Open 861: The Turing Test [game over]

[Vivax]

Vivax is mafia for me, and that kind of "yeah I guess I'll vote KittyTacky, if you guys INSIST", seemed very mafia. I just don't know whether it's a scum/scum interaction or not. In isolation KittyTacky is definitely sus, but could go either way.

Well, I agree it’s suss irrespective of what Kitty is. He talks so much about conviction then just suddenly gives that up without explaining his reasoning.

Wrt to GL’s question, Vivax made a fuckton of sense in NEP which I’ve already linked. That’s how I knew he was obvtown in that. He was bleeding obvtown to me straight out of the gate.

The entire town was beast level honestly. Didn't have to do much save exploding on the wrong person

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... &start=200

You also made a great deal of sense in that game too. I’m very certain I would not have needed a translator to understand any of your posts in that game.

Have a natural tendency to favour peculiar words
Game was weird

[Radical Rat]

Everything he posts is designed to be distracting or confusing. I don't believe a single word that's come out of his mouth all game, and now he's sussing people for.... Believing mental illness claims?

but when you say "designed to be" distracting or confusing, isn't that assuming mal intent from the start? I also disagree that it's all entirely meant to be confusing, like a post like 592 is readable to me, even if I don't agree with his ideas or theories I feel like what he's saying is not hard to understand.

I dunno, he could be mafia, but I don't think I've seen anything in his posts/arguments that feels like it's alignment indicative moreso than personality/playstyle indicative. Are his town games super logical and clear?

I haven't played with Town!Vivax yet, but Loki has the game he linked, and I have played with Scum!Vivax in Terminator where he had a similar trolly attitude, though I don't think it was near this extreme there.

[Greeting]

Vivax

is not getting concerned or even annoyed about the pressure he's having right now. He does seem like a pretty capable player overall though. I'll need to look into one of his scum games.

I must say that this game does feel very meta-based in general too.

[Greeting]

kuti has 32 posts and i counted like, maybe 2 opinions total

hi kuti i would like to hear some more opinions plz

If I remember correctly, you really like to base your reads off meta. I have played with

kutiplz

on MU and my impression is that they sound no different to what they did in the games I've played with them on that site.

[Greeting]

I'm gonna drop this now, but safe to say my opinion is that people shouldn't bring IRL circumstances into a social deduction game, especially if some people think lying about IRL circumstances is wrong (or against site rules apparently). Because the chain of logic is 1) my IRL circumstances are making me play weirdly/scummily, 2) I can't lie about this according to the rules, 3) I am therefore town. That's just how I see it.

Oh ffs. Please read 575 and 589 if you're town and not a salty scum who is angry they didn't get an easy elim because I came clean about my mood swing episodes.

I literally said that it can happen when I'm scum, it just doesn't as often.

If you really insist on dragging this on then how about you analyse my ISO and figure out the possible reason for me having acted like I did? Was the reason for my emotions spiralling out alignment-indicative? If you think it was then I am open to discuss. If you think it wasn't, then can we just move on please, because otherwise I don't see the point in talking about it any further.

[fireisredsir]

kuti has 32 posts and i counted like, maybe 2 opinions total

hi kuti i would like to hear some more opinions plz

If I remember correctly, you really like to base your reads off meta. I have played with

kutiplz

on MU and my impression is that they sound no different to what they did in the games I've played with them on that site.

ive looked at a few of their games and the tone is similar yes but the level of content is not

[Dannflor]

UNVOTE:

Committing to a full reread tomorrow. Apologies for my absence, I’ve been without service and phone posting much of the weekend. I’m not longer hot on the Greeting wagon.

GL, I’m acknowledging your response to me and my initial reaction is disagreement on your reasons for townreading Roden. But I’ll give a more thorough response on reread.

[Dannflor]

If KittyTacky is scum here then I would suspect they are being actively sacrificed by scum.

[Loki Dokie]

Vivax

is not getting concerned or even annoyed about the pressure he's having right now. He does seem like a pretty capable player overall though. I'll need to look into one of his scum games.

I must say that this game does feel very meta-based in general too.

Reactions to being voted are often nai, he’s making reads and votes that make little sense. He literally voted me for being sympathetic to your mental health issues, he claimed to dislike Ari’s post but voted Dann. He’s making nonsensical reads and pushes just like he did in Terminator but we apparently can’t get him limmed because this playerlist is somehow blind.

[Loki Dokie]

If KittyTacky is scum here then I would suspect they are being actively sacrificed by scum.

Yes, there is very little resistance to his lim, so yeah I suspect if he’s scum he’s definitely being bussed and if town, easy miselimbait.

[Loki Dokie]

UNVOTE:

Committing to a full reread tomorrow. Apologies for my absence, I’ve been without service and phone posting much of the weekend. I’m not longer hot on the Greeting wagon.

GL, I’m acknowledging your response to me and my initial reaction is disagreement on your reasons for townreading Roden. But I’ll give a more thorough response on reread.

Dann why does scum!Roden link my scumgame and town clear me for it? That’s not a wk, that’s actual evidence.

[Loki Dokie]

kuti has 32 posts and i counted like, maybe 2 opinions total

hi kuti i would like to hear some more opinions plz

If I remember correctly, you really like to base your reads off meta. I have played with

kutiplz

on MU and my impression is that they sound no different to what they did in the games I've played with them on that site.

ive looked at a few of their games and the tone is similar yes but the level of content is not

So you think they could be scum then?

[Aristeia]

Loki just because I don't agree with your choice of who to lim today does not mean that I am blind.

If you have a reason to think Kitty is town here, I am happy to hear you out.

If you are correct that vivax is scum, we will eventually have the opportunity to eliminate him.

[Loki Dokie]

Loki just because I don't agree with your choice of who to lim today does not mean that I am blind.

If you have a reason to think Kitty is town here, I am happy to hear you out.

If you are correct that vivax is scum, we will eventually have the opportunity to eliminate him.

Idk what to think rn but Dann is right, whatever he is, there’s very little resistance to his lim. I want to hear his reasons on why is Dann the most suss vote on me but Vivax votes me for sympathizing with Greeting’s mental health issues pushes Dann > you for disliking your post, so I want him to explain all that but whatever Kitty is, Dann is right. Scum is clearly fine with his lim’

We don’t get anymore elims. Scum picks one townie and one mafia and they are removed from the game, then we vote on their alignment - kind’ve like a dead gladiate which scum decides.

[Loki Dokie]

So the way I see it, if Kitty is coming from a townie mindset. Vivax ought to be the vote on my slot that should ping him the most, not Dann, for beyond obvious reasons.

I think Vivax is scum irrespective of what Kitty is, which is why my vote is on him.

At least one third of his posts are troll posts and I’m not including the ones I need a translator to understand.

[KittyTacky]

Don't like Dannflor, mostly.

I have trouble believing you actually scumread Dannflor because you have done literally nothing to push or sort him.

I was busy IRL and feeling out of this game, and I think Greeting is scummier at this point anyways.

[KittyTacky]

Maybe he just doesn’t like me personally

No you're fine.

[KittyTacky]

exceedingly fine with a Greeting wagon

Roden, who are you town reading?

Bell
Dann
GL
Kitty
Loki

Bell and GL are more like town leans though

Can you expand on Kitty and Bell?

Kitty kinda just does the exact same thing as either alignment every game, like making content but never feeling all that present, shrugging when he gets sus'd, and generally being an easy push. The way I try to read players like that is to try to understand their intentions, since I think it's harder to hide intention as scum when you're focused on making your town and scum play identical. I don't really see any attempts at obfuscating his thoughts, and he doesn't really seem to care about his wagon too much.

Bell's simpler, if he's posting then he's town, if not then he's scum. I see this get said every game he's in and I haven't seen it proven wrong yet. His activity has been somewhere in the middle this game so far though, so he's just a town lean.

Yeah.

[KittyTacky]

VOTE: DannFlor

Interested into seeing what Loki thinks of a wagon on Dannflor.
It's not on Loki, so it can't be that bad.

You know this Dannflor vote isn't gonna happen, they're widely townread. Why aren't you being more realistic about surviving?

That's a mafia priority. My priority is finding the correct elimination.
If I get yeeted, I haven't been read correctly, and neither was the mafia.

Why isn't KittyTacky the correct elimination?

Because I'm town.

[KittyTacky]

This is KT's first post with suspicion;

I don't like the naked votes on Lokie Dokie.

atp in time the only people who had voted for Loki Dokie are Dannflor and Fireisredsir, fire had unvoted at this point.

~ 3 hours later - Roden votes for Loki Dokie 188

KT comes back and reiterates his position here:

I will repeat that the string of naked votes on Loki is just HMMMMMMM to me.

which is incongruent with:

I don't understand the Roden wagon. He's got three posts, and none of them strike me as particularly scummy.

Yeah same. Roden is very null to me.

I don't see how you can suspect naked Loki voters and also be null on someone who fits your criteria.

Roden did not make any other content and just making a naked vote isn't enough to sus him.

When I press KT on which Loki voters he suspects, his response is:

The ones who actually gave content so far. I can't read someone who made so few posts at all regardless of if they made a naked vote or not.

Which implies that he is scumreading one of the other loki voters for their content - but he hasn't actually explained specifically what content he is suspecting.

I further push him to be specific about who he is scumreading at he responds with:

I don't understand the Roden wagon. He's got three posts, and none of them strike me as particularly scummy.

Yeah same. Roden is very null to me.

I don't understand how you can sus the loki voters and also be null on roden

this feels like a contradiction to me.

I'm not heavily scumreading the Loki voters. And explain how is it a contradiction?

like um

which loki voters are you exactly sussing?

The ones who actually gave content so far. I can't read someone who made so few posts at all regardless of if they made a naked vote or not.

name names

Don't like Dannflor, mostly.

Now this is weird to me because

(1) he's given absolutely no indication prior to this point that Dannflor is a person of interest or suspect for him.

I did though, see my previous comments.

There's no indication in his iso that he suspects Dannflor at all.

(2) in fact he even sheeps Dannflor with this vote:

Dear God, this whole "I don't get scumread" thing is insufferable.
I don't think it's necessarily scummy, because the same thing happened somewhat in Terminator, but it IS obnoxious and makes the game way harder to follow for anyone else.


Anyway,
VOTE: Greeting
Ignoring the actual substance of posts in favor of superficial "tells" is probably as scummy as it's gonna get D1.

Did a reread of the whole game so far, yeah I can sheep this.
VOTE: Greeting

I can sheep a case by someone else that someone I sussed is voting too.

(3) all of his responses to me feel manufactured on the spot and not part of an actual thought process to find scum. I would guess that his initial comment about the Loki voters wasn't real suspicion and really just playing on Loki's extreme sensitivity to being suspected to try to pocket Loki. Which is why he is having such a hard time actually showing any thought process that involves actually pushing or suspecting any of the people who naked voted Loki to begin with.

No that's just my writing style. I'm always sorta detached from the game.

[KittyTacky]

I suppose KittyTacky could be mafia.
Attached easily to the Greeting wagon but made a retort about Dannflor without committing.
I‘d like the right to tinfoil on this some more.

Because Dann isn't a strong read for me. -_-

[KittyTacky]

669 is a decent scumcase and probably my favourite of Vivax's content all game. Which makes me lean towards scum/scum, plus I was already leaning that way earlier after that weird vote on Dannflor.

Yeah, if I’m actually wrong on Kitty, this would probably be the most compelling argument to me based off my experience playing with him.

Yeah that Dannflor vote made absolutely no sense. I also wonder why Kitty would single out Dann who did a 180 on me when it’s Vivax who has continued to push me not Dann.

@Kitty, why aren’t you suspicious of Vivax?

I am, actually. It does seem like an opportunistic scum voting LHF. I'm willing to vote between Greeting/Vivax.

[KittyTacky]

@Kitty, I would really like your read on Vivax. Can we not run him up before this gets answered please?

Rather scummy.

I just... do poorly in mountainous games as I found out. It's slightly demoralizing having no play around PRs to find scum/town with.

[fireisredsir]

VOTE: kutiplz

my heart wasn't really in this one anyway

[Roden]

Bell's simpler, if he's posting then he's town, if not then he's scum. I see this get said every game he's in and I haven't seen it proven wrong yet. His activity has been somewhere in the middle this game so far though, so he's just a town lean.

I would kinda expect Bell to post more than he has so far tbh

in Shakespeare he posted a lot as scum and won the game off it

You expect town Bell or scum Bell to post more? Mentioning how he posted a lot as scum in Shakespeare is confusing me here.