the other big wagons and notices the cheap vote pattern.
User avatar
Bellaphant
Bellaphant
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
Bellaphant
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 4956
Joined: February 5, 2015

Post Post #852 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 5:59 am

Post by Bellaphant »

Whiskey is just town, that's nice.
User avatar
BlueBloodedToffee
BlueBloodedToffee
Survivor
User avatar
User avatar
BlueBloodedToffee
Survivor
Survivor
Posts: 22828
Joined: April 10, 2014
Location: Liverpool, UK

Post Post #853 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 6:02 am

Post by BlueBloodedToffee »

Can I be town now, Bella?
Meta this. Meta that. Meta Everything. Meta is not a good scum-hunting tool. PEOPLE CAN MANIPULATE THEIR META. Stop it. Stop. It. Now.
User avatar
Bellaphant
Bellaphant
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
Bellaphant
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 4956
Joined: February 5, 2015

Post Post #854 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 6:15 am

Post by Bellaphant »

Probably, but I've got my eye on you. I also like that your ego hasn't changed: here's some wifom, I wouldn't have nk'ed you as scum ;p
User avatar
BlueBloodedToffee
BlueBloodedToffee
Survivor
User avatar
User avatar
BlueBloodedToffee
Survivor
Survivor
Posts: 22828
Joined: April 10, 2014
Location: Liverpool, UK

Post Post #855 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 6:16 am

Post by BlueBloodedToffee »

Damn. Who would you have killed?
Meta this. Meta that. Meta Everything. Meta is not a good scum-hunting tool. PEOPLE CAN MANIPULATE THEIR META. Stop it. Stop. It. Now.
User avatar
BlueBloodedToffee
BlueBloodedToffee
Survivor
User avatar
User avatar
BlueBloodedToffee
Survivor
Survivor
Posts: 22828
Joined: April 10, 2014
Location: Liverpool, UK

Post Post #856 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 6:23 am

Post by BlueBloodedToffee »

Also, I'm pretty sure scum are here; Somnus, Cheap, Corwin.

Somnus/Cheap unlikely to be scum together? I don't see both of them planning to throw shade on me with the NK analysis. Cheap's heavy defence of his Somnus townread still makes very little sense to me. On the flip side, I felt like Somnus avoided me D1 and now is trying to pair me with anyone, just so long as he gets the wagon through on me.

Somnus has also provided very little throughout the game outside of Vasex obvtown duh, Rad scum (tunnel) BBT scum (tunnel).

The common factor though is Corwin, who could be scum with either, so I guess we just eliminate him and then go from there?
Meta this. Meta that. Meta Everything. Meta is not a good scum-hunting tool. PEOPLE CAN MANIPULATE THEIR META. Stop it. Stop. It. Now.
User avatar
Rad
Rad
he
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
Rad
he
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 1669
Joined: May 28, 2022
Pronoun: he

Post Post #857 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 6:47 am

Post by Rad »

I think corwin's a reasonable vote here

VOTE: Corwinoid

Comes in and places a vote on vasex based on a lie that no one actually cared about anymore. It's the second vote on vasex who doesn't really have any real elim steam, so pretty safe from suspicion and puts a town member just a little closer to a mislim. A good position to take as a scum wanting to elim a town.

In he has a "solid TR on Somnus and you" - you being Cheap. He appreciates the quality of Cheap's posts.

Note here that Cheap's vote on vasex is , 1 hour BEFORE Corwin's where he reads Cheap as Town.

In , after the flip, he's now got a Scum read on Cheap based on Cheap's vote, which as I noted, happened an hour before his previous Town read.

Let's also note that in Corwin says "I just want Vasex gone; I think he's been completely anti-town and disruptive and it's really hard to think we're just not better off without him--I might be tunneling, but it's genuinely making it harder to read everyone else." which is essentially the same reasoning as Cheap gave in his vote for Vasex.
User avatar
Bellaphant
Bellaphant
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
Bellaphant
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 4956
Joined: February 5, 2015

Post Post #858 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 7:04 am

Post by Bellaphant »

That's my pool too, bbt. I'd be happier doing cheap or corn
User avatar
BlueBloodedToffee
BlueBloodedToffee
Survivor
User avatar
User avatar
BlueBloodedToffee
Survivor
Survivor
Posts: 22828
Joined: April 10, 2014
Location: Liverpool, UK

Post Post #859 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 7:18 am

Post by BlueBloodedToffee »

VOTE: Corwin
Meta this. Meta that. Meta Everything. Meta is not a good scum-hunting tool. PEOPLE CAN MANIPULATE THEIR META. Stop it. Stop. It. Now.
User avatar
Corwinoid
Corwinoid
Goon
User avatar
User avatar
Corwinoid
Goon
Goon
Posts: 951
Joined: June 25, 2012
Location: Houston

Post Post #860 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 10:40 am

Post by Corwinoid »

In post 820, Bellaphant wrote:Corwind's read on sonmus flipped overnight but it does look like it's in reaction to the elim (rad said what scum would do), although they are suddenly worried about sonmus' bbt tunnel

@cor, when did the tunnel start to worry you? 731 was pretty late in the day and he was your biggest tr. Can you talk me through this a bit?
I just shouldn't post when I'm tired and starting to feel bad, I had Somnus and Spartan mixed up in my head last night.
User avatar
Bellaphant
Bellaphant
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
Bellaphant
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 4956
Joined: February 5, 2015

Post Post #861 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 10:42 am

Post by Bellaphant »

? Can you clarify with some more words?
User avatar
Corwinoid
Corwinoid
Goon
User avatar
User avatar
Corwinoid
Goon
Goon
Posts: 951
Joined: June 25, 2012
Location: Houston

Post Post #862 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 10:47 am

Post by Corwinoid »

In post 861, Bellaphant wrote:? Can you clarify with some more words?
I'm not sure what else you want me to say, I've been sleeping like trash the last three days and I spent this morning trying to make my insides my outsides, and I mixed up two players trying to post through it. Spartan starting jumping on BBT at like with a pretty omgus you put me at e-1 thing and then literally sat on that all day long. I just went with what was in my head instead of actually looking at my notes, and got Somnus and Spartan mixed up, so 797-813 just don't make sense.
User avatar
whiskey delta
whiskey delta
Goon
User avatar
User avatar
whiskey delta
Goon
Goon
Posts: 241
Joined: May 22, 2022

Post Post #863 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 12:56 pm

Post by whiskey delta »

In post 852, Bellaphant wrote:Whiskey is just town, that's nice.
Image

I'll get back to this later.
User avatar
Rad
Rad
he
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
Rad
he
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 1669
Joined: May 28, 2022
Pronoun: he

Post Post #864 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 5:25 pm

Post by Rad »

So I got a chance to look through Spartan's ISO. Here's my understanding:

Steady scum read on BBT, over time leaned scum on Bella
Started with scum read on me, but I feel like that disappeared over time, opposite of Bella
Believed potential of a BBT + Bella scum team (hinted at it and then spelled it out)
Ended with a belief of a potential Cheap + mq/Corwin, or Cheap + BBT scum team.
Probably had town reads on Vasex, Somnus, and Whiskey, leaned scum on everyone else

Let's look at the wagon on him:

E-1 wagon on Spartan contained (in order according to Spartan, not going to double check this):
- Whiskey (from left over RVS before Spartan replaced)
- Cheap
- Bella
- BBT (E-1, not announced)
(Compared to Vasex wagon, there's an overlap of Cheap, Bella, and BBT. Corwin hadn't yet replaced mq during Spartan wagon)

@Somnus @Whiskey what's your take aways on the Spartan wagon vs the Vasex wagon. Anything interesting to conclude here given the people on 2 town wagons?
User avatar
Nero Cain
Nero Cain
Survivor
User avatar
User avatar
Nero Cain
Survivor
Survivor
Posts: 44912
Joined: December 6, 2009

Post Post #865 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 5:36 pm

Post by Nero Cain »

Vote Count 2.02



Corwinoid (2):
Rad, BlueBloodedToffee
BlueBloodedToffee (1):
Somnus
Cheapside (1):
Bellaphant

Not Voting (3):
Corwinoid, Cheapside, whiskey delta

With 7 alive, it's 4 to eliminate.


Deadline for Day 2 is June 15


Deadline Timer:
(expired on 2022-06-16 14:15:00)
Last edited by humaneatingmonkey on Wed Jun 15, 2022 8:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Of all tyrannies,a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

edited c.s. lewis quote b/c limit
User avatar
Somnus
Somnus
Goon
User avatar
User avatar
Somnus
Goon
Goon
Posts: 763
Joined: January 3, 2022

Post Post #866 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 5:47 pm

Post by Somnus »

In post 864, Rad wrote:So I got a chance to look through Spartan's ISO. Here's my understanding:

Steady scum read on BBT, over time leaned scum on Bella
Started with scum read on me, but I feel like that disappeared over time, opposite of Bella
Believed potential of a BBT + Bella scum team (hinted at it and then spelled it out)
Ended with a belief of a potential Cheap + mq/Corwin, or Cheap + BBT scum team.
Probably had town reads on Vasex, Somnus, and Whiskey, leaned scum on everyone else

Let's look at the wagon on him:

E-1 wagon on Spartan contained (in order according to Spartan, not going to double check this):
- Whiskey (from left over RVS before Spartan replaced)
- Cheap
- Bella
- BBT (E-1, not announced)
(Compared to Vasex wagon, there's an overlap of Cheap, Bella, and BBT. Corwin hadn't yet replaced mq during Spartan wagon)

@Somnus @Whiskey what's your take aways on the Spartan wagon vs the Vasex wagon. Anything interesting to conclude here given the people on 2 town wagons?
This is good stuff, Rad. I’ll take a closer look at it much later today (Friday) and let you know my thoughts.
User avatar
whiskey delta
whiskey delta
Goon
User avatar
User avatar
whiskey delta
Goon
Goon
Posts: 241
Joined: May 22, 2022

Post Post #867 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 6:41 pm

Post by whiskey delta »

There is a lot to unpack in this game. I read back a bit all the way up this point, so I am going to bookmark for now. There's a lot to digest after that D1 end and I want to sleep on it. But I do like this direction of investigating the NK, however blurry that can become sometimes. It is one of the best leads we have at the moment. Spartan doesn't make sense as a PR hunt (no claim at E-1) so there was something within his scope that got him killed. There is a lot I want to respond to from D2 start but it is getting late so it will have to wait for later when I can give it the diligence it deserves - including your latest post @Rad
User avatar
BlueBloodedToffee
BlueBloodedToffee
Survivor
User avatar
User avatar
BlueBloodedToffee
Survivor
Survivor
Posts: 22828
Joined: April 10, 2014
Location: Liverpool, UK

Post Post #868 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 7:41 pm

Post by BlueBloodedToffee »

Whiskey, I'll save you some time.

Name me a more widely town read player than Spartan at end of D1, continuing on to name me a harder mislim than Spartan. I'll wait.
Meta this. Meta that. Meta Everything. Meta is not a good scum-hunting tool. PEOPLE CAN MANIPULATE THEIR META. Stop it. Stop. It. Now.
User avatar
BlueBloodedToffee
BlueBloodedToffee
Survivor
User avatar
User avatar
BlueBloodedToffee
Survivor
Survivor
Posts: 22828
Joined: April 10, 2014
Location: Liverpool, UK

Post Post #869 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 7:45 pm

Post by BlueBloodedToffee »

In post 866, Somnus wrote: This is good stuff, Rad. I’ll take a closer look at it much later today (Friday) and let you know my thoughts.
Good stuff? It was literally a narrative post saying what happened D1 haha.

Attempt to buddy/pocket Rad, noted.
Meta this. Meta that. Meta Everything. Meta is not a good scum-hunting tool. PEOPLE CAN MANIPULATE THEIR META. Stop it. Stop. It. Now.
User avatar
BlueBloodedToffee
BlueBloodedToffee
Survivor
User avatar
User avatar
BlueBloodedToffee
Survivor
Survivor
Posts: 22828
Joined: April 10, 2014
Location: Liverpool, UK

Post Post #870 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 7:53 pm

Post by BlueBloodedToffee »

Can someone show me some scum hunting from Corwin since he came into the game?

I feel like I don't really know where he stands and we're 35 pages into a game and midway through D2. Doesn't seem right.
Meta this. Meta that. Meta Everything. Meta is not a good scum-hunting tool. PEOPLE CAN MANIPULATE THEIR META. Stop it. Stop. It. Now.
User avatar
Bellaphant
Bellaphant
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
Bellaphant
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 4956
Joined: February 5, 2015

Post Post #871 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 8:03 pm

Post by Bellaphant »

VOTE: corwin

E-1
User avatar
Cheapside
Cheapside
He
Townie
User avatar
User avatar
Cheapside
He
Townie
Townie
Posts: 28
Joined: May 28, 2022
Pronoun: He

Post Post #872 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 10:12 pm

Post by Cheapside »

I'd like to at least see Corwin try to explain stuff. I am struggling to see what excuse could be given for the switch in and noted in rad's though.
User avatar
Cheapside
Cheapside
He
Townie
User avatar
User avatar
Cheapside
He
Townie
Townie
Posts: 28
Joined: May 28, 2022
Pronoun: He

Post Post #873 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 10:58 pm

Post by Cheapside »

In post 868, BlueBloodedToffee wrote:Whiskey, I'll save you some time.

Name me a more widely town read player than Spartan at end of D1, continuing on to name me a harder mislim than Spartan. I'll wait.
Spartan had a strong focus on you, as can be seen from a glance at his ISO.

Now, mafia are perfectly capable of framing someone, and the logic behind the nightkill is often pretty opaque until after the game, so the nk itself would be a weak reason to sr you, but... immediately posting a "nothing to see there, don't bother" as soon as Whisky declares intent to look into it? You see how this looks, right?
User avatar
BlueBloodedToffee
BlueBloodedToffee
Survivor
User avatar
User avatar
BlueBloodedToffee
Survivor
Survivor
Posts: 22828
Joined: April 10, 2014
Location: Liverpool, UK

Post Post #874 (ISO) » Thu Jun 09, 2022 11:03 pm

Post by BlueBloodedToffee »

I mean, I suspect you would come under just as much scrutiny as me tbf. I've already said the NK makes me look bad, I'm under no illusion.

The fact someone I am scum reading opened the day with that angle as well gives me even more reason to try and shut that down.

NKA, in general, is extremely unreliable. There are a number of reasons scum do things and a lot of it just falls into WIFOM territory.
Meta this. Meta that. Meta Everything. Meta is not a good scum-hunting tool. PEOPLE CAN MANIPULATE THEIR META. Stop it. Stop. It. Now.
Post Reply