Ladies Night 2: No Cover -- (Game Over)

[Eidolon]

The only things that stick out about that are me saying you seem newb town, and tammy calling you a mislynch. But i'm town, and i think tammy is town.

Who else was defending you?

Huntress was pretty much the first person to vote somewhere else when the piggy thing sprung.

One other thing, Mathgirl gave reads on just about everything at that point EXCEPT piggy. odd.

I'd say fujiko, mathgirl and huntress are good leads.

[Eidolon]

Actually, bunnylover and sucrose voted elsewhere in the midst of the piggy thing too.

i have to read back over it, focus on motivations, and try to narrow it down some.

but i think fujiko is a good person to be pressured. if she's town, she's not doing it right. and she might be scum.

[Sucrose]

I don't know why you're still going on about that RVS vote. I tend to think you're town because I think your persistent attacking me is genuine rather than opportunistic, although that might be partly meta, and I don't have a problem with the rest of your posts.

I said that I read DGB as town. Null for sucrose at this point (I have not read anything further than this post)
and cityelectrics recent post at the time of me saying that. her vote and her reasoning.

How is it that you have a null on me? A page back you told Spring that you thought that aforementioned vote that I put on DGB at the end of RVS was serious. That was long after I'd clearly explained over the course of several posts that it wasn't a serious vote. Either you (should) think I'm lying or you haven't been reading the thread. Explain please.

[Sucrose]

Oops, meant to quote Amrun #267 for the first part, sorry about that.

Sucrose is trying her best to be neutral and not offend anyone; makes a vote based on an entirely false premise, then backs down on it immediately. Knowing I am voting her, after seeing me express suspicion of piggy, buddies me.

[camn]

i think fujiko is a good person to be pressured.

Fine. I kind of buy Tammy's defense of Electric, anyway... kind of.

UNVOTE
VOTE: FUJIKO.

baa.

[Fujiko]

I don't like that she had to be called out for where her vote was in order to change it (to the most obvious wagon.) This paparapgh is way over justified because she gives reasoning for not just thinking piggy was scum, but because why she had a town read on her before, and then changed it. this shows that she's concerned about what people think of her/ what they will think with a mislynch. plus she doesn't explain what is scummy, just points out some things she doesn't like, which shows lack of true understanding/conviction of the wagon.

Why did I wait until I was called out? Because I hadn't decided where to move it yet.

UNVOTE:

This is me moving my vote, since I still dislike post 213, but the more I read (of both her posts and arguments) Piggy is looking more like town. It'll be somewhere else soon, although likely not tonight, because it's bedtime here.

The biggest wagon was seastorm. I didn't join that wagon, because I couldn't understand it. (I'd still like someone to explain it to me.) I could at least understand the Piggy wagon. I'm currently lacking strong suspects otherwise. I'm not awesome at this scumhunting thing.

Yes, I'm concerned of what people think of me. So is everyone else in this game. I'm trying to explain my thought process, because it's helpful to me when other people do so. (Also, it tells you why my vote wasn't there in the first place.) Votes and reads change.

"Things I don't like" = things that I find weird, inconsistent, what have you... in short: things that I find scummy, or at least potentially scummy. Different wording, same concept.

This looks so much like she doesn't really believe in piggy scum, but is attempting to find reasoning to be on her mislynch, without having to take the blame for it later on.

Or like I'm not sure if I'm reading too much into it. I'm not sure exactly if newly-dead people say "is" or "was" - especially ones that are fairly new. (See point above about different wording.)

In fact, she has explained the shortness of the posts - she was on a cell phone. Sounds like a reasonable explanation to me.

You asked me what I thought about the reaction. I told you.

but i think fujiko is a good person to be pressured. if she's town, she's not doing it right. and she might be scum.

So how should I be doing it?

[DrippingGoofball]

I don't get the Sucrose wagon. Can someone make a case?

Otherwise, the wagon emanates Greyhound fumes.

[DrippingGoofball]

To the noobs: Greyhound fumes means I think Sucrose might be scum that's being bus'ed, because from a townie perspective I don't see Sucrose as scummy.

[Amrun]

@Brandi: You're extrapolating incorrectly. Early game =/= RVS. Catching scum by re-reading early game does not mean that leaving RVS is EVER a scumtell.

@Sucrose: It was never about the vote on DGB, but your reactions to pressure following it.

@DGB: What do you think of my sucrose case?

[Eidolon]

So how should I be doing it?

Not to give too many tips to scum, but you are playing reactionary rather than proactively. If you are town, we can discuss this more at endgame if you want more info.

The post you just made? reactionary. You unvoted as a response to pressure.

You never really thought piggy was scum, did you? You said her response was fakey, yet now that others say it's townie, you unvote. It's the actions that matter. You just wanted a place to put your vote to appease people and make it look like you were contributing.

So you think piggy is town now? Who jumped on her wagon for scummy reasons? Who avoided the wagon for scummy reasons?

DGB, what do you think of fujiko? Who are your scumspects?

[DrippingGoofball]

Eidolon is town.

[Eidolon]

Sucrose is trying her best to be neutral and not offend anyone;

makes a vote based on an entirely false premise, then backs down on it immediately.

Knowing I am voting her, after seeing me express suspicion of piggy, buddies me.

When did she do that? I think you're town amrun, but i don't have a scum read on Sucrose. I'll take a look at her ISO.

[Eidolon]

Eidolon is town.

no sh!t

(DGB is town. It's probably too obvious to be pointing out though.)

[DrippingGoofball]

Looking at isos, I'm more uneasy with Fujiko than with Sucrose, who seems fine to me.

[Sucrose]

Sucrose is trying her best to be neutral and not offend anyone;

makes a vote based on an entirely false premise, then backs down on it immediately.

Knowing I am voting her, after seeing me express suspicion of piggy, buddies me.

When did she do that? I think you're town amrun, but i don't have a scum read on Sucrose. I'll take a look at her ISO.

She's convinced that my dumb RVS vote was dead serious, and that apparently I "backed down on it immediately" when I said so.

[Eidolon]

Oh yeah.... I'm still not sure why you answered her in a serious way if it wasn't a serious vote, but ehhh... i wouldn't say its overwhelmingly scum motivated.

I see in your iso that you say you are leery of telo, ask a few questions to amrun and brandi. do you lean scum on any of these people? why the lack of pressure?

[Sucrose]

Oh yeah.... I'm still not sure why you answered her in a serious way if it wasn't a serious vote, but ehhh... i wouldn't say its overwhelmingly scum motivated.

I see in your iso that you say you are leery of telo, ask a few questions to amrun and brandi. do you lean scum on any of these people? why the lack of pressure?

I only answered seriously because she asked me a theory question, which I answered seriously. Obviously I should have made it more clear that I was joking with the previous post. But I've already said all of this earlier in the thread.

Telo's reaction to DGB's gambit was the first thing from her that really caught my eye as scummy. It's not enough to vote on. Like I said, I don't think Amrun's attacks on me are scum motivated, I don't think she's faking it, thus town. I'm waiting patiently for a reply from brandi.

[Bunnylover]

Unvote.
Vote: Fujiko

I really dislike Fujiko vote on Piggy, it seemed weird to me and really opportunistic.

@Fujiko: Can you explain this more?
"This is me moving my vote, since I still dislike post 213, but the more I read (of both her posts and arguments) Piggy is looking more like town. It'll be somewhere else soon, although likely not tonight, because it's bedtime here."
What post that she has given do you like? What arguments?

[RachMarie]

Telo I can understand, I can even see why peeps are jumping on Fujiko, but why so big a wagon on Seastorm? Am I missing something? RL is being a real b**** to me for a few days. Should settle down after tomorrow though.

ATM I feel pretty good about my Telo vote.

I have seen overreactions by newbies in the newbie games many times so yeah I think CE is probly noobtown.

@DGB what exactly were you trying for with the fake dayvig stuffs?

Will dig into ISO research and come up with more reads soon as I can. Probably closer to weekend though.

I think DGB is probably town too, but I also know she can be very good as scum. ATM though she is really helpful for town so she goes in the town pile. I just do not see anyone, even a very experienced player doing the fake dayvig thingy as scum.

[camn]

DGB would certainly do it as scum. (not that I am suggesting she is here, necessarily.)

[Tammy]

I think DGB is probably town too, but I also know she can be very good as scum. ATM though she is really helpful for town so she goes in the town pile. I just do not see anyone, even a very experienced player doing the fake dayvig thingy as scum.

You don't? This makes no sense at all. You were in heterosexual revolution when my partner fake dayvigged (poisoned) your lover. I know you couldnt have forgotten this, because it was a pretty big deal and you offered to be lunched since you were going to die anyway. I know you can't have forgotten that.

[RachMarie]

oh yeah he was scum wasn't he? But he did not fake dayvig he fake poisoned and then made a serious case that the poisoner could be town, while DGB admitted it was fake right away. TBH the main reason I still felt he was scummy was because he kept it up for so long and was so defensive about it. But it is a good point, I will keep my mind open on DGB.

[DrippingGoofball]

@DGB what exactly were you trying for with the fake dayvig stuffs?

What, fake dayvigs are supposed to come with road maps, contingency plans and predictions, now?

And, of course I could do it as scum. Piggy, on the other hand, is pretty much cleared.

[Fujiko]

Not to give too many tips to scum, but you are playing reactionary rather than proactively. If you are town, we can discuss this more at endgame if you want more info.

The post you just made? reactionary. You unvoted as a response to pressure.

You never really thought piggy was scum, did you? You said her response was fakey, yet now that others say it's townie, you unvote. It's the actions that matter. You just wanted a place to put your vote to appease people and make it look like you were contributing.

So you think piggy is town now? Who jumped on her wagon for scummy reasons? Who avoided the wagon for scummy reasons?

I'll take you up on the more discussion at endgame. I tend to be very cautious and reactionary - see my two completed games. RachMarie was in the first as scum (I was the cop) and got me to L-1. The reasons will look familiar.

I thought Piggy was likely town, until she started talking about reactions etc. At that point I thought she might be scum.

I was trying to fit my Piggy=scum theory with the reaction test. I'm now convinced it was too much of a stretch.

What do people do when they don't know where to put their vote, anyway?

[DrippingGoofball]

oh yeah he was scum wasn't he? But he did not fake dayvig he fake poisoned and then made a serious case that the poisoner could be town, while DGB admitted it was fake right away. TBH the main reason I still felt he was scummy was because he kept it up for so long and was so defensive about it. But it is a good point, I will keep my mind open on DGB.

This has been bugging me. First, there is the scumtell of using "TBH" aka "To Be Honest." Second, this seems like fake sitting on the fence, keeping options open - partly because I know that I did NOT admit it was fake "right away." I didn't need to admit anything as the roles are listed in the OP. The fake-poison vs. fake-dayvig comparison is completely wonky.

I'm willing to lynch Rachmarie over this.