LOST (Game Over)

[T-Bone]

@t bone, that's ...weird. I don't care about frog in this convo - I think he's town, the wagon on them is boring, I do care about ceph because bbt was defending him, to me. The ceph and bbt wagon both change a fair bit over a short time, which is what I was talking about. (also, I literally say frog/ceph?)

Toad and t bone are throwing shade at me for stuff that is demonstrably not happening, it's frustrating

It's a post you made about things that were happening while ignoring the context of them. I'm sorry you find that frustrating but that's a thing you said and a thing you in my opinion conveniently ignored.

[The toad]

Bella I don't know what you thought I was saying in our discussion but the intention was not to shade you at all, I was trying to read roden

[Dancing Puppets]

Bella I don't know what you thought I was saying in our discussion but the intention was not to shade you at all, I was trying to read roden

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... B%5D=35800

Not a strong read but I think Toad feels somewhat different here? Like I was pretty confident on Gamma!scum after I replaced out than Toad reps in and suddenly everyone is hard tr that slot.

[Bellaphant]

I thought the +scum thing was at me? If not, cool.

@ t bone , ignoring it is such a weird idea when the vc is right there. It wasn't relevant to the conversation.

[Dancing Puppets]

VOTE: Roden

Feeling alright about Roden as possible scum at the moment.

Looking back and their reads list feels quite weak - the town section is quite generic with the exception of maybe Gaston. They have three SRs, one of whom is Toad, who their case against seems pretty weak, with C&G being another, again a SR that doesn't say much given their posting restriction.

While I'm reluctant to go too heavily on associatives early on I think Roden/Galron is a possible team - Roden's defence of Galron when they came under pressure didn't do much for me and felt like the type of early defence a scum teammate could easily make for their buddy.

I’m mulling back and forth whether his noncommittal read on me is possible a way to position to potentially push us later or why scum!Roden wouldn’t just straight up try to pocket me. Like I would expect Roden to tr me here, irrespective his alignment because there hasn’t been a single game that he hasn’t.

That'd potentially make sense. It taps into another idea that's making me factor that's making me doubt Roden here - on the whole I feel like they have a lot of null/non-committal reads, yet their (in my opinion) fairly weak SR on Toad seems a lot more committed by comparison.

@Gamma what do you think? I think it’s slightly odd that Roden isn’t even tl us at all but it’s the post before that one that concerns me more.

[The toad]

I thought the +scum thing was at me? If not, cool.

@ t bone , ignoring it is such a weird idea when the vc is right there. It wasn't relevant to the conversation.

Yeah the +scum thing was to Roden, I felt like town could do it but it'd be a very convenient thing if Roden was scum, if that makes sense

[T-Bone]

You said Ceph was a counterwagon to BBT when clearly that wasn't happening. One wasn't in response to the other. If anything BBT and Ceph at different points were counterwagons to Frogster. That you read Frog as town doesn't really change things. It's plausible that Frog was simply in your Blindspot because of that read, but from an outsider looking in, if you are placing importance on the idea of counterwagons and then not applying them evenly it looks intentional to me.

[Dancing Puppets]

I feel like Dancing Puppets could potentially be scum on the basis of a lot of their recent posts. Feel like there's a lot of stuff about them not necessarily having particularly distinct reads/being willing to sheep despite the fact that they have been quite active anyway. For how much they've posted it feels like there's a real lack of content there.

Do you think scum just admits they're going to sheep at the beginning of the game?

Granted, I think both heads of the hydra are normally very headstrong about their reads. It's a bit weird to see them both want to take a back seat.

Like considering his later post, why would he consider this to be weird? His lack of a read on us he specifically attributes that to it being a large, so these two posts seem to be inconsistent with each other.

[T-Bone]

I quoted those posts because they felt weird to me and explained why. You can have been sincere and I can feel they were weird. Those aren't mutually exclusive things.

[Bellaphant]

Ok, I think maybe it's a semantic thing? My point was wagons were fluid and bbt is/was a bit weird a ceph. It's actually weirder that the frog wagon has been so unfluid?

[T-Bone]

Okay I get you.

[Dancing Puppets]

Subject: open 852: store bought potions (sold!)

wat is scum going for a quickelim here?

Who is this referring to?

~N

anything goes to E-1 this early, pretty safe to say that's scum dashing for an opportune quickelim. so im just gonna give away a free townread towards n_m here. also i like the strength of his push.

Gullo called me “caught scum” in that game I posted, so unless that is somehow town indicative for NM, it means nothing and I still think one or both of you could be scum here.

Why Roden is convinced it’s TvT is beyond me.

Also, if you think scum is pushing NM, then why are you still voting me?

~N

I think you're town because of how you're reacting. I think you would just be more tactical as scum here, brush off the scum read on you and probably employ some AtE.

NM is probably town just because of his early aggression. I know that it isn't necessarily a town tell for him, but his tunnel on you feels genuine. I think he's just wrong though.

Alternatively, it's possible that you two are SvS and it's just theatre, but I don't really see the point of it. Game state feels a bit too apathetic for that to be necessary imo.

And in another game with town!Roden, he was actively trying to sort me from the getgo. so it’s his lack of doing that which worries me.

[Dancing Puppets]

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... B%5D=35782

Here is the only game I’ve played with scum!Roden where he WK’d me.

[Rad]

@Pooky update when you can, ty <3

Bella => Town

[Taly]

you think im being pocketed? (johnny)

May not necessarily be a deliberate pocketing but it's not impossible - scum can fake being constructive when it's useful, or if they think town are perhaps going down the wrong path. My no1 issue with Johnny after a look through their ISO is their primary SR is someone they don't even seem to particularly strongly SR. Of course, you could argue scum would be more aware of this and would have backup reads ready if their main read fades away but in a game of this size it's probably more viable for scum, if they seem helpful, to slip through the cracks early on because there's so many players and it's easy to miss when one individual scum doesn't necessarily have any reads they've managed to make look genuine.

I'm also running low with scumreads so I share

Johnny's

problem tbh, anyone in

{Rad/Galron/Pooky//Dancing Puppets}

you disagree with being townbinned?

Spoiler:

1. Roles are not revealed upon kills, but alignment is. There may or may not be ways to uncover roles. Flavor is not revealed upon flip.

2. There are 5 mafia and 21 town.

3. This game is bastard because it contains something bastard. It is relatively minor, don't expect tons of bastard mechanics.
4. Mafia is not determined by flavor. That means roles were mostly selected at random to determine which roles would be mafia.
5. There are ways for dead players to interact with the game, so it's important to not spoil anything or talk about the game while it's ongoing with anyone.
6. There is at least 1 vanilla townie in this game. The vanilla townie role PM looks like this:
7. Daychat and multitasking are in effect.

[cursed GIF]

pedit

Spoiler:

taly's besties

gamma:

passive vibes, especially from that

"hello taly"

post. I get the impression their mentality towards mafia has changed from last year where we played several games as opposing alignments. I missed their thought on

Titus

head in the skim and inquire on that.

marcistar:

I don't feel much depth to their questions or the opinions they've given, IE, skimming the hydra I don't know their reads well. I also see a lack of townreads despite the volume of people they're talking to.

OTH, vibe with me bbs<3

-townreads
-energy level/WIM
-memes

galron:

Coming from someone who has hydra'd with

Galron

before, I see nothing in

Galron's

ISO that's atypical. Doesn't like to give info about townreads but I am curious about

Klick

. What townpings is the consistency with

Rad

-town and

Frogs

-scum. I feel good about doubling down on my initial T/T read of

Gal/Rad

but I'd like to hear more from them about other slots. (Does "null" equal no thoughts or net neutral?) But I don't think that's very productive approach in sorting him this early in a large playerlist.

Galron

,

Frogs

PoE was 1000 posts ago, do you think their progression matches that original post?

titus:

TI

TU

S

I

EXI

ST

<3

. i declare myself a

titus

whisperer, my read on her is law.

nancy:

isn't mercilessly beating down players with scrutiny, so +town

ALSO HI NANCY <3

dwlee:

drowned out by the playerlist as expected, me want them around when they feel good i feel confident in my ability to sort them with some tea and lemon cakes.

dunn:

Much more active than scumgames I've seen of them and is attentive to how people respond to their roles and mechanics, which was different from how they approached a scumgame like Slaughter Hour. I'm not worried with this slot off their posts thus far. I'll be honest, this isn't an in-depth read specifically because

Dunn

is more active off first glance and so my initial ping is town, me no want to vote, me move on. I think someone voted

Dunn

? If so, I'd like to hear why.

pooky

poopy:

my strategy is to just meme until the vibe is off. me have done ugly TvTs and me have been fence-sitty T/T besties with this one. i dont have a strong first-hand perspective of their scumplay but their push for content is helpful in discerning a motive.

theMAFIAbear

, what do you get out of having the thread spew a readslist?

bell:

My focus is to parse the origin of their caution towards this slot and how that progresses to see if it comes from an informed perspective. So far I got townpings but I'm still thinking.

I just realized

Toog

has only posted twice and now I'm tilting my head at the suspicion there.

I'm failing to see the issue with

Toog's

413 since it's practically standalone, there was not much time for

Toog

to follow-up with his perspective before an accident (I hope he's okay ). And as a first post, the context of claiming role information and conflating it with alignment has a town motive in gauging reactions.

johnnyfarrar:

johnny

you prompted this from me, so thoughts?
rough feels of this group is that I'm still sorting but they're either null or townlean. which is interesting as that implies scum are players i am unfamiliar with.

i also have some familiarity with

ceph/penguin/mala/enchant

but nothing to construct much insight into them as a player.

Interesting post. Do I actually “beat down players with scrutiny as scum”? That’s actually news to me but your read is still right regardless.

I don’t know what you’re seeing BBT, this looks like Taly in pretty much every towngame I’ve played with them.

its akin to that

"you use a magnifying glass as town V something else as scum"

analogy

any read outside of your slot that you disagree with?

I think you said that scum!me is like hot knife through butter and town!me looks at everything through a magnifying glass. I ought to know it’s in my sigline.

To answer your question, I’m pretty much vibing with this read. I think J probably misconstrued your earlier comment about me, which is why I was confused.

I would be more than happy to mercilessly beat down scum, once I have a much more confident idea on who they are.

One thing I don’t vibe with you on is your Pooky read, I think he’s seems pretty town here. At first I also didn’t get wtf he was doing with that but it reminds me of Ari in PYP, she also made a lot of charts in that. Pooky also lacks that menacing tone he has as scum. Maybe the readslist thing could possibly be role related? \_0_/

oh i felt better with

pooky

!town after they gave me like 6 reasons to suggest why doing a readslist is good.

tbh i get the argument that, yes, readslists from all players are very effective for scum to manuver, but for a D1 with 26p, it feels necessary and pro-town

It’s not his asking for the readslists themselves that I tr, it’s what he did with them: the graphs. He’s keeping an ongoing record of the gamestate - something that is generally counterintuitive for scum to do.

good point,

@T-Bone for p-edit

I think it's counterintuitive for scum because scum can often mold the gamestate to their desires, by keeping an active record of gamestate and consensus for town in real-time, it's more difficult to misconstrue events in favor for a scum-aligned narrative later.

how do you feel about

galron

,

nancy

?

pedit again

Pooky does that as scum too, tho usually later in the game. Sometimes as cover while calling other ppl lazy.
I’m correcting the record.

then whats an AI action from

pooky

in your eyes so far, if one?

I think Galron’s town. If you’ve read my ISO you’d see thar he was one of the slots. I hard vetoed limming today. Galron appears to be genuinely solving, so I totally do not get the srs on him at all.

glad that your slot is town this game hehe

im proposing the same question to

malcolm

to you, what about

rad/johnny

?

Klick
MalcolmTucker
Cephrir
Malakittens
PenguinPower
Frogsterking
Cat Scratch Fever
Enchant
BlueBlooded Toffee
The Toad
OffTheHook

So this is my POE if I trust Taly. Which I do. I'm gonna see how many ISOs I can stomach before my eyes cross

Pedit: Taly we tried breaking this already

im curious, i came in with several slots cautious or scumreading me but you've taken to conversation very well, why?

2080 is super town, tbone! What's your issue with cat.
?

explain please

bluebloodedtoffee is obvscum cmon guys!!

Do you think bbts response to me is more town or scum? Specifically the climb down.

My first thought is the whiplash seems convenient, but knowing that you and

BBT

have had consistent banter, it feels more plausible for town to seek resolution.

umbra:

disagreed, i think its fear, jump up and climb down is too distant to be sincere.

VOTE: Roden

Feeling alright about Roden as possible scum at the moment.

Looking back and their reads list feels quite weak - the town section is quite generic with the exception of maybe Gaston. They have three SRs, one of whom is Toad, who their case against seems pretty weak, with C&G being another, again a SR that doesn't say much given their posting restriction.

While I'm reluctant to go too heavily on associatives early on I think Roden/Galron is a possible team - Roden's defence of Galron when they came under pressure didn't do much for me and felt like the type of early defence a scum teammate could easily make for their buddy.

I’m mulling back and forth whether his noncommittal read on me is possible a way to position to potentially push us later or why scum!Roden wouldn’t just straight up try to pocket me. Like I would expect Roden to tr me here, irrespective his alignment because there hasn’t been a single game that he hasn’t.

This feels like a town thought to me

@Luke

I disagree on

Galron

, I may have asked you earlier about that read but haven't seen a reply.

I'm also confused on

C&G

being anywhere but null or off the table given how they can't actually communicate their thoughts in the thread.

What was the issue about

Roden's

defense, specifically?

@Nancy

Let's dissect your uncertainty, what would a town and scum motive for

Roden

to push you to be?

~~~

@Cor

1738, I still want to hear what reason you had for your read here.

@CSF

I want you to challenge me on my

Gal/Johnny

townreads.

[Dancing Puppets]

@Nancy

Let's dissect your uncertainty, what would a town and scum motive for

Roden

to push you to be?

Well. it would be townie, if he had a reasonable reason to sr me I guess. For scum!Roden, probably not too smart but here’s the thing, he’s tr me every single game he’s played with me and he doesn’t seem to extremely interested in getting one on me att.

Idk, what do you think of the link I posted to his scumgame? Do you think he sounds similar or different here?

But that’s what I’m debating, why not pocket me? It’s not like that would make me suspicious anymore than it would for someone like Mastina to tr me.

[Lukewarm]

@Luke
I disagree on Galron, I may have asked you earlier about that read but haven't seen a reply.

I'm also confused on C&G being anywhere but null or off the table given how they can't actually communicate their thoughts in the thread.

What was the issue about Roden's defense, specifically?

Was all of this @me?

Once I get back to my computer I can make a post about galron, not sure what the rest would mean in reference to me because I have c&g null and don't remember saying anything about roden

[Bellaphant]

@tsly, you disagree? I think cat evaluates a ton of slots, but also sees some stuff where they disagree but also take the time to work out if the thought process behind it comes from a solveu town mindset. Plus, they were sharing a bunch of my thoughts - the ceph wagon, toad, etc. I disliked t bones reaction a lot, but also I think I'm just a bit clashy with t bone in general

[Bellaphant]

I can't work out what I think about the bbt thing. It's mainly what oth said yhY it felt like they weren't expecting me to fight back /and/ be right

[Bellaphant]

Hey @luke, why am I red for you? Can you come chat to me, I felt like we could have similar thoughts before (even when you were scum!) Some questions from you might help clarify my thinking overall.

I think this got missed too

[Galron]

Last 8 pages or so I haven't read but I was thinking C%G are a mystery. Nancy do you have any thoughts there? Taly?

[Dancing Puppets]

Last 8 pages or so I haven't read but I was thinking C%G are a mystery. Nancy do you have any thoughts there? Taly?

Absolutely no clue so dead null.

[Save The Dragons]

Replacing Corwinoid

[Galron]

Last 8 pages or so I haven't read but I was thinking C%G are a mystery. Nancy do you have any thoughts there? Taly?

Absolutely no clue so dead null.

Do you believe thy have a postng restriction?

[Save The Dragons]

d