Open 418 - Friends and Fun Times at the Fair (Game Over)

[Venmar]

One thing I did notice, however small, is a potential slip of the tongue by Venmar:

"- There are probably a couple instances in games that i have ongoing, but if you want you can read Open 399, that is my latest completed game. Luckily for you

i also played as scum there

, so feel free to get some kind of a scum meta, but that was my first time playing as scum so i doubt it is as reliable."


Also? I don't think it really fits in the rest of the sentence, and could be a slip of the tongue pertaining to this game. I would like others views on this however, perhaps I am just putting the wrong emphasis on the wrong words when reading that, but it stuck out to me.

- Interesting point. I admit it phrased that kind of weirdly, but when writing that, i was thinking in the sense of ( thinking in my mind. ) -"

also, to add

"- I am not sure if that makes sense, but regarding that post i felt like the need to add on the fact that i played as scum in that game would help clear some things up, and make the read more interesting since someone could get a feel for how i play as scum. Basically, i was adding on a point to the main part of the post, and way i worded it is how i presented that. Does that make sense..?

[The Acting Method]

Today's not going to be a very active day for me due to company.

Regarding TAM:
Honestly, I thought you were misinformed town until #38. My read on you prior to that was that you're trying to get discussion moving (good) but your metric for determining scumminess is HORRIBLE (null). Yet after, you back away from your earlier stance by saying that you only plan to policy lynch people determined by their activity compared to OTHER games (Which makes the answer to your #2 worthless), and then even go as far to admit that lurking might just be anti-town and not scummy. This backtracking is mildly scummy.

Going to respond to this before I give my thoughts on McStabs look at Venmar

1. Lurking is anti-town, if you are playing anti-town you are (at least in this game) playing for scum and why you should be lynched.

Where did I say I would policy lynch people who deviate from what they said they would post? I would policy VOTE them, but I'd only push for them to be lynched if say, over the period of two meat world days, I saw them consistently posting in another Open and ignoring this one completely. (Note this is an example, basically it still boils down to, if you don't post in your games at least once per RW day, I'm probably going to go after you.)


On Venmar's "slip"
I didn't read it as a slip, to me he was saying: "You want a sample of my play in a completed game, Here is a location. Oh and it's me as scum so you can compare it to my current play to see that I'm town." That's the idea I think he was trying to get across.

[andrew94]

hell yes, om's editing quote shit is annoying, so annoying.
in fact, i dont remember him doing it in one of his town games..
correct me if im wrong.

@Macstab, nice catch. regardless if he slipped or not, i have a
town read on you

@venmar
the game you linked is the game where you selfhammered as scum
on day 1, how is that supposed to help us? (read you)

redpanda claimed first
shotgun claimed second. i said he wants town cred, but tbh town
or scum can do that.
however, om+Acrv claimed third, which is just ???. your just following
the former two. scummy.



OH SHOTGUN IS 100% TOWN. IM SURE OF THIS TOO!

[drmyshotgun]

Yes andrew, I'm going to get you a nice little parrot one day.

[borkjerfkin]

I don't see anything scummy about the way Venmar phrased that particular statement.

@TAM: I guess I don't understand the difference between "a policy vote" and "pushing a policy lynch".

[Potack-ruv]

shotgun is confirmed town. I'm 100% sure of this. its because of something hes done in this thread. I don't want to elaborate on this. I'll play this card when the time is right.

I will not stop pushing him until you can explain this and I deem it right.

Om can you not do that editing quote shit, it's verry annoying.

It's much more annoying having to go through all the things I want to talk about and make them into separate quotes.

#67 - "I still have yet to see you explain properly why we are scum."
Wait, so if you happen to be scum, and he explained it "properly", you'd just concede the point? What?

This is a stupid attack. Considering my play so far it would be highly obvious I'm going to keep pressuring him until he gets lynched.

#84 reads like a weak OMGUS (Andrew disagrees with me, gotta be scum).

Why? Is my point not completely valid?

#89 "You focus much more on making me look bad then clearing your name. Which isn't really something town do. "
No, this is precisely what town need to be doing; attempting to find scum.

Town should also be defending themselves. They can't get scum lynched if the whole town is yelling at them. I'm sure if you weren't able to clear your name then nobody would listen to you. Plus, he was focusing more on making me look bad, instead of convincing everyone else how bad I was.

#102 -- you accuse me of a strawman when I'm asking for clarification? I'm actually actively avoiding strawmanning by not ASSUMING he meant anything and asking what he meant.

You take it too far. You assume he will do it every single time it happens, instead of asking for clarifications as to when he may do it specifically.

Also in #102 -- You already knew what I meant but you want me to explain it anyway? Why should I have to elaborate on something for the sake of elaboration?

Because your answer will help me determine your alignment even more.

[Potack-ruv]

hell yes, om's editing quote shit is annoying, so annoying.
in fact, i dont remember him doing it in one of his town games..
correct me if im wrong.

Wow, taking something that someone said and turning it into a horribly weak attack. This is seriously a load of bullshit. I do it because it makes responding easier for me. And I do it as either alignment. Go and find games where I haven't done it as town.

redpanda claimed first
shotgun claimed second. i said he wants town cred, but tbh town
or scum can do that.

Waffles. Make up your mind. Is he town or scum from doing that?

however, om+Acrv claimed third, which is just ???. your just following

Why are we following? I jumped straight into it without giving it any thought. Gunny had to ask before he did it, which means he was afraid of getting attacked if he claimed.

OH SHOTGUN IS 100% TOWN. IM SURE OF THIS TOO!

Why?

[Mortontfrh]

Vote Count 1.07

With 13 alive it takes 7 votes to lynch.

Potack-ruv

(2) - borkjerfkin, Drmyshotgun

Venmar

(2) - Soben, Redpanda

Drmyshotgun

(1) - Potack-Ruv

Not Voting: TeChNoWC, McStab, Chrimi, andrew94, mcrawford, absta101, Venmar, The Acting Method

Deadline is in (expired on 2012-07-07 16:41:00)

[TeChNoWC]

Drmy's 121 just doesn't feel genuine, and I don't like his reasoning. Potack's responses are good and drmy seems to be pigeon holing him with reasoning that relates to other players (eg Red).

Potack seems fairly pro-town to me. He seems more engaged in the argument, while drmy gives me a flailing vibe. I've seen Om (Potack) play this style before as town and I have seen it work. Also, I feel Potack is putting more on the line here. If drmy flipped town at any stage, it would make Potack look bad. Drmy doesn't seem as confident in his reads so he could weasel his way out of it more easily.

@Soben: Unfortunately most of what I know of Venmar is from ongoing games. But I have a strong suspicion he is the same in other town games. Anyone who has town meta on him could supply. But at this point, I do think he is town. His 'slip' just seemed like a grammatical error. It read to me like he was trying to say 'in addition to this, I was scum in that game'; I think that's also what Method is trying to say.

@Red: What is this reasoning you have that drmy is town? Because at this point I get the feeling he is scum, and your defense of him is the only thing stopping me voting up right now.

[Potack-ruv]

If you think Gunny is scum then vote him.

[drmyshotgun]

^Why so rushy?

It is quite uncomforting that Potack will tackle every single thing I utter in this game.
I'll keep very silent from now on.

So TeCh thinks Potack is doing something right by tunneling and analysing every single thing I say.
How useless would those be after I flip and turn Town?

[TeChNoWC]

Vote: drmyshotgun

I really wanted to hear Red's response first, but fuck it. Two votes is two votes is cool.

Potack, what do make of Red? What do you think his reasoning is? What do you think of the case on Venmar?

Pedit: Yeah, Om does that, but it's the way people react that I pay attention to. Om is good for pressure. And I think Om (Potack) is doing what
Om does as town, and your case on him is shit, and your reaction to him looks scummy.

And if Potack is scum then he is putting enough attention on himself to die soon. The only thing that worries me is if this is town on town.

[Potack-ruv]

I don't like people calling people scum and not having a reason for not voting them.

Why would a town flip from you instantly make everything I said about you useless?

PEDIT: RP is super obv town. No idea what his reasoning is. Haven't really paid attention to the case on Venmar, but I think Venmar is town anyway.

[drmyshotgun]

I'm not going to answer for Potack's apparent "questions" within the quote of my posts because I'm sure they'll just return with more piles of questions.

[Potack-ruv]

I'm not going to answer for Potack's apparent "questions" within the quote of my posts because I'm sure they'll just return with more piles of questions.

Translation: "I can't answer his questions because he'll just ask me more and I don't want that because I need to stay low and avoid suspicion."

[The Acting Method]

drmyshotgun, I would suggest answering them. Otherwise you'll just seem more scummy for refusing to answer them.

Or pretty much what Potack just said.

[Chrimi]

I'm so so sorry, I'm here, I'll catch up soon. I've run into a bit of business but I'll be back on my feet in no time!

[Soben]

Om did the editing quote thing in DV's mini normal as town.

Also Andrew should be the person explaining why Drshotgun is 100% town rather than RedPanda.

[andrew94]

@ tech, why is 121 not genuine. i think its genuine.
also, am i scum?

potack is just turning everything i say and spawning some Bs
to make it look bad. In fact, hes doing that in many games im in
atm so its actually null.


@potackwhat do you mean u jumped straight into it without any thought.
for all i know you could have thought about it for ages, but
just not post 'OH IM THINKING' in the thread.
shotgun actually posting the shit, makes him lean towner.
im going with shotgun towner here

[Potack-ruv]

lrn2committ to your attacks. "Oh Om, did something scummy, but hey he does it in other games too so it isn't scummy."

Anybody who knows me knows I say shit without thinking. Why would I actually be thinking about fakeclaiming on my first post if I were scum? What motivation would I have to fakeclaim a role everyone would claim regardless of their real role?
Gunny posting his waffles is not towny at all. It shows how waffly he is being and how non-comittal he is. He couldn't even claim without asking because he was scared of being pushed for it.

[drmyshotgun]

I'm not going to answer for Potack's apparent "questions" within the quote of my posts because I'm sure they'll just return with more piles of questions.

Translation: "I can't answer his questions because he'll just ask me more and I don't want that because I need to stay low and avoid suspicion."

Exactly why I won't answer those. Good work here.

[drmyshotgun]

drmyshotgun, I would suggest answering them. Otherwise you'll just seem more scummy for refusing to answer them.

Or pretty much what Potack just said.

Uh-huh.

[drmyshotgun]

I'm so so sorry, I'm here, I'll catch up soon. I've run into a bit of business but I'll be back on my feet in no time!

Oh Chrimi is here!

[TeChNoWC]

@ tech, why is 121 not genuine. i think its genuine.

Drmy looks like flailing scum not sure how to get pressure off him. Though I'm not sure how this argument started, it seems like he is attempting to grab a whole heap of things and fabricate a case on Potack, and his points on Potack were crap. I'm catching up with reading now (Iso'd Potack, need to ISO drmy next), but even without looking into it much drmy looks like the scummy to me.

also, am i scum?

You tell me, are you?

You haven't done anything that stands out as scummy to me so far, but I would like to know why you feel drmy is so town.

potack is just turning everything i say and spawning some Bs
to make it look bad. In fact, hes doing that in many games im in
atm so its actually null.

Where did Potack attack you?

@potackwhat do you mean u jumped straight into it without any thought.
for all i know you could have thought about it for ages, but
just not post 'OH IM THINKING' in the thread.
shotgun actually posting the shit, makes him lean towner.
im going with shotgun towner here

Elaborate please, because I'm failing to understand what you are trying to say here.

[borkjerfkin]

This is a stupid attack. Considering my play so far it would be highly obvious I'm going to keep pressuring him until he gets lynched.

*shrug* I agree that you're tunneling shotgun -- my issue is that you used the term "properly", as if there were a way to properly explain that you're scum. This seems like something only scum would say.

Also, observe:
"Oh, yeah, and now you're gonna push a policy lynch every time..."
"Are you going to push a policy lynch every time...?"
One of these is a strawman; the other is not. I asked, he clarified, and I am not misrepping him by saying he said something other than what he said.

Shotgun is backed into a corner and I think he's going to respond the way he's responding at this point no matter what his alignment is. I saw nothing scummy in his early game play except a minor OMGUS vs Potato, which seems to have been the basis for the tunneling Potato has been doing on him.

The one thing I wanna know from Shotgun: why did you give out reads in #36 and then condemn Potato for doing the same thing later (I'm looking for a very specific answer here).