Newbie 1,276 (Game over!)

[ewo2]

I did a full reread, but I don't think a summary of the action is totally necessary because Johnny just provided a fairly comprehensive one a couple pages back (although the majority of it simply repeats what others said to that point).

In said Johnny post, I see a lot of mimicking of the popular opinions at the time each post he comments on was made. This makes sense - it's hard coming into a game partway through without being able to ask your own questions. However, he calls me out for having the same opinions he does to that point (which I find odd, since he agrees with what I say). He also sheeps nh at nearly every chance he's got. As stated, most of what Johnny says in that post is really not necessary, as the majority of his comments are just "I agree" or "I disagree" and don't provide anything new or shed original light on scenarios. He seems to be trying to establish himself in the game as a neutral player, and makes sure to sidle up to the players that are generally agreed upon as town - in short, nothing controversial at all (other than advocating a policy lynch, which I'll come back to), which makes his post seem more self-serving than useful.

Additionally, while Johnny states that his two biggest scumreads are on myself and nh, it's bizarre to me that he'd list us both as scum while actively acknowledging that he doesn't think we're a scumteam. nh's dispute of Johny's charge is just weird though - he states that "to the rest of the town", at most one of either myself, johnny, or nh is scum. Why is he speaking for the whole town? This seems like a slip to me - if he's got more info than the rest of us, I can see how it would be easy for him to step into the town's shoes.

jambecca is nothing more than a complete waste of time. he actually actively avoids giving opinions on anything despite posting several times.

Maggot, I really don't see the utility in holding your opinions to yourself in the instance of your scumteam speculation. Forcing their hand would have been a more useful move imo. However, you're still cleared for me due to the previously mentioned reason, so this comes across as a bad move and nothing more.

Johnny slinks off his idea of a policy lynch after he's been called out on it. Johnny also focuses a hell of a lot on sematics with regards to nh. He even does a reread of other games in order to clear nh for the charges Johnny himself made. To be honest this looks a lot like distancing, which nh looked to be doing with nekoko way back at the start of the day.


Cheery, I don't get your point when you put me at an unofficial L-1 - asking if nh thinks his vote is in the right place is not agreeing that it should be on me.

I don't think Jason's scum-read on Maggot is scum-motivated, but it definitely seems off-base because her interation with Pasch early on more or less clears her (based on the scum-chat before the game confimation).

I will catch up with the most recent posts in a little while but I see City's is absolutely massive and I don't have enough time ATM to respond to it fully. Be back with my response to the second half of page 8 and my current reads shortly.

Sidenote: we have six days left until deadline so there's no reason to rush-lynch me. I want to get as much out there as possible so that you can reflect on it later if you do decide I'm who you're going to lynch, because it seems fairly inevitable at this point.

[StrangerCoug]

VOTE COUNT

ewo2 (4): nhammen, Paschendale, JohnnyFarrar, Cheery Dog
MissMaggot (1): JasonWazza
nhammen (1): ewo2
Not voting (3): CityElectric, MissMaggot, Wiibox3

With

9

players alive, it takes

5

players to lynch.

Day 1 ends in (expired on 2012-09-09 10:13:01).

[CityElectric]

Mod: Cheery Dog voted for ewo2. ewo2 is currently at L-1

[CityElectric]

Hurray for double-posting!

@ewo, I know I said I didn't have any questions, but upon re-reading my catch-up post, I realized I had one for you. Why didn't you give a read on nham in Post 69?

Whoops, silly me... I meant to ask: why didn't you discuss nham's actions in Post 69?

[nhammen]

It's not like I was witholding the information permanently. It was mainly to put the scum players on their toes and hopefully watch them scramble while encouraging the rest of the town to take a closer look at things. If there were sudden odd changes in play immediately after that statement, then we might have been able to bag a baddie.

This doesn't work. Before you gave out the information, scum wouldn't react, because they have no idea if they are even the ones you suspect.

Those kinds of tricks more often hurt town than catch scum. It's basically never a good idea for a town player to be deceitful. For one thing, it means the rest of us won't trust you anymore.

Also this. But I still believe MissMaggot is town, so that has little effect.

Not quoting this monster. I need to point out that you seem to give townpoints to some behavior that is not worth townpoints. Any good player can point out bad play and bad logic, whether or not they are town.

When i replace in i comment on posts that are scummy as i read them i don't see the need of going over every townie post (as god damn that would be long :/) and honestly the scum read flipped at about post #86 on the Paschendale/MissMaggot confrontation.

That is a good way to fall to confirmation bias. If you only carefully read the people that you think are scum, then you will only find scummy behavior from the people that you already have a scumread on. You wont see the scummy behavior that comes from players you have a townread on.

The other two replaces in you had done had you going over everyone in those games (but I guess they allowed spoilers and were about 4s bigger than this one (also I just noticed that you did both of them on the game post number)) except strangely venrob in 1265.

Yet he gave off the gave scummy vibe in that game as this one?

hmm... good catch. Can you show me those games?

He also sheeps nh at nearly every chance he's got. As stated, most of what Johnny says in that post is really not necessary, as the majority of his comments are just "I agree" or "I disagree" and don't provide anything new or shed original light on scenarios. He seems to be trying to establish himself in the game as a neutral player, and makes sure to sidle up to the players that are generally agreed upon as town - in short, nothing controversial at all (other than advocating a policy lynch, which I'll come back to), which makes his post seem more self-serving than useful.

Not only that, but he is sheeping me, when I am the player that he claims to have found most scummy at the time. Players don't sheep someone they are suspicious of in general. That post seriously bothered me.

nh's dispute of Johny's charge is just weird though - he states that "to the rest of the town", at most one of either myself, johnny, or nh is scum. Why is he speaking for the whole town? This seems like a slip to me - if he's got more info than the rest of us, I can see how it would be easy for him to step into the town's shoes.

I probably should expand upon the logic I used here. From the rest of the town's point of view, if Johnny is scumpartners with one of the two of us, he would not portray this as ONE of the two is scum. He would either say that you and I are scumpartners, so that if that the scum member were lynched, then the town member would be lynched as well; or he would say that neither of us was scum, so as to protect his partner. Thus, if Johnny is scum, then neither of the two of us are his partner. If Johnny isn't scum then... well actually I must have assumed something like if he is town then he is right, which is not true in general.

[nhammen]

EBWOP (edit by way of post):

Town

players don't sheep someone they are suspicious of in general.

[nhammen]

Although, I'm not sure scum would skim previous games to check if my meta matched.

[JasonWazza]

The other two replaces in you had done had you going over everyone in those games (but I guess they allowed spoilers and were about 4s bigger than this one (also I just noticed that you did both of them on the game post number)) except strangely venrob in 1265.

Yet he gave off the gave scummy vibe in that game as this one?

A) i get tired of quoting numerous posts quite easily hence the post number use
B) Spoilers would have helped me organize better yeah (it was already looking like a mess)
C) wow i didn't even realize i had missed him might have something to do with his massive V/LA at the time (it was almost a week from memory) that lead to him being replaced out (and i prefer to not grill people who replace for what their predecessors did myself (pretty much why i was lynched in that game))
D) Last sentence is blah, can you re-word that please

Okay, that's true, however, she did eventually have to come up with a theory, the theory she gave would organize at least one mislynch if we'd buy it, and it'd be easy to talk out of it when it turned out to be nothing. There is no real reason to withhold this as scum, IF this was her theory. I think her faking a theory would be a biiiiiiiiiiiiit of a stretch. The active lurking accusation is true, though.

But as scum isn't she benefiting from that by looking like she has info?
And i think scum would have an initial theory but it felt to me (whilst reading) that she might just latch it in to a convenient place if something else had happened

I don't think Jason's scum-read on Maggot is scum-motivated, but it definitely seems off-base because her interation with Pasch early on more or less clears her (based on the scum-chat before the game confimation).

I don't think anyone is cleared from that interaction and here is why

As a passive observer i could have told you that scum had N0 chat

However i doubt whoever was scum would have mentioned it

at all

because mostly only scum would know about it.

So i figure any scum would have kept going back and forth rather then actually say there was N0 talk.

No one was cleared from that interaction in my mind

+ buddy points ewo

When i replace in i comment on posts that are scummy as i read them i don't see the need of going over every townie post (as god damn that would be long :/) and honestly the scum read flipped at about post #86 on the Paschendale/MissMaggot confrontation.

That is a good way to fall to confirmation bias. If you only carefully read the people that you think are scum, then you will only find scummy behavior from the people that you already have a scumread on. You wont see the scummy behavior that comes from players you have a townread on.

Like i had said Re-Read coming, would have done it last night if i hadn't gotten a migraine but alas i will do it today some time (i hope).

[ewo2]

City's giant post is mostly solid and well-reasoned. It makes up for the lack of anything from his slot's previous owner. Again, nothing altogether controversial is raised, and of course he's off the mark in considering me scum.

To answer the questions directed at me:

1. I ignored nh in my first reads post because most of what he had said was just IC explanations. That, and I considered him town up to that point because I had no reason to suspect otherwise, and he was being helpful.

2. My post about nh and his knowledge of pre-game scumchat makes perfect sense if you ISO nh. He is so thorough and explains things in detail in all of his posts, and then doesn't even mention that every other game newbie game he's played DOES allow pregame scumchat.

3. As per your consideration of voting me, there are really two sides to the coin. I hate being in the position I'm in now - in a logical sense it would probably be beneficial for the town overall to lynch me, as having me involved in a lylo / mylo situation would be bad due to the amount of suspicion built up around me. There's very little chance I'll be NKd so that could grow to be an issue. However, it's against the town's best interest to lynch a townie regardless of the scenario as it means one less townsperson. Honestly I'm leaving it up to the town at this point and I understand either way. All I ask is that you allow day one to continue until it's absolutely necessary to lynch me, maybe two days from deadline, so that we can get more content.

4. I didn't discuss nh in my post 69 because to that point in the game, I hadn't really been struck by a particular reason to consider him scummy. Often, a player will do something to set off my scumdar and I'll look back at their previous actions more critically. That's not exclusive to me, either - that's a pretty common way of approaching a possible scum in order to build a case.

As stated by Pasch I think it's crucial that everyone weigh in with their reasons for or against lynching me so that there's something to reflect on in later days. Just a short summary post with a couple bullet points will do.

@Johnny - you raise a good point about MM - it somehow went over my head that she's the one who brought up "scripted", meaning she could possibly have known about the pre-game chat. However, what makes me consider the Pasch / MM debate a towntell for MM is that she could easily have called Pasch out on his claim that there was no pregame chat and MM wouldn't have looked scummy for doing so at that point in time. I do think she'd have said something. Someone should probably have just straight up asked this already but I didn't think to:

@MM - did you know that scum could chat before the game started before the mod clarified?


My reads:

Town: MM, Pasch, Cheery
Null: Johnny, City, wii
Scum: nh, Jason

I think the likelihood of Jason being scum is greater than nh being scum based on Jason's bad (but comprehensive) post.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Jason

[JasonWazza]

I think the likelihood of Jason being scum is greater than nh being scum based on Jason's bad (but comprehensive) post.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Jason

My bad post?
Gonna elaborate on that one or just leave it blank?

That is some of the worst reasoning i have ever seen.

[ewo2]

Check my post at the top of this page for reasoning.

[ewo2]

Oh god. I'm sorry. The replace ins/outs are not making this easy especially when two of them start with J.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Johnny

[ewo2]

@Johnny - you raise a good point about MM - it somehow went over my head that she's the one who brought up "scripted", meaning she could possibly have known about the pre-game chat. However, what makes me consider the Pasch / MM debate a towntell for MM is that she could easily have called Pasch out on his claim that there was no pregame chat and MM wouldn't have looked scummy for doing so at that point in time. I do think she'd have said something. Someone should probably have just straight up asked this already but I didn't think to:

...and that should have been addressed to Jason.

[StrangerCoug]

Mod: Cheery Dog voted for ewo2. ewo2 is currently at L-1

Fixed.

[JasonWazza]

Yeah ok i got you now (i can see why that is confusing).

I can see why you think it is a town tell but think about it this way

MM interjects right in the middle of that debate with Scum had N0 talk and she will be looked at for her knowledge of the Scum's PM

I can see why you think that way but i honestly see that entire debate as a null tell due to the suspicion that was gonna be casted on anyone who actually mentioned it.

[Paschendale]

Weak reasoning is enough to abandon the read Ewo has been so intent on before? That feels like opportunism to me. I feel fairly confident in my vote on Ewo.

[JasonWazza]

Post #12 nhammen

In re-read this sticks out just a little, why not do a P-Edit? would that not be more beneical to explain to new players?

I can understand the wagoning though it just sticks out a little in my mind.

By all means explain things but their is always such a thing as over explaining, and in this case i think it is on the verge of doing so.

Post #15 Cherry Dog

Was this post directly avoiding the 3rd RQS question, just seems odd and there doesn't seem to be any reasoning.

Post #16 Wiibox3

RVS and a lot of Fluffy stuff involved in it.

Post #17 MissMaggot

Could be distancing and will be interesting to look at later.

Post #18-19 Nekoko

Defending her RQS, and i like that she is basing the defense off experience rather then just getting uber defensive.

Post #22 Paschendale

Doesn't see merit in wiibox's wagon (possible associative tell)
Attacks Nekoko over what (by my gathering of her question) is a noob tell.

Post #25 MissMaggot

Pasch-Neko interaction is "scripted" to her (later i think she calls it just a gut read on the convo)

Post #26 Paschendale

Attacks MM's RVS without much of a defense.

Post #28 MissMaggot

On a re-read of both Post #25 and Post #28 it seems like she is trying to set up Paschendale here, first with the scripted remark and then with the lack of information, i feel this is her trying to refer to herself as town well she puts Paschendale on a target.

Post #29/30 Wiibox3

Fluff and trying to seem town

Post #31 nhammen

Wiibox and Paschendale are Scum because they didn't follow your train of thought?
I understand you are IC but your not the only one that can be right about everything and they made a competing wagon by both voting nekoko so what is the problem then?

Post #32 Paschendale

Complete misrep of what nekoko said.

Post #33 Wiibox3

Defending (poorly) nhammens vote based on fluff and not trying to look OMGUS like.

Post #39 ewo2

ewo2 seems to be reaching in this post for something scummy, he votes nekoko after saying that this is a newbie game and they are probably newb mistakes, yet doesn't vote wiibox3 even though he had something more solid on him.

Post #40 Nekoko

Nekoko showing that Paschendale's read on her is a null tell.

Post #45 Wiibox3

Defends his fluff (flavour as he calls it), the rest of the post seems like he is trying to deflect the vote back at ewo, or maybe that is just me.

Post #46/48 Paschendale

Seems to be trying to justify he's reasoning on voting venrob based on the post in between, to me this feels like he didn't have enough of a reason first off and needed more to jump on it.

Post #49 MissMaggot

Picking out Paschendales reasoning for having susspected her.

Post #50/53 Paschendale

SE advice given in a quite poor way, and to me this feels like he might be scum trying to flash light on MM and get the spotlight off himself.

Post #55 Wiibox3

he points out that paschendale's advice was scummy but proceeds to stay with his RVS vote.

Post #57 nhammen

points out to pasch he started the competing wagons
points out ewo following popular wagons
kinda just sits on the side after pointing stuff out.

Post #67 Paschendale

Declares he thinks MM is probably town.

Post #68 Wiibox3

Still nothing, just nothing.

Post #69 ewo2

Says that wiibox is likely a noob, yet has nothing against his lack of content.
Changes his vote to Pasch.
Wii has become "null"

Post #73 wiibox3

Calls out Paschndale again but still doesn't change his vote, seriously he has a scum read over his RVS and he votes the RVS

Post #78-80 nhammen

Vote's ewo for just following the wagons.

Post #83 wiibox3

Fluff that talks about lurkers

Post #84 wiibox3

Vote's Venrob, so he pressures the lurker over the scum read he has.

Major gap here is due to the scum N0 talk that i have already gone over

Post #99 nhammen

attacks cheery dog for not moving his vote based on the "scummiest sentence so far"

Post #104 Wiibox3

Fluff

post #110 ewo2

Attacks the IC based on the N0 chat.

Post #114 MissMaggot

The Gut theory for active lurkers

Post #118 MissMaggot

Now in both these posts i will note that there is no link to anyone given even in the slightest, meaning there is no real use for it.

Post #119/120 wiibox3

I think this is his first post with ACTUAL CONTENT, and he seems to pull out that ewo's attack is bad because ewo hasn't posted as much as he has (point me to any Content of the game and i will concede this point but seriously).

Post #122 nhammen

Points out that his vote isn't OMGUS

Post #128 ewo2

Ummm kinda a stretch here from ewo

Post #132 JohnnyFarrar

main thing is both his scum reads are ewo and nhammen, then says they are not partners but one is probably scum

Points out nhammen's lack of obvious reads.

Post #138 wiibox3

replys to nhammen and Johnny (beyond that there is nothing)

Post #151 Paschendale

Vote's ewo based on his methods being "just plain bad"

Post #156 JohnnyFarrar

vote changes to ewo and replys to the policy lynch stuff.

Post #162 wiibox3

Votes jambecca for stalling (isn't that a little bit ironic, this coming from the person with next to 0 content)

Post #170 MissMaggot

Finally pulls out the theory.

Post #174 Wiibox3

Unvote no content

After which i replaced in

That is my re-read

Reads:
Wiibox3:

You have next to no content in this game and it is clear that you don't look like contributing and this is extremely scummy, this makes you very scummy in my mind, you seem to just active lurk this entire game.

Scum

UNVOTE: MissMaggot
VOTE: Wiibox3

ewo2:

You seem to be following the popular wagons and on top of this you didn't vote a scum read over your random vote this to me both seem like things scum would do, and i can honestly see you and wiibox3 being a scum team together.

Scum

MissMaggot:

Still don't agree on withholding information but you seem less scummy then 0 content 100% fluff, and you did seem town through the first half of the game before the active lurking and i would prefer to see you back into the game like the start

Null - Leaning Scum

Paschendale:

You seemed scummy for the first half of the game but you seemed more toownish towards the end of the game.

Null

Cherry Dog:

You ask them hard hitting types of questions and this makes me honestly think you are town.

Town

City Electric:

You just replaced in with a decent wall to open, but your still in a rather fresh slot

Null

JohnnyFarrar:

Your slot used to be Nekoko who seemed town in my mind and you haven't done anything to contradict that read

Town

Nhammen:

Your the IC though some things seem to stick out here and there, i don't know whether this is skilled scum or bit clumsy town but i think i will need to look into it more later

Null- Leaning Town

[Cheery Dog]

Cheery, I don't get your point when you put me at an unofficial L-1 - asking if nh thinks his vote is in the right place is not agreeing that it should be on me.

Because I don't understand the need for town to ask the question. If someone has a vote on you then of course they believe you to be scum.
If it was a random vote left over from RVS then there would be a point to the question, but since it wasn't, I read that post as busted scum for what they believe to be bad reasoning.

The other two replaces in you had done had you going over everyone in those games (but I guess they allowed spoilers and were about 4s bigger than this one (also I just noticed that you did both of them on the game post number)) except strangely venrob in 1265.

Yet he gave off the gave scummy vibe in that game as this one?

hmm... good catch. Can you show me those games?

the posts in question Newbie 1265 & Newbie 1257

A) i get tired of quoting numerous posts quite easily hence the post number use
B) Spoilers would have helped me organize better yeah (it was already looking like a mess)
C) wow i didn't even realize i had missed him might have something to do with his massive V/LA at the time (it was almost a week from memory) that lead to him being replaced out (and i prefer to not grill people who replace for what their predecessors did myself (pretty much why i was lynched in that game))
D) Last sentence is blah, can you re-word that please

A & B aren't the problem I was having with your meta.
As for C & D, those points were brought up due to the following information you had given in answering me other questions.

I replaced into one of his other games and honestly he gave off the same sort of scummy vibe, which also explains this outburst

FUCKING HELL ITS A FUCKING D1 RVS! EITHER I NO VOTE OR I VOTE! WHAT THE FUCK AM I SUPPOSED TO DO IN RVS!

He kinda got grilled for his RVS in another game: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=22798

When i replace in i comment on posts that are scummy as i read them i don't see the need of going over every townie post (as god damn that would be long :/)

[Cheery Dog]

Post #15 Cherry Dog

Was this post directly avoiding the 3rd RQS question, just seems odd and there doesn't seem to be any reasoning.

I simply forgot there was a third question after I answered the other two and just pressed submit. I remembered while it was going through, but decided it wasn't important enough to have it's own post so I decided to leave it
My answer would have been somewhere along the lines of 'the best way to find out is to attack me' had I actually answered it.
[line][/line]
The brackets in my post about your previous replaces in was fluff noting that they both happened on #294 of their respective games. It was just interesting and I felt like sharing it because I notice strange things like that.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Hey, posting to say I haven't forgot you. Sorry I've been away, three day weekends are for IRL friends. I'll be home to comment on the last page tomorrow night.

[CityElectric]

1. I ignored nh in my first reads post because most of what he had said was just IC explanations. That, and I considered him town up to that point because I had no reason to suspect otherwise, and he was being helpful.

And Post 31, Post 57 and the bottom part of Post 58 are 'just IC explanations'? And if you considered him town up until Post 69, then why is he in the null list?

2. My post about nh and his knowledge of pre-game scumchat makes perfect sense if you ISO nh. He is so thorough and explains things in detail in all of his posts, and then doesn't even mention that every other game newbie game he's played DOES allow pregame scumchat.

I have yet to see an IC who does mention that in the beginning. Plus, do you think nham explained everything there was to explain in these posts? Yes, nham was more thorough on RVS/RQS than the other ICs I've seen around. But pre-game scumchat is hardly ever brought up in games!

3. [Cut, 'cause I don't want this post to grow out of proportions again. (I seem to be very capable at spawning monster posts...)]

4. I didn't discuss nh in my post 69 because to that point in the game, I hadn't really been struck by a particular reason to consider him scummy. Often, a player will do something to set off my scumdar and I'll look back at their previous actions more critically. That's not exclusive to me, either - that's a pretty common way of approaching a possible scum in order to build a case.

You said why you found Dog town, you've given reasons for MM's townieness AND you say Wii's become null to you. None of these things are commenting on scummy things. I ask my question again. Why didn't you discuss nham in that post?

As stated by Pasch I think it's crucial that everyone weigh in with their reasons for or against lynching me so that there's something to reflect on in later days. Just a short summary post with a couple bullet points will do.

You know what my problem is? You tend to pull arguments out of thin air. And then you state things as proof that aren't true. Or your arguments are stretching things so far, that they stop making sense. I'm not too sure about you being scum, but I doubt I want to have you in at lylo. Simply because you use logic that doesn't make sense.

Weak reasoning is enough to abandon the read Ewo has been so intent on before? That feels like opportunism to me. I feel fairly confident in my vote on Ewo.

Pasch, I have yet to see a well-reasoned argument from ewo...

Post #119/120 wiibox3

I think this is his first post with ACTUAL CONTENT, and he seems to pull out that ewo's attack is bad because ewo hasn't posted as much as he has (point me to any Content of the game and i will concede this point but seriously).

I'm not sure why you think Post 33, Post 45, Post 73 and Post 84 contain no 'actual content' because I'm seeing content there.

[JasonWazza]

Post #119/120 wiibox3

I think this is his first post with ACTUAL CONTENT, and he seems to pull out that ewo's attack is bad because ewo hasn't posted as much as he has (point me to any Content of the game and i will concede this point but seriously).

I'm not sure why you think Post 33, Post 45, Post 73 and Post 84 contain no 'actual content' because I'm seeing content there.

Yeah it should be "First post with ACTUAL CONTENT that isn't a major defence", if you re-check post 33/45/73 are all defensive post 84 is just poor, it's a pressure vote compared to his said scum reads.

i just feel like a LAL/RVS vote should never take priority over a scum read vote and it has in this case the entire time, my feeling is that it is to stay out of the spotlight, why? because that means he can't be held as accountable.

[Cheery Dog]

UNVOTE: ewo2
I don't actually have anything much on you except that I believe what you said might have been a slip, however looking over it again I think it might actually be a newbie mistake. The rest of your posts (except that you've got names mixed up again) look towny to me. I was wondering over these latest two posts if they were an appeal to fear or emotional truth, and I'm decided they are the latter for now, if they were appealing to fear then it's managed to work on me.
I'm not entirely sure that Johnny's post is actually that bad, but probably because I currently don't find sheeping suspects to be a scumtell. (probably because I was on a wagon with confirmed scum (only to me since I hadn't counter claimed at that point) at the end of day 1 in newbie 1260)


However Wii has actually been slipping under my radar with his lack of posting, and I'm beginning to find that suspicious.

Well, I honestly feel like I know nothing about this game. Not starting from the start really throws me off.

Honestly it seems to me that you are stalling. You have had several days to catch up and form some opinions or questions for us. You are getting off to a bad start and making yourself look like scum.

Is it just that they look like scum or did you believe they actually were scum?

So far it looks like you haven't actually found someone who believe to be scum and all your votes thus far have been on the lurkers.
VOTE: Wiibox3

---

and because I don't think I've done this so far and I feel I need to get some of my thoughts into order, my current reads are probably as follows

CityElectric	null	not enough useful content from this slot to generate a true read yet
ewo2	null	Would be a town lean however am uncertain about the 'slip' and forgetting names
JasonWazza	null leaning scum	Venrob's start was bad, I also didn't like Jason's start much either. The other posts haven't changed my mind much
JohnnyFarrar	null	Possibly a slight scum lean as I haven't seen much useful content from this slot either while having a lot of posts
MissMaggot	null	This was a town lean, but contentwise hasn't actually done anything significant yet
nhammen	null leaning town	I haven't seen anything bad from here yet and I don't understand where the attacks on him have come from.
Paschendale	Town	The townslip about not having read the other pms and general behaviour
Wiibox3	Scum	Too much lurk and not enough useful input. I'm not convinced he has found anyone scummy

[CityElectric]

Thanks for clarifying that, Jason. And, hey what, you're right. Wii is doing a lot of active lurking. And, indeed, Wii is slipping under the radar (the use of this phrase launched a huuuuuuge discussion in my previous game, so I don't feel too comfortable using it, but meh). But, I'm still not convinced about ewo, simply because he refuses to make sense. I'm going to give ewo another chance to explain Post 69 before I'll vote him again. I am going to keep an eye on Wii, though.

[Wiibox3]

Catching up. My thoughts later today.