Open 413 - Duck, Duck, Shoot! (Game over!)

[drmyshotgun]

Okay, Phill's reply is ringing Town.
VOTE: Jal
Strange how Quinter mentions your vote is fishy and you change your vote to the most popular wagon just now?

[AcRv]

... So you know that he got a town PM do you? You right there admited it. My case was because I assumed that if he got the PGO PM he would have read it, which was why he wouldn't know. You just then said that the case was on him for not reading his PM. Is that because you know he got a PGO PM so you automatically ruled out the fact that he didn't get a PGO PM?

This is WIFOM. I never said I knew he had a PGO Role PM. I said (and meant it in the way of) I have a townread on him, so I'm assuming he has a Vanilla Townie Role PM. Mhm. (Yes, I put Vanilla Tonwie on purpose, just because I felt like being sarcastic. I do mean PGO, not Vanilla Townie.) But my main point was, you can't base a whole case or read on not reading, skimming, or misreading your Role PM. It's only a small part of a case. Basing a whole case off of it is pure ignorancy to me.

Why would I put a case on someone for misreading a Role PM? I put the case on him because I thought that he didn't get a PGO PM. You're twisting it to sound like I put a case on a poor townie who didn't read their Role PM... they may have not read their Role PM, yes. I don't like the fact that you're pushing that he MUST have misread his Role PM.

The reason that I'm voting you is because you defended a player and then denied you did. Town have no reason to deny defending someone. Scum can do that for distancing, which can be WIFOMed into buddying. You're only point on me thus far has been "you're making it look like me and gunny are connected". But the thing is that you are. At least you've got a connection to him... he seems mostly oblivious to it, so I dunno if you actually are buddies or if you were buddying him.

How does this make sense?

Okay, here's a clearer version of what I'm trying to say: I'm saying that for you to defend shotgun so early on, you must either be town, or scum buddies with him, because scum like cases going around. If you were scum and he were town, you would have left it.

Although now I think about it, I do see a bit of a problem with my logic.

Here is your original vote on me in post 56. I hadn't yet ~denied defending~ anyone. You created the entire notion of me defending/denying defending. You work under false assumptions and make faulty conclusions in an attempt to make something out of nothing being there.

...

If he were scum and you were town, he wouldn't have bothered, because it'd be an easy wagon. So he's probably town.
However, as scum he might want to defend you if you were buddies. So he is only scum if you are.

Getting this straight:

So if I were scum, I wouldn't have bothered to defend him if he were town because it would be an easy wagon.
However, if I were scum I might defend him if we were buddies.

This is all on top of assuming that I was even defending him.

This sounds like some horrible roundabout logic to make me look scummy and tie Gunny and I together.

Uhm...

despite having apparently

read

your PM, and despite both PMs being posted above?

Whoa whoa whoa. We're already assuming too much here.

... Right there you say that we are assuming too much in the case against shotgun. That's defending shotgun.

Also, I haven't yet stated a case against you. Why do you keep saying so? I voted you because you are scummy.

Pointing out scummy things someone does and voting them for it is putting a case on someone.

Yes my logic was wrong with the connection, I'll admit. However - your response to the incorrectly placed pressure by saying "I never defended him" and "I never put a case on you", seems off.

Uhh Kondi

• Daystart
  Mafia have daytalk
  Each PGO must select which night they would like to arm themselves. They only get one night.
  Mafia may opt to no-kill if they wish.
  

... Wow, that's a new mechanic... that would have been useful for scum last time, seeing as two of them never confirmed and so the Mafia had NO discussion time at all.

Okay, Phill's reply is ringing Town.
VOTE: Jal
Strange how Quinter mentions your vote is fishy and you change your vote to the most popular wagon just now?

I was going to say something similar...

[drmyshotgun]

@Mod: VoteCount would be nice

[mcqueen]

UNVOTE: Phill

For the time being, I'm willing to drink the town Phill kool-aid due to his latest posts following my vote.

Kondi reads town as well. Derp town, but town nonetheless. Reviewing this page, although I don't agree with what Kondi originally voted McQueen for, this post of his does seem suspicious:

Because "busy in a QT" doesn't mean they have daytalk. It means he could be masturbating while reading whatever was posted pregame (as it's unusual for scum not to be able to talk pregame).

It seems he's going a long way to find a defense. It's very obscure and unbelievable. This is on top of the fact that there was a perfectly reasonable explanation available to him which he admits to later - that he did read the first few pages and knew scum have day talk.

There is some weirdness going on between Phill and McQueen, and for now I'm satisfied that the problem isn't on Phill's end.

VOTE: McQueen

LOL. Nice one, noob.

I made that post, because, in fact, "busy in a QT" doesn't mean talking. It

can

mean talking, but doesn't

necessarily

mean talking. Hence, he could be

masturbating, while reading pregame posts

. It's a very realistic possibility.

I wish I could just shoot, instead of firing back at people who target me, because there are a lot of people I'd consider shooting tonight.

[kondi2424]

Except that's fucking retarded.

[mcqueen]

... So you know that he got a town PM do you? You right there admited it. My case was because I assumed that if he got the PGO PM he would have read it, which was why he wouldn't know. You just then said that the case was on him for not reading his PM. Is that because you know he got a PGO PM so you automatically ruled out the fact that he didn't get a PGO PM?

This is WIFOM. I never said I knew he had a PGO Role PM. I said (and meant it in the way of) I have a townread on him, so I'm assuming he has a Vanilla Townie Role PM. Mhm. (Yes, I put Vanilla Tonwie on purpose, just because I felt like being sarcastic. I do mean PGO, not Vanilla Townie.) But my main point was, you can't base a whole case or read on not reading, skimming, or misreading your Role PM. It's only a small part of a case. Basing a whole case off of it is pure ignorancy to me.

Why would I put a case on someone for misreading a Role PM? I put the case on him because I thought that he didn't get a PGO PM. You're twisting it to sound like I put a case on a poor townie who didn't read their Role PM... they may have not read their Role PM, yes. I don't like the fact that you're pushing that he MUST have misread his Role PM.

The reason that I'm voting you is because you defended a player and then denied you did. Town have no reason to deny defending someone. Scum can do that for distancing, which can be WIFOMed into buddying. You're only point on me thus far has been "you're making it look like me and gunny are connected". But the thing is that you are. At least you've got a connection to him... he seems mostly oblivious to it, so I dunno if you actually are buddies or if you were buddying him.

How does this make sense?

Okay, here's a clearer version of what I'm trying to say: I'm saying that for you to defend shotgun so early on, you must either be town, or scum buddies with him, because scum like cases going around. If you were scum and he were town, you would have left it.

Although now I think about it, I do see a bit of a problem with my logic.

Here is your original vote on me in post 56. I hadn't yet ~denied defending~ anyone. You created the entire notion of me defending/denying defending. You work under false assumptions and make faulty conclusions in an attempt to make something out of nothing being there.

...

If he were scum and you were town, he wouldn't have bothered, because it'd be an easy wagon. So he's probably town.
However, as scum he might want to defend you if you were buddies. So he is only scum if you are.

Getting this straight:

So if I were scum, I wouldn't have bothered to defend him if he were town because it would be an easy wagon.
However, if I were scum I might defend him if we were buddies.

This is all on top of assuming that I was even defending him.

This sounds like some horrible roundabout logic to make me look scummy and tie Gunny and I together.

Uhm...

despite having apparently

read

your PM, and despite both PMs being posted above?

Whoa whoa whoa. We're already assuming too much here.

... Right there you say that we are assuming too much in the case against shotgun. That's defending shotgun.

Also, I haven't yet stated a case against you. Why do you keep saying so? I voted you because you are scummy.

Pointing out scummy things someone does and voting them for it is putting a case on someone.

Yes my logic was wrong with the connection, I'll admit. However - your response to the incorrectly placed pressure by saying "I never defended him" and "I never put a case on you", seems off.

Uhh Kondi

• Daystart
  Mafia have daytalk
  Each PGO must select which night they would like to arm themselves. They only get one night.
  Mafia may opt to no-kill if they wish.
  

... Wow, that's a new mechanic... that would have been useful for scum last time, seeing as two of them never confirmed and so the Mafia had NO discussion time at all.

Okay, Phill's reply is ringing Town.
VOTE: Jal
Strange how Quinter mentions your vote is fishy and you change your vote to the most popular wagon just now?

I was going to say something similar...

@Top - I could keep trying to make an arguement out of this, but I'm going to leave it. I'm getting nowhere, and since the rest of your post rings very town to me, there's not much point.

[mcqueen]

Except that's fucking retarded.

Except I didn't ask you to speak, did I?

Except it's still a very realistic possiblity, no matter how retarded. How am I supposed to know what he does when he reads? Honestly, I don't want to know.

Except that was another one of your useless fluff posts, trying to paint it as content, by giving me something to post about. I can honestly post about anything, so it doesn't make your post useful. Only to me keeping active, so thanks for that, I guess.

Except when you've played up to your fluff post meta, it's never turned out good between us, as we've never had a good game, even if the other loses (I still want my revenge). Be more pro-town like you were in New York 150 (I think it was this one), before you replaced out, and that game that I lost in, Mini 1390, I believe. I liked that kondi2424, more fun to play with. You do that, and I'll be the towniest guy in the game, like I was in New York 150.

(For reference, here is New York 150 and Mini 1390.)

[kondi2424]

I don't have as much time as before. I'll try, but don't have high expectations.

[mcqueen]

Also, here is the whole reason I've been "defending" Phillammon a bit. Go read (yes, I know it's 100+ pages, but read from Day 5 or 6 to the end) Worst Role Mafia. As you can see, (although part of the reason was because of my stupid fakeclaims), I was scum's (callforjudgement's, as he was the only mafiosi left, at the time) late game mislynch bait. If I could have gotten mafia-n00b lynched, I would have been onto callforjudgement the next day. After that, in LyLo, Phillammon voted Trevor early, and callforjudgement hammered. But Phillammon pulled a 360, and said (this actually ranks as my favor quote on MafiaScum), "Yup. Genuine town. Except you forgot something. Game's not over yet." Technically, if you argue this out, when callforjudgement (would have) targets Phillammon the following night, callforjudgement is roleblocked, and loses his ability (in his case, factional ability) for the night, while becoming part of the Green Goo, yet never able to kill Phillammon, so it could be said as a tie. But izakthegoomba called the 1v1 rule, hence giving callforjudgement the win. I honestly, despite being bitter over my incompetent phailure, enjoyed watching Phillammon almost pull it off, yet I didn't want that to happen to him in this game.

Almost pulling it off

, but not quite. Honestly, I left my alignment out of my "defending" of him, and took a personal approach. That's why it seems weird.

Take this how you want, but I've said what I've had to say, so yea.

[mcqueen]

I don't have as much time as before. I'll try, but don't have high expectations.

Fine. But you try to do better, so will I. Good luck, mate. Have fun.

[brundibar]

VOTE: Jal

VOTE: Phillammon

Don't care for your reasoning to vote McQueen. Your votes and reasonings between Andew, Quinter, and McQueen seem a bit "off" and manufactured.

There is some weirdness going on between Phill and McQueen, and for now I'm satisfied that the problem isn't on Phill's end.

VOTE: McQueen

[brundibar]

@Mod Votecount please?

[Lastsurvivor]

I'm back.

Om of the Nom replaces Chrimi.

VC incoming.

[Om of the Nom]

'Allo there everyone!
It's 6AM now and I haven't slept, so I can't do much right now.
Tally ho everyone!

[Om of the Nom]

Although my aim is not to sleep anyway. I'm trying to pull off an all-nighter :V
Regardless, I can't get much done at this hour. I'll do stuff later today.

[Lastsurvivor]

As Mitt Romney drawls on about a boring topic, gunfire rings through the stage. Suddenly, Mitt is on the ground. Mitt Romney,

Politican,

died Pregame. The crowd begins to shout at Barack Obama, who must have staged this stunt, but he is shot as well. Barack Obama,

Politician,

died Pregame.

People chant throughout the audience. "Ron Paul! Ron Paul! Ron Paul!"
Everyone grimaces. Those weren't the only Ron Paul fans kicked out of the stage. Ron Paul mafia has begun.
One of the townsfolk changes the channel.

D1 VOTE COUNT #6

Jal (L-2) - AcRv, Quinter, drmyshotgun, brundibar

mcqueen - (L-3) andrew94, Jal, kondi2424
AcRv (L-5) - mcqueen
Phillammon (L-5) - Om of the Nom
Quinter -
andrew94 -
drmyshotgun -
Shattered Viewpoint -
kondi2424 -
brundibar -
Om of the Nom-

Not voting: Phillammon, Shattered Viewpoint,

V/LA: Quinter LA until approximately 6/16 (but he can still post),

With 11 alive, it takes six to lynch

I'm glad you all didn't realize I was V/LA. The asking for VCs made me happy even though I said I wasn't going to be here multiple times...

Deadline is in (expired on 2012-06-23 23:13:00)

[drmyshotgun]

Yay~ Sup OmNom.

McQueen is Town I think. For wanting to actually shoot someone instead of backfiring at them.
Thinking Brundibar is Town as well.

[brundibar]

Shotgun, can you explain your read on McQueen a little more?

[drmyshotgun]

He's taking the game with enough jest and confidence. Always a good sign.
And as I've said, he wants to actually shoot someone instead of backfiring. Don't think Scum would say that.

[drmyshotgun]

@Mod: Kondi is voting for McQueen

[Om of the Nom]

Yay~ Sup OmNom.

Yay~ Sup Gunny :3

Gah, I think I fell asleep at 8AM :P
Oh well, reading up.

[Om of the Nom]

Note: The things I'm posting are liable to have already been covered. But screw you I'm posting them anyway.

After

two votes?

Lol, why is it so special that he claimed after two votes? AcRv claimed in his first post, and there was nothing wrong with that.

despite having apparently

read

your PM, and despite both PMs being posted above?

Whoa whoa whoa. We're already assuming too much here.

What makes you say this?

By the way Phil, I'm quite distressed at your reaction to my claim. Rather than saying: "Thanks Capt. Obvious, Sgt. Duh signing out!", you said something like: "Why did you claim after two votes??".

I like this.

Okay, Phillamon's jumping at a claim this early is rather odd, I'll admit. But the fact that you confirmed by PM by posting your Role Name, without actually reading what your role is, seems unlikely. Because the "confirm by PM" is at the bottom of the PM. To get to the bottom of the PM you have to read the bit before it. Which tells you what the role does.

How is it odd?
Also, I only read my rolename unless there are significant differences to normal, or it's a role I haven't seen before. Though I guess I generally know what they are anyway :V

[Om of the Nom]

Fair enough. The claim itself was fine, hence my having jumped on you doing it so early. If you had, as you said, claimed VT, you'd be outta here. However, what you just did looks like a townslip, so UNVOTE: for now.

This sounds like backtracking. What was the townslip?

We were just arguing over the fact he got wrong the role that every townie has - so town being PGOs would be on his mind.

Don't like the way this is worded.

However, one thing does hit me - scum QT would have been filled with "how are we going to tackle these PGOs?" talk.

What makes you think this?

And so he would have known what the PGO was. And so the most likely explanation is in fact that he didn't read his role PM. So yes, he townslipped, but for a different reason.

Isn't this starting to assume too much?

They don't want to risk losing someone.

What makes you think this?

I currently have townreads on drmyshotgun, Phillammon, and Jal.

Why for each of them?

Just realised that drmyshotgun is back to null because I just realised the WIFOMfest that we can have over that...

Sounds like backtracking again.

If Jal is scum then so is drmyshotgun, and if drmyshotgun is town then so is Jal.

Don't like how this came out of nowhere.

I dunno why Jal was Town and why he is closely linked with me.

This.

Look at his post. He tried to defend you by saying we were assuming you read your PM.

Isn't that assuming too? What makes you think he was trying to defend Gunny?

If he were scum and you were town, he wouldn't have bothered, because it'd be an easy wagon. So he's probably town.
However, as scum he might want to defend you if you were buddies. So he is only scum if you are.

I agree with kondi here. This is shit logic.

I was not jumping on gunny for his PGO claim, I was jumping on his timing. Still fruitless...

What did his timing have to do with anything? This also sounds like a backtrack.

[Om of the Nom]

Lol, I'm bored already :V
I'll continue this soon.

[Om of the Nom]

unvote vote quinter

sheeping etc

Elaborate.

Because of the whole thing wherein he claimed that he thought PGOs where one shot dayvigs, therefore he either didn't read his PM and thus didn't confirm (and he did confirm), or he got a scum PM. I "jumped at him" in the traditional sense of the word, when I aggressively challenged his claim, because 1) He formally claimed at 2 votes and 2) He was claiming the role he didn't know the function of, despite having received the PM.

What makes you so sure he read the whole PM? I don't normally read the whole PM, I just read the role name. And again, what do the two votes on him have to do with anything?

AcRv

:

What makes Phill town?

You want me to explain my town reads? So scum know what they can do to make me think they're town? I'm good.

This is a new one. I call bullshit.

If he were scum and you were town, he wouldn't have bothered, because it'd be an easy wagon. So he's probably town.
However, as scum he might want to defend you if you were buddies. So he is only scum if you are.

Getting this straight:

So if I were scum, I wouldn't have bothered to defend him if he were town because it would be an easy wagon.
However, if I were scum I might defend him if we were buddies.

This is all on top of assuming that I was even defending him. This sounds like some horrible roundabout logic to make me look scummy and tie Gunny and I together.

Uhm...

despite having apparently

read

your PM, and despite both PMs being posted above?

Whoa whoa whoa. We're already assuming too much here.

... Right there you say that we are assuming too much in the case against shotgun. That's defending shotgun.

Not neccesarily, maybe he was just attacking Phillamon?

Really looks like you're trying to defend shotgun a little too much... bringing up an incorrect point trying to defend him, when we had already established that what he did was a null tell. And also denying you defended him seems off as well.

What is so incorrect about what he is saying?

VOTE: AcRv

Yeah, I'm feeling uncomfortable with Jal's defending of me. Looks like he's trying to buy Town points from me and others who see

me

as Town.

This sounds a little fishy. Elaborate please.

thanks lastsurvivor.

I thought PGO was basically Daykill Vigilante...

Vote: shotgun

you can't seriously not have read your role pm if you are town

cos of this post

Elaborate.

acrv seems town to me.

Why is AcRv town?

AcRv

:

You want me to explain my town reads? So scum know what they can do to make me think they're town? I'm good.

So you're making claims that someone is townie, but backing up this claim would be giving away secrets to the scum? Why should we believe you if you're not going to back-up your claim?

Look at it this way - why would a town member lie about a townread?

WIFOM

All you need to know is that I have no plans on voting him/her in the forseeable future.

Okay, if you end up voting them, I'll make sure to attack you for it :3

He meant as in towards the end of the day. I see what he means, but I don't think we're on the same page here Andrew.

get on my page. you see what im seeing mcqueen is doing?

What is he doing?