Execution Mafia: Days of the Cold War GAMEOVER

[SleepyKrew]

L

L

[Scumhunter]

lol implosion at that last quote XD

im not calling you scummy, but yea my whole outlook on the game kind of got flipped upside down when quilford (also in obv town status from me originally) was guiltied by Zang (whose claim doesn't seem fake at all to me despite me thinking he was scummy originally). So yea, I'm allowed to change my mind on reads, but no I'm not saying you are scummy necessarily at all. I'm not saying to trust me right now, I'm saying why don't we kill the cop guilty over me. I understand my play is sketchy, but don't think you should be so quick to say that merits a lynch, especially when we have ML'd twice already and I've done the best I can to explain myself.

You can speculate that MoI would be a good target to fake on, but no, you are wrong. He wouldn't be. If I were scum there is no way in hell I'd fake on MoI there. That's just poor play. You can call it wifom but its not. Its poor play. Scum play dictates securing easily attainable mislynches at little risk.

[Scumhunter]

Tragedy yes, this game is a lot different than that other one. Doesn't make me scum though. I felt the specific situation in this game required drastic measures to call out MoI on his scumminess. If I was wrong and he's town, oops, my bad. If he's scum, honestly, the whole reason people are discussing MoI for possible scum now is precisely because I brought it into the limelight that he could be scum. Hell I don't care if people think we are bussing or some retarded shit but at least people are considering the possibility of MoI scum which is something that just wasn't happening before.

[Quilford]

So what if the last Execution Mafia had a role that allowed scumbuddies to save each other? Doesn't mean this one will. And I need to be executed tonight so I can pass my papers on.

[jasonT1981]

or have you or your scum partners roleblock the kill if there is a scum RB?

[Quilford]

Are you setting me up for a mislynch tomorrow?

[jasonT1981]

How do you even get that from my comment?

[Quilford]

Your comments about me-scum not being killed tonight make me feel very strongly that if I survive through the night you are scum and you are setting up my mislynch for tomorrow.

Regardless, I need to pass my papers on and Scumhunter is far scummier.

[jasonT1981]

no, ive suspected you are scum since day 1. And thought scum have a RBer since early in day 1 too.

[jasonT1981]

And the cop guilty confirms you are scum.

[jasonT1981]

So, how would I be setting you up for a mislynch if there is a cop guilty on you already? /fail. please try again.

[Quilford]

So, how would I be setting you up for a mislynch if there is a cop guilty on you already? /fail. please try again.

Because I show up as guilty to cop investigations?

[jasonT1981]

yes, because I think you are scum and lying about the Miller claim. Its just too convenient for my liking. You have a role that would show up as guilty to a cop, but didn't actually say anything until there was a cop guilty... umm yea, no!

[jasonT1981]

Anyway

V/LA for weekend, as always.

[Quilford]

yes, because I think you are scum and lying about the Miller claim. Its just too convenient for my liking. You have a role that would show up as guilty to a cop, but didn't actually say anything until there was a cop guilty... umm yea, no!

I explained this several times to general ignorance... because if you don't claim Miller when you're supposed to, there's no way you can be town, right?

[jasonT1981]

As I said, I don't believe you.

[Quilford]

yeah yeah but you've had a (vague and terrible) scum read on me all game

people who thought I was town and are now jumping on me because of my late claim are probably scum

[Cosca]

Once again, MoI invents a scumtell out of thin air and completely ignores what we actually wrote.

If you knew much about Mafia you'd not make such stupid pronouncements.

I however do know how a small scum-team operates ... go look at LMP's KGB Mafia. Look at my one of my early replace in posts where I drop the T-word (traitor) feeling out DGB (who was the traitor, BTW).

So contine to try to 'hand-wave' away your scummy play as me 'inventing' things. It isn't working ... just like you trying to defend your scum buddy Quilford isn't working either.

If you would read our posts instead of ignoring them, you'd not make such stupid pronouncements.

You know where we got the idea for a traitor from? From the first Execution Mafia.

Oh, and implosion mentioned a traitor before we did, here. Where is your implosion scum read? Or is it just "scummy" when the guy who he figured you out does it?

MOI

: Still town. Zzz.

Why do you believe MoI is town?

[vezokpiraka]

yes, because I think you are scum and lying about the Miller claim. Its just too convenient for my liking. You have a role that would show up as guilty to a cop, but didn't actually say anything until there was a cop guilty... umm yea, no!

I explained this several times to general ignorance... because if you don't claim Miller when you're supposed to, there's no way you can be town, right?

Yes. Check LlamaFluff in Mafia dating game I. He was scum and got copped so he said he is a miller. He actually did this before as town but he was still scum.

[Quilford]

I'm not LlamaFluff and I provided reasons as to why I didn't claim earlier.

[jasonT1981]

going back and looking.

The thread about millers: http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=15940

The game: http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=52&t=17365

Interesting if you are basing NOT claiming based on those links, I would like to know why.. in that game Millar claimed in firstpost. And general consensus in thread seems to be claim.

It is accepted claiming right away is the protown thing to do... if you really went of this thread you would have claimed right away.

Oh yea, your scum caught out.

[Quilford]

It doesn't matter what the general consensus is - that's a scum mindset. The following quotes were what swayed me not to claim miller:

People seem to underestimate the value of a miller in catching out a fake cop claimant,. Basically, the claim d1 thing seems to be based on the notion that, of all the very many things that can happen with a miller, one of them is disastrous, and therefore has to be prevented at all costs. The thing is, although bad, it isn't really very

likely

.

Millers should be--like any other player--be judged on their play. If they're scummy, lynch 'em, if they're town, let 'em be NK'd. (I am against policy-lynching millers. If a player claims miller, yet scum hunts well, why lynch 'em?) This--to me--also applies to the Miller in question. If the miller thinks their play is sub-optimal overall and that they'll catch flak, an immediate claim will be less scummy than a later claim. If the miller thinks they're going to be playing a fairly good game, there's no need to claim. Now, I've always been of the opinion millers should claim, but reading this thread has made me reconsider that position, due to the reasons mentioned.

Basically, it is a case-by-case thing, and it is up to the player. As mentioned, always claiming immediately might not be the most beneficial thing to do. However, not claiming early can be equally devastating. So, the player in question must ask themselves if they think they'll be investigated, or if they'll be fine. If the former, claim. If the latter, don't.

I know KK pulled it off famously

This was also in part due to the fact that both mafia factions were targeting him heavily. The claim itself wasn't that important; his attackers (for legitimately scummy things he did, not for the claim itself) were more important, in my opinion, than the claim itself. ZazieR (his partner) and I (of the Ceruleans) both pushed hard for his lynch. After that (surely, if both mafia factions attacked him hard, he couldn't be a member of either!), he was "pretty much confirmed town". >_< This game didn't change my opinion on miller claims, though. (Actually, it's the only game I've been in with a miller claim, so that might have something to do with it... :P) If they claim, it's no different than any other player: scummy-->strung up, town-->left alone. And their decision on whether they should claim should be influenced by what they think others will think of their claim.

Alright, so I might still be a bit bitter about that game. =P

(Having recently read my posts there in ISO, though, I realize it was my fault, in many ways, so I'm most angry at myself for failing so epically.)

So, I was going through an old thread and I found a post by myself, chastising someone for claiming miller on Day 1.

Now I realize that it's widely accepted that claiming miller on Day 1 is the best play, but I disagree. Here's why:

One might also say that how you've played your 'miller' role is regardless far less than pro-town, even if not the MOST anti-town:

1. townies only want to lynch scum. if you're not scum, you should give them every possible reason to think you're not scum.
2. investigators only want to target scum. if you're not scum, you should give them every possible reason to think you're not scum.
3. vigilantes only want to target scum. if you're not scum, you should give them every possible reason to think you're not scum.
4. scum don't know a miller is a miller. if you were exceptionally pro-town in the daytime, you could have hoped to draw a nightkill.

now those are the BEST ways to play miller. what you did do, however, was claim. and this just opens up all sorts of WIFOMbuckets™.

1. townies might want to lynch you solely based on the fact that you might just be scum WIFOMing it up.
2. investigators might investigate you anyways. dumb, but i wouldn't put it past some scummers i've met. believe it.
3. and if that's not enough, asking a vig to take you out is an out-and-out WASTE of a vig kill. seriously. ugh. see #4 above.

if you are in fact a pro-town role, you should have just shut up about your miller claim and eaten a lynch gracefully if someone DID investigate you. plus, you could have hoped to catch scum wagoning onto you for poor reasons, or any other possible useful thing you could have done until the endgame. in conclusion, you are pretty much a waste of a townie, if in fact you are a townie. you have helped the scum twice as much as the town, and i'm thoroughly displeased with you either way.

Discuss.

and in that game so much time was spent on the miller claim and we nearly mislynched because of it

[Quilford]

The majority of the players had town reads on me, and since I am town I decided not to shoot them by claiming. Figures that Zang, then, should be a cop.

[jasonT1981]

you took advice from Mastin and ReaperCharlie /fail!

[Quilford]

So what? Their ideas are perfectly valid.