Richard wrote:MoI: I can give you scumreads, but they won't be team-specific because I'm just not that guy.
Then give them. I think it bears repeating that you’ve cruised by on your ‘confirmed’ status all game and we are at the point where everyone needs to be providing input if they are Town.
Mina wrote:I'm not sure why people dislike that I'm putting pressure on MagnaofIllusion.
I doubt anyone dislikes that I am under pressure. If anything the distate probably stems from the vitriolic nature of your comments and the aggression that you are suddenly displaying. It is certain a far cry from your ‘I suck at this game, my reads stink’ theme you were playing to the hilt earlier. It’s quite a strange change of pace.
Mina wrote:There's lots that makes me itch about MagnaofIllusion's most recent post, but first I'll point out this whammy.
I've been meaning to call you on this since Day One.
Here you are. ISOs 13 and 14. MagnaofIllusion's reactions to CMAR's two-shot BP claim.
Cow can confirm that I've been concocting elaborate theories involving Magna being a SK or being a BP Greyjoy (and being the role on the Greyjoys that replaced the roleblocker on the Lannisters, since I'd thought Mikujin was town).
It looks like you were planning to set up a roleclaim (or thought that CMAR was a BP SK or BP member of the other scumteam), but ended up abandoning it after CMAR flipped town.
This is your whammy? Let me just direct you to a pertinent link
BP in AGoT.
I’m not an idiot. I do my homework to the extent possible. Since reading multiple volumes of a fantasy series wasn’t practical for me I did the next best thing – read the previous game. The manner in which Faraday explicitly used the mechanic in the Mini Theme I expected (and was correct) that he would use here. So when CMAR claimed BP out of the blue without the piece about notification it was worth questioning.
Now my turn to ask you a question –
If this is such the smoking gun of my guilt why didn’t you bring it up earlier? Town has no reason to specifically leave rocks unturned. In fact your ISO is littered with statements along the lines of ‘I need to check into that’.
Mina wrote:wrong as my suspicions were, I think I'm really, really obviously town in the Kingsguard QT. Far more so than I am in the game thread.
This is the sort of statement that rubs me the wrong way. Why can’t you be obv-Town in thread? I have every reason to believe Cow (if not to trust his judgements) but stating that your Town play shines through in a subforum that only one other player can access isn’t compelling to me. It’s much easier to be ‘Town’ when only one set of eyes is there to examine your statements. Much easier to tailor your posts to his ‘tastes’. Given your statement about 'disliking smart players who are not obv-town" why shouldn't I and others distrust you?
Mina wrote:Magna, any response to Mac's calling you on going from "No one put anyone at more than four votes!" to "Let me put Axelrod to L-1"? I mean, considering you think he's town and all, he probably deserves an answer.
That’s not exactly what I’m being accused of. Macavitar is attacking me on two fronts.
1. That I didn’t follow HIS statement not to put someone above four votes.
2. He’s characterizing that I didn’t follow my FOS suggestion and voted for Axelrod.
My response is as follows –
1. Despite the fact that I believe he is Town I don’t find his word ‘law’. I quite honestly didn’t even recall that he wrote it until he bolded that passage in his accusation.
2. No-one at all, even Mac himself, commented favourably on my suggestion so I dropped it.
3. I voted for Axel because he was (based on my partnership work) likely to be scum and Unsight was not going to be a viable lynch for unknown reasons.
4. I can’t be a scum-buddy setting up CSL for the quickhammer. Does you think I deviously conspired to put my vote right next to Miku (despite the elaborate Greyjoy distancing going on) in hopes some stupid Town player would hammer (or hoping the Lannisters would)?
Mina wrote:Also, didn't you say on D4 that you thought diddin wasn't a Lannister (for the same reason you'd thought MacavityLock wasn't one--you didn't believe all four of them were on the Richard mob)?
That's not accurate. Here’s what I wrote regarding diddin my VC analysis of Day 1.
MoI ISO 59 wrote:Diddin – Only appears as a suspected Greyjoy list in the above VC analysis and Locke’s has represented his role name would not be Greyjoy aligned.
Here’s my Day 2 VC analysis impression of diddin -
MoI ISO 61 wrote:Lannister – Unsight, CSL, diddin, mina
Greyjoy – Muki, Axelrod
Diddin was clearly in the pool of Lannister suspects. And here’s my blurb from the partnership analysis.
Moi ISO 62 wrote:In review his soft ‘support’ for dana’s wagon while never questioning him or interacting with IDI or xvart make me suspect he’s a likely Lannister if any still are around. Reading through his ISO from KOL Mafia (where he was scum partners with Richard, Zhero, and Valeo) shows a different playstyle. He bussed Richard hard Day 1 and later votes for Valeo in later days. He has minimal interaction with zhero and valeo. Perhaps his play here is a reaction to the game results? Not definitive in my eyes.
Suspicion of Lannister – Medium
So no, a single comment regarding his Day 1 VC isn’t an accurate portrayal of my thoughts. Clearly I think diddin is potentially the last Lannister (along with you). But looking at the ISO would have showed you that.
Mina wrote:I already mentioned that you and Percy came to the same conclusion about Greyjoys being early on the dana wagon. Now that Mikujin has flipped, it turns out it wasn't an evil scheme to lead us away from the real Greyjoys, but it still smacks of too much of a coincidence...particularly you never gave a good reason for why you thought the best place to look was on the early dana wagon and not on the early SSBF wagon when both should be equivalent to a Greyjoy.
So it is impossible for me to come to a logical conclusion shared by a player independently? If you think so that’s fine. I can’t exactly argue against an argument that sums to “I think it can’t be coincidence”. Especially since my thought process was correct to the extent that Miku was right there.
Mina wrote:Another one is both you AND Mikujin try to push the theory that we're not in a 4-4-1 on D4.
Again, I can't argue that it's too much coincidence. Can you explain the scum motivation I would have for that? Because SSBF’s history of killing scum would certainly make remaining scum more likely to argue for his continued life.
What happened to the ‘grand distancing’ theory you were just expounding? I’m curious because when it favors your argument I probably was clearly distancing. When it doesn’t I’m leaving easily found scum-links everywhere.
Mina wrote:It doesn't seem like an obvious conclusion at all. I know I'd assumed the teams were symmetrical after two godfather and two goon flips. What's wrong with multiple blocking roles when one of them is town-aligned? After Mikujin's Watcher flip, I think that the scum teams are asymmetrical. So it looks like you knew the Greyjoys didn't have a roleblocker.
So again – I can’t have a theory that now looks to be correct without it being inside knowledge. The reason it didn’t make sense to me then (and still doesn’t) is that 3 separate dedicated RB roles (2 scum RBers and 1 Town JK) seems heavy even in a 20 some player game.
Mina wrote:Here you are. You're thinking like a Greyjoy.
See the game from the perspective of either a townie or a Lannister-aligned player, who has no idea that Mikujin is a Greyjoy.
I have no clue who Mikujin really watched last night. That's completely irrelevant to the point I was making. But do you deny that he hadn't watched Locke on N3, given his behaviour? Do you deny that the obvious target for a watcher, after a doctor had just died, would be the cop again on N4?
Now, imagine that you're a killer.
Who do you think the town-aligned Watcher who'd watched Locke last night is going to watch this night?
I’m making arguments from the obvious hindsight of knowing Miku was Greyjoy.
I’ve never denied that it appears Miku watched Locke N3. From a Town perspective watching Locke makes sense.
But your argument is very much from a skewed prespective. The concept of a Greyjoy RB has been put out in thread multiple times. The Lannister, going into N4, has no idea if it is correct or not. They are the last member of their Squad. A successful scan of them ends any chance at victory. So you are arguing that the Lannisters must assume a let Locke live and hope the Greyjoys do the 'dirty' work. Why then, from a perspective of going into Night 4, wouldn't the Lannisters think the Greyjoys are in a similar situation regarding being Watched and thus expect a Miku kill from the Greyjoys? It would not end their chance at victory but is still a very valid concern (from a perspective that doesn't know Miku is Greyjoy).
In summary ascribing detailed motivation to the last Lannister without direct knowledge of why they acted like they did is WIFOM.
So should I accuse you of thinking like a Lannister?
Mina wrote:Answer this honestly. Did you figure out that Mikujin was a watcher (and not some other "weak" information role) on D3?
His crumbing of watcher / tracker was there. His exchange with Axel regarding his knowing what happened to Locke on N3 nudged me further along the path that Axel was scum after Miku voted for him.
"I am a leaf on the wind ... watch how I soar!"
Pretty much Geriatric game restricted at this point ... unless there are players I REALLY want to play with.
