Mafia of the Chosen Ones (Game Over!)

[Zachrulez]

If you can switch powers onto scum, what's the point of keeping scum from granting a vig to the scum?

[Zachrulez]

I mean if that capability remains in place, that would be the first thing I would do in the next game as the scum god, and then I would watch the bodies fall.

One of the other things that bothered me was the inhim n1 kill failing because of him being a demon. I don't see a point for split scumteams if crosskilling is impossible, but that's just me.

[Zachrulez]

In fact a lot of the perception about the scum having difficulty on the faith side can be solved by reducing the organization side of things, like merging the kill, merging the teams, indwelling, ect.

[Zachrulez]

(May be partly bitter because we merged early fearing crosskills in the 1st version, and never knew it was impossible.)

[Plum]

If you can switch powers onto scum, what's the point of keeping scum from granting a vig to the scum?

Money. It cost 170 Faith to pull that off. Plus it wouldn't work until we knew who our Demons were, and wouldn't be a good idea until

they

knew who their other partners were. Hence it was

not

a feasible move until later in the game, at which point it was guaranteed to cost a buttload of cash. Plus you'd have to give it to a Townie on the way there, so there would be information about the sort of Vig it was on the ground anyway. Plus then you have to do the 170 Faith all at once to prevent the Townie shooting a scumbag or such, leaving you at 30 Faith - very hard to bounce back from there even with %15 interest. Again, I think this was an intentional structure within the game that the Mod intended as a possibility - which clearly places it in the 'not-a-loophole' category and thus is irrelevant to the complaint of the joint-win happening through a true loophole, however one stands on the matter. You might as well say that using Neighborizer and Communion the way you did this game was exploiting a loophole - it wasn't; it was an inherent possibility in the game, and a scum Memetic Vig was the same.

For the record, I didn't notice crosskills were impossible this game either. I think I'd still have done it around when we did it, though.

[hitogoroshi]

One of the other things that bothered me was the inhim n1 kill failing because of him being a demon. I don't see a point for split scumteams if crosskilling is impossible, but that's just me.

I'm not Vi, but as it looks from where I'm sitting: I imagine the point of the split scumteams, balance-wise, is to give the scum clear options for things they can spend faith on to make their faction better.

I think that's exactly the point; scum feel like they have faith difficulties because they have

so much shit they can do.

Town seraphs, by contrast, seem to have "too much faith" at times because if there are no strong townreads to grant orders to we're just kinda throwing shit at the walls and seeing what sticks.

[Zachrulez]

Neighborizer + Commune was dependent on us hitting town with Commune, we didn't and it magnified the scum's advantage.

[hitogoroshi]

Neighborizer + Commune was dependent on us hitting town with Commune, we didn't and it magnified the scum's advantage.

Actually, it was dependant on

Andrius

hitting town with Commune - we had no way to direct it (since we couldn't talk to Andrius after giving him Neighborizer.)

[Vi]

Vi; Is therre a reason you're ignoring the really obvious solution: simply reducing the % difference in Battery Faith?

I personally still think it's an issue. However, the obvious solution - simply get rid of the % difference in Battery Faith - isn't necessarily appealing because
1) it removes the incentive to play quickly, and
2) people actually LIKE the incentive to play quickly

You mean this?

inHim - I'm actually very pleased with how you were able to come from a different era of gameplay and fit right in with the lunatics we have onsite now. gj overall

Magua - I'm reading your comments and making plans around them... but I don't want to ruin the next game. Of course, you could become a reviewer and things would go well from there...

Plum - I didn't anticipate the use of Account that way. I saw that the wording allowed for it and didn't bother questioning it.

Zach - Wait, so you're arguing FOR the ability for split scum to kill each other even though they're on the same team? I don't see that as a positive at all, compared to the scum possibly figuring out someone who's on their team before the Seraphs spoil it for them.

hito - I do still question why you didn't check to see if inHim was Town...

[Zachrulez]

Zach - Wait, so you're arguing FOR the ability for split scum to kill each other even though they're on the same team? I don't see that as a positive at all, compared to the scum possibly figuring out someone who's on their team before the Seraphs spoil it for them.

If they aren't kill immune they're... what exactly?

[hitogoroshi]

hito - I do still question why you didn't check to see if inHim was Town...

Then we couldn't have communed him. That one-order-per-target is kind of a bitch. :/

[Plum]

Zach - Wait, so you're arguing FOR the ability for split scum to kill each other even though they're on the same team? I don't see that as a positive at all, compared to the scum possibly figuring out someone who's on their team before the Seraphs spoil it for them.

If they aren't kill immune they're... what exactly?

Immune to scumkill? We were just as vulnerable to anything else, so.

[Zachrulez]

hito - I do still question why you didn't check to see if inHim was Town...

Then we couldn't have communed him. That one-order-per-target is kind of a bitch. :/

Yeah, I'm grumpy about that too.

[Zachrulez]

But I'm grumpy in general today.

[Fate]

This is what happens when you don't let people post in thread.

[Empking]

Vi; Is therre a reason you're ignoring the really obvious solution: simply reducing the % difference in Battery Faith?

I personally still think it's an issue. However, the obvious solution - simply get rid of the % difference in Battery Faith - isn't necessarily appealing because
1) it removes the incentive to play quickly, and
2) people actually LIKE the incentive to play quickly

You mean this?

No I mean "reducing". So the incenctive is still there (though reduced (but its not like people built mathematical models to work out whether we should quicklynch or not anyway.))

[Vi]

No I mean "reducing". So the incenctive is still there (though reduced (but its not like people built mathematical models to work out whether we should quicklynch or not anyway.))

Nobody has

yet

.

Does 75% sound okay? After toying with the numbers, it looks like that keeps a fair incentive to QL but cuts the difference down from what it was in this game by 50%.

Also, so I can get this out of my bookmarks...

[Fate]

DODGE

[Gammagooey]

Scum would still be really close to full after a d1 quicklynch at 75% though- 175 after lynch+17 from interest= 192 faith.

I'd go maybe 60%- Aside from the first day the quicklynching hurt hito's reads and the town in general more than the lack of faith did to the scum- I don't think the lynches will be nearly as fast next game.

[Vi]

DODGE

Absolutely.
If you want a barometer, your insufferability is way up recently.

[Fate]

Have you ever watched your whole world crumble around you and there's nothing you can do?

[Jack]

Have you ever watched your whole world crumble around you and there's nothing you can do?

You can't stop fate, Fate.

[AGar]

I find it mildly hilarious that 3 scum helped drive the insanely quick vezok lynch, which in effect fucked their own seraphs.

[vezokpiraka]

Didn't I get a record for quickest quick lynch?

[Nachomamma8]

This is a bit late, but needed to be said anyways.

First off, I really enjoyed the game, all things said and done. I thought that Kennedy beating Nixon by gaining the trust of the people was a pretty badass endgame even if singer DID draw things out a lot. Also, Athiest winning with the town after the town's gods were gone fit pretty well too .

Sorry Vi for the unintended ending... I don't think that you made a mistake in allowing it to happen at all. It would've reflected on you terribly as a moderator had you just said "well, I didn't want this ending so let me fix the rules so it's not possible anymore." The loophole in win conditions was based on a pretty much impossible situation, so I don't think that was really a significant oversight. I mean, what were the chances of the SK surviving until endgame with one scum, one town, and himself after already using his shot out of necessity to make MyLo into LyLo while sitting on a shitload of faith to use, where all three alignments are outed and thus he's forced to find a way to help the town win with him, and is willing to let the town win with him? I seriously don't think anyone could've predicted that >.>

As far as Seraph play goes, I was really, really disappointed about the halos. I was excited about getting the Halos because I thought they would be used more, and I could inspire a bit of a halo arms race between Town and Scum by spamming the things. But then, no one used any halos, and my ability became useless...

Rhinox kill was because I was planning on lurking and his LW2 comment made him seem like he was going to be on guard for that.
Fate kill was for self-preservation the first time, and then I had to kill him because he was too townie to be living on D4.