Heroes of Comedy Game Over - He who laughs last!

[Korlash]

So, if this is accurate, we all know this, why spend 256 words to say it?
Kills don't reflect an SK, which would be rare anyway, so why bring it up?
And these are questions to town-Korlash. We already know why scum-Korlash would do all this.

1) because I was explaining my thinking to yates which means going step by step. Also I like to talk, that's why I play. Why not spend 256 words to say it?
2) I account for any and all possibilities. this is why I'm so good at speculation and plans and shit because I think about things and account for them. And what do you mean by 'kills don't reflect an SK'? I can think of about four possible meanings you could have for this statement and I can and will argue against you for all of them.
3) Well, there isn't a scum Korlash here so I obviously assumed these were for me. Why would scum Korlash do all of this? Why would you feel the need to add this pointless... what I can only describe as 'poorly tossed out jab'?

[PeregrineV]

------------AT THIS POINT I HAVE READ UP TO POST #230. I HAVE TWO REALLY STRONG SCUMREADS THAT ARE ALIVE, AND SEVERAL TOWNREADS. THIS IS MORE THAN WORTH POSTING. ENGAGE TUNNELMODE--------------

SCUM -
[with any association tells]

Korlash scumscumscumscum [unlikely to be scum with Vijay]
knox scumscumscum
PeregrineV scum
Pizzadudes7 scum?
Jester BE USEFUL
pappumsrat post less fluff please. [town?]
Yates town
Vijay town
iStark town


So Fate-town is dead and most of the remaining town are useless [everyone except Yates] or not good enough to win us this game [Yates]. Yay.

I will summarize your post too.
Fake summary that's not relevant to current discussion of "Is Korlash scum? How real was V2V vig claim?"

Korlash scumscumscumscum [unlikely to be scum with Vijay]
knox scumscumscum
PeregrineV scum
Pizzadudes7 scum?
Jester BE USEFUL
pappumsrat post less fluff please. [town?]
Yates town
Vijay town
iStark town

So your top two scum reads are the current largest wagon, people currently voting you, and another player who just replaced in (like yourself).
You're telling Tammy to be useful, and have Mini-Lib, Yates, and Papums as town. and V2V not only town, but unlikely to be scum with Korlash.

Does that sum it up?

[PeregrineV]

So, if this is accurate, we all know this, why spend 256 words to say it?
Kills don't reflect an SK, which would be rare anyway, so why bring it up?
And these are questions to town-Korlash. We already know why scum-Korlash would do all this.

1) because I was explaining my thinking to yates which means going step by step. Also I like to talk, that's why I play. Why not spend 256 words to say it?
2) I account for any and all possibilities. this is why I'm so good at speculation and plans and shit because I think about things and account for them. And what do you mean by 'kills don't reflect an SK'? I can think of about four possible meanings you could have for this statement and I can and will argue against you for all of them.
3) Well, there isn't a scum Korlash here so I obviously assumed these were for me. Why would scum Korlash do all of this? Why would you feel the need to add this pointless... what I can only describe as 'poorly tossed out jab'?

1. At a second a word for setup speculation in themed mini, that's 4 minutes to read what should take 20 seconds to read. Some posts are good for that. This would not be.
2. Given the wide range of possibilities, it seems more like you want to draw attention off of the standard 10:3 setup in order to provide room for your scumbuddies to hide.
3. See number 2. It's not pointless, I'm trying to point out why you come across as scummy by using this post as an example.

[Korlash]

1. At a second a word for setup speculation in themed mini, that's 4 minutes to read what should take 20 seconds to read. Some posts are good for that. This would not be.

No no no no no... If you think 'setup' speculation should only take a short fucking time to explain then you clearly don't understand how it works. I cannot speculate on something and just 'give you the quick results' that's fucking stupid. Either you don't trust me because you can't see my work, or you do trust me and you are a sheep willing to believe what 'could' (possibly) be a lie. (this is an overall view, not this game specifically. I'm not saying I'm lying, I'm saying you can't trust people who don't show you their work because THEY could be... savy? ok...)

Speculation boils down to math, and in math class if you put the right answer down but don't show your work, you fail. I do speculation so others look at it and come to their own conclusions. If I don't show my work, they can't do that. Your argument that speculation should be quick is false and belittles the entire point of speculating.

2. Given the wide range of possibilities, it seems more like you want to draw attention off of the standard 10:3 setup in order to provide room for your scumbuddies to hide.
3. See number 2. It's not pointless, I'm trying to point out why you come across as scummy by using this post as an example.

2. How? I said (first and foremost) I was ignoring the presence of a SK. So my assumption is a 3:10 setup. There is no room to hide. The Sk possibility is only possible ONCE NEW INFORMATION IS ATTAINED. Hence the parenthesis. Did you actually read my post? The part where I quite clearly said "I am ignoring the possibility of an SK"? How would i be giving anybody any room to hide by doing that?

3. I play this way all the time. I know why I come across as scummy, I know I talk to much, I don't care. I'd rather say 500 words to get across 50 than to, instead, only say 5. I actually prefer to come across as scummy because it reduces the chance I'm nightkilled AND lets me play the game better. (I read people better when they attack me) this style of play works for me, works towards which ever win con I have at any given time, and makes the game more fun for me. you won't be able to change the way I play, and you're certainly not the first one to bring this up.

Short of the SK thing, did you have a point with the rest of this? It all seems like a discussion of my playstyle, not of my actual possible alignment...

[HezLucky]

I will summarize your post too.
Fake summary that's not relevant to current discussion of "Is Korlash scum? How real was V2V vig claim?"

You slipped. To be expected for a scum.

I haven't read past where I mentioned, and this is the first I'm hearing of any sort of vig claim.

You were just looking for an excuse to attack me. You die next.

[Korlash]

Don't use your 'I've only read so far' as an excuse if you're forming lines for people to die. Either read up and then start pointing out who is scum and who isn't. Or start calling for people to die and take the heat for making careless decisions without actually reading the thread.

[Yates]

I haven't read past where I mentioned, and this is the first I'm hearing of any sort of vig claim.

You say *I* can't help Town win this game then drop that statement like it isn't a big deal?? As the poet/philosopher Ice Cube stated so eloquently, "You better check yo self before you wreck yo self."

Read the rest of the thread then come back and start making accusations/value judgements. That statement right there just negated any potential value to your contributions thus far.

[Korlash]

Oh... He meant to say you couldn't help the town? I totally read it as him saying you're the only one who could... Wow... I need to work on my reading skills it seems...

[PeregrineV]

I will summarize your post too.
Fake summary that's not relevant to current discussion of "Is Korlash scum? How real was V2V vig claim?"

You slipped. To be expected for a scum.

I haven't read past where I mentioned, and this is the first I'm hearing of any sort of vig claim.

You were just looking for an excuse to attack me. You die next.

My attack of you was based on drmyshotgun. You just came in and did a post-by-post and game a summary of up to page 10. How does that translate to something useful here and now?
What it does do, as scum, is provide a reason why you never caught up if Korlash gets's hammered. You didn't even vo-

Korlash 4 - pappums rat, The Mini-Librarian,Tammy, splitfarvle
vijay2vansandani 3 - Korlash,HezLucky, Yates
HezLucky 2 - PereV,Scott Brosius,
Yates 1 - vijay2vansandani,

{looks at vote count}

Vijay is town. That counterwagon is probably based on crap. Korlash, my uber scum read, is on it. The person who was in this slot before me is on it, and Yates, who is town but bad at this.

Unvote, Vote: Korlash

You're at L-1.

My bad. You are on page 10, and based on those 10 pages on not the remaining 23, you voted Korlash.

So, yes, drmyshotgun was scummy for his posts, but you have taken up the mantle and are scummy all on your own.

[PeregrineV]

I actually prefer to come across as scummy because it reduces the chance I'm nightkilled AND lets me play the game better. (I read people better when they attack me) this style of play works for me, works towards which ever win con I have at any given time, and makes the game more fun for me. you won't be able to change the way I play, and you're certainly not the first one to bring this up.

Not trying to, but don't be suprised/hurt/etc. if you get lynched for being scummy when you are purposefully being scummy.

As to setup speculation at this point, there is no point. We have one VT, one goon, and one vig flip. Should something non-standard turn up, setup speculation might be useful.

Love to see a drmyshotgun/HezLucky analysis from you...

[The Mini-Librarian]

Split's #757 makes me twinge. My first instinct is to call it a bus.

I kinda like Hez so far but would love it if he at least read to the end of day 1 at least.

Peregrine has some decent points about Hez, but this is not a good lynch for today. We worry about split/hez tomorrow, Korlash for today. (We have T-shirts. Only $22.99 plus shipping and handling.)

*obligatory scowl towards Tammy for unvoting*

@Korlash: I'm a little confused why you did that analysis. It doesn't really seem that mafia would be a game where purely mechanical ways of scumhunting will work. Have you done this in other games and with any success?

[HezLucky]

I haven't read past where I mentioned, and this is the first I'm hearing of any sort of vig claim.

You say *I* can't help Town win this game then drop that statement like it isn't a big deal?? As the poet/philosopher Ice Cube stated so eloquently, "You better check yo self before you wreck yo self."

Read the rest of the thread then come back and start making accusations/value judgements. That statement right there just negated any potential value to your contributions thus far.

Are you stupid? What part of "these people scream maf to me and have dropped multiple scumtells early in the game?" does not make sense to you?

I have reads on nearly every person in the game after 10 pages. Some of them are extremely strong. Excuse me if I choose to be fucking useful and push on a mafia.

[Yates]

@Korlash: I'm a little confused why you did that analysis. It doesn't really seem that mafia would be a game where purely mechanical ways of scumhunting will work. Have you done this in other games and with any success?

Moreover, wouldn't the fact that you disagree with the outcome point to the fact that it's based on "Krap Logick?" I could show you several variables that are missing from your equation but I'll just leave it at that. Also, I notice you didn't assign yourself any points. Wouldn't it make sense to assign yourself points as a baseline/control?

Overall, that post was a D-. Needs improvement.


PE - Am *I* stupid, Hez? One of us has voted without reading through the entire thread [hint: it's you]. How "useful" do you think your vote is if you don't know what has happened right up until the moment of your vote? I don't even care that you are pushing on Korlash but at least do it with all the facts. Right now you sound like a silly child. Grow up, do your homework, THEN vote based on ALL of the evidence. If you can't do that, you are useless.

[HezLucky]

PE - Am *I* stupid, Hez? One of us has voted without reading through the entire thread [hint: it's you]. How "useful" do you think your vote is if you don't know what has happened right up until the moment of your vote? I don't even care that you are pushing on Korlash but at least do it with all the facts. Right now you sound like a silly child. Grow up, do your homework, THEN vote based on ALL of the evidence. If you can't do that, you are useless.

Far from useless. Strong scumreads don't go away. This shouldn't be hard to understand

Although I do like how you aren't trying to twist my words around and pre-plan an attack on me like Peregrine-scum has.

[Korlash]

@Korlash: I'm a little confused why you did that analysis. It doesn't really seem that mafia would be a game where purely mechanical ways of scumhunting will work. Have you done this in other games and with any success?

You should play with DGB's scumputer or Adel's diagrams someday then.

As far as 'purely mechcanical ways of scumhunting' it isn't. This is one post out of... how many have I made? Forty-thousand? It's the mechanical side, but it isn't everything I do. Nor do I base my entire way of thinking on the 'mechanical side'.

In addition, I couple my vote analysis with ISO, which are not a mechanical form of scum hunting, but an analytical one. Thus, I have two separate forms of scum hunting done at once. I don't get how you missed this.

I can only remember two town games where I've done vote analysis (I only started recently and two of those games as town I died night one so I never had time). In village for 13 I replaced in at MYLO as town (day 5, two dead scum) and after taking three hours to analyze voting patterns I correctly nailed the last scum (who everyone else was calling the most likely town out of the four of us remaining). So in this instance not only did my mechanical analysis work, it worked while everyone else's ways of thinking failed. (Obviously, I had a lot more information in that game than I do in this one so my results are obviously more wider here.)

In a newbie game a while ago we lynched the scum day one and I did a vote analysis day three. I didn't catch the scum because he was a lurker and thus avoided being caught by the analysis. (this is why Tammy and Scott are still in the 'running' despite failing to show up in the analysis)

I've also used it as scum, but I was bullshitting those times. It does illustrate that these results can be manipulated, but of course scum can do that with anything. (This is why I try and go step by step so people can see how I arrived where I did and why I thought the way I did.)

Moreover, wouldn't the fact that you disagree with the outcome point to the fact that it's based on "Krap Logick?" I could show you several variables that are missing from your equation but I'll just leave it at that. Also, I notice you didn't assign yourself any points. Wouldn't it make sense to assign yourself points as a baseline/control?

No. You can't have a control in this type of thing. Otherwise I would have to assign points to MoI and Fate as well. I know my alignment, and I know theirs. This is treated more as a... sophisticated PoE than a fool proof system. Hence why ISO and stuff are coupled with it.

And it's not based on 'krap logick'. My interpretation of it may be flawed in some way (which you are welcome to point out) but people have been 'analyzing votes and wagons' since the start of this great sport. hell, Librarian posted a list of all the vote counts earlier in the day didn't he? Why would he do that unless he planned on looking at it and trying to interpret what it means.

You can say you think my conclusions are wrong, but the actual act of analyzing votes is not crap.

[Korlash]

Not trying to, but don't be suprised/hurt/etc. if you get lynched for being scummy when you are purposefully being scummy.

I never am. I just try to make sure to take scum down with me.

As to setup speculation at this point, there is no point. We have one VT, one goon, and one vig flip. Should something non-standard turn up, setup speculation might be useful.

There is always a point to it mate. My point is that I can only analyze votes if I assume a standard setup distribution. Thus, setup speculation allows me to analyze votes. It's not a huge in your face point I admit. but it's important to me, hence why i do it.

Love to see a drmyshotgun/HezLucky analysis from you...

Oh it'll come. He might not be top of my list but he's not bottom either.

Peregrine has some decent points about Hez, but this is not a good lynch for today. We worry about split/hez tomorrow, Korlash for today. (We have T-shirts. Only $22.99 plus shipping and handling.)

You do know you have yet to actually show me a case as to why I'm scum right. Neither has anyone else on my wagon. You should hold comments like this until after you at least illistrate WHY I should be lynched. 'Kay, thanks, bye!

I have reads on nearly every person in the game after 10 pages. Some of them are extremely strong. Excuse me if I choose to be fucking useful and push on a mafia.

It's not being useful, it's being a detrament. You are pushing shit based on feelings that the rest of us probably already discussed in the pages you haven't read yet. So in theory, you probably have a number of reads based on shit that has already been explained and accounted for. hell, you've pushed me as scum because the V2V case is 'probably' crap yet you didn't even know he fakeclaimed vig... The only 'stupid' one here is you.

Overall, that post was a D-. Needs improvement.

Come on teach, it deserves at least a C! I stayed in the lines and my spelling was borderline acceptable! HAVE A HEART!

Far from useless. Strong scumreads don't go away. This shouldn't be hard to understand

Then you don't know how to play this game. "reads" regardless of strength or type should mold with any newly acquired information you gather. The first 10 pages are important to your reads, but so are the next 10, and the next 10, and so on. You can't have accurate reads while only looking at a third of the game mate.

Although I do like how you aren't trying to twist my words around and pre-plan an attack on me like Peregrine-scum has.

Oh wait, I get it... "Everyone" is scum and "everything" they do has scum motivation. Ok, I see what you're doing now. Just keep killing people until you eventually hit the scum, right? great plan...

[jasonT1981]

Very short Mod emergency V/LA. Last night I felt a drip of water on my head and looked up to see the ceiling cracked. Went into attic to see a pipe had burst. So a bit off house maintance that needs urgently done. I am very sorry, I am going to speak to my back up mod about her taking over VoteCounts till I am back.. I am declaring this site wide in all my games. So this is a boiler plate message. I am hoping to be back ASAP possibly as early as tomorrow evening depending on how long the plumbing takes.

[HezLucky]

Then you don't know how to play this game. "reads" regardless of strength or type should mold with any newly acquired information you gather. The first 10 pages are important to your reads, but so are the next 10, and the next 10, and so on. You can't have accurate reads while only looking at a third of the game mate.

White-Knighting game theory generalizing scum.

Can't wait until you're dead.

Although I do like how you aren't trying to twist my words around and pre-plan an attack on me like Peregrine-scum has.

Oh wait, I get it... "Everyone" is scum and "everything" they do has scum motivation. Ok, I see what you're doing now. Just keep killing people until you eventually hit the scum, right? great plan...

I'm hitting scum in my first shot.

[Korlash]

White-Knighting game theory generalizing scum.

Can't wait until you're dead.

Normally might make sense, but seeing how much I put into speculation it only make sense I delve into game theory. Add in how much I like to talk and my own ego and the argument is misplaced since I would say the same thing regardless of my alignment.

I'm sure you aren't the only one that can't wait to see that. Keep stalling for deadline to get closer and it'll probably happen.

I'm hitting scum in my first shot.

All three of us? Wow, what a great shot...

What makes me scum exactly?

[HezLucky]

I'm hitting scum in my first shot.

All three of us? Wow, what a great shot...

What makes me scum exactly?

Oh cool Another person who isn't reading my posts.

[Korlash]

Oh cool Another person who isn't reading my posts.

What do you mean, 'another'? I'm the guy you've been calling scum since you replaced in, I should have been the 'first' not 'another'. Do you ever remember who I am?

Also, more stalling.

What makes me scum again exactly?

[Scott Brosius]

Hmm...not a fan of Split's "contribution." That's the only thing there is to comment on the game? A contradiction? No thoughts on anything else?

Is the whole reason you're voting Korlash is because of the contradiction?

I'd like to know how Korlash flipping scum would clear PapRat, Yates or me. Do we look good independently or is this just a future thing in case we're voting for scum? You don't think it's at least a little bit suspicious that I voted for Korlash and then got into a lengthy discussion in which I said that I wasn't even sure if I wanted to lynch him?

Agree with this post, less than thrilling entrance into the game and gets on the easiest wagon.

On the other hand, Hez has alleviated my concerns about that spot thus far.

Unvote

Scott, when you get a chance could you answer my question from the other page? What is your read on Korlash?

I'm still torn about it. I am terrible at getting reads from content I was not involved in (anything before replacing in), and Korlash has been flailing around since I replaced in (which is neither a scum/town tell). Him being on the v2v wagon is the scummiest thing I have seen since replacing in, as that wagon is rubbish. I disagree with Korlash that getting a flip is a bad idea, especially in a game where scum was lynched D1. In this specific situation, it is worth it to get that information, since we are already ahead of the game. The problem with it is that the information gleaned is dependent on Korlash flipping scum. TownKorlash does not really give us much information, especially with no real counterwagons currently going. I need to think about this more.

I'm hitting scum in my first shot.

HE MUST BE A VIG TOO.

This is why the v2v "claim" and the wagon is stupid. If you think that is a claim, then anything can be a claim.

[Tammy]

3. I know I talk to much, I don't care. I'd rather say 500 words to get across 50 than to, instead, only say 5.

See this is why we get along. I get told I'm too wordy all the time.

*obligatory scowl towards Tammy for unvoting*

I don't like leaving people at L-1 for some happy hammer person especially when I didn't point out what I've been telling him I would.

[Yates]

HE MUST BE A VIG TOO.

This is why the v2v "claim" and the wagon is stupid. If you think that is a claim, then anything can be a claim.

You are actually painful to read. Do you even look at the words you pollute my internet with before randomly thrusting them upon the screen? Did you even read the posts where VJ claimed vig? I know he claimed vig. Actually, this isn't even up for debate. Do you know why? I have a quote from VJ that begins like this:

I claimed vig because...

Everything after the ellipses is irrelevant for the purposes of this discussion. VJ claimed vig. Hez - in context - claimed he would be killing someone first shot via his LYNCH VOTE. This is NOT a vig claim. This simply illustrates that you fail at reading comprehension and invalidates any point you just tried to make. Louis Sojo help me, if you don't get your act together I swear unto Shane Spencer that I will petition Admin to change your name to Nomar!

[Tammy]

Louis Sojo help me, if you don't get your act together I swear unto Shane Spencer that I will petition Admin to change your name to Nomar!

This made me laugh. Sorry for being useless today when there seems to have been a lot of drama. I'm in almost endgame drama elsewhere; I promise I'll get it together in the next day or two.