Nintendo Mafia (Game Over)


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Post Post #450 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 12:19 pm

Post by RedCoyote »

P&tB 446 wrote:Don't you have any defence against his suspicions though? No witty rebuttal? This isn't the RedCoyote I know. :(
Well, there's not much to respond to without just flatly disagreeing. I'm not sure what his implication is behind me "checking completed games". I made one short post in a completed game just today, but that's the last one I recall doing for some time. I don't think I'm active lurking. I think yesterday was a bit of a clusterfuck that just didn't really need much discussion. I was fairly clear about this when Dekes asked us straight up if the day should end ASAP or not. If there's something specific either of you (you or SSBF) want to engage me on, feel free to bring it up.

---
lewarcher 448 wrote:@RedCoyote; your post sounds ok to me. But I am surprised you didn't mention danakillsu among the people whose votes on lelouch don't look convincing. I also want to know what you think of TMH: it is the biggest difference between my views and SSBF's views.
No, I said that I wanted to look off the wagon. Both players were firmly on the lynch wagon, which I specifically said I was going to steer away from as far as analyzing goes. I see more potential in the players that laid off the wagon entirely, specifically mb53. I don't see anything wrong with dana or TMH in a quick skim through their isos. Both of them seemed to be stalwarts on the wagon that didn't waver or attempt to qualify their positions like mb53 did (remember his, "I could be wrong...").
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Post Post #451 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 2:56 pm

Post by Dekes »

Alright, just a couple of quick notes.

SSBF, you replaced DTM, right? Phew, that means I only have to skim your posts. Way too wordy for a VCA on a player that was obnoxius, detrimental to town and apparently claimed scum in thread.

@Espeo
Give me one damn good reason why I should ever move my vote off of you?
You simply stated Lelouch was town for "I know my VIs" reasons but did nothing to derail the wagon. You said there was scum in the wagon but you failed to follow up on that assumption. You voted esurio for tunneling, which is probably the biggest non-scumtell ever, and you didn't even acknowledge eusrio's case on Lelouch's alleged slip in the GD forum. And today you're simply parking your vote again on esurio without making the slightest effort of commenting on anything else in this game. Also, first one to suggest mass nameclaim in a Theme Game Day 1 is scum anyways.

@Mod: Will we ever see the nameflip of Lelouch? And V/LA until sometime Sunday afternoon once I'm sober.
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Post Post #452 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 3:01 pm

Post by Tragedy »

lewarcher82 wrote:Moreover, his activity tended to decrease after his "Fuck you all lynch me" post, and this is a scum-tell to me. A frustrated town VI would fight like a stupid lion cornered in this situation.
This is when I usually see a Town would suddenly get pissed at everyone since they all suddenly look at him. Looks pretty obvious that he was a TOWN VI. But why suddenly believe he'd fight like a stupid lion, although he
looked
like one, a bit...
It feels like you're just saying he's auto-scum VI when he looks somehow Town VI...
Blargh. Not much of a good defense here anyways.
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Post Post #453 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 3:12 pm

Post by Lucresia »

Lewarcher wrote:Lucresia: I think you really need to explain a couple of things:
1) did you know you were hammering when you hammered? If yes: why did you not wait for the replacements? If not: why did you feel the need of justifying your vote with these five lines of nothing?
I did not realize when I placed the vote that I was the hammer. I also did not realize we still were waiting on replacements. There was a lot of confusion on day 1 and I was voting based on my stance on Lelouch. As far as justifying my vote, I will never vote for someone without providing a justification for my vote.

I had to catch up on a few games after being gone a weekend and had to get replaced in 2 just because I couldn't keep up after the weekend I was gone for a wedding. So unfortunately I was making up for a few posts by posting my current thoughts on the most prominent situation. I should be fairly active from here on out now that I have a bit less on my plate.
From SSBF's terribly long 'Here I am! I made a Wall post so you know im not scum now!!!!!11123' post wrote:The Master Hand: Best lynch for today and for many reasons regarding the Leloud's wagon.
I disagree. I think the points they made on day 1 got a lot of conversation started Granted in retrospect it is easy for someone to say oh look how he pushed so hard for a lynch of a townie what a scummy thing to do. Obviously he fought for a lynch he believed on based on how scummy Lelouch was acting. If anything I get a town read on him. A few others I am getting a town read on are Esurio, Lewarcher, and Dekes. They've all been doing a lot of scum hunting in this game.

My top scum read so far is Tragedy and Espeo. I have a null read on Darlablueeyes since she hasn't really posted, but I am starting to believe she might just be lurking at this point since she hasn't shown up yet on day 2 and said she was back and catching up.

Tragedy has been posting very actively throughout this game, but doesn't seem to commit to too much. Even with all the mayhem of day 1 and Lelouch, I don't see a lot of posts from tragedy involving what she felt on Lelouch.
Espeo wrote:
It makes esurio scum because there isn't really any other explaination for someone to try and get someone who is obviously town lynched that hard this early
Lelouch was not obviously town. He was acting scummy and I could see people thinking he was scum VI and not town VI. I personally began by thinking he was town VI and as his play got scummier and scummier my opinion changed. He flipped town, so the lynch was a bad decision, but it wasn't an obviously bad lynch for day 1 with no information.
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Post Post #454 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 3:27 pm

Post by esuriospiritus »

@Lucresia:
I'll take you at your word that you had a legit reason for not being around, but even so, why is it that you don't have anything original to say?

RC looks town. Eventually I'll have to de-lazify myself (shut up, that's totally a word :shifty:) and re-read MB53 -- I seem to remember attacking him for what I felt was a lame defense of Lelouch early on, but I also remember that I dropped it... and I
don't
remember why.

I should probably start taking notes or something. ._.
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Post Post #455 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 3:51 pm

Post by danakillsu »

@ lewarcher
What? I said myself just now that scum was both off and on the wagon. But I think that they were mainly off, because town had no motivation to be off the wagon.
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Post Post #456 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 5:12 pm

Post by mb53 »

Once again:

Why am I scum defending a townie, rather than town defending someone who I genuinely thought was town?
i literally need to start a driving blog, please remind me
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Post Post #457 (ISO) » Fri Apr 15, 2011 6:32 pm

Post by Super Smash Bros. Fan »

@esuriospiritus: When was it establish that Dekes was super obvious town? I re-read the thread and while I don't see Dekes as scum, it doesn't mean that she is most certainly town.

@The Master Hand: There are no scum tells that are definitive (Meaning 100% chances of hitting scum), not even claiming scum. Town lynches based off scum claims have had happened before and among the worst of the VI's, it will almost surely happen again, so with an absymal player like Lelouch, even a scum claim requires thinking on whenever or not it is coming from scum. Take for example, millar13 at Mini 988: Small Town Mafia. At the end of Day 3, after being suspected by almost everyone, he gave up, claimed Mafia, but ended up flipping town. I would rank him as about the same as Lelouch VI Britannica in terms of awfulness in play and behavior.

As for the last points, it wasn't that you went after Lelouch, but that you over-exaggerated your attack on him. I don't really think you can properly determine a person as "most likely scum" after one and a half page of analysis of mostly RVS contents, thus my argument for you saying you were grasping for straws.

@danakillsu: The reasoning you're going with is too black and white for this game regarding the Lelouch wagon. Not choosing to lynch Lelouch does not mean they have to acknowledge that he was a troll and you can't just say that "Person X defended Lelouch, he must be scum!", you need to actually analyze the content of the defense to determine whenever or not it had town motivation or scum motivation.

@Pinky and the Brain: By the time you jumped in, there were still plenty of time for you to focus on your primary suspect before the lynch were to occur (At the time you voted, there were twelve days left, plenty of time to push for your primary suspect lynch, not at all unrealistic time frame, no I don't consider absolute VI's like Lelouch claiming scum to be strong enough for a vote based on that alone). It's not as strong since based off your few posts of today, you did prove consistent in your scum read on Tragedy, but it still does concern me.

@Tragedy: How can you justify voting a lurker over a scummy player? Lynching a lurker during Day One would have put us at an even worse situation Day 2, with very little to absolutely nothing to go on, regardless of alignment, and would have been especially bad if said lurker flipped town. You really shouldn't be questioning the town for choosing to vote TheJackalope over a lurker. While his slot did flip town, at least we got some information from it that could determine players alignment.

You say that people are voting you just for lurkers hunting, read mine and other players reasons for suspecting you. It should be obvious that we have more reasons for suspecting you then just that.

@RedCoyote: Regarding your mb53 case, it's genuine but not something I necessarily agree upon. The first and third points are decent, but the others don't really come as really scummy to me and are more like null tells to me. I also disagreeing that bringing up Jesters in a theme game is scummy. I've seen both town and scum use it, so I don't necessarily see as indicative of alignment.

@RedCoyote: By checking completed games, I mean checking recently finished games from six months ago or less. Considering that you're an experienced player, this is more then enough for me to understand your playstyle and how you normally play.

Also, in your response to Dekes about ending Day 1 early, there's one thing in your response to Dekes that I just noticed that also bothers me. You said in that post that we had too many players in the game. Why do you think that? Twenty players in a game is not that huge of a game, considering recently ran games like Star Aligned III (Which had 28 players) and most large games have more.

@Tragedy: I find your "My defense isn't good." to be scummy. From what I see, you're pretty much trying to get people off your back by saying that you did not make a good defense.

Your scummy reactions to Pinky and the Brain's attack on you really does bring you up on my scum list and those of others, along with these two posts I've linked to.

@Lucersia: I understood why you may not have made a full post, but I'm not sure why you couldn't have at least scanned jmj3000's vote count before hammering. Clearly it's not that hard to read a vote count.
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Post Post #458 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 6:13 am

Post by GhostWriter »

VOTE: Dana
Iso post #2 bothers me. This will do.
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Post Post #459 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 7:32 am

Post by lewarcher82 »

@Dana: I really had the feeling you wanted to concentrate all attention on the players out of the wagon. I may have misinterpreted you. But still, you are a player who casted a poorly justified vote on Lelouch (and it wasn't so hard to cast a justified vote). So I do think - as I have been saying for a while now - that there were scumplayers out of the wagon (Trag and Espe are my bet, atm), but I also think that there was scum on the wagon too, and you are one of the wagonvoters I will keep my eye on.

@SSBF: long wall, I will have to re-read it, but I don't quite agree with a couple of things. I still think your case on TMH is very weak, and I still feel that Dekes and esurio ARE obvtown. I will articulate on this in a longer post tomorrow.

@GW, if you don't explain what bothers you, your post is pretty useless and quite hard for us to read. ISO 2 is the post in which Dana voted. I also criticised that vote, but you need to post some reasons for your dislike. Pease, do.
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Post Post #460 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 7:37 am

Post by danakillsu »

@ lewarcher
My vote being poorly justified when it was made has nothing to do with anything. It wasn't a sure vote when it was made. I became sure later on that he was actually scum, and didn't have much time to make a case that was not like the cases made by others.
@ SSBF
I think there is some validity to your arguments, but scum can be good at justifying their buddying. I find it hard to believe that ANY member of the town could look at all that and say, "Oh yeah, that guy's town" for any reason other than the fact that he was a troll, much less MANY members of the town. I think it's much more likely that the people not on the wagon include most of the scum, who wanted towncred for not being on the wagon of someone they actually knew was town.
If that makes me scummy, so be it.
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Post Post #461 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 7:54 am

Post by GhostWriter »

Not the voting post, the one below it. It smells of inside info to me.
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Post Post #462 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 10:22 am

Post by jmj3000 »

Official Vote Count

Players needed to lynch: 10


Espeonage
- 3 - Dekes, danakillsu, lewarcher82 (L-7)
The Master Hand
- 1 - SSBF (L-9)
Ythan
- 1 - esuriospiritus (L-9)
esuriospiritus
- 1 - Espeonage (L-9
Tragedy
- 1 - Pinky and the Brain (L-9)
mb53
- 1 - RedCoyote (L-9)
danakillsu
- 1 - GhostWriter (L-9)


Players not voting: EVERYONE ELSE


If there are any errors, let me know and I will fix them.

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Post Post #463 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 10:45 am

Post by DarlaBlueEyes »

URG. I really despise my life right now. I'm still working on catching up, but I'm slow. Very sorry to all for my utter failure. If this persists too much I may seek replacement for the sake of the rest of you all
Show
you done goofed.


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Post Post #464 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 3:20 pm

Post by Ythan »

Alright, I'm gonna just start all over on isos. I didn't get very far before the end anyway.
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Post Post #465 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 5:08 pm

Post by Super Smash Bros. Fan »

@danakillsu: Just like you argue that scum may have stayed off the wagon for town cred, I can also argue that scum may have jumped on the wagon because VI's are easy to lynch. VI's are the easiest players to lynch, they are consistently scummy, almost always get wagoned and are frequently lynched early. Scum use this to their advantage because they can ride the lynch without gaining much scrutiny, which then cause the game to lose information because VI's players are difficult to read. As terrible as Lelouch's play was, even to the point of scum claiming after being forced replaced, he was literally what scum wanted, an incredibly easy lynch on a person that would create chaos and end up costing a day of valuable information. The fact that Lelouch was such an easy lynch is why I called on the bandwagon on the first place and why I think most of the scums were on the bandwagon, not off it.

I'd like for you to mention your other suspects and a brief description of why they are scum.
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Post Post #466 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 6:08 pm

Post by sorasgoof »

Okay, I'll catch up tomorrow and hopefully have a post up. Any questions for me at this point? I'm eager to get into this one. :D
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Post Post #467 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 11:25 pm

Post by Xtoxm »

Vote: THM


The way he went about attacking Lelouch looks scum motivated.
Smooth as silk when he's scum, and very much capable of running things from behind the scenes while appearing to be doing minimal effort. - Almost50
Xtoxm is consistently great - Shosin
you were the only wolf i townread at endgame - the worst
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Post Post #468 (ISO) » Sat Apr 16, 2011 11:47 pm

Post by esuriospiritus »

:S Do you have any additional thoughts, or are you just going to sheep SSBF and not say anything new?
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Post Post #469 (ISO) » Sun Apr 17, 2011 12:52 am

Post by esuriospiritus »

Also, guys, I'm tracking a
mini
game with like half its players dead that generates posts faster than this. C'mon guys. Seriously now. Step it up a notch or ten. I realize we have a few players on V/LA, but still.

I think it may be a good idea to setup a voting bloc, for both the purposes of generating additional discussion -- inevitably some people not deemed obvtown enough to be on the bloc will disagree with it, and some of those people will definitely be scum :P -- and for the more obvious purpose of setting up a group of united obvtowns.

By the by, related note: I am
not
going to reveal why Dekes and Lewarcher are superobvtown, as has been asked of me. Read the fucking game. Still don't get it? Read it harder.
Still
don't get it? It's probably because you're scum and didn't notice when a
blatant townslip
was made. Mmkay.

So.

PEOPLE INVITED TO THIS VOTING BLOC OF AWESOME, SHOULD THEY CHOSE TO ACCEPT THE INVITATION
Esurio
Dekes
Lewarcher


... and anyone all three of us agree are town.

My additional probtown list, in loose order from strongest townread to weakest, consists of:

SSBF
TMH (pending better D2 posting than we're getting atm)
Espeonage (And yeah, I know I won't get you guys to agree with me on this, but I'm listing him anyway. I just re-read him in iso though and I still think he's probs misguided town, so~~)
ODM/sorasgoof (ODM seemed town; but this is kinda pending sorasgoof actually posting something of use)
RedCoyote (although in re-reading the MB slot his case is kind of ehhhhhh)
PatB
CrazyPianist1116


If we all agree on any of these people, they shall be added to the voting bloc. And so on and so forth, so long as the decision is unanimous. Anyone who is not Dekes/Lewarcher can be kicked off the voting bloc given a majority of the bloc has decided they no longer are towny enough for the spot -- including me, cuz thus far I'm only confirmed to myself. :P We shall of course be able to add people to the voting bloc later should we decide they're worthy.


Once you've accepted invitation to the bloc, you vote in solidarity with everyone else in the bloc. You don't vote people someone in the bloc thinks is town unless there is no one that everyone agrees is scum. You don't vote someone in the bloc as long as they're in the bloc (but you can push to get them kicked out).

If we do this, and we do this right, WE SHALL BE AN UNSTOPPABLE WALL OF TOWNLINESS.

People who disagree with this awesome idea and are not named Dekes or Lewarcher are probscum.

PS: In the time between this post and my prior post I just skimmed or entirely re-read the isos of damn near everyone in the game to confirm my impressions. C'mon, Ythan, it doesn't take that long.
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Post Post #470 (ISO) » Sun Apr 17, 2011 1:09 am

Post by esuriospiritus »

EBWOP: Just took a look at the votecount. If we agree on this voting bloc thing then I shall move my vote onto Espeonage provided we cannot all agree that any of Ythan, Tragedy, dana, GhostWriter, or Ashblade/Xtotm is scum (those being my top four scumreads atm).

No, I'm not going to explain any of those right now. I just triple-posted; gimme a break. XD
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Post Post #471 (ISO) » Sun Apr 17, 2011 1:10 am

Post by esuriospiritus »

*five

I can't count.

QUADPOSTLOLZ
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Post Post #472 (ISO) » Sun Apr 17, 2011 4:24 am

Post by RedCoyote »

dana 455 wrote:@ lewarcher
What? I said myself just now that scum was both off and on the wagon. But I think that they were mainly off, because town had no motivation to be off the wagon.
I agree. That's why I want to focus my energies at those like mb53 who were seemingly playing the wagon to their individual advantage rather than going with it. I mean, you could've been off the wagon in a town-like way if you were pushing another case that you felt strongly about, but that should be judged on a case by case basis.

---
mb53 456 wrote:Why am I scum defending a townie, rather than town defending someone who I genuinely thought was town?
Because of the way you did it; The rhetoric you used.

---
SSBF 457 wrote:The reasoning you're going with is too black and white for this game regarding the Lelouch wagon. Not choosing to lynch Lelouch does not mean they have to acknowledge that he was a troll and you can't just say that "Person X defended Lelouch, he must be scum!", you need to actually analyze the content of the defense to determine whenever or not it had town motivation or scum motivation.
I don't think it's particularly absolute. Do you agree with the sentiment? I don't think he's saying anything too radical here.
SSBF 457 wrote:By checking completed games, I mean checking recently finished games from six months ago or less. Considering that you're an experienced player, this is more then enough for me to understand your playstyle and how you normally play.
I see what you're saying. I misunderstood your comment. Well, it's my meta, so, you know, I have some authority on the subject... and you're wrong. :D
SSBF 457 wrote:Also, in your response to Dekes about ending Day 1 early, there's one thing in your response to Dekes that I just noticed that also bothers me. You said in that post that we had too many players in the game. Why do you think that? Twenty players in a game is not that huge of a game, considering recently ran games like Star Aligned III (Which had 28 players) and most large games have more.
Well, for one thing, I don't know if I'd ever join a 28 player game. I was in a 27 player game once that was exhausting. I would not say that "most large games" have more than 28 players. I don't think that's accurate.

I will clarify though that by my definition a 20 player game is a little heavy for me personally, but not necessarily as a sitewide average for large games in general.

---
DBE 463 wrote:URG. I really despise my life right now. I'm still working on catching up, but I'm slow. Very sorry to all for my utter failure. If this persists too much I may seek replacement for the sake of the rest of you all
This is the second game we've played together where you've had these problems, Darla. Are you sure this game is right for you (obviously I don't mean any offense, I'm just trying to give you a little piece of mind to the idea that maybe forum mafia isn't the best fit for you, or at least MS-style forum mafia).

---
esurio 471 wrote:I think it may be a good idea to setup a voting bloc, for both the purposes of generating additional discussion -- inevitably some people not deemed obvtown enough to be on the bloc will disagree with it, and some of those people will definitely be scum :P -- and for the more obvious purpose of setting up a group of united obvtowns.
I'm completely game for this.

*anxiously awaits invitation*
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Post Post #473 (ISO) » Sun Apr 17, 2011 5:01 am

Post by Pinky and the Brain »

I am saddened by the lack of Tragedy votes.

In an attempt to kick-start the wagon, I am compiling my case into one post. Those of you reading along at home might want to have Tragedy's ISO opened up in another tab so you can follow it as I'm going along.


Spoiler: Interpretation of Tragedy's posts
#0 - Okay, a RVS vote. For lurking, which presumably is a joke because it's RVS and nobody else has posted yet.

#1 - Fluff.

#2 - My random vote is to get DBE to post?

#3 - Fluff.

#4 - Fluff.

#5 - Is your vote RVS? Also, where's Darla? My vote has been on her for nothing if she didn't confirm!

#6 - Let's pretend I'm talking about something relevant.

#7 - I like this Darla wagon even though it's a RVS vote from me and we're on page 5 and plenty of stuff has happened.

#8 - I'm being helpful and contributing to the game!

#9 - Oops, mb53 just realised I've been doing nothing, let me look like I am taking initiative with making points to Lelouch.

#10 - Oh noes! Pinky and the Brain are onto me, let me deflect onto people lurking!

#11 - I'm going to take the moral high ground in an attempt to look like I'm scum-hunting.

#12 - Oops, he got me. Quick, subject change!

#13 - Dodge!

#14 - I haven't really been reading, BUT I THINK I CAN TWIST THIS INTO SOMETHING SCUMMY! But I'm gonna leave my RVS vote on Darla.

#15 - Hooray for active lurking!

#16 - Let me pretend I have a purpose for keeping my RVS vote on Darla!

#17 - Somebody with less content than me? Ooh, haven't posted in a while, better make up for lost time with a bit more fluff.

#18 - Scrapping my RVS vote to vote a lurker! I sure am being helpful this game!

#19 - Yay hypocrisy!

#20 - Let me dodge the issue of a Lelouch wagon to pointlessly push my lurker vote, whilst also throwing out some vague non-specific suspicions!

#21 - Don't want to answer Dekes, so I'd better deflect more!

#22 - That's right, my vote is still on thil, let me justify it by stealing somebody else's words so that it's harder to attack me!

#23 - Ohh, Dekes caught me, let me say something that is vague enough so that it's not clear whether I think it is scummy or not.

#24 - Lurking is bad, thil. Active lurk like me!

#25 - Fluff. OHWAIT DID I JUST ADMIT I'M PUSHING A VOTE ON THIL FOR LURKING WHEN I KNOW DARLA IS LURKING EVEN MORE HARDCORE?

#26 - Super-fluff-vague-suspicions-combo!

#27 - OMGUS! Never mind that I've dodged taking a stance on Lelouch so far and I also have a vote on Thil despite the Lelouch wagon being at L-2.

#28 - Look, I haven't been defending Lelouch! I've purposely been fence-sitting!

#29 - Dodge!

#30 - I AM BEING HELPFUL!!11!1!

#31 - It's Darla! ... wait, wasn't I 'suspicious' of you for lurking?

#32 - I've been completely ignoring the Lelouch/Jackalope wagon, but let me ask for a vote count so it looks like I wasn't just avoiding it!

#33 - I know I've been hating on lurkers, but it's Ythan! I can't hate on Ythan!

#34 - Vague suspicions/attacks ftw!!!!

#35 - OMG I'M NOT VOTING!!1!! OH NOES!!! [Proceeds not to make a vote]

#36 - Maybe if I'm vague enough he'll stop attacking me!

#37 - Thanks for reminding me I was 'suspicious' of Darla for not posting! Better dodge the rest of your points though.

#38 - Good job I completely distanced myself from that Lelouch issue yesterday! BTW I unvoted the lurker to vote another lurker, stupid.

#39 - Wooooops, let me ignore this post where you show how flawed my logic is.



tl;dr
- Tragedy is scum. Vote Tragedy.

I approve of the voting bloc. Now, vote Tragedy please.


~ Hopp
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Post Post #474 (ISO) » Sun Apr 17, 2011 6:16 am

Post by lewarcher82 »

I have been skeptical towards voting blocks in the past, but I must agree that they sometimes work, and this game may really benefit from something like this: we need a momentum after Lelouch's failflip.

Since my townread of Dekes and Esurio is very strong, count me in.

my probtown list is composed by players who are also on your list, but not all of them. Namely (townier up, the 4 whom I'll accept in a VB):

TMH:
as I said, I disagree with SSBF's case on TMH.
SSBF:
I disagree with some of his points, as I said, but I am getting townvibes.
PatB:
no strong read, but his attitude towards the Lelouch wagon sounds townish to me.
CrazyPianist:
I really have no strong read. ISO 2 and 3 sounds townish to me. I'd like to see more content, but ok.

two other players from your list are nullreads to me

RedCoyote:
he is extremely difficult to read. His case on mb53 is interesting, because it is the first real case on mb53. But to be honest, I liked it better the first time I read it. But I will accept him in VB in case Dekes agrees with you about him.

ODM/sorasgoof:
soras just joined, and ODM didn't strike me as particularly town. I asked a question in my ISO 4 and I repeated it in my ISO 5. He never answered. It may be a very relevant question in case Espeonage is scum. And I think Espeonage is scum. So I'd say no: I don't want to make a joint block with him before soras is done reading and posts some content.

finally, you prolly aready know what I think about this:
Espeonage:
nope. Very likely scum here. forgetaboutit.
"Vote lewarcher82.
He's not pretty enough." --PoisonIvy

my projected game
RUBIK'S CUBE MAFIA
won't take place. Mechanics too complicated. I will prolly give it a shot around Christmas.
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