Mortal Kombat Mafia (Game Over: Mafia Win)

[zMuffinMan]

Oh, I toyed with the idea that it was colour-coded, but here's the thing....

Assume Kira is Black Dragon and Shao Khan is Invader... Why are both their role flips #BF0000? Sure, their names are individually colour-coded (as is every other name), but roles seem to share the same colour code based on alignment. So why are opposite factions flipping the same colour code?

[DemonHybrid]

VOTE COUNT FOR KOMBATANT

Day 5 Vote Count (#1)

Oversoul (3) - Bogre, kiwieagle, Nero Cain
Internet Stranger (2) - Magister Ludi, zMuffinMan
kiwieagle (2) - Oversoul, CSL
Toogeloo (1) - Darox
Nero Cain (1) - Nachomamma8

Not Voting (6) - springlullaby, The Fonz, Mastermind of Sin, Internet Stranger, Toogeloo, Amrun

Amrun is V/LA until September 6th.
Mastermind of Sin is V/LA until September 6th.

With 15 alive, it takes 8 to select a Kombatant! Deadline is Saturday, September 17th at 9:00 PM EDT.

Day 5's stage is: Hell!

[Magister Ludi]

See, Toog, that logic applies to IS as well. Come join this wagon.

[Mastermind of Sin]

The following players need to die, in no particular order:

Magister Ludi, Timeater, Internet Stranger, The Fonz, kiwieagle, Toogeloo, CSL

I'm gonna start with

Vote: The Fonz

[The Fonz]

Lets see

Vote: Internet Stranger

He's been on cruise control this game. Not overly concerned who goes in the ring, or who dies, or who lives. He's just been surfing through the days surviving and not doing much, which is what I would expect scum to be doing.

This is funny, because the above is PRECISELY why I suspect ML himself. He doesn't seem as proactive as he normally is when town, I just feel he's coasting. IS, by contrast, went out of his way to try to force through a Palisade lynch.

And, his comment to not look at the initial bandwagon on CoolDog is definitely wrong, considering that wagon had a higher than usual chance of containing scum who hoped that they wouldn't be considered 'scummy' for joining a 'joke' (/equivalent) early bandwagon. It reads perhaps like he knows that there is in fact scum on the wagon.

He's certainly wrong. Is 'he knew there were scum there and was trying to defend' more reasonable an explanation than 'he didn't think the wagon was particularly relevant or likely to contain scum?'

The scummiest looking part of the wagon (Oversoul, Palisade, Internet Stranger, T-Bone) now has two dead town, and Oversoul's really, really not looking like scum now. That does look really bad for IS.

You know what's also scummy as fuck? This wagon.

Amrun (12) - Mastermind of Sin, Toogeloo, Oversoul, kiwieagle, Nero Cain, Darox, xRECKONERx, Amrun, Bunnylover, Snakeplissken, CooLDoG, zMuffinMan

[Magister Ludi]

He's certainly wrong. Is 'he knew there were scum there and was trying to defend' more reasonable an explanation than 'he didn't think the wagon was particularly relevant or likely to contain scum?'

The scummiest looking part of the wagon (Oversoul, Palisade, Internet Stranger, T-Bone) now has two dead town, and Oversoul's really, really not looking like scum now. That does look really bad for IS.

Do you mean me with your hanging pronoun of 'he' here? Because, you basically say that my interpretation is illogical (IS knows scum was on that wagon and he himself is scum) and then turn around and agree with me that IS does in fact looks bad.

How did you decide to chop the wagon into the last four people that joined by the way?

~~~

You know what's also scummy as fuck? This wagon.

Amrun (12) - Mastermind of Sin, Toogeloo, Oversoul, kiwieagle, Nero Cain, Darox, xRECKONERx, Amrun, Bunnylover, Snakeplissken, CooLDoG, zMuffinMan

You can't just drop this off and not elaborate. Why is it scummy? Who is the scum?

[The Fonz]

He's certainly wrong. Is 'he knew there were scum there and was trying to defend' more reasonable an explanation than 'he didn't think the wagon was particularly relevant or likely to contain scum?'

The scummiest looking part of the wagon (Oversoul, Palisade, Internet Stranger, T-Bone) now has two dead town, and Oversoul's really, really not looking like scum now. That does look really bad for IS.

Do you mean me with your hanging pronoun of 'he' here? Because, you basically say that my interpretation is illogical (IS knows scum was on that wagon and he himself is scum) and then turn around and agree with me that IS does in fact looks bad.

It's not a hanging pronoun. You'd just said a load of stuff about IS (he's been on cruise control, he's wrong about the wagon) and I was continuing in that vein... well, he's definitely wrong, but I could see a town player thinking like that. My point is that I agree with your conclusion for a different reason, and also suspect you.

How did you decide to chop the wagon into the last four people that joined by the way?

I figured that that was the scummiest part of the wagon, like I said before... people who jumped on late, didn't add anything, and put the wagon altogether too high for a joke.

~~~

You know what's also scummy as fuck? This wagon.

Amrun (12) - Mastermind of Sin, Toogeloo, Oversoul, kiwieagle, Nero Cain, Darox, xRECKONERx, Amrun, Bunnylover, Snakeplissken, CooLDoG, zMuffinMan

You can't just drop this off and not elaborate. Why is it scummy? Who is the scum?[/quote]

Of this lot? Probably Nero. It's scummy because it was a wagon that grew large, without anyone ever coming up with a plausible sounding justification of it, on a player who has been investigated in such a way as to make her more likely town than most.

[Darox]

You know what's also scummy as fuck? This wagon.

Amrun (12) - Mastermind of Sin, Toogeloo, Oversoul, kiwieagle, Nero Cain, Darox, xRECKONERx, Amrun, Bunnylover, Snakeplissken, CooLDoG, zMuffinMan

It's scummy because it was a wagon that grew large, without anyone ever coming up with a plausible sounding justification of it, on a player who has been investigated in such a way as to make her more likely town than most.

Let me just step up and disagree loudly.

First of all, Amrun is on that wagon, which should set warning bells off in your head, second, that's a D2 wagon, aka before Amrun was investigated, and third, it was picking a competitor to square off against cop-guilty Weyoun.

[Toogeloo]

Spent some time this morning ISOing a couple players.

Mastermind of Sin has moved up my list of scummy players. He was White Knighting Palisades to the nth degree since Day 1. If he is scum, he would of course have known that Palisades was town, and he was Pal's only defender. The "I told you so," comment I think was just butter on the toast.


However, what I really don't like about MoS's ISO is that his must lynch lists have included a lot of people who are town, and yet he is ok with it.

People Who Are Scum:
xRECKONERx
Kise
Albert B. Rampage
zMuffinMan

People Who Are Not Scum:
Fate
The Fonz
Mastermind of Sin

...btw, I hate when people include themselves in the "town" category. Just leave yourself off the list, it's assumed you think you are town, because everyone wants to think they are town. I get bad vibes from people who do this.

His next, "must-die" list:

I would be willing to throw any of the following into the pit against Palisade-town before I'd throw Ludi in:

ABR
Ghostwriter
The Fonz
Amrun
xRECKONERx
Kise

If anyone feels like starting a wagon on someone from this list, I'm with you.

Great, he chose the lurker scum to add to the list, but it's still comprised of mostly town and a half scanned player. The Fonz is the only question mark, but I don't get scum-vibes from Fonz, so not really a point in his favor.

Posted on Day 1:

I would be willing to throw any of the following into the pit against Palisade-town before I'd throw Ludi in:

ABR

Ghostwriter

The Fonz
Amrun

xRECKONERx

Kise

If anyone feels like starting a wagon on someone from this list, I'm with you.

In other news, I feel pretty good about the net I cast in this post. ABR and Reck obviously rubbed me the wrong way because they were hiding that they were a power role. Process of elimination leaves me feeling pretty comfortable with my vote, and The Fonz still looks good for lynching, too.

I don't think Amrun is scum because of interactions with WLC, although that was certainly a nice icing on the cake. Not being a Black Dragon doesn't preclude Amrun from being in the other scumgroup. However, I could get behind The Fonz going into the ring tomorrow instead of Amrun, if y'all want to be pussies about it.

Here he tries to mask his list as being "good." He even states Amrun is scum for his own reasons that aren't tied to WLC, and doesn't want to preclude the possibility of Amrun on the other faction, yet he doesn't explain why he thinks this. He even knows that Amrun is half scanned and still votes him, which I am sure is because Amrun is still a hot topic on Day 3.

OMG NANOOK IS BACK! <3

HAI NANOOK!

Vote: Amrun

Let's get this done and give Amrun another KO.

...though this is going against scanned scum GhostWriter.

however his reasoning is:

Amrun has been on the Palisade, Cooldog, and Springlullaby wagons. All terrible wagons on town players. She hasn't really given us any useful content all game. You accuse me of not posting a case on Amrun, and yet Amrun hasn't posted a case on

anyone

all game. It's just goddamn shameful how scummy she is, and you're giving her a pass because she's not in the same scumgroup as WLC? Bullshit.

...which sounds hypocritical to me, because MoS's entire ISO is devoid of any real case on any of his initial suspect pool, or even The Fonz, his current vote.

The rest of his iso is White Knighting of Palisades, and then throwing out votes in sheepish manner on Oversoul and kiwi. Now with the new day, he is back on The Fonz.



Overall, I really don't like the entire iso of MoS and I think he is scum.

See, Toog, that logic applies to IS as well. Come join this wagon.

ISO of IS agrees... Batch him with Bogre and Darox. I doubt all 3 are coasting scum though, and my initial gut was on the first two I mentioned.


In other reads. 3 people on Oversoul at the moment, two of which I have listed as possible scum picks. I am thinking of those two is probably scum since I still maintain the votes on Oversoul are opportunistic. kiwi is the one I feel worst about though.


I'd like to vote either MoS or kiwi at this point, and since it's early enough I might be able to convince people, I will go with my current case.

Vote: Mastermind of Sin

[The Fonz]

You know what's also scummy as fuck? This wagon.

Amrun (12) - Mastermind of Sin, Toogeloo, Oversoul, kiwieagle, Nero Cain, Darox, xRECKONERx, Amrun, Bunnylover, Snakeplissken, CooLDoG, zMuffinMan

It's scummy because it was a wagon that grew large, without anyone ever coming up with a plausible sounding justification of it, on a player who has been investigated in such a way as to make her more likely town than most.

Let me just step up and disagree loudly.

First of all, Amrun is on that wagon, which should set warning bells off in your head, second, that's a D2 wagon, aka before Amrun was investigated, and third, it was picking a competitor to square off against cop-guilty Weyoun.

Let me re-iterate loudly:

1) Amrun's own vote is irrelevant, does a wagon become immune to having scum on it because someone self-voted?
2) The point is not that people were voting for someone on whom an investigation had been announced, it was that it was on a player we subsequently know isn't a black dragon. We have this wonderful ability in mafia to go back and re-evalute things in the light of new evidence.
3) Valid point, but that doesn't mean it wasn't indicative of a serious level of suspicion (or faked suspicion) toward amrun.

[The Fonz]

If Overtoast flips town, I bet Bogre would be scum.

Though they could both be scum, as that can also be a weak bus.

Holy fuck, how did I miss this? 'If the person most likely to lynched flips town, this guy's scum. And maybe he's scum anyway.'

Vote: CSL

CSL, can you explain a bit of the thought process that led you to flip from Palisade to Oversoul to Palisade again during the Kombat phase?

[Nachomamma8]

Oh, I toyed with the idea that it was colour-coded, but here's the thing....

Assume Kira is Black Dragon and Shao Khan is Invader... Why are both their role flips #BF0000? Sure, their names are individually colour-coded (as is every other name), but roles seem to share the same colour code based on alignment. So why are opposite factions flipping the same colour code?

I'm running on the assumption that Shao and Kira are both Black Dragon, and the other faction hasn't flipped yet. Is there something wrong with that assumption?

Toog, I wouldn't mind campaigning to throw MS in the pit if you help me with Nero.

[Nachomamma8]

This is funny, because the above is PRECISELY why I suspect ML himself. He doesn't seem as proactive as he normally is when town, I just feel he's coasting. IS, by contrast, went out of his way to try to force through a Palisade lynch.

Do me a favor and distinguish between MoS towncoasting and MoS scumcoasting. Does he coast as scum normally, but not do so as town? Or is he being lurky in opportunistic ways?

I figured that that was the scummiest part of the wagon, like I said before... people who jumped on late, didn't add anything, and put the wagon altogether too high for a joke.

What really needed to be added to the wagon?

Let me just step up and disagree loudly.

First of all, Amrun is on that wagon, which should set warning bells off in your head, second, that's a D2 wagon, aka before Amrun was investigated, and third, it was picking a competitor to square off against cop-guilty Weyoun.

So... are you saying this is a wagon scum wouldn't want to be on?

[kiwieagle]

I dont like how MoS just comes once in a while and all he does is post his scum list with no good reason

[zMuffinMan]

I'm running on the assumption that Shao and Kira are both Black Dragon, and the other faction hasn't flipped yet. Is there something wrong with that assumption?

It doesn't make sense flavour-wise. Shao Kahn is not a part of the Black Dragon syndicate.

[Nachomamma8]

I dont like how MoS just comes once in a while and all he does is post his scum list with no good reason

He's like you, except with suspicions!

[Nachomamma8]

I'm running on the assumption that Shao and Kira are both Black Dragon, and the other faction hasn't flipped yet. Is there something wrong with that assumption?

It doesn't make sense flavour-wise. Shao Kahn is not a part of the Black Dragon syndicate.

Yet kira is conf black dragon, and shao khan flipped the same color as her. They're most likely on the same team, one faction or two factions.

[zMuffinMan]

Nero vs IS in the pit today would make me very, very happy.

If he is scum, he would of course have known that Palisades was town, and he was Pal's only defender.

Well, if you're working on the assumption that there are two scum factions, then no, he would not have known that Palisades is town. And as far as I can tell, you still are working under that assumption, aren't you? Which makes this a very interesting thing to say.

Also, MoS wasn't Palisade's "only defender". I've been calling him town for most of the game. Admittedly, I wasn't as vocal about it because after a while it all seemed to fall on deaf ears, but still... point is, you can't really attack MoS for this.

And I'm more inclined to believe that scum was in the people who were, say, pushing an alternate lynch without being vocal about Palisade being town (for example, Bogre, who never gave his own read on Palisade, but was going on about how he didn't see the case and didn't like so many people jumping on Palisade, etc etc, standard scum reaction to a town-wagon his buddies are pushing).

Yet kira is conf black dragon, and shao khan flipped the same color as her. They're most likely on the same team, one faction or two factions.

Yeah, that's the point I've been trying to make since the start of the day. Everything points towards there being a single scum team (consisting of Invaders - e.g. Shao Kahn - and Black Dragons - e.g. Kira) and an even-night vig, except for the kill flavour on ABR.

[Darox]

So... are you saying this is a wagon scum wouldn't want to be on?

Nope, I'm saying it's a wagon that everyone would want to be on regardless of feelings toward Amrun. She was never going to be lynched, it was all about Weyoun. I mean, you might get something out of the people who were wringing their hands over possible ring shennanagins, but saying "This wagon is scummy because it was on someone who became cop-cleared town" is absurd.

[DemonHybrid]

Internet Stranger and springlullaby have been prodded.

[CSL]

I never felt that Palisade was town until he started posting walls.

Then people refused to switch from palisade to oversoul...

The wagon on Palisade was scumdriven.

Unvote; Vote: Oversoul

[zMuffinMan]

If you think the Palisade wagon was scum driven, then why not vote for one of the people who was actually driving the wagon? (hint:

vote IS

)

[Darox]

If you thought he was town and the wagon was scumdriven, why did you swap back to voting him?

Shit makes no sense.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Spent some time this morning ISOing a couple players.

Mastermind of Sin has moved up my list of scummy players. He was White Knighting Palisades to the nth degree since Day 1. If he is scum, he would of course have known that Palisades was town, and he was Pal's only defender. The "I told you so," comment I think was just butter on the toast.

How can you say I was whiteknighting someone who was so obviously town? There wasn't a

single

reasonable argument given for Palisade to be scum. Mastin is an obv easy lynch, and the scum took advantage of that. I will straight up call every single protown person on that wagon an idiot for voting Palisade, because that was

FUCKING STUPID

.

In other news, I think Toogeloo and kiwieagle haven't read up on their MoS meta recently.

[Internet Stranger]

Ny epic trip is over tonight. I will have something to say tomorrow when I'm caught up.