LOST (Game Over)

[Rad]

Further, hey, if you 100% read me as town here and refuse to vote me, I think that's an ok stance to take too. Make it known openly. You should be claiming I am a hard town read for you here and you refuse to think otherwise. That way at end game when you decide to flip on me you're caught red handed. I think Rad!Town 100% advocates should have a strong voice here too.

[Rad]

So plan:

1. If you're unsure of town!Rad or sure of scum!Rad, vote me and give reason. If you're already voting me, explain reason.
2. If you're sure of town!Rad, declare it.

#1 should win here and town will have a list of reasons to analyze when I flip green.

Please, people already on my wagon also follow this pattern.

I don't think it's necessarily scummy to be unsure of town!Rad here so just give your reasons and be done with it. There's no reason for me to continue past this point, and it's dangerous to town for me to do so, so just be open about this. I guarantee this is worst case scenario for scum to have to deal with.

[Rad]

Ah one more thing. I'm Libby the Vanilla Townie! That's it. So boring. No reason to hide it anymore since I'm openly pushing my own lim. No one has to worry about me being a super cool PR here. I'm a boring fucking VT. Give your reasons for voting me or get fucked when I flip green. Do not coroner target me. I'm boring ass Libby the VT.

[Rad]

I think I'm literally the last person to declare their flavor/role??

One thing that was weird to me here is that no one has pushed for my flavor/role during any of the wagons. I dunno what that means but it sure feels strange. Maybe I just didn't get close enough to flip to push for it? But if there are scum on my wagons, they know it was never close enough.

[Rad]

I don't wanna shut down rad's attempt on mech solving for the 2nd time now but who actually read 12058 and thought that yeah this is a good idea.

to sum that post up we're basically misliming a town(town!rad world)
wasting 2 coroner shots, bb's shot and tracker's shot all just to prove that mala is telling the truth about being a coroner which is nai.

It does a bit more than just catch Mala...

Drap confirms BB can target dead
Mala and OTH are pitted against each other's reads
BB talks to me to find out my role which could out Mala if Mala just isn't coroner at all
If scum cares about the plan, they should kill town!BB, and BB isn't being heavily town read this game so that's a wasted NK for them

Is it foolproof? Nope.

It's mechanically interesting though and accomplishes some things if everything goes to plan. Town can decide it's a bad idea though, that's fine. Also I think the plan is just dead now if OTH can't target during the day cause the result would come back before the plan could even take place.

-drap confirming that bb can target the dead doesn't mean anything just confirming their role.
-like you said bb could be scum
-mala could still be scum claiming their real role
-or mala could be town and everything is just wasted

we do all this or we could just let drap track someone and maybe they'll track another nk.

I don't wanna shut down rad's attempt on mech solving for the 2nd time now but who actually read 12058 and thought that yeah this is a good idea.

to sum that post up we're basically misliming a town(town!rad world)
wasting 2 coroner shots, bb's shot and tracker's shot all just to prove that mala is telling the truth about being a coroner which is nai.

Well most of it went over my head but what I did get out of it is that RAD’s probably town, so that much was super helpful.

I would agree with you if the plan was good but rad made this whole mech solve centered around them flipping town which looks kind of lamist
I'm having 2nd thoughts whether they really think that misliming themselves here as town!rad is beneficial for town. There's like little chance here that mala is lying about their role.

I centered it around myself because my role is completely unknown to anyone and I think mala's probably just lying here about coroner. We could target Luke but he's probably just neighbor. Also I'm probably a liability later in the game due to Bella/Bell/Luke. If Malcolm flips green I'm even moreso.

the timing of that post was also bad
both mala/malcolm were the top wagons when they said that
and they both scumread them
so why would they suggest a town!rad mislim?

Rad sounds fine up until 12058
and any mala/malcolm scum flip would also spew rad town
If it wasn't for these I would probably go there today

Just throwing out possibilities for advancing in a reasonable way. I'm all for a Malcolm or mala wagon but I get why some people might be hesitant on either of those because I'm pushing both. I realized there could be a way to get some real info while resolving my liability so I ran with it. As per usual my more open thoughts get both hard town and hard scum read

Sure sure but you are objectively scummy with what has been put forward here.

Yeah but scummy doesn't mean I'm scum. Like, that's the easiest way for scum to pick off town, by pointing out scummy stuff town does. My town game is obvtown compared to my scum game, especially in a game this big where I've been talking my ass off for a month and keep putting myself into the spotlight to be limmed. I just pick fights when I should lay back and not do that. No one likes being called scum and I openly present wacky theories about people being scum cause I want to discuss them. I know I'm to blame here but I also find it more enjoyable as town to just openly discuss stuff than to keep my cards close.

I get that I need to be resolved. I've realized that ever since Bell died and it just got worse when Luke died. It'd be cool if town was able to hero read me here but I also worry that I become a liability later, so probably best to just flip me here. Kinda sucks cause I've commited a lot of time and energy to this game but also kinda cool because it occupies a huge amount of space in my brain and it'll be nice to move on.

These are times I mentioned the word Liability with regards to my own play. Consider them. If you're convinced I'm town, declare it, and if you're not, vote me with reason.

I should be sorted here as maybe scum, or I should be declared as town.

[Rad]

YES I think scum could declare me town.

YES I think town could declare me scum.

Let's see some reasons before I flip. Sort me everyone.

[Rad]

If you've already sorted me via a past post(s), just quote it and vote again.

[Rad]

I'm trying to solve 2 things that are within my abilities here.
1. People who are not sure about town rad. That's ok and is reasonable but I want to see some reasons before I flip.
2. People who are absolutely convinced of town rad and are willing to go to endgame with that read, explain yourself.

I fully expect#1 to win here but I want to see reasons. I expect some town here and some scum. If you naked vote me fuck you get flipped next. We got time, show everyone why I'm scum.

[Cytosine and Guanine]

I'm trying to solve 2 things that are within my abilities here.
1. People who are not sure about town rad. That's ok and is reasonable but I want to see some reasons before I flip.
2. People who are absolutely convinced of town rad and are willing to go to endgame with that read, explain yourself.

I fully expect#1 to win here but I want to see reasons. I expect some town here and some scum. If you naked vote me fuck you get flipped next. We got time, show everyone why I'm scum.

Cytosine said that he thought that you were flailing under pressure.
I feel like some of your posts do give a similar impression to me though more so now then when he had said that.
I kind of feel like that self-vote was out of pressure but I can't tell if you're Town who has lost faith or scum who knows that he's been caught.
-Guanine

[butterchurn]

Alright Rad, I think you're town and I'm fine not reconsidering that read any time soon. With a town this apathetic, I doubt scum would be taking this approach.

We just need to move the game forward and get some more information. Eliminate Malcolm and C&G.

[butterchurn]

I tend to try and stay relatively calm during games but will be immensely frustrated if my elimination as town here is partially caused by scum basically annoying some townies into giving them another day. I am not scum here and I've presented what I think is a solid and robust case as to why I'm not.

What even is the actual case against me anyway? For the most part beyond one or two people who genuinely suspect me I feel as if it boils down to vibes since I'm not officially cleared yet. It feels a bit like the recurring case against BBT earlier in the game - when it came to actually presenting proper evidence for why BBT was scum nobody was really able to do so.

Malcolm here ignores the valid reasons to scumread him and is reductive of the case. He hasn't really engaged with CSF's reasoning about how his read progression on Johnny is inconsistent, and now he is acting as if there aren't any reasons to scumread him.

[butterchurn]

There also isn't much attempt to sort through who on his wagon is town as opposed to scum taking advantage of the situation. If he believes that Rad is scum, and that he is the chosen counterwagon, then why is he talking about the people wagoning him as if they're town? He should expect that scum are jumping on him to save Rad. He's pretty much only talked about Rad recently.

[butterchurn]

I think wagon dynamics today strongly suggest one of Malcolm or Mala is scum.
~Cytosine

What changed from this?

Nothing changed so much as the thought expressed was incomplete. I limited it to two names for tactical reasons, but Rad was also a major contender for the elimination and equally implicated by wagon dynamics. I would be surprised if {Mala, Malcolm, Rad} did not have a scum.
~Cytosine

This is also incredibly suspicious and should be eliminated. They originally said that Malcolm or Mala was scum, and used that reasoning to push Mala. Now they expanded that group to include Rad, and are using that to push Rad.

[butterchurn]

I've been pretty busy lately, but I'll try to make some more time for this game soon, if I stay alive. I really do believe that we just need some flips, though, and more back and forth arguing over which consensus scumread to eliminate first isn't going to help that much at this point.

[ProfessorDrapion]

Sorry Nancy you're going to have to figure this shit out cause I no longer have any confidence I can. Keep your vote on me and get me tf out of here cause I'm how town dies at end game.

I would suggest that you ignore your read on Dwlee and consider Roden and Butterchurn separately. Dwlee was so inconsequential here and could have just made the right move, even if accidental, and it fooled you, and now you have a perma town read on 2 slots for it.

You don’t die at end game if I have anything to say about it.

Malcolm can easily be a hit.

[ProfessorDrapion]

I think wagon dynamics today strongly suggest one of Malcolm or Mala is scum.
~Cytosine

What changed from this?

Nothing changed so much as the thought expressed was incomplete. I limited it to two names for tactical reasons, but Rad was also a major contender for the elimination and equally implicated by wagon dynamics. I would be surprised if {Mala, Malcolm, Rad} did not have a scum.
~Cytosine

This is also incredibly suspicious and should be eliminated. They originally said that Malcolm or Mala was scum, and used that reasoning to push Mala. Now they expanded that group to include Rad, and are using that to push Rad.

I’m completely with you on this one.
If Malcolm is a hit I’d go here next.

[MalcolmTucker]

I tend to try and stay relatively calm during games but will be immensely frustrated if my elimination as town here is partially caused by scum basically annoying some townies into giving them another day. I am not scum here and I've presented what I think is a solid and robust case as to why I'm not.

What even is the actual case against me anyway? For the most part beyond one or two people who genuinely suspect me I feel as if it boils down to vibes since I'm not officially cleared yet. It feels a bit like the recurring case against BBT earlier in the game - when it came to actually presenting proper evidence for why BBT was scum nobody was really able to do so.

Malcolm here ignores the valid reasons to scumread him and is reductive of the case. He hasn't really engaged with CSF's reasoning about how his read progression on Johnny is inconsistent, and now he is acting as if there aren't any reasons to scumread him.

I have engaged with this and I believe CSF's case re Johnny is fairly inaccurate. What's my motivation to sort Johnny as town if I'm scum anyway? It'd have been a useful place for me to continue pushing along with Rad given there's been pressure remaining on that slot if I was scum, no?

[MalcolmTucker]

I would rather vote Malcolm than Rad if it came down to that, but for now:

VOTE: Johnny

2 reasons.

1)He was an obvious ML like Day 3 and he would have went over if it wasn’t for my amazing Bella check.
2)Pretty sure T-Bone claimed Doctor to him like a previous night but it was Luke who died over him.


^ again this indicates it can be Malcolm but BB still refuses to say what Luke has said in regards to Malcolm or even me.

Ok

VOTE: Malcolm

I'm forgetting but was Furtive's slot confirmed town before he replaced in? Because this is probably the vote I like the least on the wagon in terms of opportunism.

[Cytosine and Guanine]

was Furtive's slot confirmed town before he replaced in?

No
He replaced RCE who replaced The toad.
Roden and butterchurn are the Masons.

[Cytosine and Guanine]

was Furtive's slot confirmed town before he replaced in?

No, I don't think so.
He replaced RCE who replaced The toad.
Roden and butterchurn are the Masons.
-Guanine

EBWOP

[BlueBloodedToffee]

It's funny that people think Johnny is townier than Rad and Malcolm.

If they're both town, which seems likely, it's no wonder there is no noise anywhere else.

[MalcolmTucker]

was Furtive's slot confirmed town before he replaced in?

No
He replaced RCE who replaced The toad.
Roden and butterchurn are the Masons.

I'd largely ignored RC but is it worth looking at Furtive? As I say their vote on me looks like the most opportunistic on the wagon. Initially votes elsewhere but consolidates on me once it becomes apparent it's the easiest vote to push through.

[MalcolmTucker]

It's funny that people think Johnny is townier than Rad and Malcolm.

If they're both town, which seems likely, it's no wonder there is no noise anywhere else.

I do reckon Johnny is town but this is what's making me double-take re Rad. After our back and forth yesterday discussion almost completely ceased for a while. I don't necessarily agree with Rad's conclusion Roden/Butter are actually scum but I see where the inherent logic is coming from - the rapid activity from early doors has died down and some players seem a lot more settled with the current gamestate.

[Rad]

I'm trying to solve 2 things that are within my abilities here.
1. People who are not sure about town rad. That's ok and is reasonable but I want to see some reasons before I flip.
2. People who are absolutely convinced of town rad and are willing to go to endgame with that read, explain yourself.

I fully expect#1 to win here but I want to see reasons. I expect some town here and some scum. If you naked vote me fuck you get flipped next. We got time, show everyone why I'm scum.

Cytosine said that he thought that you were flailing under pressure.
I feel like some of your posts do give a similar impression to me though more so now then when he had said that.
I kind of feel like that self-vote was out of pressure but I can't tell if you're Town who has lost faith or scum who knows that he's been caught.
-Guanine

Couple things.

Why am I scum if I'm flailing under pressure?

What pressure did I have at 4 votes vs Malcolm's 6 (would be 7 if I stayed on it) that caused me to self vote?

[Best Bird]

Ah one more thing. I'm Libby the Vanilla Townie! That's it. So boring. No reason to hide it anymore since I'm openly pushing my own lim. No one has to worry about me being a super cool PR here. I'm a boring fucking VT. Give your reasons for voting me or get fucked when I flip green. Do not coroner target me. I'm boring ass Libby the VT.

Ok, Ben.