Worst Role Mafia - GAME OVER!

[izakthegoomba]

Antihero replaces Candy Corn Vampire.

[saulres]

"Bad" as in "bad for a normal game of Mafia", so the role fits here.

So you're saying that I, too, should do something which might be detrimental to town "just because"?

Also

Tierce as town

is a force to be reckoned with.

But how do you

know

she's town? Again, I'm seeing scum thinking behind your posting.

@Tierce: What would have happened if you had turned down the role? I mean, if you didn't sign up for the game in secret, and suddenly you're told "You're playing it", if you didn't want to -- did you have an opt out option?

[BBmolla]

Saul stop misrepping me.

I was clearly not saying "Tierce is town this game and is going to wreck face." I said "Tierce as town is a force to be reckoned with." I don't know if Tierce is town, but if she is, she will be a force to be reckoned with due to experience with her in other games.

Comprende?

[saulres]

Oh sorry. You're arguing that if you were scum, you'd have brought in someone other than Tierce, because she'd be a strong town player if she weren't on your side?

What about the converse? Do you find her weak as scum, so that if you're town you're not really risking bringing in someone strong as scum?

[BBmolla]

Oh sorry. You're arguing that if you were scum, you'd have brought in someone other than Tierce, because she'd be a strong town player if she weren't on your side?

What about the converse? Do you find her weak as scum, so that if you're town you're not really risking bringing in someone strong as scum?

...That wasn't my point at all. I was just saying if she does end being town she'll be useful as hell. Judging by the average ratio or town:scum, I found it more likely that Tierce would be town, especially due to the possible imbalance adding another scum member would cause.

If she ended up being scum I think I'd be able to tell, but it'd take a bit. For the record I think she's town.

[Amrun]

Having a role that allows players to bring non-players into the game is already bad enough; there's no need to worsen it.

This is a terrible case.

How is it bad? It's good, if they're the same alignment as you. BB doesn't know they are, supposedly, but used it anyway.

I find it highly implausible that I could imbalance the game that much by using 1-shot.

I do find it plausible that my second shot would bring in scum.

Saul I don't know what to tell you, I changed my mind. The "Worst" part is that I'm recruiting someone from outside the game, which is obviously bastard.

Also Tierce as town is a force to be reckoned with.

lol what it is

"first shot town, second shot scum"

That is the biggest, most illogical wiggle out ever.

Please quote your original 2-shot claim as I asked.

[BBmolla]

Amrun get it yourself

Seriously what are you smoking

[Amrun]

I'm phone-posting, so no, I won't.

People call you out for using the ability you said yesterday was probably anti-town, and then today, you're like, "Oh, the first one is probably town," even though THAT MAKES ABSOLUTELY NO FUCKING SENSE.

[Agent_Ireland]

WHY didn't you vote Oversoul when you made a case on him, Oversoul? You WEREN'T already voting him, and that's crap.

I already told you. I thought I was voting GNR which is why I thought Pokerface was asking me that question.

Tierce, I am seeking out people's alignments with those quotes.

I'll go quote by quote to show you.

The first quote I was pressuring Saulres as you can see at the end.

The second quote is me saying that 2birds was scum and that any reasonable town would realize they were on a clock (reminds of you MLP and Ludi tying himself to me doesn't it?)

The third quote I said that RP is town... I don't know how you are missing the obvious comments on people's alignments. Or are you saying I'm not trying to snoop out their alignments?

My comments to Saul were all probing into his crap case on me.

I love how you say all of those posts were fluff when I was actively commenting on current things in the thread/responding to people who wanted answers from me.

Amrun, I am assuming that by your vote on BB you do not think Tierce is town. Your comment about her attacking you doesn't seem to equate this feeling in my opinion.

Saul, that little quoted bit sounds exactly like what happened in terms of BB bringing people into the game. BB's choice in Tierce looks like self preservation, but I actually think Tierce is a good choice so I am willing to let the scumminess of the choice slide.

I personally do not find BB scummy, but lying about the PR doesn't really point to anything.

I understand Saul's sentiments about it being scummy BB would perform an action not knowing what it fully did, but I also see that as town curiousity.

I want Agent Ireland to tell us why he used his Smoke Bomb when he did.

The reason I used my smokebomb ability day one is because, with my logic, most people who have daykill abilities, which I knew there would be a few because of this being a bastard game, would use their ability on day one. After two day kills, that was enough for me. It's a one shot ability and I just decided to use it, wait out all of the chaos and WIFOM during day one, and hop back in day two. People were asking about my alignment. I'm a town aligned one shot ninja.

[Agent_Ireland]

Amrun get it yourself

Seriously what are you smoking

Is it just me, or does this not rhyme?

[Tierce]

saul's case on BB is horrible, and is giving me a scum/scum connection vibe with Oversoul. He is putting his own motivations in place for BB's actions and voting accordingly; this is akin to A making a metacase on B using A's own meta as reasoning. He continues misrepresenting BB's words, and I'm not sure if his insistence on 'slips' (what terrible ones you're finding, BB never said he

knows

I'm town) is something scumsaul would do more than townsaul. Needs investigation.


I have no interest in addressing your point-by-point reply, Oversoul, and I think your reply to my case smells of a "why me?" reaction. You're faking offense at being called scum, you are throwing mud on BB (picking me is

not

self-preservation, we have been a BBscum/Tiercetown pair before and I can read him) but, again, not taking a stance on what you really think of his (and mine) alignment.

Also Tierce as town is a force to be reckoned with.

Not to toot my own horn here (well maybe a bit) but I am an excellent N1/N2 scumkill magnet and tend to be rather obvtown--pushing a lynch on me is not easy. BBscum would have no motivation for adding a tough lynch target / another needed NK to the game, especially since I'm someone who can read him well. BBtown would want someone to bounce ideas off--and we have worked well together in the past when we are both town.

@saul

- I got a role PM. Nothing more. No yes/no question, just a role PM with my role name, description, link to QT and to game, and a request to confirm via PM with role name. This looks exactly how a Player Recruiter would work; if I ignored it, I don't know what izak would do, but it was evident from my presence in the first post and the latest votecount that I

got

dropped in the game moment before I was PMd about it.


For the record, I'm terrible as scum. xD I'm a cowardly chicken.

Why am I waking up to a line of votes on BBtown and a distinctive lack of votes on Overscum?

[Tierce]

Phillammon (1) - IceGuy
Captain Haddock (2) - BBmolla, danakillsu
BBmolla (3) - PokerFace, Amrun, saulres
Oversoul (2) - Tierce, Phillamon <------

votes go here, guyz

No Lynch (0) - none

Not voting (13) - Robotnick2, ShadowGirl, Moneybags, Oversoul, knox, Gimmicky Alt, Captain Haddock, numberQ, ManiacalLemon, Antihero, Chimera, RedPanda, Agent_Ireland

@Amrun

, BB did not lie about his role's recruitment. From the very beginning, he said it was an X-shot Player Recruiter:

Lynching a X-Shot player recruiter would lead to your demise.

I can bring in others from outside the game

like Tierce who is probably stalking me like a spy

I got lucky, my role actually isn't all that lame.

He was worried about using the ability, and yet used it anyway. Why is this scummy? Wouldn't be BBscum be better served by NOT using the role at all, instead of attracting attention to himself? I've played with BBscum before, and he hates being on the limelight. Recruiting a player (especially me, who WILL keep an eye on him and not allow him to be quiet) is a 'loud' choice. There is actual logic in "the second shot might be a scum role", due to balance reasons (used later, roping in scum into a previously 'safe' neighborhood, adding swingyness to a bastard game), and that is why that shot is not going to be used.

I do not idly defend townreads, and there are layers of behavior from BB I try to decode in each game. In this situation, I see no case in which he would voluntarily add me to the game if he were scum. Add to that how we've interacted so far, and that is a town slot.

Stop being silly. Vote Oversoul, he's scum.

[Oversoul]

Tierce are you kidding me?

I have no interest in addressing your point-by-point reply, Oversoul, and I think your reply to my case smells of a "why me?" reaction.

Why because you have no legitimate reasoning to call me scum and would rather throw things around?

FUCK that. You're commenting on it.

You're faking offense at being called scum, you are throwing mud on BB (picking me is not self-preservation, we have been a BBscum/Tiercetown pair before and I can read him) but, again, not taking a stance on what you really think of his (and mine) alignment.

What does this even mean? This is the second time you've come after me with retarded bullshit.

BB choosing you IS preservation and here is why.

BB as SCUM would choose the person who can read him best, Tierce, to come into the game BECAUSE he knows that all of his "neighbors" will be his alignment.

Once you join the game because you are now TIED to BB you would use your "scumhunting" and discern that BB "isn't scum". BB's power to create his own little possee assures that he will have at least one other person vouching for him. So yes, that was a very defensive move on BB's part.

And for the record, now that you are coming at me yet again with insane accusations I think you both are scum.

BBscum would have no motivation for adding a tough lynch target / another needed NK to the game, especially since I'm someone who can read him well.

Yes. Yes he would if he knows what alignment you are going to be before hand.

@Amrun, BB did not lie about his role's recruitment. From the very beginning, he said it was an X-shot Player Recruiter:

This is exactly the type of shit that I was worried about with regards to both of you.

I can understand that if you were town you would come in here seeing as how you are town independent of BBmolla. That is not what you are doing. You are acting as if your own life depended on BBmolla and you are hardcore defending him. You seem to be very certain in such a relatively short amount of time that BB is town and I am not buying it.

He was worried about using the ability, and yet used it anyway. Why is this scummy? Wouldn't be BBscum be better served by NOT using the role at all, instead of attracting attention to himself?

Noting this for future reference.

Recruiting a player (especially me, who WILL keep an eye on him and not allow him to be quiet) is a 'loud' choice. There is actual logic in "the second shot might be a scum role", due to balance reasons (used later, roping in scum into a previously 'safe' neighborhood, adding swingyness to a bastard game), and that is why that shot is not going to be used.

All of this "logic" is thrown out of the window if you stop for a moment and consider that the person recruited could be scum. BB as scum knowing his recruit will be scum could definitely pull this stunt to get fake towncred.

In addition, if you stop and think BBscum could be playing you Tierce.

I do not idly defend townreads, and there are layers of behavior from BB I try to decode in each game. In this situation, I see no case in which he would voluntarily add me to the game if he were scum. Add to that how we've interacted so far, and that is a town slot.

Except that there are cases but you have somehow failed to mention them or recognize them at all.

VOTE: BBmolla

[Tierce]

Do explain how I have to think

even for a moment

that the recruited person is scum, if the recruited person is ME and I know that my alignment is town. really. How on earth do you expect me to make a case for a BBscum possibility that DOES NOT EXIST, because I know my own alignment? You're wanting me to paint

myself

as hyposcum so I'll justify this ridiculous hypothesis of BBscum? No thank you. I'm town, and BBscum would NOT recruit Tiercetown. The moment I flip scum, feel free to lynch him--but that's not going to happen because

I'm town

.


Yes, I am quite sure for a "short amount of time" of what BB's alignment is. I defend my townreads when they are being wagoned. You don't have any idea of how much knowledge we've shared, so you're grabbing at straws and, AGAIN, not explaining

why

certain behavior is or isn't scummy. Why is getting a speedread on the person I was recruited by scummy?

It isn't.

And seriously, you want me to consider that BB might be 'playing' me? Thank you so much for your kind concern, but I think I know how to play this game and I keep an eye on even those I consider town. I'm not an idiot.


I have PERFECTLY legit reasoning on you. Your whole ISO reeks of scummy behavior. Raising this against you is POINTLESS, because I have no intention of arguing with you, and regardles sof your alignment you are never going to be convinced by a case on you ("oh, I guess you're right, Tierce, I must be scum!"). I'm showing

others

how scummy your behavior is, and collecting votes on you, because you are acting like Overscum (and scum in general) does and deserve rope for it.


And you're voting the largest town wagon, who you just fenced on like crazy. Good attempt at self-preservation there, scumbag.

[saulres]

I'm trying, I really am, to see BB's point. But understand I have no way of knowing his alignment, so I'm trying to look at it from both sides. Can you try that too Tierce?

He's saying you're a town force to be reckoned with, but that's not an alignment-tell on him: If he's town, yay for him, if he's scum, just kill you off after today. I hadn't found anything since he changed his mind and brought you in that I could justify him having done as town, especially when I look at what I would have done if I had an ability which could be either good or bad for town. Which I do. And I didn't use it, because I don't think it's pro-town to experiment with what could be a bad thing. I see his actions in the same light, which is why I think they're scum-driven.

Having said that,

Judging by the average ratio or town:scum, I found it more likely that Tierce would be town, especially due to the possible imbalance adding another scum member would cause.

This makes some sense and I could see this as a town motivation that I didn't consider, because I wasn't really thinking of balance. I'm not convinced, mind you, but it's a possible reason.

In other news:

Antihero replaces Candy Corn Vampire.

10 posts elsewhere for this replacement since he replaced in, and nothing here, not even a "Hello". I'll need to look at CCV's slot tomorrow.

Also numberQ has two posts, including what he says was the hammer, so that needs to be looked into as well. Plus, of course, Oversoul. And I'd like to look at the people who were saying "No, the case against GNR was bad" (hint: It wasn't) because that group could easily consist of scum who knew he'd flip town and were "defending" him for towncred. So that's my agenda for tomorrow.

[Tierce]

What you are asking me to do is entirely different of what Oversoul did, saul. You're asking me to see what are the motivations of BBscum recruiting Tiercetown. Oversoul is asking me to look at the motivations for BBscum to recruit Tiercescum, which is just absurd and feels like deflection, there is no reason, ever, for me to dwell on the possibilities of being an alignment I'm not.

As for your view on BBscum recruiting Tiercetown: it still wouldn't outweigh the risks of doing it. 1) Limelight 2) me catching him today 3) another player to off at night instead of an actual town role already in the game. There is no scum motivation to add to the obvtown pile by adding

more players

to the game, especially when we can talk between us all the time and I can demand a rapidfire answer from him. It becomes hard to fake behaviors and motivations, and to do it deliberately? To bring someone he knows is usually obvtown and can understand where his views come from? That is a town move, one that Oversoul is trying to obscure with scummy WIFOM by saying "what if he's playing you?"

BB also fullclaimed to me before he did in thread, and the way it was handled, once again, speaks of BBtown.

[BBmolla]

BB as SCUM would choose the person who can read him best, Tierce, to come into the game BECAUSE

he knows that all of his "neighbors" will be his alignment

.

What

Where did I say this

Ever

[BBmolla]

If I was scum, recruiting Tierce would be dumb as shit. She reads me like a book.

I'd have not recruited as scum for pretty much the reasons Tierce has stated.

[Tierce]

BB as SCUM would choose the person who can read him best, Tierce, to come into the game BECAUSE

he knows that all of his "neighbors" will be his alignment

.

What

Where did I say this

Ever

O hai, may I present to you Overscum, who is making cases out of convenient 'if's and WIFOM and completely ignoring Occam's Razor, as well as completely NOT trying to read either of us outside the recruitment action?

[Tierce]

By the way, adding to the crap reasoning by Oversoul: how do you even think it would be balanced to add two scum players to a game while not altering the town pool? Why would BB announce this instead of lying low and recruit scum players 1) without anyone knowing it was his doing and 2) the night before LyLo, thus rendering the game an immediate scum win when town numbers = scum numbers?

There is no reason for hypoBBscum-with-recruitable-scumbuddies to recruit last night. None. Ever. No, it does not add 'towncred' he might need now, he could 1) do it in silence and 2) later in the game and

no one would know

.

The more I try to look at this from that "omg they are both scum!!1!11!one!" perspective you

might

have if you were town, the less sense it makes. You're not stupid, Oversoul. You're scum who knows we're both town and thus isn't even seeing the glaring holes in this theory.

[Captain Haddock]

The BB votes are weak and unfounded. I think Captain Haddock is trying to pile on with everyone else, so unless he comes back and makes a good case, this vote will stay on him.

vote: Captain Haddock

I haven't liked his play anyway.

why don't you try reading my ISO, I've posted reasons for lynching him yesterday. How am I "piling in" when I'm the first person to vote BBmolla? The case will be here later today(IRL).

Sorry!

Amrun get it yourself

Seriously what are you smoking

Is it just me, or does this not rhyme?

OMG

[izakthegoomba]

Chimera has requested replacement

...

Foxace36 replaces Chimera

[RedPanda]

Had no power for the last 10 hours.

Hey tierce!!

Would you die if we lynch BB?

@pokerface
That first post fluff was just a way for me to breadcrumb my role.

@ tierce

I'm not just a mason. I'm a _ _ _ _ _ _ , _ _ _ _ _ _ , _ _ _ , Mason.

Chimera hasn't name claimed to me But he did tell me what his ability/problem was.

Dana and saulres are the worst in this game.

I don't trust them one bit especially dana.

Just look at that scumbags posts.

Unvote Vote dana

The mason QT is depressing.

@Oversoul Who is worse? dana or BB

[Tierce]

Fun. I had a variant: computer wasn't recognizing the Network and Sharing Center, "page failed to load", no connections available anywhere, the hardware was all fine. ohvista.gif
It was an interesting hour spent

poking through Google

with advanced troubleshooting. ._.

No, I wouldn't die (afaik), but I would be pissed off because wtf wtf there won't be any lynching my townreads, tyvm.

It's not a cult--I'm town, recruited

into

the game, not into a cult of some form.

[Antihero]

Hello everyone.

Sorry isaac, but I now realize I've bit off more than I can chew and I'm going to have to

rescind my offer to replace into this game

.

I just want everyone to know that this is

absolutely not because of what the role PM I got says

(I wouldn't lie about this). I just got a lot busier in RL and I don't have time to devote to a good read-through of the 20 pages so far.

Sorry again Isaac.