Zachtown in the mountains (Game over TOWN WINS!)

[Furcolow]

i cant catchup right now
i have to go to work
i am a townie, so IAI either you are making things up or are scum just at a glance
glad you unvoted me, though, if you're town

[Oso]

..
So you only found one thing right about him, and many things wrong about him. But yet you in your last post said...(wait for it...) "I had ran across enough of a reason to think Furc may not be scum".
..

Yep, you hit it right on the head. That's exactly what I said and I meant it.

The answer is right there in part of the post of mine that you quoted.

..

..

one person

misses a lot of things that

three people

wouldn't. In this case I would guess the

mountainous set-up

was discussed at least in passing,

..

Note the three bold parts. Relate that to how this game is set up and you'll see exactly why I'm willing to believe Furcolow is not scum at this moment even with what he has said in some of his posts.

[Benmage]

Does anyone at this point not think IAI is a huge, wasted slot,

TOWN

-noob?

Yeah, I don't think that. I think he's an okay guy. I think you're the one who's wasting time tunnelling on a slot you supposedly see as town.

You don't think him town...thats funny considering:

I actually like you IAI. I think Sotty is being too harsh on you for what I see as a fairly common argument between you and Benmage (although it's a little shorter than normal perhaps). Two townies go crazy on each other but eventually back off with both of them conceding that the other is likely town.

Tunneling a slot to confirm them town to the whole game...sounds like a check in my book. Worried we're gonna start confirming people as not scum? I'd be.

[Furcolow]

makes no sense

unvote;
vote: benmage

[Oso]

Did a total re-read.

Some things that jumped out at me on players that have been the focus of attention at various points.

Elmo. Jury's still out for me on him but I will say up front I don't mind having him around. I like the way he pokes and prods and doesn't mind at all playing the "Devil's Advocate" (I think is the proper term), when he defends people. To be honest, I've never seen that sort of defending others play-style in a mafia game (to the extent he is using it) and it's throwing me on how to read him. I'm getting the definite impression though, that he votes people not so much to get a reaction out them as to see what others might do with the vote.

Red. I have considered what other folks have mentioned based on meta. I haven't played with him so I have no way to know if they are valid. He does seem to be an agreeable player but that makes him come across as non-committal in all but his vote of Jason. I don't like that he is voting jason at the moment but I've read his reasons. Borderline, as I can see them coming from town or opportunistic scum. I will say I disagree with Percy on one point though, I don't see his conceding he had made a mistake as scummy. He reacted pretty much as I expected someone who has made a mistake. He admitted it and moved on.

Benamge/IaI. Neither looks particularly good to me. IaI for his meltdown (which I hate to admit does point to a townie coming unhinged under pressure from my experience, rather than from scum) and Benmage for his confrontational posting style. I'm still smarting from the last time I tried to look that past that and ended up being wrong. On Benmage, I'm looking for a repeat of my last encounter with him. Get run up/involved in a fight early Day 1, posting like a berserk bulldog and then....I'll let you know if see the same pattern repeat. Up until then, the way he is posting is much more important than any content he is posting in my opinion. He bears watching at any stage of the game.

Nik/Jason (and to a lesser extent add IKD and Furcolow in this) Nik made decent point against Jason and up until he made that phony claim (which on my first read I thought was a joke) I was leaning that direction but like Elmo (I think it was Elmo) said, the whole situations is pretty much a head exploder if I think on it too hard. I will go out on a limb here and say that if one of the three (jason/IKD/Furcolow) does turn out to be scum I'm fairly sure the other two aren't. That's the point I was trying to get across to IaI in my last post. One person (by himself) might easily miss the fact this was vanilla. It is also possible that one of three scum might have a brain fart and forgot but I'd bet money right now that if Zach opened the mafia quick-topic for pre-Day 1 discussion, the fact that this is a vanilla game came up. In my mind there is a decent chance none of the jason/IKD/Furcolow trio is scum. Nik I don't want to see lynched today either. He pulled a stunt similar to this before (I mentioned the game briefly) and I am curious as to where he will go with it.

Sotty, Percy, Locke, Kaleidoscope, Mina, Mongoose. Nothing really stands out about you folks at the moment.

Which brings me back to my main suspect: Dry-fit. He's pretty much the only one I am getting a definite scum read off of.

Second choice would be Benmage. Not so much for what he has or hasn't posted but rather because the pattern he is currently showing is matching up almost exactly to the scum game I saw from him. Granted, it is hard to have a meta based on one game and he may act like that in all his games but there it is.

I did promise three but so far, I can't find a third person who I'd be willing to lynch today. And even Benmage is iffy. It would be hard to justify lynching him just because he is exhibiting a familiar pattern.

[Furcolow]

of the 3, the likeliest to be scum would be jason imo

[Locke Lamora]

Oso: in reference to Nik, do you mean the daycop stunt? Where else could there be to go with it?

[Nikanor]

This fucking game.

Don't worry Nik I'm not ignoring you I'm just not believing your explanations. Your vote on Jason is easy and pretty weak considering the situation and I don't feel inclined to move my vote off you because of it.

My vote on jason has never been easy or weak. I've been pushing this bloody wagon uphill all the way. I've been pointing out everything that points to jasonscum since his first serious post of the day. My vote is not weak.
Since I really want a lynch to happen before Halloween, I'll do a re-read tomorrow and possibly change my vote. It doesn't look like a majority of people want to lynch jason today.

And yeah I'm not going anywhere else with the daycop thing.

[Furcolow]

unvote;
vote: jasont1981

i don't want him to be cleared
if he was scum he would have made the same defense he made
i haven't heard anything from him, and i read nikanor as town
we can take our time, there is no rush. even if we don't get a lynch by halloween, or if we do, the day will still keep going.

votes should be like this:

Redcoyote - 4 (KaleiÐoscøpe, Mina, Percy, Elmo)
Jasont1981 - 4 (Nikanor, RedCoyote, Dry-fit, Furcolow)
Dry-fit - 2 (Oso, Locke Lamora)
I Am Innocent - 1 (Benmage)
Nikanor - 1 (Sotty7)
Benmage - 1 (Imkingdavid)
Furcolow - 1 (Mongoose)
Oso - 1 (I Am Innocent)
Not Voting: (JasonT1981)

We have about 2 weeks still to lynch, so this isn't damning, but JasonT should have his vote out somewhere by now. I am happy to lynch him because I feel if he was town his vote would be

somewhere

.

[Percy]

My vote has never been about jason's reaction. I said that in my last post. This just goes to show how much attention you are paying to what I am saying.
Why do you think that jason is town?

You asked that second question twice. Why are you recruiting for this wagon so hard?

I had a gut read of him, and I thought the only legitimate points made against him were regarding his reaction to your claim gambit. For example, when he said:

flat out lie. He is not a day cop.. If he was, he would know

my proper role

and not that I am mafia.

That sounds like scum who haven't figured out their fakeclaim. Which is why I said the reaction was providing justification.

Hey Pecry, I wish I was scum so I didn't have to read every word. Is it nice skimming?

Was this solely on the back of Nikanor's reaction? I haven't skimmed at all this game, nice try though.

Interesting....I read what was in the sign-up thread. And didn't re-read what was in this thread. Some time passed, and the detail of instant flips slipped my mind. My last game with multiple lynches waited to the end of the day for flips. Although you honestly believing it a lie...is something i'll note.

So you're saying you read the rules the first time around carefully enough to notice the instant flips (because the doublelynch mechanics are shiny and new and it's the first question that came to my mind), and since forgot? It made much more sense when you were saying it was just a mistake. But now you've said you forgot, and this story shows up when I call you on it. Not buying it.

No dumbass. I quote it to show that you misread the game, Or basically that you forgot about a key element of the game. Notice how I continuously call it to Percy's attention. Because he called out my forgetfulness as a lie. Which it clearly wasn't. Despite you somehow forgetting this game to be mountainous isn't even my point.

Except it's actually completely different. Jason says he misread the game. It's quite a bad misreading. Scummy? I don't think so. But he hasn't now, several posts into clearing up this misunderstanding, said he "forgot".
Your hysterical defence is noted.

Jason thought (or so he says) there was a day cop claiming a guilty on him. I'd be defensive and react strongly too...

Then we clearly have different approaches to the game. Since your side is seemingly winning out, it's probably good that your reaction is in line with the majority.

My side? What side is that, exactly?

Also, of course a daycop with a guilty should claim. What if (s)he's the first NK? Sure there's an argument for waiting for a little while to observe them, but I don't see why it's a bad idea.
And anyway, aren't you saying that Jason is the bad guy here? He's the one that said it was scummy to claim so early, iirc.

The problem is him trying to clarify his statements after the fact with stuff like, "Okay he admits to lying but he doesn't even have a case!"

OK, I'll play along. How is this different to Benmage vs. IAI? Especially with the "forgot" comment.

What happened to the Nikanor wagon?

I liked this, regarding Nik vs. jason:

Doesn't look like real scum hunting, more taking advantage of a players scummish play style.

Locke moved onto Dry-Fit before you explained your vote. Before that it was just "something different". So why ask us where it went? It's your wagon.

OK, I'm up to 221 and I have to go. Be back later.

[mongoose]

Saying I've had no time is an understatement. I have my spanish exam tomorrow, and now my computer got fixed, but the charger broke. reading up what I've missed

[mongoose]

you know, this stat talk is really getting away from the actual objective of finding and lynching scum. I would suspect scum would be happy to drag discussion away from scum hunting in anyway possible maybe even perhaps lead the discussion away.....

I agree with this post. I think the people who lead discussion away from lynching tend to be scum, and the stats didn't help this. However, I am innocent does list his suspicions and they seem to be decent so for now I think he is town.

So it looks like in this statement of yours you agree with my point against IAI that his stat post was filler. Whether he redeemed himself with listing suspicions as well is an entirly different thing.

On the other hand, Benmage's posts dont help much at all.

He suggests 1 lynch every day,

Inaccuracy #1. I never said 1 lynch everyday. I said for the first day only we utilize 1 lynch.

He starts a case on Innocent which is rather pointless stating that posting facts is scummy, which isnt true because hes been posting content along with it.

1. facts were filler, hence scummy
2. content doesn't nullify my initial point.

towards the start of the game, most things are filler, which people use to gauge other people's reactions. You say RVS isn't filler posting to get the game started? I think this is similar.

I think he is the scmmiest player so far, though even then I think its not much of a case and isn't too strong. I have pretty bad feeling about him too.

vote benmage

Explain this last sentence because I am lost.

1. You think I am the scummiest thus far?
2. You don't think the case on me is very strong?
3. You have a bad feeling about me?
^All correct?

that was a while ago but yeah, I thought you were the player most likely to be scum, even with a pretty weak case back then (which still isn't very strong since you haven't been acting bad since the start of the game). And I still have a bad feeling. Maybe its the over eagerness to bicker with IAI.

I've realized quoting stuff makes your posts look important.
Rereading dryfit / red coyote

[mongoose]

oops, the rest of my post didn't show up.

jason's thing about the cop seems kinda pointless. People make mistake and I dont think the fact that he didn't read the set up makes him scum. TBH I forgot the game had no PR's as well.

looking at furcolows last 4 posts he says he thinks we should hurry up and lynch someone, but doesn't say anything contributive as for WHO to lynch. then he gives a vote without information. I don't like that at all.

nothing else really jumped out at me

unvote, vote furcolow

AS TOWN:
1) too much discussion can ruin the game and our lynch
2) Dry-Fit's FoS on me (with me as town) is an expert attempt to try to get me framed...
a. consider he already has a wagon on him
b. consider i am a very easy mislynch
c. consider that i thought there might be roleblockers and medics and shit... i'm obviously a townie
3) You're voting me for wanting to quicklynch, then voting quickly? I'm flip-flopping here? I don't think so!

Dry-Fit is a good lynch. I wouldn't mind us quicklynching him.

I'm gonna read through dryfit's posts after I'm done looking through.

I still need to check his other games, but I've lost my will to continue this wagon after that wide-eyed response from mongoose. It would be like shooting Bambi.

UNVOTE: mongoose

bambi eh? I can live with that.

After all the redcoyote posts i'm gonna reread that one too, though ididn't see much as I went through the thread.


I wasn't too big on the initial case on Jason, since I had made the same mistake in forgetting the roles. However, his over reaction on benmage's post along with that and his slight over reaction makes me feel slightly bad about him. Not enough to warrant a vote though, especially with a rather questionable wagon forming.

redcoyote: I caught his claim but it was a joke, since he had admitted to lying a few posts later. All of that happened while I was asleep iirc. I didn't think too much of it until the whole Jason thin evolved which was a rather stupid case. He made a mistake. I can see why he kept the vote on after he admitted to joking. After finding out is was a vanilla game he took it off. Unvoting was a possibility, but he had a case and maybe a bit of regret in his vote. I excuse that.

[jasonT1981]

sorry, have not been on as much been packing for London and had friends over to the house so not spent much time on here. I would suspect there is scum on my wagon as it seems an easy lynch now especially with how my words are twisted... Scum suspects are IAI, Elmo and Fur.. this post is all wrong in my opinion

unvote;
vote: jasont1981

i don't want him to be cleared
if he was scum he would have made the same defense he made
i haven't heard anything from him, and i read nikanor as town
we can take our time, there is no rush. even if we don't get a lynch by halloween, or if we do, the day will still keep going.

We have about 2 weeks still to lynch, so this isn't damning, but JasonT should have his vote out somewhere by now. I am happy to lynch him because I feel if he was town his vote would be

somewhere

.

He DOESNT want me to be cleared? why???? because it will actually mean him to scumhunt or look elsewhere.. as I said, I am the popular wagon.. this all feels like a easy jump on to me.

Has not heard anything from me? ive posted quite a bit... every day in fact near enough except for yesterday..

tries to make me scummier by saying I have no vote atm.. if he looks back I have had a few of them Furs post is nothing but a quick bandwagon jump in an attempt to push a lynch.

vote:Furcolow

[mongoose]

First off, I realized there's a bit of contradiction with benmage's first quoted comment and my final response to that quote. Yeah, it does direct us away from scum hunting, and while it doesn't help too much I dont think it was too bad. Compared to some other filler posts at the start of the game, it definitely was more helpful.

I dont see anything wrong with dryfit to be honest. I think everything he has said can be justified. On the other hand, redcoyote's posts aren't really that great. There is alot of irrelevant and silly stuff, along with some questionable points (like his votes on sotty and nikanor, I didn't quite catch the reason for those). However there has been alot of stuff I think is townie behavior as well. While I think that the judgment of older, better players than me shouldn't be disregarded, i still think that the case on furcolow is stronger, so I keep my vote there

[Sotty7]

I'm not interested in lynching either furc or Jason today.

Benmage, what are you exactly trying to say with post 227?

My vote on jason has never been easy or weak. I've been pushing this bloody wagon uphill all the way. I've been pointing out everything that points to jasonscum since his first serious post of the day. My vote is not weak.

It's easy and weak in my eyes because I have played a bunch of games with Jason. This is how he fails as a townie, he acts before he thinks. As scum he is much more calm and controlled. I don't agree anything he has done today is obv scum at all.

If we are going to unitize both lynches today we probably want to start moving towards that first lynch sooner rather than later. I'm thinking about what to do with my vote, but it is likely to move over to Red depending on the vote count.

[Zachrulez]

Vote Count #9 of D1 P1

Redcoyote - 4 (KaleiÐoscøpe, Mina, Percy, Elmo)
Jasont1981 - 4 (Nikanor, RedCoyote, Dry-fit, Furcolow)
Dry-fit - 2 (Oso, Locke Lamora)
Furcolow - 2 (Mongoose, JasonT1981)
I Am Innocent - 1 (Benmage)
Nikanor - 1 (Sotty7)
Benmage - 1 (Imkingdavid)
Oso - 1 (I Am Innocent)

Not Voting: ()

If I made any mistakes, please politely point them out and I will correct them.

Deadline for (Both phases of) Day 1 is Thursday November 12 at 12pm CST

With 16 alive it's 9 to lynch.

[Mina]

Aaaaaaaaah, I don't have access to a computer right now, and my phone is low on batteries. So that this isn't a total non-substantial prod dodge, I might as well take this opportunity to answer Sotty's questions from way back. I can probably manage that before my battery dies.

I'm a bit annoyed. Because IaI made so many bad arguments before that self-vote, and on principle, throwing an antitown hissy fit shouldn't manipulate people off his wagon...but it feels genuine. Call me a sucker, but I'm buying it. So I'll direct my attention elsewhere.

What arguments of his were bad to you? I don't like that I have to ask you this when you essentially ask mongoose the same kinda thing in the same post.

Why exactly do you think I am Innocent's suspicions were decent? Which ones in particular were decent?

You'd have a point if I'd voted for him or attacked him in that post. But I didn't see the purpose of wasting breath poking holes in the arguments of someone I believe strongly is town. What would it accomplish? Showing that I'm smarter than IaI?

I'm on my phone so I can't scroll back and look for posts, so maybe I'm misrembering, but just an example: his whole line of attack on Benmage implying that Ben's NL suggestion was scummy, when he didn't even push his "plan" for more than a post. In fact, Dry-fit didn't even correct Benmage by saying they should never NL, just that we should lynch first before making our second decision. Benmage obviously realized on his own that it was a good idea. I can give more if you want, but again, I don't really see the point unless it's to make I am Innocent look bad and show off my rhetorical skills.

This feels like sucking up.

Scummy?

Yep, that was my implication.

@Red: I need time to sit down in front of a computer and reread, but off the top of my head, my other suspects are Furcolow and imkingdavid (I noticed some iffy stuff in their ISO, although that sadly might not be a scumtell with the former). I haven't taken a close enough look at Dry-fit to see if I like the case on him.

@Percy: Why do you have a town read on Locke, Kaleidoscope, and Jason?

@Sotty: Same question, except with the former two.

[Furcolow]

sorry, have not been on as much been packing for London and had friends over to the house so not spent much time on here. I would suspect there is scum on my wagon as it seems an easy lynch now especially with how my words are twisted... Scum suspects are IAI, Elmo and Fur.. this post is all wrong in my opinion

unvote;
vote: jasont1981

i don't want him to be cleared
if he was scum he would have made the same defense he made
i haven't heard anything from him, and i read nikanor as town
we can take our time, there is no rush. even if we don't get a lynch by halloween, or if we do, the day will still keep going.

We have about 2 weeks still to lynch, so this isn't damning, but JasonT should have his vote out somewhere by now. I am happy to lynch him because I feel if he was town his vote would be

somewhere

.

He DOESNT want me to be cleared? why???? because it will actually mean him to scumhunt or look elsewhere.. as I said, I am the popular wagon.. this all feels like a easy jump on to me.

Has not heard anything from me? ive posted quite a bit... every day in fact near enough except for yesterday..

tries to make me scummier by saying I have no vote atm.. if he looks back I have had a few of them Furs post is nothing but a quick bandwagon jump in an attempt to push a lynch.

vote:Furcolow

your case on me is i have a case on you
you also neglected to quote this part, my actual reasoning:


We have about 2 weeks still to lynch, so this isn't damning, but JasonT should have his vote out somewhere by now. I am happy to lynch him because I feel if he was town his vote would be somewhere.

He has now put his vote somewhere. On the person making a case on him. What a fucking joke.

Lets lynch this kid.

[Furcolow]

also, i don't want you to be cleared because i feel your speculation was way more null than mine or IKDs
i wouldnt be surprised if you were scum

[Sotty7]

Mina, I have a town read on Locke because I have agreed with everything he has posted so far. Simple really.

My read on KaleiÐoscøpe is from this post. I just think scum in that position wouldn't have pointed that out or at least they would have let the case boil over some more before then did. Of course this is more reliant on my JasonTown read than anything else.

[jasonT1981]

Guys, I am really sorry. But I am on V/LA as of now. I am getting an early night and leaving tomorrow morning and won't be back home until Tuesday afternoon/evening.. depending on how late I get back into Belfast on monday night.

[Furcolow]

Guys, I am really sorry. But I am on V/LA as of now. I am getting an early night and leaving tomorrow morning and won't be back home until Tuesday afternoon/evening.. depending on how late I get back into Belfast on monday night.

cute you can't defend yourself, because you're "v/la"
sure.
for some reason, I don't believe this.

[Sotty7]

As someone who knows Jason on a personal level, this V/LA is real. He's going to watch the 49ers play in London.

[Furcolow]

oh
well, if you know him on a personal level, what do you find his role to be?