Datisi's Café [game over!]

[Vivax]

On the other hand, it‘s Titus who has been vocal about the possibility of a mastina bus world, so now I‘m wary that it‘s the first alternative to roden that Luke suggested

I-
I'm the one who made a whole thing about Mastina likely having bussed Ircher.

I struggle to believe that town!Mastina actually has this level of certainty on her Ircher read without that, and I think it makes much more sense that this is a patent pending, Mastina designed, scum/scum partner interaction.

Like, your whole argument on Mastina is almost a copy paste of my own.

Titus has Mastina as town.

Mastina is highly unlikely to be scum.

And, "wary that it's the first alternative to roden that Luke suggested" like I did not write out a whole case on Titus.

You are are not even reading my posts, just popping in to tell every one repeatedly how evil I am.

I‘d like to know where your head is at in simpler terms. Because your approach to the game is so holistic that it reads to me like you have no actual intention of finding a specific player and killing them today while keeping wagons off your townreads.

Like...You consider a lot of things at once in parallel, but don‘t really point and shoot. I hope this doesn‘t come across as mischaracterizing, but it‘s what keeps me sus on you.

[Uncrowned]

it doesn't

what i'm saying is we have slots already saying that they're happy to off mastina if there's no results from her ability later in the game so by that logic is it worth pursuing the slot now or what

[Vivax]

it doesn't

what i'm saying is we have slots already saying that they're happy to off mastina if there's no results from her ability later in the game so by that logic is it worth pursuing the slot now or what

This entire discussion conundrum has been kicked off because I wanted the heat off Roden and I suspect mastina for being so hypertunneled on him when he‘s clearly very passionate about being the wrong elim, at the same time rather stoic about it.

You want to hope for mastina to become some kind of gamebreaking behemoth just by staying alive? Ok then, can I interest you into the fake prince of Montenegro?

[Uncrowned]

i'm literally the guy that was questioning S_S for seeming to be ok with that

i think the people who are saying "let's just wait" are >rand scum because in what world would a town player be ok with being led around by a potential scum player for days on end., especially if they've had no read progression outside of townbinning her for her first post of the game

hence why i would lean luke being town atm bc i think the read of scum!mastina goes against the grain of this game

[Uncrowned]

VOTE: Ausuka

VOTE: Ircher

Scum.

bc this game doesn't have a postcap and larges can sometimes get kinda miserable without one, if d1 starts to get close to like idk 80-100 pages i suggest we simply yeet someone

who wants to join me on this mission

we need 10 more to sign the pact

VOTE: ausuka

Probably a scum try hard, which on D1 is a treat-as-town.

I have not been having a lot of fun with Day 1 of large games. So I might try to coast this one out.

But I also might be bad at sticking to that lol.

But for now, and until I inevitably fail at holding back, Peta I declare you a double voter

VOTE: Klick

Oh is this the mythical Lukewarm scumgame?

...'Cause it looks like a mythical Lukewarm scumgame.

ayo tho luke interesting you left these out when you were comparing this game to mastina's most 'egregious' bus o.o

[Something_Smart]

I bet Roden's claim, if fake, is a mod-provided fakeclaim.

[Something_Smart]

Also, the sample role PM also has an ability that does not increase in cost. It's an ability that only does something the first time, but I imagine it was meant to demonstrate that it's possible for roles to not have scaling costs.

[Lukewarm]

VOTE: Ausuka

VOTE: Ircher

Scum.

bc this game doesn't have a postcap and larges can sometimes get kinda miserable without one, if d1 starts to get close to like idk 80-100 pages i suggest we simply yeet someone

who wants to join me on this mission

we need 10 more to sign the pact

VOTE: ausuka

Probably a scum try hard, which on D1 is a treat-as-town.

I have not been having a lot of fun with Day 1 of large games. So I might try to coast this one out.

But I also might be bad at sticking to that lol.

But for now, and until I inevitably fail at holding back, Peta I declare you a double voter

VOTE: Klick

Oh is this the mythical Lukewarm scumgame?

...'Cause it looks like a mythical Lukewarm scumgame.

ayo tho luke interesting you left these out when you were comparing this game to mastina's most 'egregious' bus o.o

There is a more to it then just "Oh look, mastina called people scum in this game, and mastina called her scum buddies scum in this other game"

Mastina calls people scum in every game, from both alignments.

When I did the comparison, I was saying that her posts about Ircher do not clear her from being partnered with Ircher, because she has no issue lock!Scum reading a scum partner in her first 5 posts.

[Uncrowned]

i'll keep that in mind

[Lukewarm]

I‘d like to know where your head is at in simpler terms. Because your approach to the game is so holistic that it reads to me like you have no actual intention of finding a specific player and killing them today while keeping wagons off your townreads.

Like...You consider a lot of things at once in parallel, but don‘t really point and shoot. I hope this doesn‘t come across as mischaracterizing, but it‘s what keeps me sus on you.

I made a reads list in 1286.

I made a scum case against my two strongest scum reads, Mastina in 1454 and Titus in 1505.

Hope that helps

[Uncrowned]

But, if she is scum wanting to double down on her doomed team mate, AFTER she has made lots of posts saying how the tmi thing is not real, she really did not have many other options.

do you think that scum!titus thinks her discrediting the TMI thing is really enough to get people to reconsider the slot, tho?

wouldn't the easier course of action be to just fade into the crowd and agree that, in hindsight, it probably was TMI?

[Uncrowned]

or were you saying it was too late for her to join on the TMI thing so she was caught in a bad spot

[Vivax]

So in simple terms, you're saying mastina has been scummy?

Mastina is highly unlikely to be scum.

Subject: Not Quite Normal Multiball II (Game Over)

Yo, very important to note:

I am a Beloved Princess

.

No, seriously; no joke; this is a realclaim. (I can fullclaim the wording use, but I've reason not to.)

Obviously, this needs to be said since eliminating me during the day is a Very Bad Idea. (I'll need to ask a question to the mod about Vigs tho.)

I may or may not be feeling like playing tonight but it'll either be shortly or not until tomorrow-at-earliest.

VOTE: mastina

Town

On phone and posts unsorted, but I‘ll just join this wagon after finding this noteworthy on an ISO of Titus.
But yeah announced superscumkiller mastina didn‘t quite die before Peta and Nero.

Guess if I consider Luke town despite my pathological paranoia, I should take another look at maybe Uncrowned.
Since Luke is kinda leading the lim on Titus

VOTE: Titus

[Lukewarm]

or were you saying it was too late for her to join on the TMI thing so she was caught in a bad spot

Yes. This.

When she first started saying it was not TMI, only Furtive was calling it that, and there was no way to know for sure if it was going to take off or not.

Then, she came up with the new reason after his wagon took off.

[Uncrowned]

I could see that

I guess the argument then becomes does she feel compelled to come up with a reason, considering a lot of people (myself included) went on for little reason outside of the tmi? i feel like the path of least resistance, even if she got questioned later on in the game about it would literally just be "yeah i didn't catch the tmi thing at first, but after it got brought up it did look pretty bad" considering she was already on the wagon prior

[Uncrowned]

I think at least one of Ircher/SS if not both are scum. The timing of this slip argument right as SS gets pushed for reads is a bit sus when that argument was there all along.

i just think it's overly convoluted to come up with something like this and have to end up justifying it and all if you're scum

[mastina]

If he's locktown for reasons you prefer not to share, then I can't follow that.

I get that it's frustrating to not be among those in the know.

But I promise that my read is right and that it is for the best for the town to not elaborate.

Keeping the scum in the dark is genuinely the way we win the game.

There's only a select number of people who could be scum. Heck, if we were to massclaim I'd probably be able to name every town player and all the scum with 98% confidence and y'all would know exactly why I have Roden as scum and those who I have town, as town.

But while my reads being accurate post-massclaim would be proven to be true, today's not the day for a massclaim. 2-3 scum dead, then we can wrap the game up quickly with a massclaim.

I guarantee that I know what I am talking about. I guarantee that I am right. I guarantee that I can back it up. But I also guarantee that on D2, it'd be a bad idea to reveal anything.

Trust me, until we have 2-3 dead scum. (Which should be after Roden's elimination mind you.)

mastina you are aware that there is a sample pm in the opening posts, right?

Oh I am, but [redacted--not revealing this needlessly].

[mastina]

If he's locktown for reasons you prefer not to share, then I can't follow that.

I get that it's frustrating to not be among those in the know.

But I promise that my read is right and that it is for the best for the town to not elaborate.

Keeping the scum in the dark is genuinely the way we win the game.

There's only a select number of people who could be scum. Heck, if we were to massclaim I'd probably be able to name every town player and all the scum with 98% confidence and y'all would know exactly why I have Roden as scum and those who I have town, as town.

But while my reads being accurate post-massclaim would be proven to be true, today's not the day for a massclaim. 2-3 scum dead, then we can wrap the game up quickly with a massclaim.

I guarantee that I know what I am talking about. I guarantee that I am right. I guarantee that I can back it up. But I also guarantee that on D2, it'd be a bad idea to reveal anything.

Trust me, until we have 2-3 dead scum. (Which should be after Roden's elimination mind you.)

For the record:
I think that the game only has a small fraction of the players as possible to be scum. The players that I am locktownning strongest cannot be scum.
From there, there are many players who are incredibly unlikely to be scum off of play.
And that leaves a small pool for who is likely to be scum.

However, I am being cautious here because in the worst case scenario where the scum are in those who are unlikely to be scum by play, keeping them from infiltrating the locktown is a top priority, because as long as the locktown are there, the scum cannot win. No matter how well they climb up reads-wise, if they can't get into the locktown tier, the town wins.

I do get that that's frustrating for the town who are not in the locktown. They are just as much in the dark as the scum are. But I can't let the town not in the know know, without letting the scum who have proven they're not in the know, know.

[mastina]

Any ideas on who would be more prone to killing a peta+nero combo? You know each other better after all

Tbh the player most likely to do that is Malakittens, but by play I think Mala is town.

I

guess

Klick

might

do it? But by play I also think that he's town.

Ydrasse

could

, but she's even more town than the above two.

Ausuka

might

, but I've not the familiarity to be sure.

Titus could, I suppose, but my reasons for townreading her outweigh the evidence for her being scum.

{Lukewarm, Roden, RCEnigma} are the three players I would most expect to kill peta (admittedly, per peta's reputation,

everyone

has reason to kill peta, it's just that these are the players I'd MOST expect to); I'd need to research their Nero history though to see how likely it is from them.

[mastina]

It really feels like you're making this up. I understand why someone would be suspicious of me in a vacuum but this argument feels like you started at the premise "ausuka is scum" and then made up reasoning to reach that viewpoint.

You are correct; fire did this for you.

You know who else has done that?

Lukewarm with his Titus/mastina cases.

Both are scum!

[Vivax]

The only thing that bothers me is that Roden goes on a lengthy argument with Luke. While both are voting Titus.
But know what, I‘ll just go turncoat here cause Roden‘s frustration feels genuine, but not of the super annoyed kind like he was as mafia in Turing test

[mastina]

Well honestly from that, I feel even better about following mastina on Roden

You can consider if I'm the last scum on D4! The day that I have said I'll do the reveal on. Coincidentally, that gives us three days to find scum and I have given you three targets for those two days! (Well technically four if you count RCE as a backup of sorts, where if I'm wrong on any of Lukewarm/fire/Roden, it'd be RCE.)

That's a 150% chance of eliminating scum by D4 if you think about it. Just requires sheeping/trusting me that I am right.

Everything about them spells self-doubt

Not quite the wording I'd use, but yes, Lukewarm is scum here. There is something absent from his game. I don't wanna detract from the Roden wagon to fully explain it, but basically Lukewarm has a critical aspect to his reads missing present in his towngame. He's doing a good job of making cases, of making reasons for players to be an alignment, but it's performative and insincere, because the sign of a genuine belief in his reads is missing.

[mastina]

Absolutely bullshit. You've seen me play as scum. I almost

never

avoid my partners. I never avoid the major wagons. Ircher being run up every game is an easy thing to defend and I could have easily talked Ircher out of the noose and coached him. Ircher, being a less active poster, would be easy to Cyrano.
You'd be familiar with my scumgame but instead you're trying to push me because I was right and you're scared.

This is applicable for both Roden's push on Titus, but

also

Lukewarm's push there.

Titus is right. Her play does not match her established behaviors of interacting with scumbuddies.

Is that a hard-clear? Well no. Titus isn't unable to change up her scumplay. She

could

change things up, and I get it--a lot of Titus's play looks like scum.

But the narrative that Titus wasn't too far off of her scumgame's established meta is bullshit, because she IS off of her established scum meta. And I believe that Titus as scum wouldn't have diverged.

The theoretical ability to diverge does not mean actually any reason to diverge in a specific game.
For instance, easy way of explaining this: theoretically, I could fakeclaim as scum any game. (Titus could diverge from protecting scum any game.) But there's a

reason

that I don't diverge from that and avoid fakeclaiming as scum. (There's a

reason

Titus doesn't diverge from defending her scumbuddies.) It works disproportionately often, giving the scumteam an edge they otherwise would lack--"don't fix what's not broken", and changing up a winning strategy is a good way to lose.

Titus had the chance to try and save Ircher. Would she have succeeded? Not necessarily--but she still had a chance to, and didn't. Any attempt to say she did is bullshit.

[Uncrowned]

because the sign of a genuine belief in his reads is missing.

and that sign is?

I don't see how you're detracting from Roden by providing this

[mastina]

Suggests a blatant denial of vca info since at least Ydrasse and mastina are universal TRs.

why do you think these are universal TRs?

Well because it's basically only the scum who think they stand a chance of running players like me and Ydrasse up.

That I am alive says more about who the scum aren't--those who continuously townread me both today and yesterday would've killed me as scum, so it means the scum are among those who did not continuously townread me both today and yesterday.

The likes of, sayyyy...you, Lukewarm, and Roden?