League of Legends (Old)

[Andrius]

I still don't understand Corki at all and how his passive actually helps in anything to do with killing tanks. I'd also argue MF, Cait, and Graves can both be harder late game carries than Ashe depending on the comp.

The Q-Slow from Ashe is just insane. So I imagine that in teamfights she turns it on and just AAs the rest of the time.
Ult is a great initiate too.

My 2cents. Still love Caitlyn loads more than Ashe, but Ashe's ult is superfun.

I've always had problems landing Cait's traps right. I try to place them under the enemy champion, but they always move right when the trap sets .

You talking in teamfights or laning phase?
Laning phase you can use them as pseudo-wards. Put them in the riverbush on your end so that if anyone walks through you'll get them. Dropping them in the edges of bushes greatly helps control people like Alistar who like to eat you. If you're under your tower you put them on the sides so they can't harass you easily. If you're at their tower you put them in the way of any ganks. For instance if you're purple_botlane you trap their tribush if you're at their tower. While wards are great, a ganker hitting a trap gives you more time to react.

If you're having trouble always aim behind the champ. Placing it under them only works if they walk to you, then back onto it. You've got to think ahead like that. :/

In teamfights put them in important venues of escape/attack. Two traps can generally block off a small path- while it by no means will stop a determined foe it will slow people down. More importantly, putting traps down in general is a good idea. Even if you don't hit the person you want to trap you will hit SOMEONE in the chaos. If you're winning they'll retreat into your traps- if you're losing they'll hit them as they're chasing.

And Bub, nothing is more satisfying than killing something with a trap as Cait...
Well, maybe the one time I killed a LeBlanc with the net...

That good?

/my main AD is Cait

[Bub Bidderskins]

I still don't understand Corki at all and how his passive actually helps in anything to do with killing tanks. I'd also argue MF, Cait, and Graves can both be harder late game carries than Ashe depending on the comp.

The Q-Slow from Ashe is just insane. So I imagine that in teamfights she turns it on and just AAs the rest of the time.
Ult is a great initiate too.

My 2cents. Still love Caitlyn loads more than Ashe, but Ashe's ult is superfun.

I've always had problems landing Cait's traps right. I try to place them under the enemy champion, but they always move right when the trap sets .

You talking in teamfights or laning phase?
Laning phase you can use them as pseudo-wards. Put them in the riverbush on your end so that if anyone walks through you'll get them. Dropping them in the edges of bushes greatly helps control people like Alistar who like to eat you. If you're under your tower you put them on the sides so they can't harass you easily. If you're at their tower you put them in the way of any ganks. For instance if you're purple_botlane you trap their tribush if you're at their tower. While wards are great, a ganker hitting a trap gives you more time to react.

If you're having trouble always aim behind the champ. Placing it under them only works if they walk to you, then back onto it. You've got to think ahead like that. :/

In teamfights put them in important venues of escape/attack. Two traps can generally block off a small path- while it by no means will stop a determined foe it will slow people down. More importantly, putting traps down in general is a good idea. Even if you don't hit the person you want to trap you will hit SOMEONE in the chaos. If you're winning they'll retreat into your traps- if you're losing they'll hit them as they're chasing.

And Bub, nothing is more satisfying than killing something with a trap as Cait...
Well, maybe the one time I killed a LeBlanc with the net...

That good?

/my main AD is Cait

Yeah, that helps, I'll try to work on that. Being able to land those traps is what really separates the good Caits from the mediocre ones, and I'm afraid I'm a mediocre one at the moment .

[Andrius]

It takes practice. :/
What's your LoL name BTW?
I'm not sure I have you listed. >_______>

[DeathRowKitty]

Two traps can generally block off a small path

Fun fact: this can also be used as an extra layer of protection against stupid teammates. If you think there's a chance someone will need to make an escape (what? people getting caught? nowai!), two traps can block off certain river and jungle entrances/exits. There will usually be better places for your traps, but there have been occasions where I've kept 2 traps at one river entrance for extended periods of time and actually saved people with it.

[Andrius]

Two traps can generally block off a small path

Fun fact: this can also be used as an extra layer of protection against stupid teammates. If you think there's a chance someone will need to make an escape (what? people getting caught? nowai!), two traps can block off certain river and jungle entrances/exits. There will usually be better places for your traps, but there have been occasions where I've kept 2 traps at one river entrance for extended periods of time and actually saved people with it.

This is also true.

[Ankamius]

I still don't understand Corki at all and how his passive actually helps in anything to do with killing tanks. I'd also argue MF, Cait, and Graves can both be harder late game carries than Ashe depending on the comp.

This is why you build more heavily on AD than AS compared to other AD champions. Not only does 10% of that damage get added again as true damage (this is before resistances, so 10% of your AD value), but it also makes his E do more damage while also shredding their armor meaning your autoattacks do more damage.

[Shanba]

I still don't understand Corki at all and how his passive actually helps in anything to do with killing tanks. I'd also argue MF, Cait, and Graves can both be harder late game carries than Ashe depending on the comp.

This is why you build more heavily on AD than AS compared to other AD champions. Not only does 10% of that damage get added again as true damage (this is before resistances, so 10% of your AD value), but it also makes his E do more damage while also shredding their armor meaning your autoattacks do more damage.

The only part of this which makes sense is the bit about the E. For everything else it is about maximising total dps, as 10% extra damage scales equally well with attack speed as it does with attack damage, as does the armor shred. It's the same misconception that people have with mundo ult, where in reality it scales equally well with health and resistances (and his passive is the same) people see what it says and think "OOH MUST STACK HEALTH".

[Brandi]

can anyone confirm whether or not lulu's passive damages wards

this is important

Not sure if this has been answered yet, but, nope.

When playing support Lulu, what should you max first?

I feel like one point in her Glitterlance till level 18 is fine, but I don't know which of the polymorph or shield thing to max first.

The great thing about lulu is it's not completely DEFINITE which one you should max.

When it comes to maxing her W or E first it's completely situational, and based on your personal preferences.

Feel like you can be aggressive? Max W.
Getting your FACE SMASHED IN? Max E.

[JDodge]

played lulu tonight, she's incredibly fun

re: what to max

Why would you ever leave her Q unleveled? It's a 280 magic damage nuke every few seconds with an 80% slow

for essentially free

.

W is not an aggressive spell unless you're laning with AP for some reason (it's a good counter-aggression spell, though)

E is a strong shield; failing that, it's free vision on someone. Neither is to be underestimated and I don't see any situation in which I wouldn't max E first (Q second, W last)

Her ult is an example of why she's probably the best bot lane support now at disengaging aside from maybe a Janna; she's got Q slow, W is a movespeed buff or a silence, and her ult. One does not simply initiate on a team with a Lulu.

[Andrius]

Damn Draft Pick trolls.

ENEMY TEAM PICKS AHRI & KENNEN.
SOMEONE DODGES
GET BACK IN WITH SAME PEOPLE
TELL FIRST PICK TO BAN KENNEN AND AHRI
DOESNT BAN ANYTHING
THEY PICK KENNEN & AHRI

[Brandi]

W is amazing because a 2.5 second silence is amazing. Not to mention it slows as well. You're going to want to max W at least second for the silence duration increase because of team-fights. That Q damage will not help in team fights and a slow is not as good as a silence. Not to mention the CD on your W is very important to minimize.

So far I've been maxing it first with great results. I cant imagine not having it on low CD by level 10. It's secured dragon for me multiple times. It's like having exhaust on a 12 second cooldown. (with a bigger range)

I would only max Q on Lulu first or second if I was going AP or AD /AS Lulu.

[pickemgenius]

I'll take a damaging spell(base damage is quite good) with a 2 second 80% slow(that doesn't cost hardly any mana) on a really low cd than a 2.5 second hex with a longer cooldown and no damage.

[Brandi]

Do you max fiddles fear last? What about Rammus's taunt? Neither of those do any damage, and they aren't even supports. But it's quite clear those skills are of high priority.

Her W does no damage, but the silence not only stops them from using spells, IT STOPS THEM FROM AUTO ATTACKING.
Not to mention that you can speed up your allies OR yourself, with an AP buff, which is not entirely useless on every AD carry. (Trist/Kog/MF)
The longer CD wont matter once you have some CD reduction.

Leveling up her Q or E doesn't reduce the cooldown at all.
Leveling up her W does.

Not to mention, her Q is a SKILLSHOT. That 80% slow isn't guaranteed. Where as you would only miss her W to invulnerability. (Such as Fizz's E or Vlad's pool)

Her Q can only be used offensively.
Her W and E can be used offensively AND defensively.
Her Q is the least useful of all of her spells as a support.
It doesn't matter that it does damage.

That damage DOES NOT HELP IN TEAMFIGHTS. 280 damage- oh boy that will do so much against any MR that is built, even natural MR.... and you totally wanna be sniping those kills as support.
80% slow for 2 seconds that's great I sure hope that can help me or my carry escape from a gank. I sure hope I don't miss with it in a crucial time.

People really need to get out of the mindset that the laning phase will last you forever, and think about what is going to help most during team-fights. Especially with lulu, as she is strongest during team-fights vs the laning phase.

On another note

, I would say that yes, if you maxed Q earlier on, you WOULD have a better harass as long as you could hit your skillshots properly.
But you and your team would still suffer for it mid-late game. If you don't plan on having a mid-late game and just want a kill lane, want to force them to surrender at 20, go for it.
I mean, I'm not saying that it's better in every scenario. But to claim that an 80% slow is better than a Super Silence is silly.

[JDodge]

Do you max fiddles fear last?

no, because you don't get any increase in the cc from leveling dark wind (so it's a completely different case); all you change is the damage and the mana cost

Her W does no damage, but the silence not only stops them from using spells, IT STOPS THEM FROM AUTO ATTACKING.

which is all fine and dandy the once every blue moon you get to use it

Not to mention that you can speed up your allies OR yourself, with an AP buff, which is not entirely useless on every AD carry. (Trist/Kog/MF)

dat extra 4 damage per tick on make it rain gonna bust some heads in yo

The longer CD wont matter once you have some CD reduction.
Leveling up her W and E both reduce the cooldown.

how exactly do you reconcile the "CD doesn't matter cause CDR" and "it reduces the CD" points of view, out of curiosity

seems kind of 100% and completely contradictory to me

Not to mention, her Q is a SKILLSHOT. That 80% slow isn't guaranteed. Where as you would only miss her W to invulnerability. (Such as Fizz's E or Vlad's pool)

in other news, cassiopeia is now the worst champion in the game because her damage isn't guaranteed

the skillshot missile is easy to hit, spammable, and quick

Her Q can only be used offensively.
Her W and E can be used offensively AND defensively.
Her Q is the least useful of all of her spells as a support.
It doesn't matter that it does damage.

how exactly is a slow not helpful defensively, out of curiosity?

how is a purely defensive support good in any lane outside of the most passive of farm-off lanes? sona is good because of her poke, janna is good because her shield is an AD steroid and she has cc out the ass (which aids in offense), etc.

That damage DOES NOT HELP IN TEAMFIGHTS. 280 damage- oh boy that will do so much against any MR that is built, even natural MR.... and you totally wanna be sniping those kills as support.

280 damage won't do anything except it will do something if they're at low health

logic has died somewhere between this point and your point about cds earlier, not entirely sure where

how exactly do you reconcile this point with your "but W adds AP!" point earlier when it's actually adding in general

less damage

to most things you'd be laning with than Q adds to yourself, and the fact that Q is essentially free due to its low mana cost?

80% slow for 2 seconds that's great I sure hope that can help me or my carry escape from a gank. I sure hope I don't miss with it in a crucial time.

you can fuck right off with your smug little bitch attitude

[Ankamius]

I just played a game where the enemy Lulu basically died every time she used Whimsy.


...in a lane where there's no fucking excuse to even have a chance of losing the lane in.

[Brandi]

You seem to have an over aggressive tone and are taking things I said way out of proportion.

dat extra 4 damage per tick on make it rain gonna bust some heads in yo

I was imply saying it could benefit them, not that it was amazing. It's not the damage that is important anyway.

how exactly do you reconcile the "CD doesn't matter cause CDR" and "it reduces the CD" points of view, out of curiosity

seems kind of 100% and completely contradictory to me

I'm saying, at least by level 10 you should be able to afford some CD boots, and should have some CD reduction in your utility tree as well. 12 seconds base CD isn't too long, and with full CDR (which should always be a priority on someone like Lulu) It can be down to 7.2 seconds.

in other news, cassiopeia is now the worst champion in the game because her damage isn't guaranteed

Because that is totally what I was saying. No. I was saying that something that is more guaranteed is slightly more reliable than something that isn't.

how exactly is a slow not helpful defensively, out of curiosity?

It CAN be, but if you are turning around to slow someone, you are not moving yourself. It is not as reliable as speeding up yourself with your W. Trust me, I have tried, and every time I've tried to use Q defensively over just using my W to get away, it's ended badly. (Yes, even at level 18) But every time I sped myself up with W, I always got away. Though at one point I sped up my carry and left myself to die, but they survived at least.

how exactly do you reconcile this point with your "but W adds AP!" point earlier when it's actually adding in general less damage to most things you'd be laning with than Q adds to yourself, and the fact that Q is essentially free due to its low mana cost?

Sure, and it's just as good at 1 point.

Glitterlance: Cost: 40 / 45 / 50 / 55 / 60 mana

In fact, if low mana cost is what you want, it's BETTER at one point.
All you are really getting for leveling it up is MORE damage and 1 more second of SLOW.

you can fuck right off with your smug little bitch attitude

If you don't like my opinions that's cool, you can disagree all you want. But just because I use a certain method to explain my points does not mean I'm being smug. And If I came off that way, I'm sorry. I edited my post multiple times to try and make it not seem that way. I'm a sarcastic person in general and I talk like that as a way of endearment rather than to belittle anyone.

[Brandi]

I just played a game where the enemy Lulu basically died every time she used Whimsy.


...in a lane where there's no fucking excuse to even have a chance of losing the lane in.

Probably obsessed with getting to someone an turning them into something CUTE. In fact I almost died a couple of times that way, my first time playing her. I was like "FUCK YOU I JUST WANT TO TURN YOU INTO A KITTY!"

[pickemgenius]

60 mana at rank 5 q is still less mana than rank 1 w.

[Brandi]

So? It's still cheaper at level 1 and still good for harass at level 1.
Why would you need to level it up any more than that?
1.5+ more seconds of a cuteness on your enemy totally worth it, OP even
(Really at this point, it's just a matter of opinion. I feel W is more useful a skill than Q and therefore has a higher priority in my book. I can't change your mind on that and vice versa. I don't care that it's more expensive, I feel it's better, that's about it.)

A note on glitterlance though, it synergies well with her "Help! Pix!" you can take out minion waves REALLY effectively if you build her AP.

[Ankamius]

I'm not impressed with Lulu players right now. I've yet to see one not feed.

They're also in every game.

[Brandi]

that's why you ban her
not because she's "OP"
but to not have the baddie first timers on your team, haha.
Tell them to go practice her in blind pick/co-op vs. ai
give it a week, people will get better

[Ankamius]

I only play with people that invite me, and 90% of them are blind pick. If I end up being captain, I always ban the new champ if it's within like 4-5 days of their release. I can't stand stupid people using a new champ and ruining it for me, since that's what ends up happening.

I mean stupid people as in people that constantly go full retard when they are 2k gold behind the support.

[mykonian]

Being able to land those traps is what really separates the good Caits from the mediocre ones, and I'm afraid I'm a mediocre one at the moment .

Ok, I never played cait. But I do play a lot of support, and from my point of view the difference between a mediocre or a good cait is if they actually shoot at their opponent. Cait can, and should, win the game in the first few levels. You have the range and the abilities to throw a lot of damage on your opponents and zone them out. There is nothing more frustrating then a cait just last-hitting, because you know late she'll be worse then the enemy carry. Sure it's easy, there is nobody who can really stop a cait from farming early. But it's quite mediocre play.

[Ankamius]

That's why I'm weird. I can zone with Graves, MF, Corki, Sivir, etc. fine. I can't fucking do that with Cait. It's probably her Q which makes it so annoying, but I can't zone with her since she can't actually trade for shit with just about anyone.

[Brandi]

Madreds literally won this game for us.
My friends really wanted to surrender, but then I told vayne to get madreds, and mundo FINALLY DIED>>>>>YAY
(Morgana's Deathfiregrasp helped too! )