Cosmos Mafia (Dawn 1)

[MathBlade]

As for me I am not sure of that hence my Unvote in the spirit of cooperation but I can always move it back to Mastina.

[unwnd]

A thought popped into my head that you could just use your shot on mastina if you feel your confidence will not waver

Maybe this was brought up or suggested already

[unwnd]

Hopefully I'm not bogging people down with questions but like

You mentioned a townblock needs to form: I assume you think that the people defending mastina is not one? Kinda makes me scratch my head at RR being voted because according to them those are the mastina defenders lol

[MathBlade]

A thought popped into my head that you could just use your shot on mastina if you feel your confidence will not waver

Maybe this was brought up or suggested already

This was brought up.

I have to live until D3 or D4 though to do that.

The odds are extremely low of me doing so in a multiball game.

[MathBlade]

Hopefully I'm not bogging people down with questions but like

You mentioned a townblock needs to form: I assume you think that the people defending mastina is not one? Kinda makes me scratch my head at RR being voted because according to them those are the mastina defenders lol

I do not. I think if it was a townblock around Mastina being town the game would have found a common scumread to go after. Instead it’s pot shots at the Mastina wagon pushers.

[unwnd]

So in your head is mastina like this scum ringleader and the defenders are associated? I don't know if I can exactly see that, because it begs the question what happens if mastina goes over? All her defenders would be incriminated

[furtiveglance]

So in your head is mastina like this scum ringleader and the defenders are associated? I don't know if I can exactly see that, because it begs the question what happens if mastina goes over? All her defenders would be incriminated

periodttttt *snaps fingers*

[MathBlade]

So in your head is mastina like this scum ringleader and the defenders are associated? I don't know if I can exactly see that, because it begs the question what happens if mastina goes over? All her defenders would be incriminated

I think they are because of my role and how it flips.

She will eventually go over but scum want it on their terms.

In lost I was a one shot RB. I didn’t care about dying on any day other than D1.

It’s a cost benefit analysis.

If the scum teams lose a scum today then it becomes a lot harder to crawl back from than on d2 or D3

[Past Present Future]

Generally speaking I find multiball scum behavior to be more affixed on survival. I think if it hasn't been said-- mastina getting desperate sounds similar to that practice?

Will stop POSTURING for now and read. However don't expect me to immediately come back as I have other priorities not related to Mafia today

Unwnd, Titus wasn’t referring it you. I have only seen her act “desperate” when she was either town or endgaming scum and here she tonally reads town to me.

Neglecting my reading to respond to this

Don't you think mastina is capable of faking tone? I just think tone really matters so little, especially with the more experienced player. mastina has that in bulk so I don't think it's proper to rely unless her tone is excruciatingly telling. I assume you think it is? What do you think of RR's reasoning?

1072.

I don’t see why scum!Mastina goes out of her way like that to put a target on her back. No one had any interest in voting her prior to that.

[MathBlade]

Generally speaking I find multiball scum behavior to be more affixed on survival. I think if it hasn't been said-- mastina getting desperate sounds similar to that practice?

Will stop POSTURING for now and read. However don't expect me to immediately come back as I have other priorities not related to Mafia today

Unwnd, Titus wasn’t referring it you. I have only seen her act “desperate” when she was either town or endgaming scum and here she tonally reads town to me.

Neglecting my reading to respond to this

Don't you think mastina is capable of faking tone? I just think tone really matters so little, especially with the more experienced player. mastina has that in bulk so I don't think it's proper to rely unless her tone is excruciatingly telling. I assume you think it is? What do you think of RR's reasoning?

1072.

I don’t see why scum!Mastina goes out of her way like that to put a target on her back. No one had any interest in voting her prior to that.

Incorrect a sizable wagon had formed then.

[Past Present Future]

Math, if you're town, you do realize that clsiming your vig shot is the worst thing that could have happened right?

~Titus

[MathBlade]

Math, if you're town, you do realize that clsiming your vig shot is the worst thing that could have happened right?

~Titus

It’s a damned if I did, damned if I didn’t.

A dayvig has to be crumbed.
Mastina outed those crumbs.
At that point I could either claim => which sucks but should have gotten a scum elim
Or
Don’t claim => Scum notice it anyway and we are worse off.

Once it was open to scum it kinda became a have to situation.

[unwnd]

@MathBlade

I think that's a bit too...self-serving on your part

I know you speak a bit more on mechanics so I'll do my best to level with you. This is a 17-man multiball setup. 9-man multiballs usually have a split of 2/2 and I imagine 17 is just 3/3. I find it very very unlikely that one faction is riding on this one particular instance. I think mastina's choices are her own and not some cunning plan made up of one of these factions. Multiball can be a bit fucky because of the additive layer of two scum factions trying to find the other. I feel like what's being explained to me about mastina and her conviction can be moreso faked due to this layer. I scumread her outburst due how it transpired and what it lead up to more than anything.

[Past Present Future]

If mastina's scum, then her team will use the excuse you'll shoot her to keep her alive.
The opposing scumteam would keep mastina alive because that's a vig shot not on their team.
We don't want to spend time wagoning someone who is going to be shot by you. If we do, we run the possibility of being in the same hostage situation again. Doubly so if you're wrong.

~Titus

[MathBlade]

@MathBlade

I think that's a bit too...self-serving on your part

I know you speak a bit more on mechanics so I'll do my best to level with you. This is a 17-man multiball setup. 9-man multiballs usually have a split of 2/2 and I imagine 17 is just 3/3. I find it very very unlikely that one faction is riding on this one particular instance. I think mastina's choices are her own and not some cunning plan made up of one of these factions. Multiball can be a bit fucky because of the additive layer of two scum factions trying to find the other. I feel like what's being explained to me about mastina and her conviction can be moreso faked due to this layer. I scumread her outburst due how it transpired and what it lead up to more than anything.

I think when I flip you’ll see why.

I can see where you’re coming from.

I admittedly am omitting a tiny part that doesn’t matter for reading me but that if scum knew would suck.

So yes. You can think this, but I think there’s a very good chance we could be losing on d3.

[unwnd]

If mastina's scum, then her team will use the excuse you'll shoot her to keep her alive.
The opposing scumteam would keep mastina alive because that's a vig shot not on their team.
We don't want to spend time wagoning someone who is going to be shot by you. If we do, we run the possibility of being in the same hostage situation again. Doubly so if you're wrong.

~Titus

To me, it just sounds like the problem is continuing to fester though. Motivation seems very low and people seemed burned out. I don't believe there's compromise to be found this phase

[MathBlade]

If mastina's scum, then her team will use the excuse you'll shoot her to keep her alive.
The opposing scumteam would keep mastina alive because that's a vig shot not on their team.
We don't want to spend time wagoning someone who is going to be shot by you. If we do, we run the possibility of being in the same hostage situation again. Doubly so if you're wrong.

~Titus

To me, it just sounds like the problem is continuing to fester though. Motivation seems very low and people seemed burned out. I don't believe there's compromise to be found this phase

This.

I shut up for > 48 hours and nothing happened of note.

[MathBlade]

VOTE: Mastina

[Past Present Future]

If mastina's scum, then her team will use the excuse you'll shoot her to keep her alive.
The opposing scumteam would keep mastina alive because that's a vig shot not on their team.
We don't want to spend time wagoning someone who is going to be shot by you. If we do, we run the possibility of being in the same hostage situation again. Doubly so if you're wrong.

~Titus

To me, it just sounds like the problem is continuing to fester though. Motivation seems very low and people seemed burned out. I don't believe there's compromise to be found this phase

Yeah, it's a problem. I agree. Math's claim literally killed motivation because people feel we lack agency. No agency means no scumhunting. Which is a stalled game.

~Titus

[Past Present Future]

If mastina's scum, then her team will use the excuse you'll shoot her to keep her alive.
The opposing scumteam would keep mastina alive because that's a vig shot not on their team.
We don't want to spend time wagoning someone who is going to be shot by you. If we do, we run the possibility of being in the same hostage situation again. Doubly so if you're wrong.

~Titus

To me, it just sounds like the problem is continuing to fester though. Motivation seems very low and people seemed burned out. I don't believe there's compromise to be found this phase

This.

I shut up for > 48 hours and nothing happened of note.

Called it.

~Titus

[unwnd]

Titus would a 'i told you so' be enough of a reward if mastina was just limmed? I understand your own conviction but am trying to see this on a wider scale

[MathBlade]

If mastina's scum, then her team will use the excuse you'll shoot her to keep her alive.
The opposing scumteam would keep mastina alive because that's a vig shot not on their team.
We don't want to spend time wagoning someone who is going to be shot by you. If we do, we run the possibility of being in the same hostage situation again. Doubly so if you're wrong.

~Titus

To me, it just sounds like the problem is continuing to fester though. Motivation seems very low and people seemed burned out. I don't believe there's compromise to be found this phase

Yeah, it's a problem. I agree. Math's claim literally killed motivation because people feel we lack agency. No agency means no scumhunting. Which is a stalled game.

~Titus

My claim isn’t what killed it.

We had e-2 well before agency died.

I hate your misrep and it’s why I SR your head and TR Nancy head

[unwnd]

FYI I am leaning mastina being scum so this isn't just 'hey let's vote mastina cause a thing happened'

[MegAzumarill]

Prodding Yume and Enchant

[Past Present Future]

Titus would a 'i told you so' be enough of a reward if mastina was just limmed? I understand your own conviction but am trying to see this on a wider scale

Namcy and I have a strict policy on voting TRs. Nancy's is stricter than mine. I asked her about it, and she said no.

I also don't want someone as stubborn and wrong with an unleashed shot. If he's right, we get a day with a confirmed flip.

I don't think 1 vig is extremely valuable in the scheme of things.

~Titus