Simpsons Mafia (Game Over)

[jasonT1981]

Okay, lets show Fonz how much of an idiot he's being this game.

You may lynch me now. Regret later.

I hope you guys take off your votes I wanna use my power.

So when do votes come off.

Lets take a vote. Who here thinks that this is not AtE?

DH, I REALLY am not sure what you are trying to get at here... because you were also on the wagon that saw Mist lynched.

Mist7676 - 13 -

hiraki, SensFan, jasonT1981, The Fonz, sottyrulez, DarlaBlueEyes, LlamaFluff, KageLord, DemonHybrid, Nero Cain, Mariyta, boberz, ribwich

Unless I am completely misreading this whole thing.

[jasonT1981]

Actually, disregard that. I see the arguement is about town motives of hammering sorry.

Mists posts did look big time like Appeal to Emotion.

[SensFan]

Alright, just got confirmation from the Mod. There are exactly two players who were on the Mist wagon that have wincons that go directly against that of the Town. No sanity/immunity issues to worry about.

[The Fonz]

Mariyta and boberz or ribwich. Bookmark it. Now back to our regularly scheduled programme.

[SensFan]

Fonz, if someone claimed combined Cop/Doc with no drawbacks, would you lynch them D1?

[Hiraki]

What question?

First, you've completely ignored my case on you. Second, I asked you to give cases on people w/o using the word "opportunistic." You've so far used it to explain your case on Guiderian; you've attacked me for "major vote hopping opportunities"; in ISO#30, you comment on scum "taking opportunity"; you accuse Diddin of being opportunistic; and just recently, Ribwich is opportunistic. I'd really like a case that isn't "Well, you were being opportunistic."

First, no I haven't.

Second, I don't see that question anywhere in your ISO, but I'll be glad to answer it.

For the word opportunistic, I mean that this person isn't going to take a definite stand on something, but he's dwindling between two ideas. Per se with Ribwich.

He realizes that I'm probably scum, but sees that the non-voters have a definite possibility. Note that the town has gone from Hiraki-hate(which obv. makes no sense) to lurker hate. While I understand that because everyone has shifted, Ribwich can as well, the whole situation just looks fishy to me. More like "I can't get enough appeal on this lynch, so therefore let's try for an easier gambit." per se.

After further inspection though, it seems more like Ribwich was just doing what he wanted to do. Therefore, I take back what I said earlier. It was more of an impluse to think that after seeing something that remotely looked like an option for opportunity.
Jason: He's going for the point that TheFonz doesn't think that Mist was scummy, but he was. So I believe.

[SensFan]

For the word opportunistic, I mean that this person isn't going to take a definite stand on something, but he's dwindling between two ideas.

So when you say "opportunistic", you mean "not at all opportunistic, but fencesitting"?

[The Fonz]

Fonz, if someone claimed combined Cop/Doc with no drawbacks, would you lynch them D1?

No. In fact,

obviously not.

Even if so, cop/neighbor is weaker than that. I've seen mason cops before (they were naive, but still).

[SensFan]

Have you considered that your chosen way of dealing with claims means that you will literally never lynch Scum on Day 1?

[Hiraki]

For the word opportunistic, I mean that this person isn't going to take a definite stand on something, but he's dwindling between two ideas.

So when you say "opportunistic", you mean "not at all opportunistic, but fencesitting"?

No. Fencesitting happens on one topic. Opportunistic is when someone is able to vote with both sides. Per se with Ribwich.

[boberz]

Bob do you have any evedience towards what you are saying about Simpsons with strong PRs... or are you actually playing outguess the mod?

Homer very strong pr
Suggestion of simpsons v nuclear power plant reminds me of an episode where something similar occurs and it was the family who had to take on the world.
THe simpsons film was essentially homer uber strong and family fairly strong. Everybody else powerless.

Also element of outguess mod.
Also rolefishing noted.

---

Mariyta and boberz or ribwich. Bookmark it. Now back to our regularly scheduled programme

May I ask why.

[Mariyta]

Mariyta and boberz or ribwich. Bookmark it. Now back to our regularly scheduled programme.

You're wrong (at least about me). After bob'z vote on Jason, I'm inclined to agree with you on him and I've yet to decide how I feel about ribwich.

He realizes that I'm probably scum, but sees that the non-voters have a definite possibility. Note that the town has gone from Hiraki-hate(which obv. makes no sense) to lurker hate. While I understand that because everyone has shifted, Ribwich can as well, the whole situation just looks fishy to me. More like "I can't get enough appeal on this lynch, so therefore let's try for an easier gambit." per se.

I've done the exact same thing. Though I know you're scum, I realize it's not likely enough people will agree with me today (unless you do something so overtly scummy that it cannot be denied). Statistically, it's better to go the other way. So why choose Ribwich over me? You also used "opportunity" in your argument yet again. Tsk tsk.

P-edit: We were the last three on the Mist wagon.

[The Fonz]

Don't be ridiculous, that's not the case at all. For starters, I'm in general very much a claim-sceptic type. Like here, when I lynched a claimed cop on day four when she claimed one roleblock and two results on corpses.

Or try this:

It was always entirely possible Richard would claim power as well- indeed, if he's scum, it was certain. Do bear in mind town even-night tracker is pretty the weakest power role there is- I feel Richard is actually more likely scum for having made this claim. Also note we've seen the existence of scum power roles.

We can't just keep letting off anyone who claims power, because then we're basically guaranteeing a mislynch, because the only people who will claim vanilla are those who genuinely are.

There's a huge difference between 'any power role' and 'cop with an additional confirmable ability to boot.'

Also, counterclaims. Both 'Homer' and 'Cop' are just BEGGING a counterclaim. I can just about understand you/DH, I think, because I think you misread the claim in such a way to feel you've caught the player in a lie. 'Caught in a lie' overcomes pretty much anything.

Would you lynch a claimed vig D1?

[Wraith]

Bob do you have any evedience towards what you are saying about Simpsons with strong PRs... or are you actually playing outguess the mod?

Homer very strong pr
Suggestion of simpsons v nuclear power plant reminds me of an episode where something similar occurs and it was the family who had to take on the world.
THe simpsons film was essentially homer uber strong and family fairly strong. Everybody else powerless.

Also element of outguess mod.

Also rolefishing noted.

---

Mariyta and boberz or ribwich. Bookmark it. Now back to our regularly scheduled programme

May I ask why.

He's the claimed doctor. OBVIOUSLY he is going to rolefish.

[Mariyta]

Fonz, who are you talking to in 1062?

[Scott Brosius]

Vote Count 2-6

Benmage(1)- Nachomamma8,
boberz(0)-
Consigliere(2)- DemonHybrid, LlamaFluff,
DarlaBlueEyes(0)-
DemonHybrid(0)-
diddin(1)- hiraki,
hiraki(3)- diddin, jasonT1981, Wraith,
jasonT1981(2)- Tragedy, boberz,
KageLord(1)-sottyrulez,
LlamaFluff(0)-
Lowell(1)- Mariyta,
Mariyta(0)-
Nachomamma8(0)-
Nero Cain(1)-Benmage,
ribwich(1)-The Fonz,
SensFan(0)-
Sleepless Assassin(0)-
sottyrulez(0)-
Steven Hacking(1)-Lowell,
The Fonz(0)-
Tragedy(1)- Steven Hacking,
Wraith(2)-SensFan, Nero Cain,


Not Voting(5)- DarlaBlueEyes, KageLord, ribwich, Sleepless Assassin, Consigliere

With 22 alive, it's 12 to lynch. Deadline is February 19th at 1pm (EST)

Consigliere replaces tvellalot

Sleepless Assassin will be replaced.

[The Fonz]

Fonz, who are you talking to in 1062?

Sens.

[jasonT1981]

I was not rolefishing. I was pointing out his entire theory is based on outguessing the mod which is a game I do not want to play. He was introducing WIFOM based on nothing at all. The fact he would introduce WIFOM is scummy in itself.

[SensFan]

Don't be ridiculous, that's not the case at all. For starters, I'm in general very much a claim-sceptic type. Like here, when I lynched a claimed cop on day four when she claimed one roleblock and two results on corpses.

Or try this:

It was always entirely possible Richard would claim power as well- indeed, if he's scum, it was certain. Do bear in mind town even-night tracker is pretty the weakest power role there is- I feel Richard is actually more likely scum for having made this claim. Also note we've seen the existence of scum power roles.

We can't just keep letting off anyone who claims power, because then we're basically guaranteeing a mislynch, because the only people who will claim vanilla are those who genuinely are.

There's a huge difference between 'any power role' and 'cop with an additional confirmable ability to boot.'

Also, counterclaims. Both 'Homer' and 'Cop' are just BEGGING a counterclaim. I can just about understand you/DH, I think, because I think you misread the claim in such a way to feel you've caught the player in a lie. 'Caught in a lie' overcomes pretty much anything.

Would you lynch a claimed vig D1?

Re: Claim skepticism
Fair enough; I was just asking. I know that you belief in clearly-defined policies in most cases, and was trying to get a bearing on your stance in this case.

Re: 'Any PR' != 'Cop with additional conformable ability'
Again, agreed. But there comes a time when the role is too strong/far-fetched to be believed. Particularly when we get to the specifics of this claim; see below.

Re: Counterclaims (Cop)
Cops aren't in all games; Mods are starting more and more to use alternative information roles in lieu of Cops. Oh look, I was an alternative information role, one arguably as strong as a Cop.

Re: Counterclaims (Homer)
Flavour=God is an easy way to get killed. See my Harry Potter Mafia game from this summer, when RC was bandwagoned to a claim D1, used his Dumbledore safeclaim, and wasn't looked at twice the rest of the game, even though his mechanics claims was one of the worst I've ever seen - and kept changing.

Re: Lynching claimed Vig D1
Nope. Vig and Cop are the two roles that I think you need to fuck up your claim really badly to get lynched on D1. Guess what I feel Mist did with her claim? (Hint: It rhymes with 'ducked-up-really-badly')

[The Fonz]

I'm kind of with you on that last point, but she didn't fuck up her claim any worse than I would have expected from a VI of the level mist was coming across as. (I want to blacklist whoever her alt is for deliberate VIing, incidentally). And the additional point, the one which you said made it 'Too powerful to believe' well, it. was. confirmable!

[SensFan]

I'm kind of with you on that last point, but she didn't fuck up her claim any worse than I would have expected from a VI of the level mist was coming across as. (I want to blacklist whoever her alt is for deliberate VIing, incidentally). And the additional point, the one which you said made it 'Too powerful to believe' well, it. was. confirmable!

You're right; her claim that she could talk with her family members in a QT was confirmable if a Simpson family member came out and confirmed it. Guess what? I'm a Simpson family member and she was claiming something that was not the case.

[The Fonz]

Screw me, you're obstinate. How do you know she doesn't have the ability to neighborize you when she hasn't had the chance?

[The Fonz]

Also, what the hell do you think the 'Family Man' part of her role meant? It obviously was the family-talking ability she mentioned. Again, she emphatically did not. ever. claim that the Simpsons as a whole had nighttalk.

[diddin]

Awww hell Consigliere is in this game. I'd consider a policy lynch of him.

[SensFan]

Well I could also talk in a QT with Other family members of my family at night.

Could you please do me the huge favour of explaining how I'm supposed to think this is in any way related to neighborizing?
Pre-edit: or how this is not a "claim that the Simpsons as a whole had nighttalk?"