Nintendo Mafia (Game Over)

[The Master Hand]

Also, danakillsu is town.
Unvote and vote Ythan please.

-A

[Kdub]

1) Does not outweigh the fact that he is a PR and I am not.
2) Could be just as easily applied to me trying harder to defend myself. The same pressure is going to be on me tomorrow, so why would I try to get someone else lynched instead who I think is town? No, I want to at LEAST give Ythan another night of actions. If you're still wanting to lynch him tomorrow with whatever extra info you have, so be it. Doesn't mean I think it makes sense, though.

This can't seriously be your mindset as town. You know what townies actually do? They defend themselves and try to argue their way out of being lynched. They

never

volunteer themselves to be lynched in this situation unless their lynch is absolutely inevitable (e.g. false guilty result or some other incriminating info). Right now you are playing scummy, but certainly not in a situation that a normal town player would find unsalvageable.

And if dana does flips scum, tomorrow I am going after anybody who unvoted or claimed a town read on him after his attempted sacrifice gambit. The fact that the dana wagon has stalled in favor of bad wagons against uncounterclaimed PRs makes me pretty confident that there are scum trying to save him under the guise of believing his sacrifice attempt to be genuine.

ythan is scum. ythan slipped in assuming a correlation between night actions that town players cannot see.

Can you explain what extra info he would have as scum that would make his case against thil make any sense?

Ask yourself, why would Ythan claim doc in that situation if he were scum? First of all, if there is an SK in the game, he just put a big target on his back. Second, if he really wanted to gambit to get thil lynched, why didn't he just counterclaim cop?

[lewarcher82]

@kdub: I think that there may be a reason why ythan's reconstruction made sense to him: probably, he know that scum has a role that prevents or redirects night actions. But I have no complete reconstruction. Just the strong feeling of a subtle scumslip.

As for claiming doc: well, I think scum knows that there is no doc (for instance, when I joined frenzy mafia, I was scum and mod gave us roles we could safely claim). If there is no doc, and town has other protective mechanics (jk, rb, watcher or similar stuff), claiming doc would be the best way for him to be able to talk himself out of the shit once thil flipped cop. Since I am really convinced ythan is scum playing scummy for scum reasons due to a scum win condition, I conclude that most likely we have no doc. Probably a rb or a jk + a now claimed joat with a one shot huge protective power.

Besides, do not forget that ythan was trying to get thil lynched without claiming doc. He was kinda forced to claim.

I think you should ask yourself: why is Ythan voting dana and not thil now? This is a far more interesting question.

@dekes: I meditated about your claim. There are two questions I'd like to ask you, the first is easy, but I am not sure if it is a good idea to ask the second...
1) why did you decide to use a strong massblock ability - which in endgame transforms mylo into an ML - on night 1? Blocking kills on night 1 is borderline anti-town, because it prevents town from getting information... I'd have definitely waited a little longer to use it. Can you explain?
2) mmmh... let me put it this way. There has been a lot of flavour speculation lately, and part of it was used as a way to support ythan's genuinity. Do you have any comments about it?

[GhostWriter]

Alrighty, look, today needs to end in a lynch. All 3 wagons offer data and varying likelihoods for scum flips. And all that's happening is talking that amounts to beating around the bush to a no lynch for the day. Which helps nothing and no one. So I don't know about the rest of you, but I am willing to move my vote to ensure a lynch today. Ythan would be my preferred back-up vote, but if it has to be Thil, then I'll vote Thil.

Speaking of Ythan, I think Lew brings up an excellent point:

I think you should ask yourself: why is Ythan voting dana and not thil now? This is a far more interesting question.

[Bunnylover]

reading.
Nothing has changed my mind.

[danakillsu]

1) Does not outweigh the fact that he is a PR and I am not.
2) Could be just as easily applied to me trying harder to defend myself. The same pressure is going to be on me tomorrow, so why would I try to get someone else lynched instead who I think is town? No, I want to at LEAST give Ythan another night of actions. If you're still wanting to lynch him tomorrow with whatever extra info you have, so be it. Doesn't mean I think it makes sense, though.

This can't seriously be your mindset as town. You know what townies actually do? They defend themselves and try to argue their way out of being lynched. They

never

volunteer themselves to be lynched in this situation unless their lynch is absolutely inevitable (e.g. false guilty result or some other incriminating info). Right now you are playing scummy, but certainly not in a situation that a normal town player would find unsalvageable.

You think I'm not going to notice that you just restated your original argument again? You haven't explained WHY that's what townies always have to do, you've just said it over and over. The point is NOT that it's salvageable, which I've already told you. I don't want to salvage it, because of the consequences I see if I DO salvage it.
On the other hand, some people have been bringing up good points about Ythan that make me somewhat less sure that he's town. I suppose at this point if it's thil or Ythan getting lynched, I'll lynch Ythan, but I STILL want me lynched over either of them and Kdub lynched over me.

[Ythan]

I made a mistake with my information and thil isn't going to be lynched without it.

[Dekes]

1) thil's play is consistent with that of an unexperienced player who - being a PR - is unable to scumhunt and relies too much on mechanics;
2) being unexperienced, there is no way he would invent such a crazy claim;
3) pine did not overreact to the report, and he did it on purpose, to have people think thil was scum

1) I disagree. A newbie, probably first time as a cop and his first guilty, I don't see anybody being completely passive towards their guilty, not even mentioning the guilty until being wagoned themselves. Imo the excitement over the guilty would outweigh the fear of being exposed as a cop.
2) Scum fakeclaiming cop with a guilty is hardly a crazy claim. The opposite actually. And don't forget: scum have daytalk.
3) Would that be different if they were buddies? I mean, if thil gets lynched and flips scum, Pine is basically cleared, no?


@thil
You said somewhere you had offsite mafia experience. Did you ever draw a cop there?

So our ultimate consensus is that we're not lynching thil and we're not lynching dana, despite his pleas to do so. Vote stays on Ythan, and I don't think there is anything in the thil or dana case that will convince us otherwise.
-Toast

So, you'd rather no lynch today than lynching a claimed VT, offering his death for information's sake? Gotcha.

Also, Dekes' claim is believeable, as N1 was N1 and had no result and blocked kills and crap like that.
YET, I think its just as likely to be scum as town.

Your tunneling is getting ridiculous.
1) Link me to a game with a scum mass roleblocker.
2) Tell me the benefits of a mafia that blocks everything during the night, including his faction's own kill.
3) Why would scum me claim unprovoked right now before night without any pressure? I did it to out the information I have and to stop NK speculation about the discrepancy in NKs that has no place right now close before deadline when we should discuss lynching business.

@dekes: I meditated about your claim. There are two questions I'd like to ask you, the first is easy, but I am not sure if it is a good idea to ask the second...
1) why did you decide to use a strong massblock ability - which in endgame transforms mylo into an ML - on night 1? Blocking kills on night 1 is borderline anti-town, because it prevents town from getting information... I'd have definitely waited a little longer to use it. Can you explain?
2) mmmh... let me put it this way. There has been a lot of flavour speculation lately, and part of it was used as a way to support ythan's genuinity. Do you have any comments about it?

1) Because Day 1 was a waste of time and words, period. I wanted to give us a clean slate and be Lelouch's/Jakalope's a free policy lynch for town. Sure, the optimal use of this role would be in MyLo, maybe even catching the scum in the progress. But I thought it to be too unlikely to happen and honestly, I thought, I played a decent town game back on D1 and didn't expect to make it to endgame. If I had known that the mass roleblock combined with the myriad of replacements would stall the game that much, I obviously would've reconsidered.
2) Not today. It becomes more relevant, once more people have flipped.

@Kdub
How far will your believe in thil's and Ythan's claims go? Is the fact they are un-cc'd in a closed setup, the only basis for your town reads on them?

Six hours to deadline, people! Move those votes!

Unvote; Vote: Dana

Seems to have the biggest chance of getting through in time. DH is still scum, he keeps ignoring the shit of this game.

[The Master Hand]

Wasn't going to post until night but I saw Dekes' bullshit and had to respond.

So, you'd rather no lynch today than lynching a claimed VT, offering his death for information's sake? Gotcha.

I will NOT lynch a player, who in my mind, is near confirmed-town status. If you're unwilling to vote Ythan then you're going to have to selfvote for me to help you lynch right now.
Why? Because thil and dana are strong townreads at the moment. Nothing besides a Cop-guilty on dana would make me lynch him right now. This is how sure I am right now.

Your tunneling is getting ridiculous.
1) Link me to a game with a scum mass roleblocker.
2) Tell me the benefits of a mafia that blocks everything during the night, including his faction's own kill.
3) Why would scum me claim unprovoked right now before night without any pressure? I did it to out the information I have and to stop NK speculation about the discrepancy in NKs that has no place right now close before deadline when we should discuss lynching business.

Your idiocy is getting ridiculous.
1) Mini 943: Greek Mythology. Plum's SUPERPOWER blocked all actions against made against her scumteam.
2) I highly doubt, a straight mass-RB is your power (if you're scum). I think it would be conditional- everyone BUT YOU would be blocked, or every action would be blocked. Also, you would purposefully no-kill to pass off your claim as town, unless jmj said that your kill wouldn't work if you used it. Regardless, you either no-killed to paint yourself a true town all-stop or it blocks everyone EXCEPT your group's actions. And hey, as scum, guaranteed blocking any SK/vig/other mafia factions' kills is a bonus ANY night. Why are you so eager to prove they they don't exist as scum?
3) Because you're looking for towncred. And with me and lewarcher breathing down on your fail-tastic "alliance" and fail-voting bloc you could use the extra towncred. You'd be the perfect vig shot tonight and I plan to fire up the bakery oven tonight.

Hey Dekes:

Character:

Heat

Alignment:

Mitochondrial Mafia

[Anti-Town]

Win Condition:

You win if at least one member of your group is alive and all other players are dead (or if nothing can prevent the same).

Role:

Universal Roleblocker

Abilities:

1) You are confirmed as a member of the

Mitochondrial Mafia

with bill1148 and inHimshallibe. At all times, you may communicate with your group privately. You are encouraged to communicate in this quicktopic:
*pending permission from the group*

2) As the universal roleblocker, you have the ability to potentially end a night phase instantly. Using this action will roleblock every living player, including your teammates. You cannot perform this ability on consecutive nights.

3) Each night, you may perform a night kill on behalf of your faction. Your kill flavor is "kicked to death."

4) At night, you may privately communicate in the following neighborhood:
http://www.quicktopic.com/44/H/CNNG9Aw98NUJ

Size is mine. Please note his alignment.

<3,

-A

[jmj3000]

Official Vote Count

Players needed to lynch: 7

danakillsu

- 5 - Kdub, GhostWriter, Ythan, thil13, Dekes - (L-2)

Kdub

- 1 - danakillsu - (L-6)

thil13

- 3 - Pinky and the Brain, Crazypianist1116, esuriospiritus - (L-4)

Ythan

- 3 - The Master Hand, lewarcher82, Bunnylover - (L-4)

Players not voting: DemonHybrid,

Searching for a replacement for crazypianist.

(expired on 2011-06-06 05:00:00)

Y'all let me know if there are any errors.

[Dekes]

@TMH
Well, you got me there. They do exist in scum form. Never seen them and I'd still wager the disadvantages outweigh the benefits fopr such a role, but oh, well.

Besides you, Ythan is the only one who's expressed suspicion against me. Even your continued crusade against me hasn't changed that. lewarcher is mad, because he expects more activity from town Dekes, and rightfully so.

You thinking I'm a better vig shot than scummy non-contributors like DH and cp's is just further proof of your tunneling and an exclusive opinion among town.

I didn't suggest the alliance and I didn't actively pursue its agenda for at least a month, and neither did its other members. So stop misrepping me once again by saying that "my voting block failed".

[danakillsu]

Well, the shift to Kdub isn't happening, and this isn't against the rules as far as I can see, so

unvote vote: Dana

.
At this point, I would definitely switch to Ythan to keep thil from being lynched, but for no other reason that I can expect will I change my vote.

[The Master Hand]

dana, unvote. That's no way to the play the game. Vote Ythan. You know you're town. That's what matters. So please, at least vote someone who you know isn't 100% town.

This is ridiculous.

@ Dekes: You're just lurking at all the wrong times, dude. It failed because its supposed to catch scum and vote as a bloc. By

not

acting it fails

to

act and therein fails its purpose. Also, I'm just not motivated to make the case on you 4 hours before deadline, and with 4 hours left ROI says to not bother so.

[Kdub]

On the other hand, some people have been bringing up good points about Ythan that make me somewhat less sure that he's town. I suppose at this point if it's thil or Ythan getting lynched, I'll lynch Ythan, but I STILL want me lynched over either of them and Kdub lynched over me.

How convenient, after you just went on about you wanting to be lynched over Ythan because you thought he was town. And as for why townies don't behave the way you have been, I thought I already answered that. If you are town, you

know

that your own death guarantees a mislynch, whereas you obviously can't say that about anybody else (as evidenced by this recent wavering on Ythan). Town wants to maximize the chances of lynching scum, so town sacrificing themselves goes against this goal.

Also, since you are now claiming to prefer to lynch Ythan (whom you were willing to sacrifice yourself in place of because of your read on him) over thil, let me remind you of your stated reads on thil:

Hmm. After reviewing the evidence, I tend to agree that thil's actions read more like inept scum than unfortunate town.

thil's a complete wild card.

Also, I should mention that the thil thing isn't actually definite town, it's just that I have no idea where to put him.

The closest you come to defending him is this:

I thought those arguing for thil being scum made more convincing arguments. That is not important to me anymore, because thil has proven himself somewhat, and I don't really want to lynch him right now.

But that's hardly as emphatic as your defense of Ythan.

@Kdub
How far will your believe in thil's and Ythan's claims go? Is the fact they are un-cc'd in a closed setup, the only basis for your town reads on them?

It's mostly the basis for my town read on thil, along with the fact that his claim led directly to Pine's lynch. With Ythan, I have a decent town read based on his play alone, and it's not just the fact that his claim is uncountered, but the timing and nature of his claim that makes him look town.

I've put a scum one-shot mass roleblocker in a game before as an alternative to a traditional roleblocker. The version I used blocked only town abilities, but the SE3 version that TMH brought up did apply to all players. It seems redudnant to give scum a roleblocker and a mass roleblocker. If thil is telling the truth about being roleblocked last night, it strongly suggests that Dekes' is town. Obviously if Dekes turns out to be a scum mass roleblocker, thil is probably scum. Independent of that, Dekes is probably telling the truth because 1) if the mass block was one-shot, it would be stupid for scum to waste it on N1 instead of in a situation where they might need to stop an investigation or a one-shot town role, and 2) if it's not one-shot, and we have a future night where there are no kills and nobody gets investigation results, then obviously Dekes was lying, so he would not be able to use the ability again at any point or else he would be giving himself up. Also, like with Ythan, the timing of the claim seems town to me. What would scum-Dekes have gained by claiming there?

@thil:
Were you explicitly told that you were roleblocked? Could be important.

Nothing besides a Cop-guilty on dana would make me lynch him right now. This is how sure I am right now.

This is suspicious. I can maybe understand someone reading dana as town by believing his sacrifice attempt to be genuine, but I can't fathom how anybody can look at his play as a whole and say that he is a surefire town read.

Nevermind the deadline, I don't even think there is sufficient support for a thil or Ythan lynch even if time wasn't an issue. dana dies today.

[esuriospiritus]

Fuck. Just saw this.

vote: dana

Hopefully it's not too late to prevent a no-lynch.

[esuriospiritus]

Also, @TMH: Why didn't you vote Dana to prevent a no lynch when you were around?

[Ythan]

Hammer! Probably goodbye guys. <3

[The Master Hand]

I will NOT lynch a player, who in my mind, is near confirmed-town status. If you're unwilling to vote Ythan then you're going to have to selfvote for me to help you lynch right now.
Why? Because thil and dana are strong townreads at the moment. Nothing besides a Cop-guilty on dana would make me lynch him right now. This is how sure I am right now.

[esuriospiritus]

Sure enough that you'd rather go through the same exact crap tomorrow? No lynching is mega anti-town, regardless of what your read is. I'm not completely thrilled with Dana going either, but it's better than

nobody

flipping. Town not being organized enough to push a lynch through can only benefit scum, in the end.

[The Master Hand]

Sure enough that you'd rather go through the same exact crap tomorrow? No lynching is mega anti-town, regardless of what your read is. I'm not completely thrilled with Dana going either, but it's better than

nobody

flipping. Town not being organized enough to push a lynch through can only benefit scum, in the end.

Whoop-de-freakin'-doo.
My read is based on a personal tell. He's town.
However, if there's a vig with half a brain out there I suspect he'd at least consider shooting dana if he had a scumread on him. Otherwise please shoot a scumread in general. Mafia Doctor = dead so there's no real excuse. OH HEY. If the vig isn't blocked then thil was. If thil is town and the vig doesn't kill THEREFORE thil must get a result. YAAYYYYYYY LOGIC WINNNNN YESSSSSSS

Oh yeah.
dana is town.

-Hydra with Half a Brain

[danakillsu]

Okay, so I prevented a no lynch. That's good enough for me. Now get the scum, please. Dana out.

[jmj3000]

As the computer works towards the end of another active cycle, you all argue and point at whoever you think is scum. Finally, you all start to come to a consensus on the one that calls themselves danakillsu. "I'm just plain old vanilla town!" he claims. Some believe him, some don't, and you are at a standstill. Finally, as the computer is shutting different programs down, you all decide to drag danakillsu towards the recycle bin. Suddenly, he breaks free of all of you and jumps into the recycle bin by himself. His last words as he is deleted are "Get the scum, please." Not sure if his words were meant to confuse or not, you go check his folder. You are greeted with the noise of cuccos clucking, in what appears to be a small inn. Appears like he never had time to do anything, for good or bad.

danakillsu, Anju, Vanilla Townie

Has been lynched Day 4.

Night deadline is 72 hours from this post, which makes it 9:30 AM EDT June 9th.

(expired on 2011-06-09 09:30:00)

[jmj3000]

wierdalexv replaces crazypianist1116, effective immediately.

[jmj3000]

Night is over. I will post flips and open the thread after work tonight, so please bare with me.

[jmj3000]

Flavor to come later. There has been enough of a delay in this day starting already.

Ythan, Princess Peach, doctor

,was found incinerated and surrounded by energy burns Night 4.

Dekes, Kirby, Jack of all Trades

, was found with multiple high-energy burn marks on their body Night 4.

It is now Day 5. Deadline is going to stay 2 weeks, because I feel like being nice. Deadline is June 24th at 12:30 AM EDT.

(expired on 2011-06-24 00:30:00)