Open 399: Faith Plus 1 (Day Seven)

[Chrimi]

On what grounds?

[Om of the Nom]

Because he stated much earlier in the day that he's much more content with waiting for scum to slip up instead of taking action and making them slip up.

[Darkling_Perhaps]

IioA

Heh, I had to look that up. I meant to post the full set of ISO reads with a final analysis at the bottom originally. I started like 15 hours ago and took a few hours break and came back to a bunch of pages. So I tried again like 9 hours ago, and the same thing happened. So that one above is a little incomplete. Lemme work on fixing that.

Chrimi: His posts have reminded me right off the back of the other game we both died in, we were masons. I thought maybe he was posting light but I realize I've been spaced out because of how quick the thread is moving, I've randomly been thinking more time is moving than it has. I agree with him about the voting block and I understand why he voted Kondi. I think his defense to Kondi's counterattack was very good, he reacted as I expect good Town to. I don't mind his shotty defense math, I don't see it as scummy to spread that information, and he followed the same train of thought I did when I was trying to see how we could get through the night with our Seer still standing. Truthfully I don't feel he did anything that's particularly scummy.

Now in regards to FaithHealers claiming: I do think it's a bad idea. It was gut at first but with the logic above it makes too much sense for our FH to claim. I'm just hoping the scum won't go for Shotty because they'd rather get a confirmed kill than a chance at a power role.


BK201: Good gods, I think we found ourselves a scum here. His Kass argument was literally 'scum if he acts right, scum if he acts wrong', though he tried to argue otherwise. Then he jumps some posts around without good logic before settling on Shotty with the bad logic that is his '

we

' argument. Then his counterarguments are all based on that bad logic. Ugh. I feel like he's just pretending to be a good little townie but not posting any god material. BK, can I get an argument from you not based on bad logic?
On this note VOTE: BK201 to get some pressure on this scum

@Kass Whoa, I like the new direction you're taking with this posting useful information thing. I'm waiting your reads tomorrow.

PEdit: Nom, you're still on me? *shrugs shoulders* Eh, we'll find the real scum one way or another. What I'm asking from you is some good info about who you think scum are and aren't. Perhaps an actual analysis instead of "SoAndSo is scum/town" or "My super psychic gut told me."

I'm exhausted. v_v I'm going to finish off my reads and analysis when I wake up. Have a nice night/morning/afternoon/evening, respective of timezones.

[Om of the Nom]

Sorry, can't explain the gut reads any further. Just learn to trust my gut, it's really awesome.

[Venmar]

Venmar # 297 - Do you actually think that buddying is scum? What do you think of Vijay being so open about his desire to be a part of the "Voting Bloc Team" and buddying up with them?

I don't know about you but i did not call neither shotgun nor Kondi scum in that post. If you go back and re read I did not accuse them of being scum. I did say i did not like it, which is true, but never actually said they were scum. Players can buddy each other and still both be town, as they can at least work together and root out scum together. Anyways, I dont see them BOTH being scum right now mainly because of how shotgun claimed. Which brings me to my other point:

I don't think you should have claimed shotgun.. not much pressure was being put on you other than Trollie and some random scum reads, but no one really tried to pressure you to the point of where you SHOULD claim. I might me mistaken but i don't think you were pushed to that point and i think claiming really did not benefit both you and the town. Whoever the faith healers are, hopefully they protect you, and hopefully only one of them. ( Both would mean 100% failure to save shotgun )

As for the second part of your quote, Morton, i can somewhat answer that. I am not sure. For 1, Vijay could be a eager scum trying to get into a group of townies where he could easily manipulate the day lynch by persuading the other townies into either lynching others or other townies outside the circle. Or, 2. Vijay is a town really trying to help town and root out mafia. A bloc can really benefit town if the players in it think alike and all are some type of town. Although i doubt we have a bloc yet, but his eagerness to join one can go one way or the other. Until we all are sure of his alignment, its hard to say why his desire is so great.

Kondi, could you answer my question ins # 297? I am still wondering what your "results" for your bloc bait.

[kondi2424]

Starting right after my last post:

@Matt: Both shotgun and BK have their own scumminess via intention, and I could definitely see them bussing here. Also, BK switched to me when there was about equal support for both of us. If I flip town (and I will), his whole shotgun argument goes down the drain and he has no reasoning. Which would be awesome, were they buddies.

@vijay: You should vote BK because he is most definitely scum. I've already explained.

@Chrimi: The first reads list was incomplete and was based on minor scumreads as well. The second list was complete.

...and shotgun claims Cop.

I have mixed emotions on this. I want it to be true so that BK can either fuck off or find some other reason to push me, but shotgun is scummy. Plus, the claim w
Had bad timing and was uncalled for. He

did

mention that he didn't want to be lynched anytime soon, though, so I'll go for it. Faith Healer would also be a much more believable claim.

@Chrimi & shotgun: NONONONONONO. A Faith Healer claim is the WORST possible way to handle this. Chrimi gets scumpoints for suggesting it after that was pointed out.

Guys, we need to stay the course and vote BK. I'll vote Chrimi if I have to, but BK is a LOT more likely to flip scum.

Om, Chrimi is right. Darkling is town.

@Venmar: I already answered you, but I'll answer again: It gave me a town read on MattP and scum reads on Trollie, shotgun, and BK. Also, seeing as some people's scumhunting originated from the bloc idea, I'd say it wasn't a bad thing.

[Om of the Nom]

Noooo, Dark is scum. Listen to me kondi.

[kondi2424]

No sir, Dark is town. His most recent post only makes that better.

What's your read on Chrimi?

[Om of the Nom]

Nooooooooooooooooooooo, dark is scuuuuuuuuuummmmmmmmmm.
Chrimi is lolrolefishing. But he's trying too hard to make it look like he isn't.

[Venmar]

@Kondi
- I don't agree with your bloc play, but the more i look at it, it actually got something going rather than the usual " I am going to make a random vote ". It got us talking and thinking, and basically the first few hours of the game going.

I think i might not be making any scum reads yet, so give me a second, i will come read over some people and i will post soon. Maybe in like an hour or so.

[TheTrollie]

And vijay, if somebody fake claims then all a real faith healer has to do is counter claim *shrug*

if there are 2 faith healers and a non faith healer claims no one will know if the person is lying. Both of the other healers will think that its actually a possibility that the person claiming is the other healer, and according to shot's plan, will not counter-claim.

[kondi2424]

Actually, Chrimi can be town for now.

Does BK, morton, and Psyche make much sense as a team?

[Venmar]

Ok, here are my quick reads:

Town

- Venmar

( Im town )

- Morton

( Hasn't given off a single mafia vibe for me. This isn't much but his play seems more townish than scummish. )

- Psyche

( Doesn't strike me as a scummy player. His absence at first seemed like lurking, but he has returned with plenty of decent and good content )

- Mattp

( He has been doing a lot of scum hunting lately and has been pressuring others greatly. Looks very townish to me. Regardless of how hard he is trying to tunnel me.. )

Neutral / Null

- DmrShotgun

( I am very null about shotgun. I can't seem to decide if his claim is legit or not. Until someone can help me decide if his claim can be trusted or not, i will stay null about him. Seeing shotgun wasn't REALLY pressured into claiming, his claim is a bit harder to believe. )

- Kassadin

( Very unreadable for me. I can lean town but he hasn't been posting enough nor giving much content in his posts. This makes him hard to read for ME. So i am neutral with Kass. )

- Om Nom

( Seems very energetic with his posting. Not sure if this is a hyper mafia or just a energetic personality. Semi-tunneling into Dark also seems kind of weary. But none of this really makes me suspicious enough of him to list him as mafia. So i am null here.. )

- Vijay

( Seems to be trying to scum hunt some people. Though i don't agree with some things, his posts are generally well spirited and fairly pro-town. However i am not sure if i can list him as a Townie just yet, nor mafia. )

Possible Mafia or Scum

- Darkling

( His post about saying lurkers are scummy so early in the game just set off plenty of alarms in my head. Compared with my post about Psyche, his is much worse. I only tried to pressure Psyche into talking, Dark outright said he was scummy for lurking. )

- BK-201

( I cant decide, but he seems to ignore or forget about questions aimed at him and it kind of makes him look like a scum trying to avoid further suspicion. I cant really say though, but out of all others BK seems to be more scummier than those below and most of the above. Further more, his justification for why Kondi could be a bad town is very insulting. I don't think current behavior should be based off of play records. Its easy for others to say your a bad town simply for not playing the game before. Im calling you out scummy just for that. However, in my previous off site game BK played somewhat well as a cop, but from my experience BK does not lie unless he is scum. For the time being, sticking with a possible scum read. )

Limbo ( Not sure if Mafia or Townie )

- Kondi

( You know, i am leaning scum just for the bloc at the beginning of the game, but at the same time i kind of believe him that it could have been a bait trying to arouse reactions from others. His further activity in this game has been promising, so i doubt he is mafia because making that bloc would have been a fairly dumb mafia move. Seeing as Kondi doesn't strike me as a bad player, i doubt that it was scum mistake. )

- Trollie

( His large disapproval of the Voting Bloc is very edgy for me. I think he could be a scum trying to prevent us townies from forming a bloc, which could actually help us get scum. Naturally, i feel like mafia members would try and prevent blocs to stop the town from organizing themselves to beat the mafia. Then again his suspicions for a bloc seem somewhat solid, as mafia members sneaking into blocs is always a possibility. I have a very un decided opinion on Trollie. )

- Chrimi

( In post 480, he exactly quotes " Neither of you claim,

we don't want scum knowing who another of my faith healer is

." Tell me what you guys think of what he said here. He could be saying he is a faith healer or just talking to the town in general. Him asking for the faith healer(s) is kind of a scum move in my opinion, as at this point the faith healers definitely should not claim ANYTHING regarding their role. This, coupled with my weird gut feeling on Chrimi and what others have said, i cannot decide if he is Town or Maf. )

Well there's my reads on people. Nothing is set in stone, and i am more than happy to answer any questions aimed at me.

[kondi2424]

Just to be clear - I feel almost positive that Kassadin, OmNom, vijay, Venmar, and Darkling are all town. Those five are just town. MattP, shotgun, and Trollie are lesser town reads, but I still feel good about them. BK is scum, and Chrimi, morton, and Psyche are null reads.

[Venmar]

Kondi, this is a not a game ralated question.

In your signature, you have a line from a game. How did you win on Day 2? Im am interested how that happened.

[kondi2424]

It was a Marathon game, Lucid Dreamers. If you don't know, Lucid Dreamers is mafia where you can choose any night action you want. Well, anyway, I chose to turn myself into a Jester on N1, and got myself lynched on D2.

[Venmar]

Well.. that is just hilarious. I don't think anyone in the game expected a jester. Seeing as Jester is really uncommon, and how you thought outside the box.

Back to the game.

[kondi2424]

Yeah

So anyway, with your reads on Psyche and morton, are you giving them town status because they are contributing well?

[kondi2424]

Oh god I'm stupid.

@vijay, Venmar, OmNom, & Darkling: Do you all feel good enough about each other to form an actual voting bloc?

[kondi2424]

Take the fact that I'm sure all of you are town into consideration when answering that.

Just make a list of all of the people I listed above you are okay with bloc-ing with.

[Venmar]

Technically, yes.

Both of them seem to be trying to contribute well, and as far as i can see i don't see much or any scum play in their posts. I feel Psyche to be more town than Morton, but both seem townish to me. I don't personally see them being scummy, can you explain to me why they are suspicious?
- Morton seems to keep asking questions and directing arguments towards others, which kind of tells me he is trying to scum hunt. In my eyes this is a very towny thing to do.
- Psyche is more harder to crack for me, but he seems to contributing considering his partial absence for the most part of D1.

PEdit: I am suspicious of Darkling, but i can form a bloc with Vijay and Omnom.

[kondi2424]

Psyche and morton aren't necessarily

scum

reads, but they are two of the four people I don't have any kind of

town

read on, which is bad.

I know Psyche is a good player, and scumhunting for him is null. I don't know about morton.

@Psyche & morton: Can I have a link to a scumgame of yours, particularly a "normal" one?

And I don't think OmNom will go for Darkling in the bloc either.

Does me-you-OmNom-vijay sound good?

[Venmar]

Yeah, i can do that.

[TheTrollie]

To explain about shotty: You say he changed his story about the voting block. I see it as he revealed information. At first before he knew it was fake he said it would help town. After he found out it was fake he said he assumed it was made to help town by lynching kass. I don't see any conflicting information there.

thank you. this is the first time anyone has given an alternate reason for his behavior...

not sure if shot is telling the truth but seems likely…not worth killing the cop if he is so I’ll drop it for now (idk his play style, but role claiming at this point seems pretty silly. I know he apologized, but, for people who have played with him before: is that role claim out of character?)

Reads

Town:

Om

Vij

MattP

leaning town

Kondi

– I see a lot of scumhunting, he’s been going after multiple people and has follow-up questions to a lot of people’s interactions.

Kass

– I don’t know anthing about him, but you guys have made good points for why he’s probably town in this game due to the way he is posting compared to how he usually posts.

Null

Shot

– claim of dr. moves him to null. I still don’t like how aggressive he was against me when he wasn’t doing anything to answer my questions about him.

Psyche

Dark

Venmar

– his posts are very wishy washy but at the same time he is generally encouraging scum-hunting. I just wish he encouraged it less and did it more. Also his response to Matt’s attack is very weird—he thinks matt is talking about psyche. He’s probably fine but I want to keep watching him.

leaning scum

Morton

– bad vibe…he attacks me for not scum hunting based on a post that was clearly me being a smart-ass
Chrimi – the role fishing was scummy, but he was trying to deal with a pretty tough situation (finding a way to save our potential cop) so I’m not ready to pull the trigger on this yet.

Scum

BK

– spends a lot of the game trying to get us off the scumhunting path and onto Kass. After claiming he will replace out if we do not lynch kass he changes his vote to shot because of a scumslip. He is very much against anyone else voting for someone other than kass if they feel someone is scummy, however.


On another note I am sorry for flipping you off Om, that was wrong of me. However, I was trying, in my own ass-holish way, to get you and others to focus more on THIS game and less on the out-of-game discussion. Didn’t mean to piss you off.

[TheTrollie]

oh...and also:

UNVOTE: drmyshotgun