Micro 65: No Town Lynched (Game Over)

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

@ Shos, if you disagree with Thor's read, why are you voting me instead of Thor? I wasn't the one who claimed the quickhammer made me obvtown.

[Equinox]

Vote Count 2.01

F-16_Fighting_Falcon (1) - shos
Nachomamma8 (1) - Thor665

Not Voting (4) - F-16_Fighting_Falcon, Gregory, Nachomamma8, RedCoyote

With 6 alive, it's 4 to lynch.

The deadline is Friday, November 16, 2012, at 8:10 PM EST (UTC-5).

[shos]

because you quickhammered -_-;
I disagree with him, that doesn't make him scummy for that. however, you - you quickhammered town on page 2 of the game. wtf.

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

I had a gut read on MyKonian being scum. I was wrong.

Why, in your opinion does Thor immediately call me "obvtown" if Mykonian flips town?

[Thor665]

@Shos - i do think he's fairly obv. town but am fine with you pressuring him to at least explain his logic.

What's your read on Nacho?

@F-16 - why wouldn't we do that, you think Nacho is town?

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

@ Thor, I don't have a read on Nacho yet.

It is you I am concerned about. If someone else had hammered, I wouldn't think they are obvious town, so the question is: why do you think I am obvious town?

It seems to me like a scum-strategy to elicit reactions from the other townies. Call someone obv-town and hope that the others are flabbergasted enough to say "No! how is he obvtown? Vote F-16." This of course would allow you to distance from a lynch.

Dumb scum would immediately go after someone who quickhammers and try to get them lynched. If that player defends himself and the Day is open long enough, town would eventually realize that the hammerer was town and scum are trying to use that hammer to get him lynched.

Smart scum wouldn't do that. They would call the hammerer obv-town to elicit frustrated reactions from the other townies who would hopefully pressure the hammerer.

Of course, I could be wrong, maybe you are just good as town and was accurate in reading me. But if you are scum, this is exactly the strategy I'd expect a smart player like you to use. If Shos is town, it's working. Same if Nacho is town. Same if Gregory is town. Nobody thinks I am town except for you. Which makes your strategy a good one.

[Thor665]

It is you I am concerned about. If someone else had hammered, I wouldn't think they are obvious town, so the question is: why do you think I am obvious town?

A couple of possibilities for you here;

1. You are town and I am town - I have an accurate read, rejoice!
2. You are scum and I am town - Bwa-ha, you fooled me, rejoice!
3. You are town and I am scum - I have limited my ability to mislynch you later, rejoice!

So...?

It seems to me like a scum-strategy to elicit reactions from the other townies. Call someone obv-town and hope that the others are flabbergasted enough to say "No! how is he obvtown? Vote F-16." This of course would allow you to distance from a lynch.

Of course, I could be wrong, maybe you are just good as town and was accurate in reading me. But if you are scum, this is exactly the strategy I'd expect a smart player like you to use. If Shos is town, it's working. Same if Nacho is town. Same if Gregory is town. Nobody thinks I am town except for you. Which makes your strategy a good one.

[Thor665]

Why don't you have a read on Nacho yet? You were content to end the day, I figured that meant you had some decent reads.
Who do you have reads on?

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

3. You are town and I am scum - I have limited my ability to mislynch you later, rejoice!

Your buddy would still be able to push a mislynch while you can use your "accurate read" for towncred at LYLO. Or maybe you could sit back and watch the town mislynch all on their own. So, I won't discount that possibility.

I don't have a read on Nacho because he made 3 posts this game. One of which is a random vote, the second one, he votes Mykonian and wants to keep the wagon at L-1, the third, he says Gregory is town and that he wouldn't call me town. All these posts read somewhat null to me.

I find Shos slightly scummy for going after me right after the hammer. His 40, and 45 seemed like he was trying too hard to lay the blame on me because I hammered.

Why do you think Nacho is scum?

[Thor665]

Because I agree with Myrk (except on how to play town, natch) in that there was scum on the wagon that lynched him.
I think you and Greg are likely town.
So.

[shos]

@103: and do you really think that 'gut scumread' from 1 page worth of posts is good enough to hammer so quickly?? seriously?
Thor is the next one in my list after you. He has yet to explain to me his train of thoughts about why you are so obvtown, and he continuously pursued me in questions of why I unvoted in L-1 iirc.

You quickhammered, so you're my vote atm; I have no reason to think gregory is scum because - come on, look at his ISO, only one post, containing a half random vote(and the first one). About Nacho - he posted this:

Unvote, Vote: mykonian

My god. If we can't put a wagon to L-1 and keep it there, then what the hell are we? A bunch of pansies?
No.

which is a legit reason. when I unvote at L-1 it is because I'm cautious, and there's lots of people who don't agree with me there - and put more pressure even until L-1. so no scumread here yet.

So you're my main target now, and by poe so far I guess that thor. lurkers need to talk more tho.

~~~

@104: I don't care that you do, I already know that. I care WHY. tell me WHY you think so.

look above for nacho.

@105: I'm gonna lol at the supposed 'strategy' you mentioned. The next sentence you said tho - it rubs me off the wrong way. why is it needed? how is it in context at all? seems like you're trying to give me reasons for why you, "the hammerer", is town. sounds forced. and that last sentence? the fuck? nobody even posted. this post is like uberpeculiar.

post 107 just stresses my point. you A) said that you, by now, STILL don't have any read atr all on Nachomamma, and B) you quickhammered on D1. how does that sleep together? why would you end the day like that? Do you also have no read on Gregory? how bout RedCoyote??

@108: this is not at all trying too hard, it is a big, big, WHAT THE FUCK. who the hell haammers on page 2. whose alt are you?

@thor 109: apart from why-is-f16-so-obvtown-in-your-eyes-goddamit-ffs, why is GREG town?? he literally posted TWICE.

[RedCoyote]

F16, why did you hammer before letting all the players in the game post? I don't mind quick days, but only to a point. I hadn't even logged in before the first day was over. I like to think I can read mykonian fairly well. I've successfully caught him as scum and correctly read him as town on two separate occasions. I'm not saying this to brag; I just want to know why you thought my input was unnecessary.

[Thor665]

Thor is the next one in my list after you. He has yet to explain to me his train of thoughts about why you are so obvtown, and he continuously pursued me in questions of why I unvoted in L-1 iirc.

1. I *did* already explain it.
2. I did pursue you with those questions - how does that matter one way or the other?
3. Links to games you've played in with scum quickhammering Day 1?

@thor 109: apart from why-is-f16-so-obvtown-in-your-eyes-Smurfdamit-ffs, why is GREG town?? he literally posted TWICE.

I like how you ask me the same question three times in the post - go iso me, it can't be that huge, the question was answered.
I also explained my read on Greg too, so...?
And he only posted ONCE when I made that call.

[Thor665]

He is only cleared if Aru is town.

He is cleared because in a game like this - that's not a viable scum play to be the derp hammer, it's fine (and optimal) to be on the wagon, but the spotlight seat? Not so much.

Here's the quote - y'know, for the reading encumbered.

Bold tag fixed. (Equinox)

[shos]

well I probably missed 73, but I think that is completely wifomish. like, 100%.

@112:
1. resolved
2. that's what I said -_- you did not want me to unvote. and the flip was town.
3. none of those games ended so far :\ so no talking about this.

I'm lazy, can you quote me your explanation on Greg like you did with F16?

[Thor665]

Everything in this game is WIFOM. Every town action can be looked at and said of 'but scum might do that to look town' and every scummy action might be done because 'scum do it because it looks so scummy scum wouldn't do it'

It's a silly rebuttal that applies to everything.

2. Yes...and?
3. So you're saying that besides very recently you've never seen it happen? What makes you think it's such a likely scum move than?

My explanation with Greg is actually Nacho's - but I agreed with it. I won't quote it because your laziness is less than my laziness and so I don't care and have already proved that I am awesome and you can't read.

[shos]

lol

I'll answer only 3:

so..
3. yes, I've never seen a quickhammer on D1 like that. and what makes me think it's a scum move? there is absolutely no in any way motivation for town to quickhammer like that.

[Thor665]

But there is motivation for scum to *not* hammer like that.

[Thor665]

I mean, even look at his case on me (and, yeah, I know, it makes me laugh too) look at the level of complexity he is working with there as a conceptual standard. You think the guy claiming that as a scum plan is going to have as his scumplan 'lawl, quickhammah!'

Get back to me on that.

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

RedCoyote, I didn't feel that your input was unnecessary. As I said, I had a gut feeling that Mykonian was scum. He showed disinterest in the game (I've seen this from scum a lot), he didn't answer my questions as to why he felt Thor was town. It is mostly a trigger-reaction. I strongly believed he was scum and wanted to end it hoping I was hammering scum. That would have put us in a better position day 2 because one scum would be gone. I thought of it like a vig-kill. I had an opportunity to kill someone who I strongly felt was scum - I went ahead and took that opportunity. Of course, when I am wrong, it would set the town back. But it was a risk I was willing to take. I didn't know that you could read Mykonian well, so it was probably a mistake not waiting for you.

As for scumreads, right now, I am thinking Shos is likely scum, possibly with Thor. They are doing a ton of arguing but no votes on each other. Shos goes so far as to say Thor is his second biggest target - a convenient place for his buddy.

Also, I explained in 105, why I found Thor suspicious. I'd think he as scum is persuing a very smart strategy. The fact that Shos goes on an all-out attack on Thor while not voting him is concerning to say that least.

I don't have reads on the others yet but more posts from them would help.

who the hell haammers on page 2.

This seems really fake - like trying to fake righteous anger.

[Thor665]

@FF - you don't hammer a lynch as a 'Vig shot' they're totally different things.
Your case on me wouldn't make me smart scum.

I have addressed why I am voting where I am voting - if you think I'm doing it all to protect Shos then why aren't you voting me or him?

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

@FF - you don't hammer a lynch as a 'Vig shot' they're totally different things.
Your case on me wouldn't make me smart scum.

Yes, it would because nobody else caught onto you. I caught on because I am smart town. I may not be the best at persuading players but I am usually always right. That is part of the reason I hammered Myk and was shocked that I was wrong - it rarely happens.

I have addressed why I am voting where I am voting - if you think I'm doing it all to protect Shos then why aren't you voting me or him?

Can't decide which of you is more scummy.

[RedCoyote]

Okay. Please understand that I'm not trying to beat you over the head with this, it just really set us back, I think. I'll read over the game tomorrow most likely given that I've got football to watch today.

[Nachomamma8]

Dumb scum would immediately go after someone who quickhammers and try to get them lynched. If that player defends himself and the Day is open long enough, town would eventually realize that the hammerer was town and scum are trying to use that hammer to get him lynched.

Smart scum wouldn't do that. They would call the hammerer obv-town to elicit frustrated reactions from the other townies who would hopefully pressure the hammerer.

This is sort of what I was expecting if Falcon was town. A player that's too confident for his own good who expects he can defend himself and draw out scum with what would be considered a classically scummy move, but isn't to him because he thinks that good things will come out of it. He's not voting right now AND he's attacking someone who has an obvtown read on him, and meanwhile hasn't really formed any strong reads at all. It all adds up to being super fucking confident that he won't be lynched because he just doesn't give a fuck.

so town reads on Gregory and Falcon so far.
RedCoyote sort of reads town I guess?

Vote: shos

Don't really like the "he's scum because he quickhammered" shit, especially since he's gone on and talked about how many quickhammers he's seen lately. He should know by now that they are not inherently scum or town, unfortunately, and the push on him seems like rush for a quicklynch on him and not "pressure to get an explanation", like Thor calls it.

[Nachomamma8]

Okay. Please understand that I'm not trying to beat you over the head with this, it just really set us back, I think. I'll read over the game tomorrow most likely given that I've got football to watch today.

yeehaw