Open 387: Jungle Republic (Day 6 - ends in a Town Victory)

[andrew94]

Day 4 Vote Count

Chrimi (1): Fat_Tony
Om of the Nom (1): Kassadin
Thomith (1): Om of the Nom

Not Voting (4): Thomith, Pirate Chemist, andrew94, Chrimi

There are 7 players alive, which means it takes 4 votes to lynch.
Deadline in

(expired on 2012-05-09 18:00:00)

(May 9, 6:00 PM EDT or 10:00 PM GMT)

As of Post #944

RULE CHANGE:

Plurality lynch is active. Whoever has the most votes by the deadline will get lynched.

your voting him, so you think hes scum
since i cant be scum, shouldnt you be happy that i think hes scum?

[andrew94]

actually after reading some more om seems super scummy along with possibly pirate/kass

unvote vote om of the nom

[Om of the Nom]

Sure I'm kinda happy you think Thomith is scum.Doesn't mean I'm happy with your case.

Why am I scum? Why are Pirate/Kass scum?

[Chrimi]

Kass is always scum :/

[Chrimi]

Well, anti-town is the best way to put it >.>

[Om of the Nom]

^This.
I still want a reason from andrew.

[andrew94]

what the crap?
i dont need to give YOU reasons.
you need to give ME reasons.

and yea kass looks vi but not scum

[Om of the Nom]

actually after reading some more om seems super scummy along with possibly pirate/kass

unvote vote om of the nom

what the crap?
i dont need to give YOU reasons.
you need to give ME reasons.

and yea kass looks vi but not scum

Seriously, wtf is this shit? You're just abusing your confirmed towniness to do literally jack-shit. Get off your ass and make a case on me.

[Kassadin]

Om Nom, people do make cases on u but all u say is that every case made towards u is shit so

[Om of the Nom]

They aren't cases. They are individual points aimed to make me look scummy, when those points aren't even scummy things.

[Thomith]

andrew, i gave reasons why keeping the seer alive was a good thing for us, the town, and i am pretty sure someone else said something similar.

[andrew94]

They aren't cases. They are individual points aimed to make me look scummy, when those points aren't even scummy things.

sorry, but i havent made any cases on you. I was commenting that you are scummy when i read through.
Sounds like your panicking.

@ Thomith, the way you said it raised alarm bells with me

[andrew94]

Also, note that i only need to find 2 TOWN, which is easier than finding 2 SCUM, and you sure as heck are not in that list.
so your in the 'eventually lynched' category'

[Om of the Nom]

What makes you think I'm panicking?

[Thomith]

shouldn't you be trying to find both?
I understand the finding 2 town part but shouldn't you be looking for scum as well?

[Kassadin]

I see buddying

[andrew94]

kassadin, i would appreciate if you dont just post one or two liners

i want some opinions from other ppl

i have scum in a group of people, i should lynch those group of people, the only question is, who first..

[Ravel]

BK20 officially replaces Pirate Chemist

Day 4 Vote Count

Chrimi (1): Fat_Tony
Om of the Nom (2): Kassadin, andrew94
Thomith (1): Om of the Nom

Not Voting (3): Thomith, BK20, Chrimi

There are 7 players alive, which means it takes 4 votes to lynch.
Deadline in

(expired on 2012-05-09 18:00:00)

(May 9, 6:00 PM EDT or 10:00 PM GMT)

As of Post #966

RULE CHANGE:

Plurality lynch is active. Whoever has the most votes by the deadline will get lynched.

Warning: If there is a tie, it will come down to a die roll, so watch out

[BK201]

Hey guys. If I could get the game summary from many perspectives that would help.

[Chrimi]

Welcome.

Reread 39 pages will be hard. I can't give a summary for two days tho, so...

[BK201]

Slandaar is playing great at getting reactions.

However, I don't like the way he is doing it.

I have a town read on Slandaar, but he really needs to not act the way he is, because it's very anti-town.


And Slandaar, if you're going to try and reaction test, please make it a little more subtle. The manipulativeness was 0 in what he was saying, and based on your vocabulary and gameplay so far I am assuming you knew that and was only reaction-testing.

If you were reaction-testing, town read. You may be trying to get whatever you can on other people, which would be much scummier.

Ugh, I'm not used to this kind of gameplay. Alright, let's see here...

Until I get some kind of response that is noteworthy and explains well, I shall...
VOTE: Slandaar

I'm kinda wary of kondi and Slandaar right now. This may sound wierd, but they seem more concerned with making cases and being active than I remember from their town meta. Yes, I get this is what town are supposed to be like, but it just feels off to me.

Om has 10 pages of meta on me. This is not very much, this is also very wrong from what I remember but thats not really the issue.

Om knows this;

Of course, this could just be me being fail and forgetting half of their town meta, if that's the case, then just disregard this.

He knows that he doesn't really have adequate meta to be accurate so throws in an out when his meta read is challenged.

He cant possibly think he knows 'half my town meta' from ten pages let alone my full meta.

He then tries to defend his read with '10 pages is enough' then what was the point in the above quote? he surely knows my meta because 10 pages is enough, so why the doubt that he might not? Its because he knows its not enough.

His read is completely fabricated. His general read list shows a complete lack of reads bar gut and fake meta reads. Meta reads and gut reads require very little commitment, leaving him open for change later which is further backed up by his 'I could be wrong though if so disregard!' They are also very easy to invent as scum requiring little explanation.

His reaction to my vote is bad, he tries to get me to post content for which he can defend himself instead of just explainign a town read (vijay) which could have helped read him. It also shows a great hypocrisy that he can have gut reads that he doesn't need to explain but I can't

Basically hes scum.

Ugh what is this? OOTN sounds like a cornered townie imo. Slandaar's pressure is good, but it's coming close to confirmation bias imo. I played with him before and the meta is fairly similar, which is null, but gut gives me a slight town read.

@ Mod: could we get kondi in here please? Thank you.

Vote hopping can be a scumtell depending no the context.
it is a scumtell when you do it during the day with no deadlines nearby and no clear reason.

Obviously you were insinuating this

I see it as scum vote hopping.

as shown here

Therefore you are saying I am scum for vote hopping, I am scum based on meta, yet my meta says votehopping = town.

You cant use meta when it suits you and not when it doesnt. (well you can when you are scum, or try to)

or you want to admit you dont know my meta and just fabricated your read on me again making you scum... (this is the case)

Thomith, your sig. Best song ever. Regarding the game, I'm guessing you're insinuating OOTN - newbscum?

OOTN still is cornered townie lashing out at his attackers. Also, I believe that he was wrong about knowing your meta, but has no space to back down.

Chrimi, I was going to say you would play better if you stopped posting like everybody you talk to is 12. Then I remembered your actually quite close to that age yourself X.X

Meta reads are very easy to makeup to look like you are scumhunting.

He defends himself from me saying 10pages is clearly not enough to meta someone on but later wants me to meta him, which shows complete hypocrisy as if his read is good, I have the same meta on him as he on me therefore I know his meta like he knows mine. Yet it shows he knows 10pages isnt enough. Making him scum.

Makes his current logic bad. His current logic is faulty because he is being pressured hard.

Cornered townie, as vijay said. Defending from his attacker(s). Slandaar, somebody's case being bad does not make them scum, it makes the case bad and that's it. Both scum and townies can make bad cases, it happens all the time.

So, I agree Om your logic on the situation is at fault, but I do not believe he is scum.

P-edit: Thomith, he is fighting back and defending, if he just backed down Slandaar would move in and continue making points and asking for an answer. Om is answering and defending, like anybody would. A bad defense means a townie that has given up, anyways. Fighting back and defending means a strong town who is trying to understand why Slandaar is tunneling him.

@ Asher: my gut has served me very well in the past, as well as my metaing. I know how to use both. I'm not going to be right all the time, but more often than not.

When I bring up Thomith's meta, it's because he's playing fairly similar to that previous game. The fact that he flipped town in that one gives me a gut town read. Also, POE is another way of scumhunting, and something I've been trying to integrate to my skillset.

Regarding pressure, I believe it's you being short-sighted. Well not short-sighted, but more not considering both sides of the coin. Sure pressure can be imposed in the long term by questioning statements made, but why wait for that when you can pressure now? Furthermore, shouldn't early pressure provide you with more ammunition for late pressure as scum crack and flail?

I did not know what to expect, and he didn't really react. A weak reaction at most, I'm pinning it as trying to evade or ignore it. Ergo, scum points.

Chrimi and reaction testing:

I think you are town but im voting you untill you meet my demands.
Pressure by calling said person town; 0. Noone is going to actually stick to a vote on someone they think is town IF they are town themselves.
What reaction would be a town reaction to a no pressure vote exactly Chrimi? coming at you guns blazing? thats a strong reaction right? so thats town? doesnt seem to make much sense especially the tone of your OMGUS post recently.

So my reaction was always destined to get scumpoints wasn't it? your test was not impartial, thereby making you scum.

also explain the benefits of voting me for being antitown over kass for being antitown? who is being more antitown hm?

Oh but whatever alignment kass is as scum you want to keep him alive...

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Chrimi

this guys scum hes just been posting reactionary stuff and done approximately 0 scumhunting.

It actually makes more sense hes defending kass due to kass being useless so as scum he wants to keep him around rather than being buddies, the connection between the 2 is too obvious.

Hmmmm I think for now this is the best thing to do.

VOTE: Slandaar

I looked up all of the games (still on the site) of all of the players

I meta one game per player

Nice try but you are clearly lying.

Except, Slandaar, if we lynch Kass we'll be lynching town.

Lynching town today is very bad YOU don't seem to grasp this.

You are not seer. You are wolf. Will somebody hammer him please?

For the record, I would really have preferred it if Slandaar had not died today, he was active (if a bit flaily) and had he not made the Worst Claim Ever (TM) then maybe he'd have lived. Allowing him to live overnight just muddies everything up tomorrow and we can't afford to get bogged down in ridiculous WIFOM all day in D2. You had to die, even though it should have been Kass the whole time.

Pre-edit: What would your notes have done if you were going to hammer straight afterwards anyway? You would have given wolves more info to work with. Save them for tomorrow, they'll still be valid.

I'm up to page 26 already.

[andrew94]

Why did you quote these posts?

also, vijay has connections with Om +1

[BK201]

Slandaar is playing great at getting reactions.

However, I don't like the way he is doing it.

I have a town read on Slandaar, but he really needs to not act the way he is, because it's very anti-town.


And Slandaar, if you're going to try and reaction test, please make it a little more subtle. The manipulativeness was 0 in what he was saying, and based on your vocabulary and gameplay so far I am assuming you knew that and was only reaction-testing.

If you were reaction-testing, town read. You may be trying to get whatever you can on other people, which would be much scummier.

Ugh, I'm not used to this kind of gameplay. Alright, let's see here...

Until I get some kind of response that is noteworthy and explains well, I shall...
VOTE: Slandaar

I'm kinda wary of kondi and Slandaar right now. This may sound wierd, but they seem more concerned with making cases and being active than I remember from their town meta. Yes, I get this is what town are supposed to be like, but it just feels off to me.

Om has 10 pages of meta on me. This is not very much, this is also very wrong from what I remember but thats not really the issue.

Om knows this;

Of course, this could just be me being fail and forgetting half of their town meta, if that's the case, then just disregard this.

He knows that he doesn't really have adequate meta to be accurate so throws in an out when his meta read is challenged.

He cant possibly think he knows 'half my town meta' from ten pages let alone my full meta.

He then tries to defend his read with '10 pages is enough' then what was the point in the above quote? he surely knows my meta because 10 pages is enough, so why the doubt that he might not? Its because he knows its not enough.

His read is completely fabricated. His general read list shows a complete lack of reads bar gut and fake meta reads. Meta reads and gut reads require very little commitment, leaving him open for change later which is further backed up by his 'I could be wrong though if so disregard!' They are also very easy to invent as scum requiring little explanation.

His reaction to my vote is bad, he tries to get me to post content for which he can defend himself instead of just explainign a town read (vijay) which could have helped read him. It also shows a great hypocrisy that he can have gut reads that he doesn't need to explain but I can't

Basically hes scum.

Ugh what is this? OOTN sounds like a cornered townie imo. Slandaar's pressure is good, but it's coming close to confirmation bias imo. I played with him before and the meta is fairly similar, which is null, but gut gives me a slight town read.

@ Mod: could we get kondi in here please? Thank you.

Vote hopping can be a scumtell depending no the context.
it is a scumtell when you do it during the day with no deadlines nearby and no clear reason.

Obviously you were insinuating this

I see it as scum vote hopping.

as shown here

Therefore you are saying I am scum for vote hopping, I am scum based on meta, yet my meta says votehopping = town.

You cant use meta when it suits you and not when it doesnt. (well you can when you are scum, or try to)

or you want to admit you dont know my meta and just fabricated your read on me again making you scum... (this is the case)

Thomith, your sig. Best song ever. Regarding the game, I'm guessing you're insinuating OOTN - newbscum?

OOTN still is cornered townie lashing out at his attackers. Also, I believe that he was wrong about knowing your meta, but has no space to back down.

Chrimi, I was going to say you would play better if you stopped posting like everybody you talk to is 12. Then I remembered your actually quite close to that age yourself X.X

Meta reads are very easy to makeup to look like you are scumhunting.

He defends himself from me saying 10pages is clearly not enough to meta someone on but later wants me to meta him, which shows complete hypocrisy as if his read is good, I have the same meta on him as he on me therefore I know his meta like he knows mine. Yet it shows he knows 10pages isnt enough. Making him scum.

Makes his current logic bad. His current logic is faulty because he is being pressured hard.

Cornered townie, as vijay said. Defending from his attacker(s). Slandaar, somebody's case being bad does not make them scum, it makes the case bad and that's it. Both scum and townies can make bad cases, it happens all the time.

So, I agree Om your logic on the situation is at fault, but I do not believe he is scum.

P-edit: Thomith, he is fighting back and defending, if he just backed down Slandaar would move in and continue making points and asking for an answer. Om is answering and defending, like anybody would. A bad defense means a townie that has given up, anyways. Fighting back and defending means a strong town who is trying to understand why Slandaar is tunneling him.

@ Asher: my gut has served me very well in the past, as well as my metaing. I know how to use both. I'm not going to be right all the time, but more often than not.

When I bring up Thomith's meta, it's because he's playing fairly similar to that previous game. The fact that he flipped town in that one gives me a gut town read. Also, POE is another way of scumhunting, and something I've been trying to integrate to my skillset.

Regarding pressure, I believe it's you being short-sighted. Well not short-sighted, but more not considering both sides of the coin. Sure pressure can be imposed in the long term by questioning statements made, but why wait for that when you can pressure now? Furthermore, shouldn't early pressure provide you with more ammunition for late pressure as scum crack and flail?

I did not know what to expect, and he didn't really react. A weak reaction at most, I'm pinning it as trying to evade or ignore it. Ergo, scum points.

Chrimi and reaction testing:

I think you are town but im voting you untill you meet my demands.
Pressure by calling said person town; 0. Noone is going to actually stick to a vote on someone they think is town IF they are town themselves.
What reaction would be a town reaction to a no pressure vote exactly Chrimi? coming at you guns blazing? thats a strong reaction right? so thats town? doesnt seem to make much sense especially the tone of your OMGUS post recently.

So my reaction was always destined to get scumpoints wasn't it? your test was not impartial, thereby making you scum.

also explain the benefits of voting me for being antitown over kass for being antitown? who is being more antitown hm?

Oh but whatever alignment kass is as scum you want to keep him alive...

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Chrimi

this guys scum hes just been posting reactionary stuff and done approximately 0 scumhunting.

It actually makes more sense hes defending kass due to kass being useless so as scum he wants to keep him around rather than being buddies, the connection between the 2 is too obvious.

Hmmmm I think for now this is the best thing to do.

VOTE: Slandaar

I looked up all of the games (still on the site) of all of the players

I meta one game per player

Nice try but you are clearly lying.

Except, Slandaar, if we lynch Kass we'll be lynching town.

Lynching town today is very bad YOU don't seem to grasp this.

You are not seer. You are wolf. Will somebody hammer him please?

For the record, I would really have preferred it if Slandaar had not died today, he was active (if a bit flaily) and had he not made the Worst Claim Ever (TM) then maybe he'd have lived. Allowing him to live overnight just muddies everything up tomorrow and we can't afford to get bogged down in ridiculous WIFOM all day in D2. You had to die, even though it should have been Kass the whole time.

Pre-edit: What would your notes have done if you were going to hammer straight afterwards anyway? You would have given wolves more info to work with. Save them for tomorrow, they'll still be valid.

Kondi, you were saying slandaar was town yesturday, but he claimed seer, if you ARE the seer then why did you still act like slandaar was town as he would have been lying would he have not?
UNVOTE:
i would vote but L-1 early in the day probably wont help much.

Also chrimi you viewed me and slandaar as a scumteam so you changed the meaning of one of my posts to make it more believable?
VOTE: chrimi

Uhm...

No?

I was just adding to my point.

by changing mine?

Yes.

@ Fat Tony: I don't understand that unvote. Are you claiming that you knew Chrimi was going to vote Kondi?

By the way, note the Chrimi-OMGUS.

Anyway, I still want kondi lynched. Kass is probably scum, so is Chrimi. But kondi gets rope today.

VJ wouldn't that make Tony scum as well? Since he knew Chrimi was going to vote?

That seems to fit rather nicely. Who did Tony replace again?

Fat_Tony LBJ**

Really it just seems awkward how the exchange here went

But why would Tony say that he knew? That's a connection that goes under my too convenient to be scummy cabinet. Like sort of how some people are too scummy to actually be scum, if that makes sense. Tony is null for me atm.

That's the problem though. Were dealing with multi scum teams as well here

So what exactly are you suggesting Elmo?

But why would Tony say that he knew? That's a connection that goes under my too convenient to be scummy cabinet. Like sort of how some people are too scummy to actually be scum, if that makes sense. Tony is null for me atm.

Too scummy to be scum. You can't look past that right now. With only one team being able to be found by seer and the other is basically a group of evil masons. You can't make an argument too scummy to be scum

Well I have scumreads that I personally believe are stronger than Tony at the moment.

I just mini-quote things as I read, since I just read all 39 pages in 3 sittings.

[BK201]

Was clear Asher was the seer when he said this to Slandaar. Maybe more clear because I already knew some slips my first time reading it.
"By the way, if you are a VT who claimed seer just to save your own hide, that's one big /facepalm right there."

Anyways, Omnom and Chimri are the best bets for being scum. Both used very faulty meta logic which was destroyed by Slandaar. Early in the game v2v(that scum player), soft-defended omnom saying he is town backed into a corner. Chimri hasn't been pro-active, and sometimes harmful to town. Omnom is the best bet right now.

VOTE: Om of the Nom

[BK201]

^slips was meant to be flips.