Open 861: The Turing Test [game over]

[GuiltyLion]

mmm

that post explains your thought process a bit more, but I'm just struggling to understand why scum!Vivax panics there. I usually assume scum are attempting to

not

panic in any circumstances, especially on D1 of a game where they have four teammates to help them out. I feel it's rare you see someone let the mask slip so quickly unless they're just bad at mafia.

And for scum!Vivax to panic, like you mentioned it pretty much only makes sense if Greeting is also scum and Vivax wants towncred for being a bus vote, right? If town!Greeting, why is scum!Vivax panicking? So already we have to assume scum!Greeting in order for scum!Vivax to really make sense.

My other thought is that there's a possible explanation or town!Vivax panic and vote - he might have seen a bunch of players coalescing on Greeting, thought "oh shit, what if I'm totally wrong and Greeting is scum, and I'm going to get pushed next after the flip?", and voted there. Again, not great play, definitely erratic, but to me that feels more likely than the same thought process coming from Vivax as scum - as I said, I tend to think scum are more likely to be overly cautious/calm rather than panicky, and then if nothing else the odds that Greeting/Vivax is S-S are low in a vacuum.

[furtiveglance]

I think Loki, Greeting, GuiltyLion, Fire and Roden are 5 of 7 other town.

KittyTacky, Kuti plz, Aristeia, Dannflor, Radical Rat probably has 2 town (or 3 if I townread a mafia).

Bell and Vivax are both mafia.

[furtiveglance]

I think Loki, Greeting, GuiltyLion, Fire and Roden are 5 of 7 other town.

KittyTacky, Kuti plz, Aristeia, Dannflor, Radical Rat probably has 2 town (or 3 if I townread a mafia).

Bell and Vivax are both mafia.

What does everyone else think?

Or do you not want to say?

[GuiltyLion]

I'm not sold on Vivax especially if Greeting is town, for reasons I've said

I could vote Bell if we're not doing KT, but I also still think KT is scum and kinda surprised people aren't jumping on him after he said he was demoralized because this is a mountainous setup, to me that just felt like such an awkward self defense

[furtiveglance]

I'd rather vote Bell than KT but I want Bell to check in first, voting out someone who isn't here always feels a bit wrong

[Radical Rat]

mmm

that post explains your thought process a bit more, but I'm just struggling to understand why scum!Vivax panics there. I usually assume scum are attempting to

not

panic in any circumstances, especially on D1 of a game where they have four teammates to help them out. I feel it's rare you see someone let the mask slip so quickly unless they're just bad at mafia.

And for scum!Vivax to panic, like you mentioned it pretty much only makes sense if Greeting is also scum and Vivax wants towncred for being a bus vote, right? If town!Greeting, why is scum!Vivax panicking? So already we have to assume scum!Greeting in order for scum!Vivax to really make sense.

My other thought is that there's a possible explanation or town!Vivax panic and vote - he might have seen a bunch of players coalescing on Greeting, thought "oh shit, what if I'm totally wrong and Greeting is scum, and I'm going to get pushed next after the flip?", and voted there. Again, not great play, definitely erratic, but to me that feels more likely than the same thought process coming from Vivax as scum - as I said, I tend to think scum are more likely to be overly cautious/calm rather than panicky, and then if nothing else the odds that Greeting/Vivax is S-S are low in a vacuum.

I would agree with you on the broad claims, scum generally are calmer and less prone to panic, but I also don't 100% buy the panic claim in the first place. If it IS genuine, then only the scum explanation makes sense to me, and if it ISN'T true... then it's a pretty obviously scum-motivated lie defending a bad vote. The Town explanation is

theoretically

possible, but I don't really get the impression that Vivax as a player really cares about his image that much? I have no actual backing for this beyond vibes, but I suspect he's actually a competent player when he puts in the effort to be.

[Radical Rat]

I think Loki, Greeting, GuiltyLion, Fire and Roden are 5 of 7 other town.

KittyTacky, Kuti plz, Aristeia, Dannflor, Radical Rat probably has 2 town (or 3 if I townread a mafia).

Bell and Vivax are both mafia.

I always struggle to read lurker slots, so I don't have strong opinions on those yet.
GuiltyLion brings up a good point with Kitty's mountainous complaints being very odd for Day 1 though.

I also don't really have any solid townreads yet. It's hard to work through with such a high scum ratio, makes me second-guess everything.
I am leaning Town on quite a few people, but I'd rather not disclose a full list yet. No reason to make scum's night decisions any easier for them.

[Loki Dokie]

I'd rather vote Bell than KT but I want Bell to check in first, voting out someone who isn't here always feels a bit wrong

Idk what to make of Bell. I can’t obvtown them which is concerning but they do have some content that might be townie but most of its fluff and does sound kind’ve wooden.

Thing is wrt to GL’s theory, if Bell is actually scum here and scum wanted to bus, they would most likely bus Bell because he absolutely hates rolling scum and would likely beg to be put out of his misery.

[Radical Rat]

Gun to head, I'd pick Kitty over Bell, but I still would much rather Vivax.

[Loki Dokie]

I'm not sold on Vivax especially if Greeting is town, for reasons I've said

I could vote Bell if we're not doing KT, but I also still think KT is scum and kinda surprised people aren't jumping on him after he said he was demoralized because this is a mountainous setup, to me that just felt like such an awkward self defense

Kitty was never demoralized in Schadd’s game. I don’t even know how he feels about playing either alignment. Kitty is always awkward, so that’s totally nai for him.

[Loki Dokie]

Gun to head, I'd pick Kitty over Bell, but I still would much rather Vivax.

@Vivax, give us some reads. both town and scum with explanations.

I think the very fact that he continues to make unreadable posts and keeps trolling me, in addition to everything I and others have already stated, doesn’t give me a lot of confidence that I’m wrong here.

[Loki Dokie]

I think Loki, Greeting, GuiltyLion, Fire and Roden are 5 of 7 other town.

KittyTacky, Kuti plz, Aristeia, Dannflor, Radical Rat probably has 2 town (or 3 if I townread a mafia).

Bell and Vivax are both mafia.

What does everyone else think?

Or do you not want to say?

I’m still on the fence with Greeting but agree on Fire and Roden.

Of your second line, I probably like RR. Dann. Kuti best but I honestly don’t know yet.

My most confident trs are GL, you and fire, probably RR, Dann as well. \_0_/

Still unsure about Bell. My only confident sr right now is Vivax

[Bell]

Here. Apologies. Work is starting up again.

[Bell]

Anything interesting happen in the last few pages?

[Bell]

Doesn't look like it.

[Dannflor]

less feigned indifference pls

more on who you want to kill

[Bell]

also scum has a ton of wiggle room in this situation so please later be careful about assumptions that people usually make like "oh scum wouldn't all pile on a wagon together" or "scum must be the ones pushing this counterwagon to scum" because they have 5 people. we need 7 to elim. to get an elim on scum without bussing we need 7/8 town people to agree. that's just not really ever gonna happen if scum doesn't want it to

so scum is free to just mostly do whatever they want and be as unconventional as possible with their votes in order to look unpaired with each other, bc they know that multiple of them will have to flip at some point

Caution preaching does not make me feel warm inside.

[Bell]

less feigned indifference pls

more on who you want to kill

Thinking.

[Bell]

Wait, why is my indifference feigned.
I'm just not sure which players are scum or not. It's not indifference, it's being indecisive.

[Bell]

Vivax is all over the place for me.

Kitty hasn't done anything. I get "Meta says they're always like this"
but even for that, I'm not seeing any hyper posting which they say they're capable of.

[Dannflor]

It feels a little too deliberate when your response to a couple votes on you in the last few pages + others saying they'd be fine with a wagon on you is "nothing interesting happened." Like, "oh, look at me, I don't care about this."

Did I misinterpret that reaction?

[Bell]

Kutiplz has managed to uptick as town by 0.000000125%. But that's basically it. I just don't want to lose this game to the lurker slots. Truth be told this game should be relatively easy after this first elimination and it's probably relatively important that we hit right, but honestly. Given my accuracy it's probably better just to go for the unsolvables.

[Bell]

It feels a little too deliberate when your response to a couple votes on you in the last few pages + others saying they'd be fine with a wagon on you is "nothing interesting happened." Like, "oh, look at me, I don't care about this."

Did I misinterpret that reaction?

When a player disappears for 2 days getting pressured for it, is not exactly what I would call out of the ordinary. it's perfectly normal for a player to slip down in a reads list. I've had this happen to me a lot, an everytime I get back all the reads right themselves back into town leans. Because I'm not difficult to sort and I'm relatively in your face when I'm here. "A little too deliberate" is quite the round about way of saying something you could be saying plainly instead. I actually can't tel which ones are scum and which ones aren't in terms of push because the takes are defaults to something plain.

[Loki Dokie]

@Bell who do you townread?

[Bell]

I think Loki's indecision of me looks natural but meh. It's not a slam dunk.