Ladies Night 2: No Cover -- (Game Over)

[Eidolon]

^dont like her response to pressure from me^

I still have sliiight scum on spring. if we look at the largest wagon right now, i think one scum is on that. i'd say likely huntress, possibly mathgirl though her initial post had me leaning townish.

But i feel strongest about camn and telo.

[Brandi]

I'm going to be away tomorrow and possibly all of Tuesday as well, just a heads up. I may or may not find internet access while away.

[springlullaby]

Nowhere was I whining about anything.
And it did not appear to be a joke vote to me, I took it seriously.

Vote: Dripping Goofball

For ending RVS so damn soon.

But if it's any consolation, your username reminds me of slimy tennis balls, not boogers.

Looks like a non serious vote to me.
I don't see how it could have been taken as a serious reason to vote someone.

Also "complaining" you keep throwing words in like that that are completely unfounded.
Nothing about my stance or opinions is that of one who is unhappy or is complaining/whining. I don't know where you're getting that from but it really feels like you are trying to misrepresent me, when in fact all I was doing was explaining why someone had a good reason for their vote.
Which by the way I still don't see how it was taken as a joke vote.

Not everyone has had a chance to make a RVS post. Now if we want to look back at players and see how they acted during the RVS stage, we cant.

Looks like complaining to me.

You do not need to have experienced something to have an opinion on it, that is common sense. Which is why I refer to it as a fallacy.

Oh so you agree you were talking out of your behind in a theory discussion that was unwarranted, but saying it is a fallacy when I call you on it? I dunno if you are arguing with genuine blind faith or scum who just can't lose a point. In any case I'm happy I cut that venue from you.

I don't like your replies and I also think both your votes were weak, the first one on Piggy was a bad one with meh meta reasons - I would expect anyone doing meta to be checking whether they would do the same as town, yet what you did was to confirm if they would do that as scum, it strikes me as a vote that strives to be safe.
Your second vote on seastorm is also meh, I don't see what in thread could have changed your mind about Piggy, and this whereas you have posted a number of posts after the initial vote on sea by huntress.


.............................................................................



I really dislike camn's last series of posts, reason to suspect Piggy are reaching. Piggy reads as a total derp to me, pinning mastermind scum 'coaching' on her is just terrible. Then the whole interaction with Eidolon/City, I don't like at all. The only point in her corner is that City is a shaddy character too.

Town

Eidolon - I liked her line of questioning about DGB, it read right and pot stirring.
Tammy - Town read, although I wonder if you are purposefully leaving out the fact that you were scum in Heterosexual.
Huntress - Town read in last post, comment about sucrose strikes me as town paranoia.
RachMarie - Ok-ish vote on Telo, still less strong town vibes than others.
Sucrose - Not a lot of content but everything said so far is ok-ish.

Null

Seastormjt - Nothing
Amrun - Nothing
Fujiko - Nothing
Bunnylover - Nothing. Will lynch if do not make an effort.

Scummy

Brandi - For reasons cited.
camn - For reasons cited. Only redeeming feature is that the votes on her are not very good either.
Telo - Reads as an endless series of self justifying posts with no content so to speak. Only redeeming feature is she doesn't read as if she is all there.
CityElectric - Awkward to read, one single vote that is very weak.
flinter - Very contrived vote on camn. Do not like.
MathGirl277 - I was meh on Mathgirl only content post but rereading it I decided that I hate it, it says a whole load of nothing amounting to 'I like you, no you!' with a lot of words.

Derp

PiggyGal15 - Hurt my head to read, will lynch if do not make an effort.

[springlullaby]

I forgot DGB, she is in a category on her own as I can't read her anyway, but it bothers me that she is driving it so hard on Piggy whom I

[springlullaby]

*whom I see as totally unreadable.

Sorry I don't know what button I'm pushing by accident that makes me cut my posts.

[camn]

What is terrible about it?
Scum get nervous and coach all the time! And its one of the very few early tells I think are reliable!




(Yes, ignoring eloidian. Can't find a productive reason to engage, given lack of factuality)

[springlullaby]

Either Piggy is nervous scum or she is masterful scum purposefully hiding messages in their posts.
You can't have both in the same proposition.

[camn]

I would argue that she is hardly hiding it. Thus nervous.. NOT hiding.

[Fujiko]

Fujiko- Weak pushes, weak defense of piggy, no scumhunting. Look at the ISO. Fujiko, what do you think of piggy and telo at this point?

Piggy is fairly null to me, possibly town - but I disagreed with the rationale people had for her as scum. People thought she was scum because of nervous joking, and the response thereto? No. The point I was trying to make there is that is a person tell, not a town tell. I've had to restrain myself from doing that as town - because I knew people would read it as scum, not because it wasn't my initial response.

Telo: as I said before, I really don't like post 130, and 144 I still don't agree. One thing from my (extremely limited) experience is that not everyone gives reasons for their reads. It makes them harder to read, but it's true, and doesn't make them any less of their reads

What is terrible about it?
Scum get nervous and coach all the time! And its one of the very few early tells I think are reliable!

Why would less experienced scum coach more experienced scum?

[Huntress]

In post 46, Brandi voted Piggy based on a meta check of a single game which didn't really bear out her claim of long/weird posts as scum. She was fourth on that wagon, or third if you don't count Piggy's self-vote. Then when the wagon on Piggy starts to break up she hops on to the next one citing Sucrose's post on Seastorm. In post 88, she says that Seastorm's answer was insufficient but doesn't say what more she wants to know. Time will tell but I'm getting a scum-vibe here.

I agree with Brandi that the discussion on the value of an RVS belongs in MD, not here, but I do have a question about the following:

Spring, there was a direct question regarding RVS and it ending early as well as it's merits.
A player landed a vote becaues of such.
I was giving reasoning as to why it was a legitimate and understandable stance, because I had that opinion as well.
Now I did not say that it made DGB scum, though- just that the reasoning could make sense.

By this, are you saying that you think the reasoning for Sucrose's vote on DrippingGoofball was valid for a vote? I'm asking this in view of the fact that in post 112 you said that it did not appear to be a joke vote to you, that you took it seriously. Just looking for a yes or no answer here at the moment.


Still catching up,

[Brandi]

Looks like a non serious vote to me.

Looks like a serious vote to me.

Looks like complaining to me.

Well then, you're wrong and are bad at reading. I was simply stating a fact. That's it.

Oh so you agree you were talking out of your behind in a theory discussion that was unwarranted, but saying it is a fallacy when I call you on it? I dunno if you are arguing with genuine blind faith or scum who just can't lose a point. In any case I'm happy I cut that venue from you.

There you go, not knowing how to read again.
No. I was not talking out of my behind. I was and AM 100% correct.
Sorry, sweetheart, it's still a fallacy. Try again. Maybe use actual logic next time. ^^

@Huntress: I think it was valid reasoning, but not a valid vote, as I don't think DGB is scum.

[Brandi]

Like, here is an example for you since you seem pretty thick, Spring:
I've never been raped before, but I know for a fact that I wouldn't like to be raped.
Other people seem pretty confident that it's a pretty terrible experience.

Are you going to tell me that I need to be raped to have a valid opinion on it?
If not- shut up.

[Brandi]

Ok that was a little bit rude, sorry. I don't think you're stupid spring.
My period just started today and I woke up super early just because of pain, and it's making me really moody- I apologize.

[Brandi]

I'm going to be away tomorrow and possibly all of Tuesday as well, just a heads up. I may or may not find internet access while away.

probably leaving sometime after 12 PST.

[Eidolon]

(Yes, ignoring eloidian. Can't find a productive reason to engage, given lack of factuality)

Fact # 1. putting a vote up for "reactions".

Fact # 2. a few people call camn out for her vote.

Fact # 3. Camn disregards her initial vote, puts no analysis up of the "reactions" she supposedly was looking for, and sheeped the popular wagon, of a newb.

Fact # 4: continual buddying of DGB.

Fact # 5: Dismisal and denial of points against you. (i gave a reason for calling you suspicious. You insult me and say my reasoning was bad. I provided more reasoning and insult you. You call my whole case an insult and say i'm scummy for what you were doing.) major hipocracy and unwillingness to reason.

Sooo.. we've got:

fake scumhunting.
Going with the easy wagon. not even attempting to pressure or question that person.
buddying & sheeping of the person who apparently often takes the town leader role.
Dismisal and denial of points brought up against you.

Don't wanna defend yourself and actually do some scumhunting, no? Just gonna lay around for a while, eat some bon bons, not give a fuck? It's really becoming of scum.

[RedCoyote]

Prodding MathGirl and Amrun

---

Vote Count 1 - 7

• Seastormjt

  (4) (MathGirl277 - Huntress - Sucrose - Brandi)
  
  
  PiggyGal15
  (3) (DrippingGoofball - Seastormjt - camn)
  
  
  camn
  (3) (CityElectric - flinter - Eidolon)
  
  
  springlullaby
  (1) (

  Eidolon

  - Bunnylover)
  
  
  Sucrose
  (1) (Amrun)
  
  
  RachMarie
  (1) (Telo)
  
  
  Brandi
  (1) (springlullaby)
  
  
  Eidolon
  (1) (Fujiko)
  
  
  Huntress
  (1) (Tammy)
  
  
  Telo
  (1) (RachMarie)
  
  
  Not Voting
  (1) (

  RachMarie

  - PiggyGal15)

With eighteen alive, it takes ten to lynch.
Current Deadline:

(expired on 2012-10-11 12:10:00)

[Eidolon]

^hmm. i changed my vote to camn.

unvote, vote: camn

Ah, so you did. I missed it, sorry.

[Telo]

As soon as I have a strong scum read I'll be placing my vote there and it will very likely stay there until the end of the day.
So far who I'm leaning towards and why.

Piggy

for reasons I've already stated and don't need to repeat.

Spring

- post 90 just seems pushy and mean. I know pushing is part of the game but that post seems strategic.

DGB

because I really hate the term Hos. Usually people use that type of term to make themselves look better by putting others down.

Bunnylover

for hanging back the most

MathGirl

because I hate it when people put tiny font in their post. I can see that it's there but I can't see what it says and it makes me feel like they're doing it on purpose to hide something but then be able to claim that they weren't hiding it.

My strongest town read is

Tammy

but I've already said that.
After that in no real order

RachMarie

-yes yes, I know my vote is on her but I already explained that was rvs. I'll move it when I decide where to place it.

Fujiko

- mainly because she says things that I'm thinking to the point that I don't feel that I need to say them too or it'll look like I'm sheeping. I'm not. I just find her townish

Amrun

- willing to ask a question, get an answer and then move on. So far doesn't seem to get hung up on stuff.

[camn]

can you cite? That helps my willingness to reason.
I dont like to try and discuss your 'feelings' about what I did or didnt do. They are your prerogative..
But if you think I did something, and you actually want to discuss it (which I doubt is true)- show me where it happened.

And what happened to "derailing the piggy wagon"? Are you redacting that? Or did it just fall off the list because it was inconvenient?

But, since I am feeling sweet... a defense:

MY reaction-testing in RVS is pretty low-level . Its not a gambit.. it is simply to sort people into playstyle groups (as explained in 153). Thus, fact #1 is barely there.
There is ONE common exception.. and that is what Electric did. I think that is actually scummy, and not just playstyle-characteristic. Which is why I mentioned it.
If you want some MattP-style "OMG YOU POSTED THRICE, HAHA CAUGHT SCUM" kind of analysis... you are not going to get it from me. Thus, the first bit of fact #3 actually falls to the wayside.

I'll give you Fact #2. That actually happened.

In re: my place on the piggy wagon---> is it derailing it, or sheeping it? Im still unsure which I am guilty of
From my perspective, early in the game I put down my RVS vote... not actually randomly, but based on a small, insignificant twinge of uneasiness. Then. I actually voted Sucrose for a reason (as explained in 153.). Then, when I actually started paying attention to the game, I realized Sucrose was likely town, and was posting much better now (as explained), and so it was back to my initial radar-ping.
Thats it. You think it was wagon-derailing followed by wagon-sheeping.. but that is just your thoughts. You have yet to actually show me how I was derailing the wagon.. or how it got popular again.
This bit of VCA should clear it up:

Spoiler: THE PROGRESSION OF THE PIGGY WAGON

PiggyGal15 (4) (DrippingGoofball - Brandi - Seastormjt - camn)

camn unvotes, post 75. No reason given. Actual reason? probably post 44.....

PiggyGal15 (3) (DrippingGoofball - Brandi - Seastormjt)

Brandi unvotes, post 83. Reason? agrees with Sucrose's points vs. Seastorm

PiggyGal15 (2) (DrippingGoofball - Seastormjt)

^^^ this is the state of the 'wagon' thereafter... from #83 till post #153. 70 posts.. about 36 hours later....I return to the wagon.. and

PiggyGal15 (3) (DrippingGoofball - Seastormjt - camn)

aaaaaaand... that is how the wagon sits today!

SO- take a look. Can you show me where I derailed the piggy wagon? Where it got 'popular' again? I dont think you can, because it didn't happen.
Re: derailing- Brandi jumped off.. but her vote wasn't solid anyway. Thats it.
Re: gaining popularity-- where are the votes? Its just me.
Thus, the REST of fact #3 is gone.
Do I think you are scum because of this? Not really. Scum probably would have looked harder at what actually happened before claiming.
But I hope you are PRO-TOWN town enough to look at your so-called facts and realize that they are mostly just a matter of your perception.

Regarding fact #4- DGB and I

are

buddies. There is no other state of me playing with her other than buddying. Even when I want her dead. So yes. That is a fact.

And Fact #5- I apologize if you thought I was insulting you. I assume post 169?
If you want the truth.. I put the smiley face in because it was jokey.. . but I dont think calling your case a crapcase is particularly insulting. But I apologize if it was. I can be abrasive sometimes.
HOWEVER, as noted above.. all of your 'points' were not actually based in fact.
Your response to "how did I derail the piggy wagon" never held water.. because I didn't derail it. Thus there is no how.
And your answer to 'when did I take heat for derailing that wagon? That never appeared.
Thus, the only real response is to blow you off. as town OR scum. So fact #5? partially true, but not relevant. Yes, I dismissed your points.. but only because you never made them. Hypocrisy? I don't think so. Unwillingness to reason? I am TOTALLY willing.. if you would start actually using some. I mean that in a "please cite-your-case" kind of way.. not in an insulting way. Just stating your opinion is not 'reason', especially when it hinges on game events that never happened.

And with that, I am off.


PS- I actually love bon bons.

[Bunnylover]

Be making a post later tonight, got class atm.

[PiggyGal15]

Spring, you made my day by making me a special derp read <3 Thank you.

This is pretty much a prod dodge as everyone is reading town/null to me right now :/

[DrippingGoofball]

As soon as I have a strong scum read I'll be placing my vote there and it will very likely stay there until the end of the day.
So far who I'm leaning towards and why.

Piggy

for reasons I've already stated and don't need to repeat.

Spring

- post 90 just seems pushy and mean. I know pushing is part of the game but that post seems strategic.

DGB

because I really hate the term Hos. Usually people use that type of term to make themselves look better by putting others down.

Bunnylover

for hanging back the most

MathGirl

because I hate it when people put tiny font in their post. I can see that it's there but I can't see what it says and it makes me feel like they're doing it on purpose to hide something but then be able to claim that they weren't hiding it.

My strongest town read is

Tammy

but I've already said that.
After that in no real order

RachMarie

-yes yes, I know my vote is on her but I already explained that was rvs. I'll move it when I decide where to place it.

Fujiko

- mainly because she says things that I'm thinking to the point that I don't feel that I need to say them too or it'll look like I'm sheeping. I'm not. I just find her townish

Amrun

- willing to ask a question, get an answer and then move on. So far doesn't seem to get hung up on stuff.

SCUM DETECTED

Can you guess why?

[DrippingGoofball]

This is pretty much a prod dodge as everyone is reading town/null to me right now :/

BACON DETECTED

[camn]

Calling out personality quirks as scum characteristics?

[PiggyGal15]

This is pretty much a prod dodge as everyone is reading town/null to me right now :/

BACON DETECTED

Spoiler: ...

Are you implying you're going to...

eat me