TM2012 - Closed Normal(Over!)

[GreyICE]

Problem, Grey?

You don't have seven votes on you.

Don't worry, I can fix it.

[Captain Murasa]

@IAAU: UN is pretty townie, DeltaWave's vote is bad considering he hasn't said anything since and Slaxx is town.

@Jason: Quick, who is scum based on the events so far? Also I noticed a waffle in your post which I don't like.

I'll be interested in seeing why Glork voted for UN.


Stop cutting me

[GreyICE]

Why would I cut you? You already cut yourself~

[Glork]

Okay, I'm going to take a moment here and just put down some thoughts on this whole situation.

I can pretty easily see a scenario where HaylenTown, but before I even BEGIN to speculate on those scenarios, I want to double check some stuff with the mod(s) to ensure I'm not breaking any

What I will say is some public knowledge: Every team received either 0, 1, 2, 3, or 4 scum role PMs. It is POSSIBLE that some decisions were made based on the availability of desired alignments, or the lack thereof. The idea that a player took a role in a game because of alignment operates on the inherently flawed assumption that every member of every team was able to willingly choose their own alignment.
PLEASE relay this to your Team's QuickTopics. Mislynches based on bad team-role-distribution assumptions are a fickkng terrible waste of time and resources. Being cognizant of the notion that a team may have had fewer scum PMs available than players wanting scum PMs (or vice versa) will spare bad arguments from flawed assumptions. This will help towns in EVERY game, not just this one, so send the message along.

Ultimately, while I don't mind using Team Mafia mechanics or strategies as a springboard into the non-RVS part of D1, I plan on treating this like a normal game as much as possible and just finding and lynching scums like I would in any non-TM game.


Now... Relevant to the game at hand, I do NOT like how people went after Haylen for defending herself. Murasa backed off, but UN's agreement with "I don't like how much she's defending herself" is complete bullshit. Someone presented a meta argument, and he presented a meta defense. If you want to attack the contents of the defense, do that, but defending oneself from an attack isn't by any means a scum tell. Gonna have to do better than that.

[Slaxx]

I think the point was an over-defense, not a defense in itself.

So Glork, GI, and Iam are all probs town. Good to know.

[UberNinja]

[Slaxx]

The irony of a gaint flashing gif from someone who is accusing someone else of over defending is not lost on me.

unvote

gimme a bit.

[jasonT1981]

@ Capt - Right now I have more town reads than I have scum reads

Town - GrayIce, Haylen would be the top of that list... Glock I think is round about in 3rd place. Slaxx is probably town

As for scum, I agree with Glock on UberNinja. Mostly about the contridiction though. Would like to see more from Captain Murasa I have a gut scum read on... nothing substanal but just a feeling. Seems like she is trying to say the right things and seems forced.

Null so far is DeltaWave, same with Iamausername.

gonna have a quick re-read after my dinner and see if I can come up with something more.

[Captain Murasa]

That post itself felt forced.

I'm keeping my vote on Grey for now, but I can support a Jason wagon and a DeltaWave wagon too.

[jasonT1981]

forced how? you asked a question... i replied. Grey is town. I don't see him as scum.

[jasonT1981]

I know GreyICE has done some crazy shit before, so

I'm not going to use meta to instantly clear him or suspect him

(same goes for anyone else really).

Right now I'm suspicious of GreyICE.
VOTE: GreyICE

If only because of the bullshit meta attack he's pushing on Haylen

.

So, your not going to use Meta to clear or suspect him, but suspect him because he uses Meta.

Sense made... none

[Porochaz]

Murasa is bugging me. Partly because I don't know who it is, but mostly because his opinions are not good.

Page 2 UN started to get scummy, didn't see the Haylen problem and UN hasn't really done anything to alleviate my suspicions.

Glork bugged me a little due to his vote change making his initial UN vote seem pointless and made me feel the Haylen vote wasn't worth much either, but since he changed back, he has stopped worrying me.

Jason stop posting.

[Glork]

Grey, what timeframe exactly did your teammates affirm your opinion of UberNinja?

Also, I never implied that 72 was scummy, or that I thought Haylen was scum. The extent of my discussion of Haylen was a conversation with Chamber yesterday afternoon/evening in which we pretty much wound up on the fence saying "fuck if I know, let's see how this plays out." 72 doesn't bother me a whole ton, but the others are definitively bad, hence "far more egregious."

[hasdgfas]

Haylen(3): UberNinja, GreyICE, DeltaWave
Glork(2): Porochaz, Haylen
Uberninja(2): iamausername, Glork
Captain Murasa(1): PeregrineV
Porochaz(1): CooLDoG
GreyICE(1): Captain Murasa

Not Voting: Mastermind of Sin, jasonT1981, Slaxx

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

[Porochaz]

Ok so I worked out why Murasa was bugging me. There is nothing in them. Opinions without any weight behind them. (and them being fucking absolutes, a pet hate, but particularly this early in the game), a lot of fluff, no analysis, no info. Just making useless statements or in other words, posting lots, saying little.

I also meant to change my vote last post to UN but I am going to

vote Murasa

[GreyICE]

Haylen is SCUM.

We are lynching her today.

I pressure her early because I can read her like a book, and she is today's lynch. Town does not make posts like post #72. Period. The. End.

Glork, my entire team, minus Llamarble chimed in after your vote. About an hour.

Now for the love of God, Glork, sheep me. Haylen is pure, 100% scum.

[PeregrineV]

I'm not going to participate in the whole meta-meta thing. I like the idea of sharing (as much as permissible) our team thoughts from the QT, and will most likely do so. However, it is also an independent game, and how you were some other game has little to no relevance to this game.

@Slaxx-Can you bulk up your IaI supposition?

So Glork, GI, and Iam are all probs town. Good to know.

[Porochaz]

Haylen is SCUM.

We are lynching her today.

I pressure her early because I can read her like a book, and she is today's lynch. Town does not make posts like post #72. Period. The. End.

Glork, my entire team, minus Llamarble chimed in after your vote. About an hour.

Now for the love of God, Glork, sheep me. Haylen is pure, 100% scum.

More likely to vote and push your lynch now.

Thanks.

[Haylen]

Haylen is SCUM.

We are lynching her today.

I pressure her early because I can read her like a book, and she is today's lynch. Town does not make posts like post #72. Period. The. End.

Glork, my entire team, minus Llamarble chimed in after your vote. About an hour.

Now for the love of God, Glork, sheep me. Haylen is pure, 100% scum.

Grey...give me 1 game each where your team have read me correctly. You think I'm scum when I'm not, LLD thinks I am when I'm not, and the experience I've had with MoI is he think's I'm town when I'm not.

You're exaggerating here and you were exaggerating when you said nobody could find more than 2 of my normal games which is quite interesting when 6 of them are listed on my wiki.

Vote GreyICE

[Slaxx]

I'm not going to participate in the whole meta-meta thing. I like the idea of sharing (as much as permissible) our team thoughts from the QT, and will most likely do so. However, it is also an independent game, and how you were some other game has little to no relevance to this game.

@Slaxx-Can you bulk up your IaI supposition?

So Glork, GI, and Iam are all probs town. Good to know.

I like the questions he is asking, mainly. His posts seem to actually lead places. I'm always wary of early game players who ask a lot of questions that don't really lead to anywhere.

Jason, what Murasa says makes sense. Using meta to read someone and reading someone else because they use meta are two different things. It would be like using truth serum on a scientist to help determine their intentions and using the fact a scientist used truth serum on his subject to determine the scientist's intentions. Logical fallacies, don't fall for em.

[Slaxx]

Don't think Grey is scum Haylen.

I like

vote Uberninja

Flashy GIFs are pretty but thats about all they do for me.

[Glork]

Whatever.

Vote: Haylen

Still don't like UberNinja a whole lot.

[Haylen]

If you want to attack the contents of the defense, do that, but defending oneself from an attack isn't by any means a scum tell.

Glork's voting me when he said my defence isn't scummy. Voting patterns inconsistent with opinions -> noted.

Prozac - Murasa is Om of the Nom.

Murasa, why is Uber town? My read on him is currently leaning scum.

I could see a partnership between those two right now.

Also, Grey, you've played with me twice before, both times I was town, both times you tried to lynch me. You cannot read me like an open book.

[Porochaz]

Oh that would explain it.

Glad Glork is flailing. Makes all his posts so far a bit worthless.

[Porochaz]

Yeah, completely unhappy with every vote you have made so far now. Well apart from your random vote, but that doesn't count.