Open 399: Faith Plus 1 (Day Seven)


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Post Post #575 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 8:09 am

Post by kondi2424 »

I've already dropped it.

We need a Kassadin in here.

@Kassadin: Do you counterclaim Cop?


PEdit: What the hell are you talking about? I've got six VERY strong townreads, shotgun, and myself. That leaves you, BK, Chrimi, morton, and Trollie. Three scum, so 3/5 chance of you being scum.

Can you explain what I've done that's scummy?
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Also, kondi may not be scum anymore. I'll check with my die.
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Post Post #576 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 8:10 am

Post by BK201 »

My read on mort is/was scummy because he made like 2 posts, voted and ran. His tone just seemed kinda fake too.
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Post Post #577 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 8:13 am

Post by MattP »

Going out on a date with Trollie so that he can buy me food in an attempt to woo me into bed. Will be back later to respond to the BK argument.
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Post Post #578 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 8:14 am

Post by Darkling_Perhaps »

@BK Answer any questions, you say? Alrighty then, while I'm working on finishing off my ISO's, lemme ask you this. Who are the scum and who are town? You haven't impressed me that you're actually looking for scum, so look for them.
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Post Post #579 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 8:17 am

Post by BK201 »

Town

BK201
drmyshotgun
vijay2vasandani
Psyche
MattP

Town/Null

Darkling_Perhaps
Venmar

Null

kondi2424
Kassadin
Chrimi
TheTrollie

Scum

mortontfrh
Om of the Nom

P-Edit: Yeah I wasn't really scumhunting once I found that major slip, I'd still be on that if drm didn't claim cop.
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Post Post #580 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 8:19 am

Post by Psyche »

Also, with my strategy, we have a 50% chance of confirming me as town tonight if the scumkill fails. It'll either be because I was targetted by scum or because shotgun was targetted as scum and a protect was a success.

By D2, we'll have 3 confirmed townies (or two confirmed townies + confirmed scum) and no dead townies, including a surviving cop. It's a more ambitious hope than other strategies can provide. I understand that it is only reasonable from the perspective that I am town, but if I can successfully prove to you (or, specifically, the faith healer) that I am town, then there is no problem with this strategy and we'll have achieved the optimum.

@Kondi: Oh, I thought it was because of the 3 scum: 2 Faith healer odds. Kk.
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Post Post #581 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 8:36 am

Post by Psyche »

Sigh. Going through my notes, I have to admit that kondi is no longer my strongest scum read and that I've been unintelligently tunneling her. Him. Goddamn it, him. Sorry, your user reminds me of Condoleezza Rice.

The reasons I find him scummy include a consistent gut reaction to his posts. I don't think his early posts were a gambit as much as I think they were a disingenuous/scummy attempt to show earlygame initiative. It was much too affected and grandiose for my taste.

"gambit" suggests that he risked something for some bigger gain later, which isn't a good description of what I feel occurred.

His Chrimi vote clearly served not one purpose except to show that his earlygame tactic wasn't useless. All of her earlygame posts have this tone — "Silly human! I am above you and all my activities are above yours! How dumb of you to think otherwise!" — that I usually see in scum.

kondi2424 wrote:The thing is, Kassadin is (usually) the easiest person to read, ever. In the games I'm with him in when he's town, I can tell within posts. If he's scum, I usually get null vibes from him.

OmNom is town.


Reads as scum abusing his access to knowledge.
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Post Post #582 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 9:14 am

Post by kondi2424 »

So, who is your strongest scumread, and why aren't you voting them?

Also, what's your personal read of BK?
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Also, kondi may not be scum anymore. I'll check with my die.
" - vijay2vasandani

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Post Post #583 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 9:39 am

Post by Psyche »

kondi2424 wrote:So, who is your strongest scumread, and why aren't you voting them?

Also, what's your personal read of BK?


There's absolutely no apparent reason to think BK is scum.

I'm not changing my vote until I post a case on my strongest read, morton so that it is justified. Until then, I'm fine keeping my vite on a less strong scumread.
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Post Post #584 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 9:46 am

Post by kondi2424 »

Fair enough. Interested in your morton case, because I don't have a town read on him.
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He's saying your an idiot redff
" - theamatuer

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Also, kondi may not be scum anymore. I'll check with my die.
" - vijay2vasandani

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Post Post #585 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 10:04 am

Post by MattP »

Darkling_Perhaps wrote:
On BK:
BK201 wrote:
drmyshotgun wrote:
Chrimi wrote:And of course, you left me out, which means that you don't have all of the town in there.

Yes,
we
left him out....I find Chrimi the most fun player to be in a game with so far.
Explain this.

Meanwhile, VOTE: Kassadin
BK201 wrote:actually this is much better
UNVOTE:
VOTE: Mortontfrh
BK201 wrote:your record is bad as town. I'm not taking advice on how to play town from you, not when Kass is involved anyways.
An unexplained read and bad logic.
BK201 wrote:although kondi said he was just reaction testing, I should clarify that dmr seems to support it, and vjay blatantly does. anyways.
BK201 wrote:P-Edit: I have experience with Venmar off-site as I said. This is his his normal, and at least he tries unlike Kass. Also, I have many game's experience off-site. Thirdly, you're scum if dmr is.
More bad logic, basing Kondi as scum off of his terribly bad '
we
' argument.
That's not all I was referring to but it sums up his behavior in a few quotes

An unexplained read isn't a scumtell.

The only reason an unexplained reads can be scumtells is if they are used for the sake of seeming like you're scumhunting and have reads. That vote on Morton does not read that way, it reads, "it's time to put pressure on Morton." It does not at all look like an appeal to town.

BK's town read on venmar is not scummy, it's just flawed. It would be scum if he seemed scum with more knowledge than us about who was town and was using it to seem town, but he does have a seemingly legitimate point for his read from his standpoint.

Nothing BK has done is very scummy or very towny. He's just null and this wagon on him is stupid with the reasons suggested.

Om, yes, you should stick to your gut, but you should also be giving logical reasons for your gut read. Also, yes, you shouldn't ALWAYS doubt your gut but there are times when it's good to admit you're wrong, otherwise you become antitown.

Psyche is town for his admittance on the kondi situation.

Kondi, you're being useless. You keep insisting that you use intentions to determine reads, but that's not town motivated. Town cannot use your reads based on intentions to their favor because we don't derive anything from you posting a read list and then saying, "I can't explain my reads logically, it's just an intention thing". You posting your reads will not sway town to listen to you, and that makes you either scum trying to seem like you're scumhunting or useless town.

I want to do a read of morton because I've been overlooking him, and I will post it later tonight.
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Post Post #586 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 10:09 am

Post by kondi2424 »

Fine, I'll try to find examples. Most people never listen to those, though, because they think they're easily faked when they're not.
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He's saying your an idiot redff
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Also, kondi may not be scum anymore. I'll check with my die.
" - vijay2vasandani

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Post Post #587 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 10:56 am

Post by Kassadin »

No i am not cop
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Post Post #588 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 11:00 am

Post by MattP »

Who asked Kassadin if he was cop? I can't find it.
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Post Post #589 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 11:01 am

Post by MattP »

EBWOP: Never mind, found it.
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Post Post #590 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 11:18 am

Post by kondi2424 »

REASONS MY INTENTION READS ARE TOWN


OmNom:


kondi2424 wrote:
BK201 wrote:Why would you even vote me? I said I will REPLACE OUT if he isn't PL'd.


Because you did it in a scummy manner. Plus, if he's doing alright as you said he was, what need is there for a PL?

Kassadin is town. We're not lynching him. I guarantee one scum in my crowd who keeps pushing it.



kondi2424 wrote:
BK201 wrote:Why would you even vote me? I said I will REPLACE OUT if he isn't PL'd.


Because you did it in a scummy manner. Plus, if he's doing alright as you said he was, what need is there for a PL?

Kassadin is town. We're not lynching him. I guarantee one scum in my crowd who keeps pushing it.


Om of the Nom wrote:I still want him PL'ed.
I did blacklist him for a reason you know.


OmNom WOULD NOT continue pushing the Kassadin PL after I called him definite town if he were scum.

vijay:


kondi2424 wrote:Vijay pushed for [the voting bloc] when EVERYONE disagreed with it. Dont think he'd touch that area as scum. He's probably town.


Kassadin:


kondi2424 wrote:I just skimmed through the posts made since last night. Kass is 99% town. As scum, he would not have admitted to skimming the thread.


Venmar:
the fact that he's pretty new makes him an easier read. He didn't bandwagon on me with the bloc thing and gave a different opinion on it, plus the general disagreeing with the crowd over it.

Darkling:
He found (good) reasons that I could be town or scum due to the bait, when he could easily slip one way or the other as scum. It's like fencesitting, but in a towny way because it's unnecessary. He also didn't really push anyone until later, when there was plenty of opportunity to before.

MattP:
Townslipped, already explained.

Good enough?
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He's saying your an idiot redff
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Also, kondi may not be scum anymore. I'll check with my die.
" - vijay2vasandani

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Post Post #591 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 11:30 am

Post by MattP »

Better. I think your points on Om and Vijay are valid ones.

Venmar didn't give a different opinion of the bloc idea, not did he disagree with town. He initially called you scum for it in #37, as I previously pointed out, but he didn't vote you, showing that he was fencesitting and trying to get people to vote for you without getting his hands dirty. I really find his #37 scummy for, "Making a random list of most likely random people is just kind of weird to me, as some of those could be your scum buddies." Also, I REALLY believe with all my heart that succinctness is a towntell and overexplaining is a scumtell. Little add-ons in his posts, like "Just saying, I don't like it" read newb scum not knowing when to shut up.

Also, apparently he is not a newb and has actually played with BK off-site. All of your points on Venmar have been refuted and you should reevaluate your read on him.

I also, disagree with your point on Darkling, I don't think that that's a towntell. It could be that a scum is already on your wagon and he is just not committing to distance himself from his scumbuddy. It could be that he is trying to actively look like he is scumhunting. There are many scummy reasons he can be fencesitting and it is not at all a towntell.
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Post Post #592 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 11:32 am

Post by MattP »

@Mod: I see you there. I am begging you to put up a vote count. We're like 20 pages in and we need one. Thank you.
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Post Post #593 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 11:35 am

Post by funkybike1 »

@MattP: No votes have changed since my last VC.
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Post Post #594 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 11:35 am

Post by MattP »

I did not see that. I am soz, you may lick me as compensation for my error.
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Post Post #595 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 11:39 am

Post by BK201 »

I unvoted.
@matt, venmar has played 1 game off site, this is his 2nd game of mafia period.
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Post Post #596 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 11:39 am

Post by MattP »

BK201 wrote:I unvoted.
@matt, venmar has played 1 game off site, this is his 2nd game of mafia period.

Whatever, I stick to my read on him. He still doesn't get a free ride for being a newb.
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Post Post #597 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 11:40 am

Post by kondi2424 »

Yeah, the Venmar read sucked. I remembered finding a REALLY good reason for why he was town, and couldn't find it again when you asked me to explain. -_-

I stand by my read of Darkling, however. I think he looks genuine.

What about Kassadin?
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He's saying your an idiot redff
" - theamatuer

"
Also, kondi may not be scum anymore. I'll check with my die.
" - vijay2vasandani

Town: 10-22
Scum: 11-3
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Post Post #598 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 11:41 am

Post by MattP »

I would still agree to a Kass PL today. I think he is useless and I know he just endgamed in another open and was useless there. Had there been someone else in his slot the outcome may have been different. I want him lynched or replaced.
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Post Post #599 (ISO) » Sat May 12, 2012 11:41 am

Post by BK201 »

Kassadin is unreadable.
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