[OLD] Open Setup Ideas and Discussion

[Empking]

Scum 9p

2 Mafia (No Kill)
2 Werewolves

2 Seers
3 Townies

[Andrius]

Why two seers?

[Empking]

Why two seers?

1. So that if a mafiaso claims Seer they won't be counterclaimed (unless there is a dead seer already)
2. To weaken the wolves.

[Andrius]

Makes alot of sense, Emp.
I mean, they could eat the wolves alive N1, but I get the point.

It feels odd without a RB, but yeah. :/

[Empking]

Makes alot of sense, Emp.
I mean, they could eat the wolves alive N1, but I get the point.

It feels odd without a RB, but yeah. :/

Andy, want to nominate it?

[Andrius]

It would be an honor, sir.

Nominate: Scum 9p

[Herodotus]

Who wins in the following:

1Maf : 1Ww

1Maf : 1T

And have you calculated win probabilities?

[Empking]

Who wins in the following:

1Maf : 1Ww

1Maf : 1T

I'd give the Mafia a "win if you make up 50% of the town" and the other two a "win if only your faction remains" so the Mafia would win both of those.

And have you calculated win probabilities?

[/quote]

No because I honestly have no idea how you'd go about doing it. Like how do the Mafia affect the chance of lynching a wolf?

Edit: I'd also be inclined to give the mafia the win if day begins with 1 Mafia:1 Wolf: 1 Townie or 2 Mafia: 2 Wolves: 1 Townie

[Herodotus]

Mafia winning 1:1 and 2:2 is fair.

As far as EV is concerned, it looks hard for the town to win. If the werewolves only kill town, the town can only win if the lynches are:
1. All scumlynches, in any order
2. Both werewolves on the first two days, then no more than one mislynch
3. A werewolf, then a mafia, then a werewolf, then a town, then a mafia

[Empking]

Mafia winning 1:1 and 2:2 is fair.

As far as EV is concerned, it looks hard for the town to win. If the werewolves only kill town, the town can only win if the lynches are:
1. All scumlynches, in any order
2. Both werewolves on the first two days, then no more than one mislynch
3. A werewolf, then a mafia, then a werewolf, then a town, then a mafia

The town is quite powerful when it comes to taking out werewolves due to the two seers and (the way I see it) the mafia can work as a mini-mason group in order to reduce the wolves numbers (since its in their best interest to also scumhunt.)

[Empking]

Empking's Five Player

2 Mafia (Even- Night Kill)

1 One-Shot Publishing Cop (the cop's target has their alignment revealed in the end of night post.)
2 Vanilla Townies

(I calculate the town's chance of winning as 7/18)

[Herodotus]

Empking's Five Player

2 Mafia (Even- Night Kill)

1 One-Shot Publishing Cop (the cop's target has their alignment revealed in the end of night post.)
2 Vanilla Townies

(I calculate the town's chance of winning as 7/18)

Are both the target's name and alignment revealed?

[Empking]

Empking's Five Player

2 Mafia (Even- Night Kill)

1 One-Shot Publishing Cop (the cop's target has their alignment revealed in the end of night post.)
2 Vanilla Townies

(I calculate the town's chance of winning as 7/18)

Are both the target's name and alignment revealed?

Oh yeah, I wrote that wrong. The answer to your question is yes.

[Crazy]

Empking's Five Player

2 Mafia (Even- Night Kill)

1 One-Shot Publishing Cop (the cop's target has their alignment revealed in the end of night post.)
2 Vanilla Townies

(I calculate the town's chance of winning as 7/18)

Are both the target's name and alignment revealed?

Oh yeah, I wrote that wrong. The answer to your question is yes.

Have the cop claim Day 1, and investigate a pre-determined target on Night 1. Scum can't counter-claim the cop, because any fake-claim would be refuted once the results show the following day.

Perhaps only the alignment of the cop's target should be revealed? Then scum could still counter-claim if necessary. I still think it would be best for the cop to claim Day 1 and then No Lynch, though, since that would mean that the cop at least gets his investigation in before he dies. A mislynch is going to mean a scum win whenever it happens, so it's not like a No Lynch on Day 1 "wastes" a lynch or anything.

[Empking]

Empking's Five Player

2 Mafia (Even- Night Kill)

1 One-Shot Publishing Cop (the cop's target has their alignment revealed in the end of night post.)
2 Vanilla Townies

(I calculate the town's chance of winning as 7/18)

Are both the target's name and alignment revealed?

Oh yeah, I wrote that wrong. The answer to your question is yes.

Have the cop claim Day 1, and investigate a pre-determined target on Night 1. Scum can't counter-claim the cop, because any fake-claim would be refuted once the results show the following day.

I'm pretty sure its in the cop's best interest to stay hidden in order to avoid being night killed in order to turn 3p LyoL into a 50% shot.

Perhaps only the alignment of the cop's target should be revealed? Then scum could still counter-claim if necessary. I still think it would be best for the cop to claim Day 1 and then No Lynch, though, since that would mean that the cop at least gets his investigation in before he dies. A mislynch is going to mean a scum win whenever it happens, so it's not like a No Lynch on Day 1 "wastes" a lynch or anything.

Yeah, I presumed that the town would No Lynch Day One after a bit of discussion (its five players so you could probably get a feel of all the players pretty quickly even eithout the threat of an lynch.)

[Herodotus]

With the cop claiming on day 1, EV is 1/3. So if it's 7/18 for the case when the cop stays hidden, that's the better strategy.

[Empking]

Does anybody have any problems with the set up? I feel that it's guaranteed two days of good talking and is 2.? days long so that's good. Its also not too dependent on luck or good play by the cop (though its better to have good play by the cop so it doesn't go too far the other way.) I know I'm biased but I'm really attached to this set up and think it works very well.

I really want to see this nominated so if there's anything anybody would reccomend me doing then I'm all ears.

[Empking]

Empking's Superior Vengeful

Nightless

1 Godfather (Town wins if he's lynched day 1)
1 Goon

3 Townies

If a townie is lynched Day 1 then they survive until the end of Day 2.

Town Win Rate: 2/5

Empking's Innocent

Nightless

1 Vengeful Mafia
1 Goon

1 Innocent Child
3 Townies

Win Rate: 2/5

Empking's Pseudo-Open

Nightless

1 Vengeful Mafia
1 Goon

1 Townie
1 Citizen
1 Villager
1 Villager/Townie/Citizen

Win Rate: 197/540

Empking's Smith

2 Mafia

1 Doc OR Gunsmith
1 Gunsmith OR Bladesmith
3 Townies

Empking's Protection

1 Mafia Hitman
1 Mafia Ninja

1 Watcher
1 Doc
3 Townies

Empking's Suicide

2 Mafia Lovers

4 Suicide Bombers

[gandalf5166]

What's a bladesmith do?

[Terrion]

A bladesmith is a type of flavor cop: in the same way that gunsmiths get false positives on cops, bladsmiths get them on doctors. Now I can't say whether or not Empking's little setup with the bladesmith assumes that Mafia kill with knives or not; that changes everything.

I was completely unsurprised to see it after looking through his very recent mention of bladesmiths in a gunsmith-based topic.

[gandalf5166]

I've seen them used as the equivalent of gunsmiths for SKs and docs instead of mafia and cops. I guess that in Emp's setup, mafia have both? Or one has each?

[Empking]

I've seen them used as the equivalent of gunsmiths for SKs and docs instead of mafia and cops. I guess that in Emp's setup, mafia have both? Or one has each?

Mafia do not have Knives in Empking's Smith. Essentially its a doc detector.

[gandalf5166]

So gunsmiths would have guns I assume?

[Empking]

So gunsmiths would have guns I assume?

Yes.

[Empking]

Empking's Impotent

2 Mafia Goons

1 Compulsive Vig
1 Compulsive Blank Vig
1 Compulsive Roleblocker
2 Vanilla Townies

Empking's Death Miller[/b]

2 Mafia Goons

1 Death Miller One-Shot Cop
1 Cop
3 Townies