Succession Mafia (OVER!)

[ReaperCharlie]

-You've been pretty useless throughout the game.

So? I can name at least 2 other people who were more useless .. And how is that indicative of alignment?

It's indicative for YOU. Because you're usually a pretty useful guy, and very pro-town as town.

RC is scum. I hope one of my loose cannon brothers kills you ..

I really hope you don't think this load of BS will fly. rofl

[Yosarian2]

- Your cult can recruit or kill theory is wrong

Huh? That's interesting...how do you know that, ooba?

But lets assume your cult can kill or recruit theory is right, which is better - adding a person to my scum group hence increasing the clout of the group (or) kill someone ...
Recruiting is twice as useful as killing ..

Well, a lot of cult groups can't recruit either pro-town power roles, or members of the other cult group. If a cult group had the chance to kill a pro-town power role, or possibly to kill someone they thought was the other cult recruiter, then it might be worth losing a recruitment attempt in order to get rid of them, especially since that would also mean that cult recruit attempts on people with unknown roles would fail fairly often.

- Irrelevant - he was not on my town reads

That doesn't make it "irrelevent". If I think someone is clearly town, and you kill them and they flip town, I'm going to have a problem with your play.

I'm still unclear about why you were so sure he was scum as to use up what you're claiming is a one-shot vig kill on night 1 on someone who didn't have a chance to claim and who a lot of people thought was town, and you didn't really answer my question when I asked you this before. Why were you that confident he was scum, ooba?

RC is scum. I hope one of my loose cannon brothers kills you ..

What do you think about Andreus, ooba? Do you think he's lying, do you think he got roleblocked, or what?

[ReaperCharlie]

-You seem to know know the

scum

didn't kill dram.

- Your cult can recruit or kill theory is wrong

a) how do you know it's wrong?
b) who said it's MY theory?

[ReaperCharlie]

And... ninja'd by Yos2

[singersigner]

One other relevent question I have.

He wasn't 100% explicit, but I had the very strong impression that yesterday TheLonging was claiming to be a one-shot vig and that he announced that he was going to kill Gandalf last night (who, obv, is still alive). I'm kind of doubting that there are 3 oro-town vigs in the game (Zwet, Ooba, and TheLonging), so this would be a good time for TheLonging to clarify his claim, and say who, if anyone, he shot last night; that would help us figure out what's going on here.

lol. Yeah, I was trying to figure out the context of his soft-claims, as they seemed fairly random...
So, he claimed one-shot vig, which I can verify is true. My understanding is that he did not use this ability last night, and I chose not to since I wouldn't have known who to target with the amount of time I had. However, this is making me concerned for Zwet and Ooba's claims. I'll have to look into what Zwet claimed, but Ooba's is exactly the same as mine, so...hmm...

[ReaperCharlie]

I'm kind of doubting that there are 3 pro-town vigs in the game

On second thought...there theoretically could be, in a multi-cult-recruiter game. It would make the game much more swingy and random, and I still don't think it's likely, but it's not impossible. I guess getting a counterclaim might be pointless here.

Looking back at Andreus's posts day 1, he did say that "something bad" would happen if he targeted the brothers. Did you ever get clarification on that? Could "not getting a result" (and the whole "getting suckerpunched" thing or whatever) be what the mod meant?

No because I got sucker punched too (by Andrius).

And I find it PRETTY FREAKIN' CONVENIENT that ooba claimed Loose Cannon, just like zwet who is conveniently ALREADY FLIPPED.

ooba's got a pretty good head on his shoulders so obviously he'll want to make up a fake claim that's got a hint of believability in it.

And it's perfect to copy someone else's role, add your own 'flavor', and then conveniently a few posts later speculate this:

Setup spec:
- 2 Recruiters
- Investigative roles as town needs em to help against cult
+ Bunch of other roles which start out pro-town but help cult if recruited
-- Bodyguard (Can protect recruiter from vig)
-- Loose cannon (Vig can kill people who suspect recruiter; It is nerfed since it is one-shot)

[ReaperCharlie]

And it is also pretty convenient how utterly useless you were day 1 compared to the vast majority of people in the game, but now you're on an activity-splosion now that it seems like you might get lynched. You have 16 posts total in the first 52 pages of the game, and all of a sudden you have seven more in the last 2 pages.

Something smells, and it's not my armpits. I put deodorant on today.

*sniffs himself anyway just to make sure*

[ReaperCharlie]

I'll have to look into what Zwet claimed

Zwet did not claim IIRC; he was one of last night's NKs.

[ooba]

-You've been pretty useless throughout the game.

So? I can name at least 2 other people who were more useless .. And how is that indicative of alignment?

It's indicative for YOU. Because you're usually a pretty useful guy, and very pro-town as town.

I can point at least one town game where I am pretty useless for the most part ..
Can you point out one scum game where I was useless?
Preview: Again I have upped my posting level as I was wagoned as town - why is this an alignment tell?

@Yos
- That's what I think the setup is - A cult which can just recruit
"Well, a lot of cult groups can't recruit either pro-town power roles,

or members of the other cult group.

"
If this was the case, then it makes even more sense to recruit early to make sure the other group fails more often later.

"Why were you that confident he was scum, ooba?"
I wasn't but he was MY top scum read. Killing made sense since I hoped to hit the recruiter.

Andruis got roleblocked ..

[Yosarian2]

No - The lack of a counterclaim confirms my kill ...

When someone claims a kill, I generally assume that either they or one of their scumbuddies made the kill; almost no one ever claims a kill if they think that there might be a vig that knows their lying. That was not what I wanted the counterclaim for.

Only question you have to ask yourself is "Do you think I was recruited N0?" ..

You could have been, or you could be part of a cult group that has a kill, or there could be someone else in your scum group could have made the kill.

In other words, if you're the recruiter, and you recruit a vig, then if they made a kill that you know about you can claim the kill without worrying about being counterclaimed. Or, of course, if your scumgroup has a kill and you make it, you can also claim the kill and claim to be a vig without worrying about being counterclaimed.

You're stretching with the "something bad"="not getting a result" part ..

I'm trying to figure out a possible explanation for what happened last night. Day 1, he made vague comments that something bad might happen if he targets a brother; after that, he targets you, and claims that something vaguely bad happens, and he dosn't get an investigation. Why is me asking Andreus if the two could be connected be "stretching"?

[Yosarian2]

Wow, posts are coming fast here.

lol. Yeah, I was trying to figure out the context of his soft-claims, as they seemed fairly random...
So, he claimed one-shot vig, which I can verify is true. My understanding is that he did not use this ability last night, and I chose not to since I wouldn't have known who to target with the amount of time I had. However, this is making me concerned for Zwet and Ooba's claims. I'll have to look into what Zwet claimed, but Ooba's is exactly the same as mine, so...hmm...

Ok. Ooba's claim, the whole "one shot vig or one shot double voter" thing is exactly the same as your role? Interesting.

That makes it a little more belivable. If he knew it that exactly, I think that means that either Ooba has that role, or he is in a scum group with someone who has that role (or had it and then got recruited, or something like that).

[ooba]

Furcolow, Town reads based on
Vezo - claim + timing of claim (early claim which he thought would help town)
gandalf - generally get the feeling that he's far too reckless to be scum

TheLonging - Secret reasons. He looks like a loose cannon.

erg0, Faraday - vib

Pretty much destroys your "Ooba made that up after zwet's flip" theory ..

@Yos: If it helps your analysis - If I am a recruiter who recruited a cannon, I did it on N0 ..

[Faraday]

Wow. Ooba's town here I'm pretty fucking sure. The kill on zwet makes bags of sense, couldn't have really picked a better target. Zwet was scummy, so yeah.

[Faraday]

think that means that either Ooba has that role, or he is in a scum group with someone who has that role (or had it and then got recruited, or something like that).

Mafia one shit vig (if that was their only killing power) probably isn't that far fetched, but with the best will in the world I doubt zwet would have been that high on any hypothetical mafia factions nightkill list.

I'm trying to understand the Andrius situation atm. I guess I could see him being roleblocked in the hope he's mislynched...maybe? I don't think it's that unlikely.

[vezokpiraka]

Apparently there are more of the same role.
Are there any rolebockers here?
If we get at least one roleblocker claim then Andrius is cleared. If we don;t he dies.

[Yosarian2]

Zwet (or some other loose cannon) killed dram ..

This actually seems more possible, now that I think about it.

Looking at Zwet's posts, he ended the day voting for Dram. Also, I can't really imagining Zwet not vigging someone, given the chance.

PPE: Huh, interesting breadcrumb, ooba. I hadn't noticed that.

So; either ooba is a loose cannon (who might or might not have been recruited), or else he recruited a loose cannon night zero and then instantly started to breadcrumb for a loose cannon claim. That kind of strategy would be brilliant, but it's probably not that likely. (Also, if ooba was a loose cannon who got recruited, that wouldn't actually explain the failed cop investigation at all.)

Ok. I want to hear from Andreius, but I don't think we want to lynch ooba today; he's probably either town, or a recruited loose cannon who already used up his kill; either way, we've got bigger fish to fry. Especially after that disaster at the end of day 1, our goal needs to be to lynch a recruiter today.

[Andrius]

Intresting.
I didn't die.
And Andrius didn't die.

unvote
vote andrius

Serious.

Hey dumbass, dramonic died protecting me. Some players in this game are actually

useful

, and not complete asshats.
I understand why Seraphim left.

Oh. I am stupid.

unvote

You didn't have to tell us that...

No shit.

One other relevent question I have.

He wasn't 100% explicit, but I had the very strong impression that yesterday TheLonging was claiming to be a one-shot vig and that he announced that he was going to kill Gandalf last night (who, obv, is still alive). I'm kind of doubting that there are 3 oro-town vigs in the game (Zwet, Ooba, and TheLonging), so this would be a good time for TheLonging to clarify his claim, and say who, if anyone, he shot last night; that would help us figure out what's going on here.

Same here. But Longing replaced out, Yos.

Setup spec:
- 2 Recruiters
- Investigative roles as town needs em to help against cult
+ Bunch of other roles which start out pro-town but help cult if recruited
-- Bodyguard (Can protect recruiter from vig)
-- Loose cannon (Vig can kill people who suspect recruiter; It is nerfed since it is one-shot)

I agree with this. Even I'd be an asset though, since I can hunt down the other mafia faction (B, if A recruited me). And as veok said, I'm still town-aligned.
Also, perhaps the mafia factions DON'T get a NK. Perhaps they have to recruit the loose cannons in order for them to kill, etc. Just a though. Like, the recruiters have to recruit any PRs they want on their side. So if they want a Cop, they'll come after me. If they want a loose cannon, they'd go after The Longing...
SPEAKING OF WHICH, we need to keep tabs on these Vigs. Nothing is more beneficial to the mafia than kills and recruits. I feel we (aka, vezok/me) should watch TheLonging.

Looking back at Andreus's posts day 1, he did say that "something bad" would happen if he targeted the brothers. Did you ever get clarification on that? Could "not getting a result" (and the whole "getting suckerpunched" thing or whatever) be what the mod meant?

I could ask for more clarification... but I don't I'll get anything worth much.
Yos, I suckerpunched ooba, not the other way around.
I get the feeling I'd be killed/ maimed if I target a Son.

No because I got sucker punched too (by Andrius).

Naw, I hit you in the back of the head. XD /sneaky

I'm trying to understand the Andrius situation atm. I guess I could see him being roleblocked in the hope he's mislynched...maybe? I don't think it's that unlikely.

Call me crazy, but I feel like I'm being kept alive by the mafia factions until they don't have a better PR to convert to their side. Like, they'll come for me once they don't have a lead on a vig/blocker/doc or whatever. Until then I'm probably going to be roleblocked until the end of time...

Activity explosion is great. I work better this way.

predit: vezok's last post is fucking stupid, asking for my lynch if no one claims Roleblocker. WTF. You're rolefishing and, if that falls through, asks for the COP to get lynched?
I don't carae if you're a town PR. You need to die or STFU. Because its getting really annoying playing with you, and I sympathize with Seraphim's plight.

predit2: Hi Yos. You ninja'd me. And there's no 'e' in my name, so you can call me 'Andy' if its easier for you. XD

[Yosarian2]

Apparently there are more of the same role.
Are there any rolebockers here?
If we get at least one roleblocker claim then Andrius is cleared. If we don;t he dies.

...what?

The scum could have started out with a roleblocker. Or the town could have started out with exactally one roleblocker, and that person got recruited. No one claiming roleblocker dosn't prove anything about Andrius; for that matter, if someone does claim roleblocker, that dosn't tell us anything about andrius either.

The claims you're trying to get tell us nothing, vezo, and you're fishing for even more town roles to claim for no good reason.

[ooba]

So; either ooba is a loose cannon (who might or might not have been recruited), or else he recruited a loose cannon night zero and then instantly started to breadcrumb for a loose cannon claim. That kind of strategy would be brilliant, but it's probably not that likely. (Also, if ooba was a loose cannon who got recruited, that wouldn't actually explain the failed cop investigation at all.)

Ok. I want to hear from Andreius, but I don't think we want to lynch ooba today; he's probably either town, or a recruited loose cannon who already used up his kill; either way, we've got bigger fish to fry. Especially after that disaster at the end of day 1, our goal needs to be to lynch a recruiter today.

Good. Although I should point out that you've ignored the case where I had a loose cannon fakeclaim ..

[ooba]

Andrius, without getting modkilled, can you tell us what exactly happened when you targeted RC on night 0 and me on night 1?

[Andrius]

ooba, I'm pretty sure I've made that information abundantly clear in previous posts.

[Yosarian2]

Hey dumbass, dramonic died protecting me.

Do you actually know if that's true?

Also, the so-called "softclaims" are getting so incredibly obvious by this point that I might as well just say it; I'm pretty sure vezokpiraka is claiming to be a watcher who targeted you last night; if so he might actually know if someone tried to kill you.

I suckerpunched ooba, not the other way around.

Ok.

I get the feeling I'd be killed/ maimed if I target a Son.

Interesting.

predit2: Hi Yos. You ninja'd me. And there's no 'e' in my name, so you can call me 'Andy' if its easier for you. XD

TO be fair, I never spell anyone's name right, heh.

[vezokpiraka]

Nah.
I am not a watcher.

[Faraday]

No pro town roleblocker would target andrius last night unless they're completely retarded.

Also Yos Scumgroup A tried to kill andy and scumgroup B roleblocked him is another posibillity isn't it?

[Yosarian2]

- That's what I think the setup is - A cult which can just recruit

The biggest reason I think that's unlikely is that I have trouble seeing a pro-town bodyguard in a game where the scum don't have a kill.