Open 387: Jungle Republic (Day 6 - ends in a Town Victory)

[asher1611]

also asher i voted you because i felt you only voted when pressured, yes i said you should vote, but your sland vote just seemed like a "oh fuck better vote" with little reasoning.

Little reasoning? Except for all of the reasons I gave on why I thought Sland's claim was false?

[Slandaar]

None of your reasons made any sense

You never did find that quote btw (it doesnt exist)

[Thomith]

what i meant was it seemed that you just decided "OH SHIT I NEED TO VOTE" yes you said why sland was scum, but you never actually VOTED until i called you up on it.

[Chrimi]

wow you really don't know how to meta do you chrimi, why meta a newbie game where peoples game is more prone to be a little different due to less activity?

also asher i voted you because i felt you only voted when pressured, yes i said you should vote, but your sland vote just seemed like a "oh fuck better vote" with little reasoning.

I told him the one I was referring to, it wasn't the only one I was implying.

[Chrimi]

None of your reasons made any sense

to me.

They sounded perfectly reasonable to me.

[asher1611]

what i meant was it seemed that you just decided "OH SHIT I NEED TO VOTE" yes you said why sland was scum, but you never actually VOTED until i called you up on it.

ATTENTION TOWN: we must all now only vote when it is deemed convenient for Thomith.

I had already declared intent to hammer but by the time my post got up OM had withdrawn his vote. If he wasn't L-1 he would have already had my vote for his desperation claim. If you think I only voted because you said I had not voted, which is essentially what you have explained as your reason for a vote in multiple posts, you're giving yourself way too big of a pat on the back. The vote was coming whether or not you posted a word.

On a side note: there's a lot of people not contributing who I wish would. I'd love to hear a few more perspectives on Sland's claim, lest the scum teams get a free pass to sit back and watch the town tear itself apart..

[Chrimi]

^ Finally, somebody with some logic.

[Thomith]

ok, an asher lynch probably wont happen, and looking back i don't have as much as i thought i did on them so for now
UNVOTE:

[Chrimi]

So Thomith, if not asher then who is your vote going to be on?

[Kassadin]

so, can we lynch SLandaar now?

[Chrimi]

I agree, but what are your reasons for wanting to lynch him, kass? What are your thoughts on his claim?

[Kassadin]

He just needs to die o.o
Really, all he has done is vote me, vote me , vote me
He votes just random people who ever looks scummy after like 1 or 2 posts

[Elmo TeH AzN]

He just needs to die o.o
Really, all he has done is vote me, vote me , vote me
He votes just random people who ever looks scummy after like 1 or 2 posts

So if he flips town we can PL you? Even then I want to wait either till we get a replacement or people pick up their prods. Or have they already? Sorry this game just took a backseat to another 2 for right now,

[Chrimi]

I agree that he is a little vote happy and his vote has become worthless, but you should see he claimed Seer. Does that not change your mind or tell you anything?

[Kassadin]

I dont mind if i die next day if slandaar dies 2day

[Elmo TeH AzN]

@Mod can I get a VC Please?

[Ravel]

Day 1 Vote Count

Slandaar (5): Kassadin, Chrimi, drmyshotgun, vijay2vasandani, asher1611
Om of the Nom (1): LBJ
asher1611 (1): kondi2424
Chrimi (2): Slandaar, Elmo TeH AzN

Not Voting (3): BagSquad, Om of the Nom, Thomith

There are 12 players alive, which means it takes 7 votes to lynch.
Deadline in

(expired on 2012-04-16 09:00:00)

(April 16, 9:00 AM EDT or 1:00 PM GMT)

As of Post #540

[Elmo TeH AzN]

Much thanks.

Chrimi its clear your opinion hasn't changed as well with Slandarr claiming Seer. your votes still on him.

[Om of the Nom]

@asher: The post still gets a 500 error when I try and preview it. I might have to end up posting it D2.

[Elmo TeH AzN]

Have you tried splitting it?

[Om of the Nom]

:facepalm: I forgot I could do that.

Lemme get it now.

[Om of the Nom]

My responses in bold.

VOTE: OM to the NOM
Reason: Not a fan of his trying to throw META at everything. His play has raised a number of red flags for me. Seems more like trying to distract people from the game at hand. Also, cracks under pressure too easily and in strange ways.

Meta is a respectable strategy. Stop reaching.

Alright, kinda did a cross between skimming and reading. Also I'm not going to bother answering the RQS questions unless someone asks me to.

Kass is town. He's playing to his useless town meta I remember from Open 376 (except he was also Mason there but w/e).
Shotgun is town.
v2v is town.
Chrimi is town.
LBJ is probably newb-town.
Thomith is town.

I'm kinda wary of kondi and Slandaar right now. This may sound wierd, but they seem more concerned with making cases and being active than I remember from their town meta. Yes, I get this is what town are supposed to be like, but it just feels off to me.
Of course, this could just be me being fail and forgetting half of their town meta, if that's the case, then just disregard this.

The rest (TheX, asher and Bag) are null.

VOTE: kondi
My gut is going crazy on you.

For now my reads are mainly gut, but I will probably end up using more logic as time goes by, as I personally find it hard to make cases on things that have already happened.

I left this post intact because I do not like this post. At all.

You're both throwing in meta immediately PLUS encouraging people to sit by and do nothing.

Where am I encouraging people to do nothing?

Almost seems like a scum team to me if it wasn't such blatantly bad play. Or maybe the "bad play" is there to hide your tracks. If anything, encouraging "useless town" is incredibly "anti-town."

I'm not encouraging useless play at all. I've even tried to help Kass in a previous game we played together.

Also, LBJ is "newb-town" based on the nothing he has contributed?

LBJ's posts feel like they come from town.

Heck, while I'm at it, I'm with others who are not entirely fans of you refusing to say why you think people are town. We're just supposed to take it as fact, and because you're giving us your "full disclosure" we're not supposed to be suspicious of you. That's the game you're playing, right?

Now you're putting words into my mouth.

Plus mentioning forgetting people's meta? C'mon buddy. If you're going to use it use it, if you're going to assert it then make up excuses on why you've screwed it up, that's just sloppy play. But I guess we're not supposed to suspect you either because you replaced in.

Am I not allowed to be 100% sure on people's meta? Are you trying to force a false dilemma on me?

And the last sentence of that post is just terrible. Hard to make cases for things that have already happened? That's EXACTLY what you are supposed to do. That's like saying you can't make a case on someone in Day 2 based on what happened in Day 1. No, instead you just want to meta til the cows come home instead of encouraging people to look at what's going on right in front of them.

It's a personal problem. I find it hard to make cases based on stuff that happened while I wasn't active in the thread. That's why I am able to make more logical cases as time goes by.

[Om of the Nom]

Responses in bold again

I'm not a fan of explaining townreads. Plus it's mainly gut.

But I did manage to explain my scumreads other than gut. Which is what I'm asking you to do. Why am I scum other than gut? Answer my question, no sidetracking.

gut reads are reads you

CAN'T EXPLAIN.

First off, gut reads can be explained at least in so far as you can point to some posts that come to your attention. At least giving some basis of thought to the town helps explain your mindset instead of leaving them guessing or throwing charges of "LOLGUT" at you.

My point exactly.

Second, answering a question in a way you don't expect or do not like to hear does not equal side tracking. You have been reacting very poorly to Sland's prodding as well. You hem and haw instead of refuting his points.

Slandaar wasn't directly answering my question like I asked. He was refusing information to me. Which is anti-town because it means I can't make a proper judgement.

Hey Slandaar, here's a test for you.

Go through the first 10 pages of any game I REPLACED INTO (yes this is important), and see if you can find me using gut reads straight off. Also see if you can find me explaining a town gut read.

You'd be surprised how much I don't explain my town gut reads when replacing in. I do it all the time, regardless of alignment.


EDIT: Yeah you can explain gut reads. Normally there is a cause for your gut to go off. It can't just go off at random and nail scum in an instant. THere has to be a base for your suspicion. Gut is just when you can't entirely pinpoint it on one specific fact.

MAJOR red flag here. I do not like players who, at the first sign of pressure, immediately meta themselves. Like an ostrich hiding its head in the sand. A very scummy ostrich.

That wasn't the first sign of pressure at all. Are you really reading the game?

And I'm not sure why replacing into a game makes a difference or not. What, you're too lazy to read into old posts? Seems to be the case from what you posted above? Or would you rather just wing it because you know who your scum team is and don't care as long as one of them doesn't get lynched?

When I replace into games, I read the game then make my first batch of reads based almost completely on gut. I even did it in the game Slandaar is talking about. I don't normally explain those gut reads either, though sometimes I explain the gut scum reads. When I am in a game from the start, I am able to stay on top of all the information in the game and am able to start making more logical cases as soon as possible.

Self metaing = damning in my eyes. When your only response to holes in your play in this game is to direct people to other games, that's attempting to distract the town from the matter at hand.

The whole meta argument between Slandaar and I is about other games, so does that mean we are both distracting the town?

Well hey, you can only really pressure one person at a time. Yet Slandaar votes so many people. He can't be pressuring them all now can he?

It is entirely possible to add pressure to more than one person at a time. Voting is not the only way to pressure someone in a game. It might be the most effective way (something about the prospect of going to the gallows has that effect), but it's not the only way.

Pressuring someone is constantly asking them questions and keeping them on their toes. Voting is just a way to apply more pressure. Slandaar wasn't pressuring most of the people he voted in that way at all.

But my point is that not giving examples isn't anti-town. Don't misrep what I'm saying.
Yeah, as I was going to say you also seem to do it for the sake of discrediting me.

How do any of you guys feel about a Thomith wagon?

Also I'm going to have to stop for the night. It's about 11PM now, and I'm really tired (been staying up till 3AM the past few nights).

Your first set of posts raised red flags because you were misusing meta and encouraging poor town play. This post confirms more of my suspicions about you. See, you're already under pressure due to the number of votes on you.

So you propose a Thomith wagon because he's the most recent and most convenient target?

No, because he's scum.

What, to draw votes off of you when there is plenty of reason to make a case against you.

With biased people like you on my case what's the point? You probably won't budge from my wagon (feel free to prove me wrong) so there's no point in trying to get you off.

Why should we bother listening to you for a wagon

Why should we bother listening to you either?

, and why should we even be forming a wagon one week out from the deadline when there are two players (you and Sland) that already have plenty of votes.

Wagons can change drastically as deadline comes closer.

It's not like we're in danger of getting a no lynch at this point. So I can only assume you're proposing the wagon to save your scum hide.

Nah man, it's because I'm making a wagon on scum.

[Om of the Nom]

Whoops the second part posted twice. You don't have to read the third one.

modedit: I deleted it for you

[Chrimi]

Elmo, my opinion only got stronger- I'm pretty positive he's scum. His claim makes me sure he's wolf.