Mad World: Time Travel Mafia (Game Over)

[Alpha Werewolf]

Why should you need differentiate the reason for Karma’s vote so early on Day 1?

I think that there's not enough of a reason to think that Zang is scum. I very much dislike Karma's answer - If you think he's scum, you vote for that.

For the record MagnaofIlusion posts a lot of stuff but only 5% of that is valuable info. Id suggest a more concise approach. Magna, who are your top suspects and why?

I'd like to know this too.

I highly dislike RC's #147. Why the need to inform us that he's finished writing PMs now? The game's just started.


I approve of the case on The Longing. Especially with Anon's analysis of The Longing's defense post in #127.

Vote The Longing

[Tasky]

also you dont see an insult in this?

karma, you remind me of razorback, only with slightly better grammar. .

Really you don’t see an insult here? Also noted.

Oh, and Tasky, razorback is possibly the most irritating player on the site. He has zero language skills, and makes votes based on nothing at all. I'm pretty sure he's actually retarded. If I ever saw razor join a game I had joined, I would /out immediately. That's how terrible he is.

ok, now I see the insult... didn't know the background about razorback...
still, I usually dislike people who use caps-lock, but maybe the ethic here is less strict than in other forums...

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I agree with Magna about Anon's Town\Scum lists, and would prefer that no-one posts list of players they think are pro-town. It's all fine and well listing people we think are scummy but pro-town lists paints targets on townie's heads.

I actually do absolutely not agree... finding people who are very likely to be town is helpful almost as much as finding scum. once you have a "sure" townie, scum has two options:
1. killing that guy and losing the chance of a power-role-kill (good for town)
2. not killing that guy while going for a power-role and leaving a confirmed townie in play for next day (even better for town, except in the very unlucky case that scum really does hit a power-role)

the more confirmed townies there are, the easier it is to find scum.

Of course I am far from saying that Anons list confirm townies, it's just a general disapproval to your theory...
I think if there are reasonable arguments to characterize someone as pro-town, just tell them... more information is always better than less information

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Vote: Sharkfinn

for blatant misrep, and backtracking

excuse me, could you please explain what backtracking is (please provide an example)? still trying to learn online-mafia-mechanics

[Zang]

Zang's attack on the theLonging wagon is wrong. There's more reasoning on it than the Tasky wagon.

Well before your post I believe the only person to give much reasoning was anon.

Prob scum
Longing
diginova
Zang (even though he is looking more and more like VI, still dont want him in endgame)

You still haven't explained why I'm scum.

I like the Zang wagon. He was massively scummy in Stardust Smalltown but coasted by through lurking and letting other caught scum take the heat. Also Magna's aforementioned boneheaded play

Lurking like this will only hurt the town, and until The Longing starts being much scummier than just mildly hypocritical I can probably happily leave my vote sat here.

You were also lurking and you were town. At least I became more active day 2, you were still barely posting. And I wasn't coasting by.

And I'm not even lurking right now.

[MagnaofIllusion]

Its interesting that before calling you on your "posts a lot but says nothing" style you had this opinion of me:

Ah the Clarion Call of ‘interesting’. Used to convey that something is scummy when you can’t come right out and say it because you know it would be shot down.

As to your assertion let’s examine it. I said –

Hmmm … attempt to buddy up to an experienced Town player by scum? Or just plain bad Appeal to Authority on your part?

The only thing in that statement you could readily call an ‘opinion’ is that you are experienced. You are, in that your join date indicates an Oct 09 entry to MS. Do I say you are posting well? Nope. Do I say you are effective? Nope. At this point I’ll let you try to show where stating that you are experienced conflicts with my opinion of your “Look busy with pointless lists” playstyle.

Now I am just trying pointless exercises that make me look busy. What changed? Are you implying Im scum here?

Actually, if you were exercising reading comprehension here you would realize I’m addressing Young’s play. But I’ll explain it for you.

Young went all fanboy over one of your posts. I noticed and inquired as to whether he (A) had picked you out as an experienced player with which to buddy, or (B) or was just trying a half-assed Appeal to Authority based on your join-date.

A. Implies that Young is scum and you are Town.
B. Implies that Young is making a stupid argument.

You sensitivity to even the notion that someone might be assessing you as scummy is noted.

But since we are exchanging questions answer the following that you ignored in 143 –

Why is Zang questioning Young trying to exacerbate a Town-Town argument between Young and Tasky?

Young has said Tasky’s playstyle is suspicious. Asking for elaboration isn’t scummy.
Why do you assume Young / Tasky is a Town – Town argument? You have a ‘read’ on Young per your lists but say nothing about Tasky.

[MagnaofIllusion]

EBWOP -

MOD - I'll be V/LA from 4pm EDT today until Tuesday for the Holiday weekend.

[TheLonging]

I approve of the case on The Longing. Especially with Anon's analysis of The Longing's defense post in #127.

Vote The Longing

Did you even read my response to it?

Confused his post with another poster's that was actually serious, therefore I am in the wrong (I just checked btw).

Which poster was it?

Eh, I've seen it happen so much more often with scum.

Links/examples please.

In the other game I just started with you, you changed your vote 4 times within the first half of the day (real time) and got very defensive about it. Something very suspicious about your play style.

Granted, I was skimming over the thread quickly, and his post was right under Tasky's, so I mistook his post for Tasky's post. Say what you want, but I did miss his vote on Tasky. (For what it's worth, my original post "Tasky is a good vote" or whatever was ment to get a reaction from Tasky, which I did not succeed in.)

http://www.scorehero.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=100099

^A mild example of it done by some of the scum members.

http://www.scorehero.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=102172

^Scumteam lurked their way to victory, in addition to them also double-standardizing.

[Karma]

Alpha, why didn't you like my response to your question?

Let me read over those links, although they were offsite.

[TheLonging]

Yeah they were offsite, though they were the best examples I can find

[youngminii]

Actually, if you were exercising reading comprehension here you would realize I’m addressing Young’s play. But I’ll explain it for you.

Young went all fanboy over one of your posts. I noticed and inquired as to whether he (A) had picked you out as an experienced player with which to buddy, or (B) or was just trying a half-assed Appeal to Authority based on your join-date.

A. Implies that Young is scum and you are Town.
B. Implies that Young is making a stupid argument.

You sensitivity to even the notion that someone might be assessing you as scummy is noted.

But since we are exchanging questions answer the following that you ignored in 143 –

Why is Zang questioning Young trying to exacerbate a Town-Town argument between Young and Tasky?

Young has said Tasky’s playstyle is suspicious. Asking for elaboration isn’t scummy.
Why do you assume Young / Tasky is a Town – Town argument? You have a ‘read’ on Young per your lists but say nothing about Tasky.

Actually it was mostly a joke. Come on, even a 10 year old could spot that. Why would you even be so aggressive on that point anyway?
Sure, it's good to put pressure on somebody on Day 1 by using one of their posts but blatantly taking a post and turning it into the bullshit that you did is scummy as hell.

[SharkFinn]

Vote: Sharkfinn

for blatant misrep, and backtracking

excuse me, could you please explain what backtracking is (please provide an example)? still trying to learn online-mafia-mechanics

I voted RC because I thought that he was disappointed that he wasn't on Anon's list, but I misread and he actually said that he was happy to be on the probtown list. My premise on him was wrong, so I unvoted. But...

Apologies to all: I was writing a bunch of flavor for role PMs for a mini-theme I am modding, and now they are all finally out. Expect a re-read and some more in-depth posting this weekend, now that I have some time, and I'm less busy with my modding commitments now that the game's finally started. *whew!*

That really bugs me because I still thought he was doing a good job at being active and posting, but why do you need to apologize?

[Tasky]

Vote: Sharkfinn

for blatant misrep, and backtracking

excuse me, could you please explain what backtracking is (please provide an example)? still trying to learn online-mafia-mechanics

I voted RC because I thought that he was disappointed that he wasn't on Anon's list, but I misread and he actually said that he was happy to be on the probtown list. My premise on him was wrong, so I unvoted. But...

I was actually asking for a definition of backtracking... looked it up on the wiki but found nothing

[Karma]

That really bugs me because I still thought he was doing a good job at being active and posting, but why do you need to apologize?

Um...what? It bugs you that RC has promised a content-filled post? Why? Is it because he might figure out that you're scum?

unvote, vote: SharkFinn

I like the TheLonging wagon too but this one just feels more right to me.

[ReaperCharlie]

Pro-tip: Backtracking is first saying one thing (valid or not), and then reversing your stance and saying another thing once someone puts pressure on your original premise.

[Tasky]

Pro-tip: Backtracking is first saying one thing (valid or not), and then reversing your stance and saying another thing once someone puts pressure on your original premise.

I don't really get why that is necessarily scummy... if someone sees he was committing an error, what's so wrong about admitting it?
wouldn't it be more scummy to stay on an argument that has been shown faulty?
I could accept it as a scumtell if the first argument was scummy in the first place, but what need is there to appeal to backtracking then?
so actually I think backtracking is (if taken alone) a null-tell

[diginova]

Pro-tip: Backtracking is first saying one thing (valid or not), and then reversing your stance and saying another thing once someone puts pressure on your original premise.

I don't really get why that is necessarily scummy... if someone sees he was committing an error, what's so wrong about admitting it?
wouldn't it be more scummy to stay on an argument that has been shown faulty?
I could accept it as a scumtell if the first argument was scummy in the first place, but what need is there to appeal to backtracking then?
so actually I think backtracking is (if taken alone) a null-tell

Backtracking is a null tell at certain times, especially if the person putting pressure brought up either a logical fallacy or radical new information, but backtracking whenever a little bit of pressure is put on you is a common scum tactic to try placating everybody so they aren't under suspicion or the eventual lynchee.

Tasky and the others who this is their first game on-site: How would you describe your playstyle? Do you have any links to sample games off-site that can be viewed for some background information?

[ReaperCharlie]

My vote on him for backtracking was a joke. Ergo, one might expect me to unvote.

But then my unvote would be considered backtracking. And I wouldn't want to do that! Right?


And thus, we also learn what WIFOM is.

[SharkFinn]

That really bugs me because I still thought he was doing a good job at being active and posting, but

why do you need to apologize?

Um...what? It bugs you that RC has promised a content-filled post? Why? Is it because he might figure out that you're scum?

unvote, vote: SharkFinn

I like the TheLonging wagon too but this one just feels more right to me.

The apology bugs me because it is unwarranted, not the content-filled post. I'd actually like to see what he has to say (which is why I'm not voting him yet).

[diginova]

EBWOP (after 2 ninjas): Answering my own question, since this is my first non-Newbie: I'd say my playstyle is probably overly cautious; I don't normally place non-RVS votes unless they do something that is overtly scummy or after a fair amount of discussion.

[Tasky]

but backtracking whenever a little bit of pressure is put on you is a common scum tactic to try placating everybody so they aren't under suspicion or the eventual lynchee.

well I agree with that, but it doesn't apply to SharkFinn's case, does it?

Vote: Sharkfinn

for blatant misrep, and backtracking

do you still hold to your accuse based on backtracking? if yes, I'd like a good argument for that. if no, will you continue accusing just based on the misrep?
are there other scummy things in SharkFinn other than misrep/backtracking that made you vote for him?

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Tasky and the others who this is their first game on-site: How would you describe your playstyle? Do you have any links to sample games off-site that can be viewed for some background information?

it's the first time I play online-mafia, so my online play-stile yet has to be formed... I can tell you about my face-to-face-play-stile:
I like taking control of the game early, ask question, somehow lead the discussion... this is also because I want to get people talking... In face-to-face mafia my favorite type of questions is "A, what do you think about B"; "A, what do you think about the fact that B thinks C is scum?" and similar things... from what I get, I'd say it's less effective in online-mafia, since the whole emotion-related reads (face, body-language,...) are missing
usually the ones I play mafia with let me do my game, since it's favorable to them to have somebody who exposes himself doing the questioning, so I never really needed to change my playing-style.

[ReaperCharlie]

Uh... you've been here since 2007 and you're only a Goon? /facepalm

[ReaperCharlie]

That was @ diginova btw

[Tasky]

EDIT: damn... made a quote error again...
my post should look like this:

*********start of post correction***********

but backtracking whenever a little bit of pressure is put on you is a common scum tactic to try placating everybody so they aren't under suspicion or the eventual lynchee.

well I agree with that, but it doesn't apply to SharkFinn's case, does it?

Vote: Sharkfinn

for blatant misrep, and backtracking

do you still hold to your accuse based on backtracking? if yes, I'd like a good argument for that. if no, will you continue accusing just based on the misrep?
are there other scummy things in SharkFinn other than misrep/backtracking that made you vote for him?

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Tasky and the others who this is their first game on-site: How would you describe your playstyle? Do you have any links to sample games off-site that can be viewed for some background information?

[/quote]
it's the first time I play online-mafia, so my online play-stile yet has to be formed... I can tell you about my face-to-face-play-stile:
I like taking control of the game early, ask question, somehow lead the discussion... this is also because I want to get people talking... In face-to-face mafia my favorite type of questions is "A, what do you think about B"; "A, what do you think about the fact that B thinks C is scum?" and similar things... from what I get, I'd say it's less effective in online-mafia, since the whole emotion-related reads (face, body-language,...) are missing
usually the ones I play mafia with let me do my game, since it's favorable to them to have somebody who exposes himself doing the questioning, so I never really needed to change my playing-style.

**********end of post correction**********

[curiouskarmadog]

holy shit, when he said "razorback" I thought he meant an aggressive gorilla not a person....ok that explains why everyone is talking about "razorback" (was confused)....who I dont think I know...anyway, need to reread shit now that I realized razorback is a person and not a gorilla...god, I am fucking slow.

at any rate, probably going to be busy until Tuesday....

[curiouskarmadog]

also

unvote

until then.

[diginova]

Uh... you've been here since 2007 and you're only a Goon? /facepalm

I played in a newbie all the way back in 07 and had a completely idiotic scum partner who pretty much gave up on the game. I then left for about 2 years or so, then came back and pretty much stayed in MishMash until a couple weeks ago since classwork took up 8 hours a day. Now that I've graduated, I have more time to actually play Mafia.
Thus why I replied to my own question, since I don't think anyone here has played with me.