NY 151: Playground Mafia (Game Over-Mafia Win!)

[StrangerCoug]

SSC, whats your opinion on rack?

Dead. Your name can be added to the "not gonna cry if this person gets lynched" list for not reading.

There a reason you keep avoiding everything that anyone asks/requests of you?

Yeah. The same reason you keep blowing off everything non-drmyshottyizsik related that I yell at you for. Are you conceding that the Lady Lambdadelta case is crap? Are you going to try again? Or have you failed to realize that it never held any water?

[Nero Cain]

Until LLD is dead or mod confirmed town I don't see whats so town about her. Maybe someone can explain.

I see no reason for me to explain my case to you when you are avoiding questions in the first place. And even now I'm asking a very simple "why you keep avoiding" question and you still get all pissed and angry? WHY? Its a simple question. If you are town there shouldn't be anything to be upset over.

Though I'll make you a deal. You answer my questions and I'll "defend" my case.

[StrangerCoug]

Point me to the outstanding questions and I will answer.

[Nero Cain]

Nor did I ever say anything about you thinkin' shotty was town. Nor am I still trying to for for a pl on shotty as you claim.

Why are you putting words into my mouth?

I have to ask you about your shotty scumread. As far as I can tell 488 is the only time you express that he's scummy. The case (shotty is scummy for weak replys to Nero and Mastin and (I think) they are crossbussin') is a pretty weak case

or is there more to it? Would my town flip make you change your read on shotty? Why did he not make your list of scum reads/lynchs in 1453?

As far as I know I never called shotty scummy or put a case on him.

Why then are you saying that you are attacking the shotty case?

(hint:if there's not one you can't attack it) If anything you are attacking me. Not any case.

Please quote were I called shotty scum and put a case on him.

I do have some additional questions but as per our agreement after you answer these and I "defend" my case (is there any particular area you have a question on?), I wll ask.

[StrangerCoug]

Why are you putting words into my mouth?

Once again, for me to "defend" someone, I have to think a player is town. By claiming that I am defending drmyshottyizsik, you posit that I believe he is. I have my doubts right now.

I'll admit that the fact that it's a topic of discussion again is skewing my beliefs, but there was never a reason to PL

ANYONE

. You took roughly the same attitude toward shotty as you did to my immediate predecessor. A look at your ISO reveals that the shotty PL was not, in fact, a topic of discussion for awhile before I replaced in, so I'll take that as an error on my part and drop it.

I have to ask you about your shotty scumread. As far as I can tell 488 is the only time you express that he's scummy. The case (shotty is scummy for weak replys to Nero and Mastin and (I think) they are crossbussin') is a pretty weak case

or is there more to it?

I had nothing else on him.

Would my town flip make you change your read on shotty?

If you flip town, as your question is phrased, then no; if you flip scum, however, then I have less of a reason than I already do to push for drmyshottyizsik.

Why did he not make your list of scum reads/lynchs in 1453?

Answered already. Lynching him is suboptimal right now, so I

WOULD

cry if he gets the rope. Of the people I suspect, he's the one on which I have the weakest read.

As far as I know I never called shotty scummy or put a case on him.

Why then are you saying that you are attacking the shotty case?

(hint:if there's not one you can't attack it) If anything you are attacking me. Not any case.

Please quote were I called shotty scum and put a case on him.

A sample of your statements regarding drmyshottyizsik:

he's a VI and they make great early game lynches.

ummmm...ever game I've played with him. Its common site knowledge that he's a VI. Why are you seemingly defending a shotty pl?

For anybody to be a decent lynch, they have to be scum. I am led to believe you seriously meant to carry out the lynch and you have been attacking people against it. Lynching someone for being a village idiot is not a valid case; this is why I implied that you shot yourself in the foot after the first time you asked this.

[Kublai Khan]

LOL! Keep digging.

how would Jun voting/attacking you give him towncred?

"Woh is me, the attacks against me are scum-founded!"

Sorry about your grandma, hope everything is ok

[The Mini-Librarian]

@Benmage

: Vote for shotty. Really, why are you voting a mastin pl? I mean if you really don't want to read his walls wait till someone inevitably argues with him and summarizes what he says. But seriously a shotty wagon is full of win here.

[FakeGod]

@FakeGod: You have 4 posts in all of Day 2. I want to see your reads on everyone.

My apologies. For some reason, this game is hardest to follow among my current games, and I seem to keep getting distracted by my other games and keep falling back on this one.

I will try to comply to your request at the earliest opportunity.

[Nero Cain]

For the record I don't really get SC's request to "defend" my case.

Spoiler:

Calls Mini slightly scummy for finding Rack scummy but she finds Rack scummy and later joined the Rack wagon herself. Cognitive dissonance and possible buddy distancing given that she didn't call anyoneone else scummy only Mini.

Librarian has some good posts about Rack. Then again, Rack is a incredibly easy target and anyone can make the blanket statement about Rack's questions. They're terrible. Follow this with Rack not substatiating his claim about me, and he's looking really bad. This isn't to say that I think Librarian is scummy for liking Rack as scum,

I just don't think he's incredibly town for it.

And I don't think any conjectures can be made about Scooby's confirm post. It's literally completely null until Scooby posts some content.

So, yeah Librarian is town but not as town as everyone seems to think. Probably a slight town lean, just for sincerity in posts.

I really don't get any town vibes from calling some one "not incredibly townie" and "not as town as everyone thinks" AND THEN joining that same wagon.

Also since we have two kills and [most likely] two mafia factions this might be a slip. If she was scum and knew there were two factions she could use that to justify voting for a scum suspect while calling someone else slightly scummy (that's how I interpret it).

Believes that Rack town told but ignores it since he did something scummy. Town tell + Scum tell=null tell not town tell + scum tell=scum tell

RedFF- I don't know what the problem with forcing a hydra to claim their heads is.

I actually found it to be a town tell.

The only reason I'm not doing it, is because at this moment I consider my vote on them and if they refuse to answer my question again, I'll be lynching them day 1. And then it won't matter who their heads are.

Says she thinks its a towntell that Rack didn't want to reveal thier heads but thinks its a scum tell that he dodged questions. I don't see how one outwieghs the other.

Says its anti-town to explain town reads despite explaining some town reads.

Ninja strikes me as a pure hearted townie of goodness.

KK seems logical town, but I have a real... twinge about KK that I need to check up on. Nothing too serious, I just gotta go read a Metropolis game again. God help my soul. If everything checks out, then KK should be a pretty good town here.

Librarian has some good posts about Rack. Then again, Rack is a incredibly easy target and anyone can make the blanket statement about Rack's questions. They're terrible. Follow this with Rack not substatiating his claim about me, and he's looking really bad. This isn't to say that I think Librarian is scummy for liking Rack as scum, I just don't think he's incredibly town for it. And I don't think any conjectures can be made about Scooby's confirm post. It's literally completely null until Scooby posts some content. So, yeah Librarian is town but not as town as everyone seems to think. Probably a slight town lean, just for sincerity in posts.

JasonT is town. I've got a dead read on him from the last few games I've played with him. That's as town as Jason gets.

I like how Deas Veil is playing. It's a little cautious, but in this case his caution appears to be town oriented rather than scum.

might be more but these look like her explaning town reads to me.

Flips on Fire when Fire didn't post between her posts. Fence sitting, made up read.

I just don't see what is setting of so many alarms in rack's posting.


LLD, I noticed you haven't said a thing about firestarted all game, what do you think of that wagon?

I do agree that the KK wagon isn't great.

There's a Firestarter wagon? I know a few people were displeased with his opening post, but I didn't see a lot wrong with it.

It was a little weak but not scummy IMO.

8 voters, 2 former-voters, 3 interested players, 13 to lynch.
Rack's been pseudolynched already, even without the above players' opinions. Look at the names involved.

[Benmage, The Mini-Librarian, drmyshotgun, Firestarter, Kublai Khan, Pine, Lady Lambdadelta, Candy Corn Vampire], {NihilisticNinja, Psyche}, (mastin2, Maxous, DV).
[Voting]{Voted}(Interested).

Tell me, LLD, does this look like a town-driven wagon to you?

Um, with the exception of Pine and maybe CCV and

Firestarter

, I believe most players on this wagon to be town.

Ninja is town. Psyche is null-town for me right now.

So I mean, it looks pretty town to me.

She's now explained that she went back and reread and found that his [first] post was scummy afterall. Maybe she's being truthful. Maybe she's scum backtracking, idk.

Heavily buddies AH in 502. and guess who wound up dead?

You yourself said this was "inherently scummy". I do agree that doesn't mean she killed him but its extremely suspiocios to me.

I don't know about this Nero wagon. Like I said, I can't tell if his terrible posting is scum or just a genuine dislike for me and based off policy.

I'll go look back through his ISO and interactions with people.

I agree he's just voting me to vote me, but there's a potential it might not be scum.

This is

NOT

a townie response. "Meh, I'm being voted b/c they dislike me. OH WOE IS ME!!!" Is scum

ATEing

and waving the vote off.

[/quote]
Both yours and LLD's "ZOMG, NERO IZ VOTING PEOPLE B/C HE DOESN'T LIKE THEM!!!" just seems so

ATE

and vote discrediting to me. I mean sure, I could see some issue were people likely think I'm scum (I "scumslip" all the time as town; see mafia om the gulf coast) but I'm not

THAT

bad. While I don't expect you or anyone to believe me (and I'm pretty sure no one will) but I'd

NEVER EVER...EVER

vote someone just b/c I dislike them. That would be against a town wincon/breaking a rule.

As it stands, there are about 3 or 4 people on this site that I think are a P.O.S., none are in this game. Though I will admit that I dislike GI but my vote had nothing to do with it. (I already disliked the slot and his opening that Rack and shotty are both scummy didn't seem to town to me.)

[quote="Nero"
Also I found this fairly interesting.

Quite honestly, I make a dozen or more such connections on day 1.

I don't post any of them because in my mind none of them have any relevance until some people die and we have some absolutes to work with.

What makes you so cofident that you'll live to tell? I understand its past day 1 now but you could have died. You could die tonight, the next night etc. I don't see why pesudo-town is willing to with hold information/speculation.

EBWOP: As such, I find it a LITTLE bit suspicious that people try and do that, because there is scum motivation to state these kinds of reads. (See: Chaining Lynches)

but there's also town motivation to do so but you refuse to do so in fear of comming across scummy. Duly Noted.[/quote]
I can see where people might disagree with this one and while I've head this "town should limit the number of conspiracy theories etc. until there's "proof"." But I don't really see the harm. Sure someone might call you an idiot but I don't see how sitting around and masturbating until there's "proof" is UBER AWESOME PROTOWN!!! Post what you believe, what you feel, what you think. Maybe you're right, maybe you're wrong but either way scum will react and it furthers the game along.

Specifically, LLD (and anyone really} doesn't know when she'll die (with a few exceptions, obviously) so IMHO its anti-town to withold thoughts on the game.

[Nero Cain]

those tags came out wrong.

[drmyshotgun]

Don't have much to say really.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

drmyshotgun is NOT confirmed town... what the heck.

What.

Vote: Junpei

[drmyshotgun]

Oh did Junpei say that. That's disappointing.

[StrangerCoug]

I find some elements of Nero Cain's explanation for finding Lady Lambdadelta scummy, especially regarding explaining town reads, sufficient enough to knock him down a slot or two in my scumlist. I still think he's significantly scummier than her, though.

[Nero Cain]

I still think he's significantly scummier than her, though.

Well you should!!! Considering you once said you had a strong LLD town read on her. Has that changed?

[Nero Cain]

and stop posting elsewhere on the site and post here, kdowns.

[Psyche]

kdowns is in this game? <3<3<3

[Nero Cain]

yep. dude replaced Macros. I'm actully starting to think Mastin was on to something with his Jun/Mac/KK scumteam theory.

[DeasVail]

Nero Cain:

What do you think of GreyIce's replace out?

[Nero Cain]

personal feelings aside, I think its null. Maybe you and red can explain what makes it townie.

[Kublai Khan]

yep. dude replaced Macros. I'm actully starting to think Mastin was on to something with his Jun/Mac/KK scumteam theory.

I love how nobody directly accuses me of scum. They just put next to two scummy people and say loudly "Look how scummy those three people are. Collectively, not individually!"

BTW, just to check... What was your red on redFF?

[Kublai Khan]

*read

What's your read on redFF, Nero Cain?

[Nero Cain]

null, though he gets some scumpoints for his crappy vig kill theory. Though I wasn't accusing you of being scum. I was simply stating what his theory was. This is still not the town Jun I'm used to and Kdowns is lurking horribly so perhaps Mastin was on the right track afterall.

[DeasVail]

KK:

I hereby accuse you of being scum. I hope you're feeling better now.

Nero Cain:

I can easily relate to GreyIce's feeling of apathy toward this game as town. I'd expect scum to be much more motivated in this game considering they're part of a team and things had obviously been going quite well for them. I also don't see scum having Red (unless scumbuddies with him) influence their decision to replace out.

[Nero Cain]

So you think scum don't replace out?