A Gentleman's Game of Guile, Subterfuge, and Intrigue (Fin)

[Feysal]

And I must take issue with you over the appropriateness of that. It's not uncommon for cases, particularly early in the game, to develop further in response to how the accused person responds to the pressure on them. Indeed, I'd venture that it's the rule rather than the exception.

Perhaps I should clarify what I meant by that. It has been my experience that mafia often find it difficult to fabricate reasons to suspect someone, and thus they have a tendency to let the town players do the work for them, after which they adopt their points as their own and jump on board the lynch wagon. If it is someone they were voting to begin with, so much the better. I had this happen to me in a more recent game of mine. I had forgotten your original reason for voting kr0b, and it appeared as though you were jumping on board a popular wagon. Now, I am satisfied by your response.

Feysal and InHim

not voting I see. Why might this be?

It is sadly typical for me, particularly for early in the game. I do not have a good grasp of the game yet, and my reads on half of the players are weak or nonexistent. I am working on remedying this, and will vote in due time.

Clearly the subject I should delve in first is the case of Twistedspoon and Sir Hoppster. As I alluded to earlier, I've encountered feuds before, and their voting each other at the very beginning of the game reminded me of such. One particular pair of players I've encountered off-site has become infamous for stunts like crosskilling each other on night zero when in opposite mafia teams, or picking a fight with each other for the purpose of distancing when in the same team. Looking at what is happening between Twistedspoon and Sir Hoppster, I would say it has gone much too far to be distancing though. I think it is highly unlikely they could be partners in crime.

I am somewhat amused by Sir Hoppster choosing to vote himself. Every time I've seen that happen someone has pointed out that self-voting is a useful ploy for mafia to gather sympathy, so I might as well be the one to say it now. However, I've never actually seen mafia self-vote, except in hopeless situations to end their own misery. Thus I view the self-vote as a town tell, particularly the attitude with which it was made.

I believe I'll have to look for Twistedspoon's past games to get a better read of him. My experiences with meta have been unreliable, however newer and less experienced players are often easier to get a read on, so seeking meta on him could be worth it.

[inHimshallibe]

I do believe I've refreshed myself of the current situations to participate in the present.

Hoppsy, my dear, I think the prevarication and shouting match you've found yourself in with Twistedspoon is a fray of folly. At this point I think emotion is controlling you as a confounding couple and you could use some time outside of the Chunnel, as it were. Spoon, Esq. looks the worse of you two, but many a time have I been blinded in rage as a townie.

If Spoon were not as active as he is, his actions might garner more suspicion with me, but I will not push to evict someone producing as many posts, and therefore by some byproduct, content. The squeaky wheel gets the grease, and all that, dear Hoppsy, and I think we're seeing a direct corollary of said rumination.

As for yourself, my dear Hoppsy, your points are logical in regards to Spoon, Esq. and you make several decent rebuttals. But, again, I think emotion has taken deep root and you will not be able to see eye-to-eye with Twistedspoon for a good while and so I do not doubt your position is genuine, but that your premise is biased.

[inHimshallibe]

Now, who is taking advantage of the name-calling to push Spoon, Esq. out the door?

[inHimshallibe]

Sirs K. Paca and V. Piraka - dare I ask if you two share a common lineage a bit down the family tree? Anyway, those two at first glance to be voting Spoon, Esq. in earnest.

I've located the faker.

[inHimshallibe]

vote: Sir Apokalyptika

This is a matter of feel, a certain je ne sais quoi to his voting patterns. I think Sir Boose has a valid point that Sir Apokalyptika's voting patterns have changed stances until he has found a firm footing of popularity.

In other words, I get the sense of feces being flung at the wall, and hoping for something to stick.

[Twistedspoon]

I am somewhat amused by Sir Hoppster choosing to vote himself. Every time I've seen that happen someone has pointed out that self-voting is a useful ploy for mafia to gather sympathy

as I thought too

[imaginality]

On my meta reads: I don't meta often (meta me if you want to check that ) but from what I saw, Twistedspoon's posting this game seems more like his town games here and here than this scum game where he comes across as trying harder to play in a pro-town, well-reasoned, more-long-posts (relative to his usual length) way. That leaves me feeling he's likely town here. And wondering what Apokalyptika thinks, following her meta reason for voting him, if she's now had time to check his meta beyond the one game she mentioned.

inHimshallibe also seems more similar to his town play here and here than his scum play here.

Had trouble finding much difference between StrangerCoug's meta as town and scum.

[inHimshallibe]

I am somewhat amused by Sir Hoppster choosing to vote himself. Every time I've seen that happen someone has pointed out that self-voting is a useful ploy for mafia to gather sympathy

as I thought too

My dear Spoon, Esq., you've relinquished context from Sir Feysal's post. Sir Feysal ascertains the vote-for-self method more telling for a true Gentleman.

[Twistedspoon]

the part I quoted was the part I agree with

If anyone wants to read more of feysal, they are welcome to do so

I didn't post the second part, because that was not the part I agreed with, obv

[Caboose]

Sir Caboose, I fear that you have been inattentive. I have repeatedly said that a policy lynch is an excellent place for a scoundrel to place his vote without repercussions.

That, my dear sir, is begging the question. Why is placing a policy lynch vote inherently scummy?

In addition, the votes I have placed were for Sir Hoppster (for mere whimsical reasons), Sir imaginality (for what I believed to be an overenthusiastic defense), Sir Longing (for promoting a policy lynch), Sir Vezok (for lack of contribution) and now Sir Twisted, for being 10 types of scummy.

The Sir Longing vote is "popular" in the sense that the reason for the vote (policy lynch vote) is a well-accepted "scumtell" but, upon examination, really isn't. Your scuminess comes from your failure to adequately back up the premise of the vote.

I'm not sure what Hoppster wants me to say the TS wagon. If I thought it had any merit, I would be on it.

[Hoppster]

I'm not sure what Hoppster wants me to say the TS wagon. If I thought it had any merit, I would be on it.

So why does it have no merit?

I am somewhat amused by Sir Hoppster choosing to vote himself. Every time I've seen that happen someone has pointed out that self-voting is a useful ploy for mafia to gather sympathy

as I thought too

*splutter*

So why did you not bring this up before if you thought it, rather than waiting for somebody to say it so that you could parrot it? And even then, you are distinctly misrepresenting their actual views on this scenario. Why not just state your opinion without taking a quote out of context and sheeping it?

the part I quoted was the part I agree with

If anyone wants to read more of feysal, they are welcome to do so

I didn't post the second part, because that was not the part I agreed with, obv

But quoting it out of context is misrepresenting his views, by presenting him to be somebody who feels it is scummy in this scenario when he said he does not. Did you not feel that you were misrepresenting his views when you took his quote out of context? Or did you feel that it was justified in order to have something to sheep?


Apokalyptika: What did you think of my self-vote?

imaginality: Why use meta this game if you do not do it on a normal basis?

StrangerCoug: Would you say that my pursuit of Twistedspoon is sincere?

[inHimshallibe]

Sir Hoppster is truly a Gentleman. I will not give up the faith on Twistedspoon, Esq. so quickly, but do not side with him in the current argument between those two.

[Twistedspoon]

@hopp: my aim wasn't to misrepresent him

in fact I wasn't representing him at all

I just chose a nice sentence I agreed with and said I agreed with it
I don't have to agree with his whole post do I?

[vezokpiraka]

Why did you say you agree with one sentence? That's like 2 types of fluff and active lurking.

[inHimshallibe]

In words not so eloquent as our own, a dear friend of mine would often respond to tripe like this with simply:

Why did you say you agree with one sentence? That's like 2 types of fluff and active lurking.

not helpful

[Hoppster]

@hopp: my aim wasn't to misrepresent him

in fact I wasn't representing him at all

I just chose a nice sentence I agreed with and said I agreed with it
I don't have to agree with his whole post do I?

I am somewhat amused by Sir Hoppster choosing to vote himself. Every time I've seen that happen someone has pointed out that self-voting is a useful ploy for mafia to gather sympathy

as I thought too

"as I thought too" = He thought this, and I agree with him

Do you dispute this?


And while we're talking:

I am somewhat amused by Sir Hoppster choosing to vote himself. Every time I've seen that happen someone has pointed out that self-voting is a useful ploy for mafia to gather sympathy

as I thought too

*splutter*

So why did you not bring this up before if you thought it, rather than waiting for somebody to say it so that you could parrot it?

vezok:

I answered it.

I think TS is scummy because of the fluff he is posting. That is my position on him.

I never said only one of you could be scum. I actually said that this could be a scum VS scum fight but I maintain my position on TS.

Yes, that was one of my questions, but I'm talking about the other. I'll re-quote it:

Kr0b freaked out because of a vote and asked for reasons. Townies don't do that. I didn't give reasons because I wanted to see his reaction. He is

still

scum.

vezok, I am (most logically, if I may say so myself) inferring from the above quotation (which I most correctly am attributing to your self) that you must have had a reason for voting kr0b and thinking him not a good fellow

before

the results of your so-called 'test' (ho-ho!). I have taken the liberty of adding boldened emphasis to show my line of reasoning - you said he was

still

scum, what made him scum before, I must ask?

Further to this, I'll add the following:

a) I flip scum. Is Twistedspoon more or less likely to be scum?
b) I flip town. Is Twistedspoon more or less likely to be scum?
c), d): as a) and b), but vice-versa.

[Twistedspoon]

Why did you say you agree with one sentence? That's like 2 types of fluff and active lurking.

I quite liked the sentence :0

anyways, why don't you just ask hoppster why he self-voted

no-one seems to have done so :/

[Twistedspoon]

So why did you not bring this up before if you thought it, rather than waiting for somebody to say it so that you could parrot it?

[/size]
[/quote]
I thought I voiced my dissatifaction at your self-vote already :/

does it matter when I said it?

[vezokpiraka]

a) Less likely. Although just by a slight margin.
b) More likely. Like 75% sure he'll flip scum.
c) Won't change my view on you. As much as I know you could've bussed a weak buddy.
d)Eh. Still won't change my view on you too much.

I view you as town btw.

[Caboose]

I'm not sure what Hoppster wants me to say the TS wagon. If I thought it had any merit, I would be on it.

So why does it have no merit?

The burden of proof is on you to prove that it's a good wagon. To me, you've failed to do so.

[Hoppster]

Why did you say you agree with one sentence? That's like 2 types of fluff and active lurking.

I quite liked the sentence :0

anyways, why don't you just ask hoppster why he self-voted

no-one seems to have done so :/

LOL WHY DON'T YOU

Ahem, I mean, what utter foolishness I do see here. For you are getting others to do the dirty work for you, it would appear?

I thought I voiced my dissatifaction at your self-vote already :/

does it matter when I said it?

Correction: you have sheeped two opinions on my self-vote (and even then, one of them was taken out of context).
Why

wouldn't

timing matter?

a) Less likely. Although just by a slight margin.
b) More likely. Like 75% sure he'll flip scum.
c) Won't change my view on you. As much as I know you could've bussed a weak buddy.
d)Eh. Still won't change my view on you too much.

I view you as town btw.

That's more along the lines of what I wanted, but you still haven't answered that bit about kr0b. ;_;

I'm not sure what Hoppster wants me to say the TS wagon. If I thought it had any merit, I would be on it.

So why does it have no merit?

The burden of proof is on you to prove that it's a good wagon. To me, you've failed to do so.

¡¿QUÉ?!

This is... absolutely ridiculous. Have you been reading recent posts I have made? Have you been reading the bit where Twistedspoon decides all my questions do not need answering because they're traps? Did you see my self-vote? Have you seen Twistedspoon's repeated misrepresentation? And yet you feel no need to comment on any of these?

[Twistedspoon]

Why did you say you agree with one sentence? That's like 2 types of fluff and active lurking.

I quite liked the sentence :0

anyways, why don't you just ask hoppster why he self-voted

no-one seems to have done so :/

LOL WHY DON'T YOU

Ahem, I mean, what utter foolishness I do see here. For you are getting others to do the dirty work for you, it would appear?

well when i saidd that I was asking you in a way :p

so why did you if you need it as plain as that

[Hoppster]

If you'll forgive me, I'll withold that until we've heard back from everybody (although it's fairly guessable).

What do you think of Caboose?

[Twistedspoon]

If you'll forgive me, I'll withold that until we've heard back from everybody (although it's fairly guessable).

What do you think of Caboose?

it's fairly guessable why you voted for yourself?

hardly to me unless it's a mafia empathy ploy

Caboose? Caboose asks a lot of Questions and provides analysis. The Quality is evident in the ISO despite the quantity
A top-half town read for me

[Hoppster]

Caboose? Caboose asks a lot of Questions and provides analysis. The Quality is evident in the ISO despite the quantity
A top-half town read for me

Despite this (bottom of post)?