Mini 1217 - Campaign Mafia (Game Over!)

[hiplop]

oh god. I forgot about this completely

Wouldn't a scummy player be better for the town? we want obv towns for end game dont we?

[Packbat]

oh god. I forgot about this completely

Wouldn't a scummy player be better for the town? we want obv towns for end game dont we?

Good point - although we need to have a backup towny volunteer available, in case deadline looms and our scummy candidate concedes the case by refusing to self-nom.

[Johhog]

Shadow Dancer is very scummy imo.

[Lurconis]

Shadow Dancer is very scummy imo.

No I did not read the five pages of thread you have aggregated over night.
Does it mater - no - because no way I am voting for Maruchan today. Who seeds irresponsible behaviour will earn just the same...

vote timeeater

Look up the latest vote count now...

High five!

Why hasn't maru been quickhammered yet? Quicklynch him, it's the best strategy. Chances to hit scum even by pure chance are never as high as today due special game mechanics. Long discussion only plays into scum's hands, they have a nasty fat voting block in this game.

I totally agree on Shadow Dancer he seems scummy from what little he has posted. Tavo, him and hiplop have barely posted. So it is hard to get strong reads, but then again it isn't always about the amount it can be about the content. Tavo's one post while too brief for me to personally feel a full town read on had much more content than Shadow. Hiplop is either town or a very savy WIFOM scum by voting maruchan. At this point i feel packbat and shadow dancer are the two most scummy players though packbat actually participates and tries to scum hunt. Shadow just shows up says he isn't reading what has happened before votes. Then congratulates himself. Then comes back and shows he didn't read again by not knowing an election already happened.

Anyway I am fine with us asking Shadow Dancer to show us good faith by entering the election.

[Lurconis]

EBWOP those three shadow dancer quotes are all he has offered so far in this game and his final one came well after Maru had already been eliminated.

[Quilford]

let me be blunt

Quilford how do you say my play in that game is different to this one? And don't say you were more transparent because that means nothing and is exactly the sort of flimsy meta accusation I would expect scum to use.

all I'm asking you to do is explain you read on me

Screw that. You were more transparent. Your play in that game just rung town. Everything you said just sounded like it came from a genuinely townie perspective. I recommend everyone go read that game and compare.

and the reason I found you "Welp I guess I'm conftown now. lol" post so scummy is because it's exactly the sort of self-preservation that i'd expect scum to use. Town modesty is a virtue. If you hadn't come along and said yu were confirmed town then that ironcally would have made you more town. It's only scum who have to flount their townieness. You weren't even in danger of the lynch/ext at this point so I saw no reason for it, and your baseless conjecture doesn't stand well with me either

It doesn't matter whether calling myself confirmed town is scummy or not, it matters why I'm calling myself confirmed town.

[Twistedspoon]

let me be blunt

Quilford how do you say my play in that game is different to this one? And don't say you were more transparent because that means nothing and is exactly the sort of flimsy meta accusation I would expect scum to use.

all I'm asking you to do is explain you read on me

Screw that. You were more transparent. Your play in that game just rung town. Everything you said just sounded like it came from a genuinely townie perspective. I recommend everyone go read that game and compare.

how was I more transparent?

you haven't said what of my posts you don't like

you're like arguing with my younger brother here. I never get anywhere.
Until you give reasons I won't be happy

you've still got other things to answer but tbh I can't be bothered chasing them questions down If I'm going to get the same scummy answers.

[Johhog]

I'm agreeing with Twisted here. Quilford, you need to come up with a real accusation.

[Twistedspoon]

johog, do you think quilford is confirmed town?

[Johhog]

Lolno. Why would he be? He is one of the scummier in this game imo.

[Twistedspoon]

I should be close to confirmed town for my post asking Maruchan for the timing of his Role PM, which at the time was something only a townie would know.

I'm not sure I understand this reason quilford

what's not so say both scum and town got their role Pms at the same time?

[Quilford]

Crazy felt the need to actually post the timing...?

I have come up with a real accusation, and I do have other points that I am too lazy to post at this point, like the fact that what obviously happened was Twisted voted Maruchan for towncred and then immediately switched, quoting all previous reasoning and not even offering an original perspective on things, once he realised he had the hammer.

[Twistedspoon]

Lolno. Why would he be? He is one of the scummier in this game imo.

hmm

not sure if this is just the 'old quilford' playstyle though. I'll admit I'm unsure. I don't understand why he find you scummy

I also think hiplop's last post could have included more. He seems to be avoiding taking a stance on many issues and reads, but maybe that's just his inactivity. Hvaen't seen any particularly strong tells either way, but I'm leaning town on him

I still feel this game is incredibly scum-sided. imo scum should never have ~45% population as well as the advantage that they know each other and have a QT. I shall rant about this more at the endgame if we lose

PEdit: I'll explain my reasoning on Lurconis in a bit - don't change the subject.

how about now? I don't want you to forget :/

oh god. I forgot about this completely

Wouldn't a scummy player be better for the town? we want obv towns for end game dont we?

Good point - although we need to have a backup towny volunteer available, in case deadline looms and our scummy candidate concedes the case by refusing to self-nom.

it was my idea to keep the obvtownies for the end
but yeah, this looks the best plan

anyways I'm off to play football manager now. 2024 seems to be my lucky year :p

[Twistedspoon]

Crazy felt the need to actually post the timing...?

I have come up with a real accusation, and I do have other points that I am too lazy to post at this point, like the fact that what obviously happened was Twisted voted Maruchan for towncred and then immediately switched, quoting all previous reasoning and not even offering an original perspective on things, once he realised he had the hammer.

an original perspective? my perspective was that I found manchu scummy but not worthy of a quickhammer when I realised i had hammered
that's how all players feel after they realised they have hammed accidentally and I was no different

what sort of 'original perspective' were you looking for?

[Twistedspoon]

Crazy felt the need to actually post the timing...?

so? he said that wasn't indicative of alignment or something like that, meaning that PMs were sent out at the same time

@crazy: were scum role Pms sent out at the same time as town Pms, and would we be able to use role PM time to deduce alignments?

[Quilford]

Lolno. Why would he be? He is one of the scummier in this game imo.

hmm

not sure if this is just the 'old quilford' playstyle though. I'll admit I'm unsure. I don't understand why he find you scummy

Did you just admit to not reading my posts? I'm pretty sure I list Johhog as town in the same post I list you as scum?

I also think hiplop's last post could have included more. He seems to be avoiding taking a stance on many issues and reads, but maybe that's just his inactivity. Hvaen't seen any particularly strong tells either way, but I'm leaning town on him

Fencesitting.

I still feel this game is incredibly scum-sided. imo scum should never have ~45% population as well as the advantage that they know each other and have a QT. I shall rant about this more at the endgame if we lose

Theory discussion.

PEdit: I'll explain my reasoning on Lurconis in a bit - don't change the subject.

how about now? I don't want you to forget :/

oh god. I forgot about this completely

Wouldn't a scummy player be better for the town? we want obv towns for end game dont we?

Good point - although we need to have a backup towny volunteer available, in case deadline looms and our scummy candidate concedes the case by refusing to self-nom.

it was my idea to keep the obvtownies for the end
but yeah, this looks the best plan

For some weird reason you guys are all overlooking the obvious fault in this plan which is that if we nominate who we think is obvtown the scum will nominate obvscum and vice versa?

[Quilford]

so? he said that wasn't indicative of alignment

Lies.

or something like that

Backpedaling.

[Twistedspoon]

Lolno. Why would he be? He is one of the scummier in this game imo.

hmm

not sure if this is just the 'old quilford' playstyle though. I'll admit I'm unsure. I don't understand why he find you scummy

Did you just admit to not reading my posts? I'm pretty sure I list Johhog as town in the same post I list you as scum?

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 9#p3335109

I also think hiplop's last post could have included more. He seems to be avoiding taking a stance on many issues and reads, but maybe that's just his inactivity. Hvaen't seen any particularly strong tells either way, but I'm leaning town on him

Fencesitting.

I'm weighing him up. if you don't have a nullish read on hiplop too, i'd be surprised. so don't call me out for fencesitting when it's only natural to have a nullish read on hiplop

Theory discussion.

so? I kept it brief and then continued to talk about the game afterwards. It's not like it ruined any momentum or was a focal point of mine

For some weird reason you guys are all overlooking the obvious fault in this plan which is that if we nominate who we think is obvtown the scum will nominate obvscum and vice versa?

do you have a better idea?
and isn't this theory discussion here yourself the irony

so? he said that wasn't indicative of alignment

Lies.

at the very least it's against the spirit of mafia to try and break the game by figuring out role Pm times instead of scumhunting. at the worst it's useless and time-wasting

or something like that

Backpedaling.

it's not backpeddaling because I can't exactly use that weak term to give me a free contradiction later on

anything else or can we idscuss how your read on johog changed in 2 posts?

If that isn't backpeddaling then I don't know what is

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 9#p3335109
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 2#p3336752
you call me out for things you do yourself. backpeddaling, theory discussion. You Mr. Quilford are starting to irritate me

[Quilford]

Lolno. Why would he be? He is one of the scummier in this game imo.

hmm

not sure if this is just the 'old quilford' playstyle though. I'll admit I'm unsure. I don't understand why he find you scummy

Did you just admit to not reading my posts? I'm pretty sure I list Johhog as town in the same post I list you as scum?

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 9#p3335109

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 2#p3336752
Thanks for admitting it.

I also think hiplop's last post could have included more.

He seems to be avoiding taking a stance on many issues and reads,

but

maybe that's just his inactivity.

Hvaen't seen any particularly strong tells either way, but I'm leaning town on him

Fencesitting.

I'm weighing him up. if you don't have a nullish read on hiplop too, i'd be surprised. so don't call me out for fencesitting when it's only natural to have a nullish read on hiplop

Having a null read is not fence sitting. Saying the bold is fence sitting.

Theory discussion.

so? I kept it brief and then continued to talk about the game afterwards. It's not like it ruined any momentum or was a focal point of mine

For some weird reason you guys are all overlooking the obvious fault in this plan which is that if we nominate who we think is obvtown the scum will nominate obvscum and vice versa?

do you have a better idea?
and isn't this theory discussion here yourself the irony

If you're going to discuss theory we might as well do it in a manner that isn't anti-town.

It doesn't really matter what type of player we nominate because the scum will just nominate their polar opposite.

so? he said that wasn't indicative of alignment

Lies.

at the very least it's against the spirit of mafia to try and break the game by figuring out role Pm times instead of scumhunting. at the worst it's useless and time-wasting

Only scum use the excuse of 'against the spirit of mafia'. And you've somehow brought up this completely different argument instead of responding to the fact that you were lying when you said he said it wasn't indicative of alignment.

or something like that

Backpedaling.

it's not backpeddaling because I can't exactly use that weak term to give me a free contradiction later on

While it may not have been backpedalling (I was searching for a better term at the time) it was certainly leaving significant room for error.

anything else or can we idscuss how your read on johog changed in 2 posts?

If that isn't backpeddaling then I don't know what is

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 9#p3335109
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 2#p3336752
you call me out for things you do yourself. backpeddaling, theory discussion. You Mr. Quilford are starting to irritate me

A flip happened, smartass. And you just completely invalidated the point you were trying to make in Quote #1.

[Quilford]

he fact that what obviously happened was Twisted voted Maruchan for towncred and then immediately switched, quoting all previous reasoning and not even offering an original perspective on things, once he realised he had the hammer.

I noticed you didn't respond to this point.

Is it because I'm right? Yes.

[Twistedspoon]

I don't for things for 'towncred'

it doesn't cross my mind, even as scum. You know that from royal mafia. I did nothing for towncred in that game

a new question to you: why do you think johog does not view you as confirmed town? He is a town read of yours and you seem quite confident that you're confirmed

This game is less fun with quilford refusing to listen. I'd like to nominate myself if there are no objections. The sooner I flip the sooner I will be content at quilford not understanding what transparency is and perhaps he'll realise that once a player doesn't play identically to a previous town game of theirs, it doesn't make them scum.

[Quilford]

You're doing exactly what Maruchan did and you're doing it for towncred in light of his flip.

[Quilford]

Moreover, you've ignored my points.

[Twistedspoon]

Only scum use the excuse of 'against the spirit of mafia'. And you've somehow brought up this completely different argument instead of responding to the fact that you were lying when you said he said it wasn't indicative of alignment.

no, I use it

you know very well from my last game that I value good scumhunting above all else, even encouraging you to make cases on me and explain your reads(as town). A hollow victory it is when you play against the spirit of mafia. why not get all players to swear an oath that they're not scum? It's against the spirit of mafia and I oppose these tactics as town or scum. Besides, I still fail to see why scum and town role Pms won't have been sent at the same time

[Johhog]

Nah, we need a obvtown or a obvscum, and I'm afraid most won't agree that you're obvtown Twisted. Quilford is one candidate we could nominate as obvscum, but I would prefer Shadow or something along that line tbh.