[OLD] Open Setup Ideas and Discussion

[Junpei]

Why is survivor worse than Serial Killer? Oh yeah, no kill - no problem in my opinion in a small setup. Hidden miller is fine if people understand the 1/6 chance that the given person could be mafia based on the report. Seems cool.

[IceGuy]

Me not liking survivor and hidden miller is a personal preference (like Magua wouldn't play my setup in the Open Setup Review thread).

[Junpei]

Oups - 1/5 chance to not be guilty. Sorry!

[BBmolla]

Survivor is a terrible role because he can be either an additional townie or an additional mafia and

it's completely up to him to decide

.

Survivors need some sort of additional modifier or they're just awful.

Also, 9p with 5 Townies, 2 Goons, 1 cop and an anti town role is scumsided as hell.

[Junpei]

Survivor is a terrible role because he can be either an additional townie or an additional mafia and it's completely up to him to decide.

Just like a Serial Killer! Either may be a town vig or a mafia vig.

[Faraday]

Except for the fact it can win with the mafia, which acts as an extra mafioso in lylo.

[BK201]

Why is No-Lynch not allowed in Donner Party?

[callforjudgement]

Survivor is a scum role, that has a chance of winning with town if things go badly, and that can't sacrifice themselves.

Among other things, this means that town should always kill claimed survivors.

[Junpei]

so possible 3v6.. you need more town roles sir.

[vijay2vasandani]

Why is No-Lynch not allowed in Donner Party?

Because they have to eat somebody.

[LlamaFluff]

Random thought...

Friends and Acquaintances and Enemies

3x Masons
3x Neighbors (Masons or Mafia can be neighbors) - Have Daytalk
3x Vanilla Mafia
4-7x VT (bring to 13 players)

Just a new way to look at what already is a decent setup (FaE/FaEaE) by adding a new element to it.

[animorpherv1]

I know this will seem really insignificantly small, but if all 3 masons end up drawing neighbours (as unlikely as it is), then it's a waste of neighbours. A way to prevent that would be nice.

[LlamaFluff]

I know this will seem really insignificantly small, but if all 3 masons end up drawing neighbours (as unlikely as it is), then it's a waste of neighbours. A way to prevent that would be nice.

Statistically insignificant (0.3%) outcome shouldnt weigh on it since it would come up all masons/mafia about one of every 280 runs.

[callforjudgement]

If scum had three neighbours, they could definitely find a way to use that to their advantage, I think.

If masons had three neighbours, it would at least give them information (e.g. that all the neighbours were town, = the scum didn't know who they were).

[animorpherv1]

If scum had three neighbours, they could definitely find a way to use that to their advantage, I think.

If masons had three neighbours, it would at least give them information (e.g. that all the neighbours were town, = the scum didn't know who they were).

Well duh scum could find a way to claim an advantage. They could claim neighbours and anyone who thinks that role = alignment would auto unvote (Let's face it. A lot of the people who play Open games aren't the best scumhunters out there).

I however, cannot find enough semi-useful situations for mason-neighbours to make it worthwhile.

[Junpei]

(Let's face it. A lot of the people who play Open games aren't the best scumhunters out there).

Lets face it: http://forum.mafiascum.net/search.php?k ... mit=Search
You haven't played an Open in over a year - and of your last 3, two you replaced out of (impressive) and one you have 12 posts in after replacing in and subsequently being lynched. I haven't read any of your recent games or looked at them (I went to look at your threads you've posted in and it seems you chat much more than you play) but I've played some Opens and in my experience they have lots of great players. I'd bet a lot that you are worse than the average Open player as well.

Mason neighbors would, as callforjudgement says, give masons some information. There are times when scumhunting when people use the idea of dead mafia knowing who neighbors are/suspecting someone as mafia in conjunction of being a neighbor which are erroneous - and the mason-neighbors confirm this to themselves. It is SOME information. Not much, but some. You wouldn't know this of course because you don't play games enough to understand the impact of neighborhoods. Instead you pout about things that doesn't matter and shitpost.
[/rant]

[Faraday]

Random thought...

Friends and Acquaintances and Enemies

3x Masons
3x Neighbors (Masons or Mafia can be neighbors) - Have Daytalk
3x Vanilla Mafia
4-7x VT (bring to 13 players)

Just a new way to look at what already is a decent setup (FaE/FaEaE) by adding a new element to it.

Town sided with 13 players depending on how the neighbours are utilised I guess? Depends on how pro town you figure the neighbourhood is, since I think F+E with 13 players is slightly town sided on the forum.

[Junpei]

Neighborhoods protowness (I've found) is very dependent on the neighbors and it's too hard to factor it in pregame. I've seen neighborhoods tear town apart and catch mafia (I've done both in neighborhoods in previous games, both times I was town unfortunately - but the point remains, it's too much intangible stuff). I think neighborhoods make the game more interesting though.

Also: I just noticed that the neighborhood has daytalk. That automatically adds even more usefulness to mason-neighborhoods.

[LlamaFluff]

Random thought...

Friends and Acquaintances and Enemies

3x Masons
3x Neighbors (Masons or Mafia can be neighbors) - Have Daytalk
3x Vanilla Mafia
4-7x VT (bring to 13 players)

Just a new way to look at what already is a decent setup (FaE/FaEaE) by adding a new element to it.

Town sided with 13 players depending on how the neighbours are utilised I guess? Depends on how pro town you figure the neighbourhood is, since I think F+E with 13 players is slightly town sided on the forum.

Thats kinda why I like it, its going to add some EV to whatever side is able to use the neighbor ability better (if scum have it) and the fact that its daytalk really pushes for the utilization of it if you can trust the other players in it enough. If scum gets in there and plays it well, it could be very useful for them to have around. If mason gets in there and plays it right, it will be great for getting them better established.

Basically just giving a little tweak to something that we know already works, and I like neighbors due to the current site interest in that role, making a group in an open setup can be interesting. Daytalk vs Nighttalk is very negotiable, but I like removing a time period that both masons and neighbors can be chatting at once. Chance of all masons/mafia is so low that it doesnt matter, even getting two in there is about a 4% chance.

[BridgesAndBaloons]

so possible 3v6.. you need more town roles sir.

Hmm... which of these solutions do you prefer:

1) Survivor has to win with town
2) Give the town more power, possibly one-shot vig.

[BBmolla]

Maybe make the survivor a faction with another survivor. So have like two survivors who can only win if they're the last ones standing. Make it so they can't win with anyone else also. And maybe to help them out a bit, give them a vig shot each night to use. You also make one them a "Survivor Roleblocker" or "Survivor Rolecop" but that's up to you and how you want to balance it.

[animorpherv1]

Once again, Junpei everybody. Clap if you give a fuck what he says.

[quadz08]

Llamafluff, I quite like that setup.

[gorckat]

Maybe make the survivor a faction with another survivor. So have like two survivors who can only win if they're the last ones standing. Make it so they can't win with anyone else also. And maybe to help them out a bit, give them a vig shot each night to use. You also make one them a "Survivor Roleblocker" or "Survivor Rolecop" but that's up to you and how you want to balance it.

Isn't that a 2-man scum team?

[Junpei]

so possible 3v6.. you need more town roles sir.

Hmm... which of these solutions do you prefer:

1) Survivor has to win with town
2) Give the town more power, possibly one-shot vig.

Well 1 obviously makes it a VT, so 2. I'd add 2 town roles. 1 VT and 1... watcher while in the survivor setup? Does that sound right? I mean, mafia will know the setup, so should we let one town role also know the setup half of the time? Watcher is more power definitely, I'll think about if I think it makes sense to have a watcher in the miller setup or not, but I'm not sure. If not, it'd just be a VT in a setup.