TM2012: White Flag Mafia (Game Over)

[Equinox]

Vote Count 1.01

Llamarble (4) - Matias, Amrun, singersigner, Cogito Ergo Sum
Benmage (2) - Johhog, Llamarble
Cogito Ergo Sum (2) - Benmage, Bub Bidderskins
singersigner (1) - Zachrulez

Not Voting (4) - Captain Haddock, Regfan, SocioPath, Thestatusquo

With 13 alive, it's 7 to lynch.

The deadline is Monday, May 21, 2012, at 12:00 AM EDT (UTC-4).

[Zachrulez]

CES' first post comes off as null to me.

Bub's post and response strike me as townish.

I don't find bandwagoning scummy, avoiding bandwagons is something I'd see as more likely to extend RVS.

Then what are your thoughts on Haddock?

Null, vote was cast too early in the game for me to consider it noteworthy.

[Matias]

Wait, really?

Who are your scumreads so far then? singer doesn't count; that logic is null at this point.

[Matias]

There's a reason why I chose Llamarble at the beginning. Scum would likely hop onto a bandwagon being pushed against someone formerly scum in a game like this in an attempt to fit in, assuming Llamarble is town (or possibly even if he's not).

I don't agree with you. I don't think Haddock's "vote" was early at all. It was after 3 votes on Llamarble's bandwagon. Do you agree that, if you don't find bandwagoning scummy, that those that avoid bandwagoning are instead the scummy ones? Or do you feel like that isn't necessarily the case?

Unvote

[Bub Bidderskins]

woo*

Townpoints 'cause she didn't gather all her thoughts together before posting.

He was the fourth on the bandwagon, which is my breaking point for "bandwagon inflation". But more importantly, he made a comment that did not further any discussion at all and was kind of pointless. Other people either just voted or came up with a silly reason for voting. You asked Singer a valid meta-related question. CES just made a silly comment on the game itself that served no purpose.

Townpoints for scumhunting.

CES' first post comes off as null to me.

Bub's post and response strike me as townish.

I don't find bandwagoning scummy, avoiding bandwagons is something I'd see as more likely to extend RVS.

Townpoints because I agree with this. CES plays the early game a pretty similar way most of the time and is tricky to read because of it.

4 votes on a player in a game where 7 is needed for lynch is still fine with me, heck I would even call it pro-town. As to your second point no real comment, but I view it as null.

Townpoints for 'heck' bit.

VOTE: Benmage

Why are you voting for Benmage?

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Who are your scumreads so far then? singer doesn't count; that logic is null at this point.

Hint: only correct answer is Llamarble.

[Benmage]

unvote vote zachrules

Llmarable is my best town read thus far.

Zach how did you know that about Singer?

[Benmage]

Matias... I'm not familiar with White Flag history... assuming llama was scum there? Were you also in the game?

[Zachrulez]

There's a reason why I chose Llamarble at the beginning. Scum would likely hop onto a bandwagon being pushed against someone formerly scum in a game like this in an attempt to fit in, assuming Llamarble is town (or possibly even if he's not).

I don't agree with you. I don't think Haddock's "vote" was early at all. It was after 3 votes on Llamarble's bandwagon. Do you agree that, if you don't find bandwagoning scummy, that those that avoid bandwagoning are instead the scummy ones? Or do you feel like that isn't necessarily the case?

Unvote

It depends on the context. If you want me to be honest, I didn't even notice Haddock until you asked me about him.

[Zachrulez]

unvote vote zachrules

Llmarable is my best town read thus far.

Zach how did you know that about Singer?

I played team mafia last year. I was in that theme game.

[Benmage]

So why'd you choose differently? (You can wait for Singer to answer first if you like)

[Zachrulez]

So why'd you choose differently? (You can wait for Singer to answer first if you like)

Well, I'll point out the fact that she was scum in that game and I was town, so your argument with respect to me doesn't have the same tune as the one I'm making with her, because what I'm noting is that she chose a different type of game having been scum the previous year.

To answer your question though, the reason I took the role I did last year was because on a 4 town slate on our team, that game was the only one that had a power role, and the team considered me to be the least likely player to get nightkilled. That strategy failed because I was killed on night one, but anyway... I almost was slated for white flag. So I'm basically in the game that I would have ended up being in last year all things being equal.

[Matias]

Matias... I'm not familiar with White Flag history... assuming llama was scum there? Were you also in the game?

Correct, I was. Scumteam was mith, DGB, Llamarble.

[Matias]

There's a reason why I chose Llamarble at the beginning. Scum would likely hop onto a bandwagon being pushed against someone formerly scum in a game like this in an attempt to fit in, assuming Llamarble is town (or possibly even if he's not).

I don't agree with you. I don't think Haddock's "vote" was early at all. It was after 3 votes on Llamarble's bandwagon. Do you agree that, if you don't find bandwagoning scummy, that those that avoid bandwagoning are instead the scummy ones? Or do you feel like that isn't necessarily the case?

Unvote

It depends on the context. If you want me to be honest, I didn't even notice Haddock until you asked me about him.

The question of the day for me is whether you came up with the "he posted too early" reasoning before my question about him or after. If it's the former, you're scum. It seems like convoluted reasoning but I'll make that judgment later on in the game.

I'm leaving this be for right now.

Singer hates being scum, going off of meta knowledge of her.

Vote: CES

. Read my earlier post on my bandwagon analysis.

[Zachrulez]

She didn't hate it enough to avoid playing it in Dram's game last year.

Do you think I'd willingly take a scum role pm? (I'd classify my own meta the same way. Perhaps to even more of an extreme.)

[Llamarble]

There's a reason why I chose Llamarble at the beginning. Scum would likely hop onto a bandwagon being pushed against someone formerly scum in a game like this in an attempt to fit in, assuming Llamarble is town (or possibly even if he's not).

Scumpoints for 'I cooked up this purposeful vote in my lab pregame.'
But townpoints for trying to figure out Zach.
And townpoints for this auxiliary introspection stuff:

It seems like convoluted reasoning but I'll make that judgment later on in the game.

Though it could be trying to disengage from something sticky.
And Zach minor hypocrisy was definitely a latchable thing.

I don't think my wagon was terribly informative because it consisted entirely of people who were probably going to vote me anyway because of last year and CES, who was probably going to vote the biggest wagon.

Benmage why did you pick this game?

[Zachrulez]

There's a reason why I chose Llamarble at the beginning. Scum would likely hop onto a bandwagon being pushed against someone formerly scum in a game like this in an attempt to fit in, assuming Llamarble is town (or possibly even if he's not).

Scumpoints for 'I cooked up this purposeful vote in my lab pregame.'

How is that scummy?

[Llamarble]

I've noticed myself and others doing voteplanz more often as scum than as town at the start of a game.
I think scum think more about how they're going to play the early game than town do.

BTW I picked this game because I had a great experience last year and I like the setup.

[Captain Haddock]

I think Matias tried to encourage suspicion of me without comitting himself and he's asked for opinions without giving any.

I don't find bandwagoning scummy, avoiding bandwagons is something I'd see as more likely to extend RVS.

Then what are your thoughts on Haddock?

I don't agree with you. I don't think Haddock's "vote" was early at all. It was after 3 votes on Llamarble's bandwagon. Do you agree that, if you don't find bandwagoning scummy, that those that avoid bandwagoning are instead the scummy ones? Or do you feel like that isn't necessarily the case?

Unvote

This is what I'm talking about. Not "early at all"! "After 3 votes on Llamarble's bandwagon" , like that was anything other than 3 rvs votes on the same person.

Read my earlier post on my bandwagon analysis.

What analysis? I just ISOed you and I can't see any. Notepad?

VOTE: Matias

[Johhog]

Wait, quick question, are you Captain Greypatch?

[Llamarble]

VOTE: Captain Haddock

[Captain Haddock]

Yes.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

VOTE: Captain Haddock

Nope.

[Bub Bidderskins]

Llamarble, why are you voting benmage?

[Johhog]

Do you read Benmage as town?