[OLD] Open Setup Ideas and Discussion

[Max]

Better Idea:
If Town Mislynch, Scum Sacrifice a player
If Town Lynch Correctly, Scum kill a townie.

Like My "perpetual mylo". It reduces the swinginess as appropriate.

I approve of Max's set-up with the following added rule.

Scum are not allowed to Sacrifice any scum player who hammers a wagon. It prevents the L-1 on Town quickhammer and sacrifice strategy that really helped Scum win in the original iteration.

Agreed

[Amrun]

Do scum also get a normal NK in that scenario?

[Max]

I didn't include that when I did my calculations. I'll change it now to account for that.

If town has 11 there's a 60-40 split.
If there are 12 it's a 30-70.

I think 11 is better.
10 is a poor number.

[cjdrum]

3 Mafiosos

1 Cop

1 Vigilante

2 Watcher/Trackers

5 VTs

Watcher/Trackers

- Example: Every even night, they are a Watcher, every odd they are a Tracker. They aren't told which they are on what night. Each alternation is chosen randomly from these:

Spoiler: First W/T

- Even Watch, Odd Track (65%)
- Even Track, Odd Watch (35%)

Spoiler: Second W/T

- Even Watch, Odd Track (35%)
- Even Track, Odd Watch (65%)

I'd call it... "WT-65". Sounds spacey.

Thoughts? Improvements? Thanks in advance
(I bet I've done something wrong with keeping it in "Normal" rules. Just let me know)

[DarthYoshi]

@animorpherv--but w/ one protective + one investigatory role (rather than two protective), couldn't the town still have two cleared townies in a day? The point of Faith Plus One is to allow both protective and investigatory roles in an open setup without relying on the more cliched solutions of maf roleblockers, macho cops, etc.

@cjdrum--with that many investigatory roles in the game, I'd make one of the mafia a godfather or ninja at the very least.

[animorpherv1]

Yours is however broken by having cop and faith healer claim, because if the FH protecting the other FH gets good luck and lots of saves, ten game can essentially fall into a "rocks fall, everyone dies" scenario where the mafia can't (and/or won't) kill anyone else and town consistently NLs so they get more information.

[cjdrum]

@DY: I was reluctant about using a Godfather because of the single Cop, but I can see where you are coming from. A Ninja, though? I don't think I've heard of it...
PEdit: I think that, considering the ambiguity of when the two W/Ts are each role, the Ninja is pretty overpowered. The Godfather seems to be the best option, here, though.

Revised?

2 Mafiosos

1 Godfather

1 Cop

1 Vigilante

2 Watcher/Trackers

5 VTs

Watcher/Trackers

- Example: Every even night, they are a Watcher, every odd they are a Tracker. They aren't told which they are on what night (or which probabilities of these they specifically have). Each alternation is chosen randomly from these:

Spoiler: First W/T

- Even Watch, Odd Track (65%)
- Even Track, Odd Watch (35%)

Spoiler: Second W/T

- Even Watch, Odd Track (35%)
- Even Track, Odd Watch (65%)

I'd call it... "WT-65". Sounds spacey.

[Duplicity]

Cjdrum. Your setup is incredibly broken. If town mass-claims day one mafia will have issues counter claiming a power role meaning the following roles will be un counter-claimed and clear: Vig, Cop, 2 Watchers/Trackers.

Tell Watcher/Tracker #1 to be on the the vig claim. Tell Watcher/Tracker #2 to be on the cop claim.
Mafia can't kill either of the vig or cop without having a 65% chance of being caught. If mafia shoot a watcher they allow the uncounterclaimed cop to attain a likely clear or a possible guilty.

Lets run an example. Mafia shoot the cop N1. Watcher #2 has a guily on mafia #1. Watcher #1 is on the vig claim N2. Watcher #2 is on Watcher #1 N2. Mafia again have to kill one of them, 65% chance of town catching another mafia again unless mafia just shoot watcher #2. If they shoot watcher #2 the vig remains alive meaning town have multiple more shots at nailing mafia.

[Meransiel]

This is a suggestion that could be kind of fun if played out:

Military Mafia

9 townies
1 roleblocker
3 mafia goons

All players have a 1-shot night kill, and all players have a 1-shot bulletproof. The same mafia goon cannot use his one-shot kill and factional kill at the same time. Likewise, the roleblocker can't block and kill at the same time.

[Empking]

I like it and I think it goes back to what the Open Queue is all about.

Empking's Military Mafia

4 Townies
1 Roleblocker
2 Mafia Goons

All players have a 1-shot night kill, and all players have a 1-shot bulletproof. The same mafia goon cannot use his one-shot kill and factional kill at the same time. Likewise, the roleblocker can't block and kill at the same time.

[Meransiel]

Isn't that number of roles...too small?

[Empking]

Isn't that number of roles...too small?

No its just right.

[Herodotus]

I like it and I think it goes back to what the Open Queue is all about.

Empking's Military Mafia

4 Townies
1 Roleblocker
2 Mafia Goons

All players have a 1-shot night kill, and all players have a 1-shot bulletproof. The same mafia goon cannot use his one-shot kill and factional kill at the same time. Likewise, the roleblocker can't block and kill at the same time.

The mafia will win very quickly. Probably on Day 1.

[Empking]

I like it and I think it goes back to what the Open Queue is all about.

Empking's Military Mafia

4 Townies
1 Roleblocker
2 Mafia Goons

All players have a 1-shot night kill, and all players have a 1-shot bulletproof. The same mafia goon cannot use his one-shot kill and factional kill at the same time. Likewise, the roleblocker can't block and kill at the same time.

The mafia will win very quickly. Probably on Day 1.

Do you mean night one? And I'm not too sure (and if thery do it means that town made a concentrated effort to kill two townies. They deserve to lose.)

[ortolan]

Vengeful Lovers Multiball

2 Mafia Goon Lovers

2 Werewolf Lovers

2 Serial Killing Lovers

6 Vengeful Lovers

> Vengeance only happens on Day 1
> Nightless
> Serial Killers wins when it equals the amount of Town : 3rd Party

Does the Vengeful loveres each get one shot or does the couple as a whole get one shot?

this setup has too many potential kingmakers and is otherwise generally dysfunctional

[cjdrum]

Bloody hell this thread is full of "Nah that idea fails". Does

anybody

help with making the setup better, or is everything instant-yes/instant-no-get-rid-of-it?

[Empking]

Bloody hell this thread is full of "Nah that idea fails". Does

anybody

help with making the setup better, or is everything instant-yes/instant-no-get-rid-of-it?

I've just improved Meransiel's game. Also why don't you comment productively?

(I think we have to remember that a large porportion of set ups put out in this thread both suck and lack a decent hook. I think it shows good spirit that we're willing to just say the sucky set ups suck.)

[ortolan]

Bloody hell this thread is full of "Nah that idea fails". Does

anybody

help with making the setup better, or is everything instant-yes/instant-no-get-rid-of-it?

It's because people propose too many crappy setups which feature neither a purpose nor any good ideas within them

in the case of the setup I linked above, it caught my attention because it seems like it has potential, but unfortunately the main dynamic in it is ultimately unworkable

[Empking]

Empking's Guide to Making an Open Set Up

1. Steal somebody else's idea
2. Make a cosmetic change
3. Add your name to it.

1. Work out a hook
2. Evaluate the hook. Is it good? If yes go to three.
3. Work out the bare minimum of roles needed to fulfill your hook.
4. Work out the bare minimum of scum needed (two or more).
5. Make your set up only using those bare minimums.


On another note:
Thinking about it.

Empking's Military Mafia V.2

2 Mafia

1 Roleblocker
5 Townies

All players have a 1-shot night kill, and all players have a 1-shot bulletproof. The same mafia goon cannot use his one-shot kill and factional kill at the same time. Likewise, the roleblocker can't block and kill at the same time.

[cjdrum]

Also why don't you comment productively?

Because I don't know the slightest thing about balance or improvement in those sorts of areas, maybe?

[Meransiel]

Also why don't you comment productively?

Because I don't know the slightest thing about balance or improvement in those sorts of areas, maybe?

OMGUS

Idea:

New Blood Mafia

2 Mafia Apprentices
2 Cops
5 Townies

Mafia Apprentices are treated as Town if investigated until they kill somebody.

[gandalf5166]

That idea has been done before in Hard Boiled, but more complex and with more distractions. Just telling you that, not saying it's a bad idea to make a simpler version. Although two cops might still be a bit much.

[Empking]

Also why don't you comment productively?

Because I don't know the slightest thing about balance or improvement in those sorts of areas, maybe?

OMGUS

Idea:

New Blood Mafia

2 Mafia Apprentices
2 Cops
6 Townies

Mafia Apprentices are treated as Town if investigated until they kill somebody.

Drop a townie (to move it to the superior nine players) and I'll nominate it.

[Meransiel]

Once again, as I have told Tragedy. Me = New player

If it looks as if I'm ripping somebody off, that's not the case. Just sayin'.

Also, ok, 1 townie dropped.

Btw, I think 2 cops is not too much because the scum team may use only 1 member to make kills, so there's a good chance the other member will come off as confirmed for just enough to warrant a win.

[Empking]

Nominate: New Blood Mafia -1 Townie