Open 459: There is a New Scum in Town. Game Over Town Wins!

[Majiffy]

The underlying implications of the question were "why do you see these as scumtells instead of newbtells", as UTC (and myself) see Fizz's actions as more newb rather than scum.

[borkjerfkin]

@LS -- I was saying that there is a plausible (dare I say likely) explanation for Fizz's nervousness other than that he must be scum. That's not an endorsement of Fizztown, it's just something that Kmd jumped on way too quickly early game.

@Breakfast -- yes, that answer makes perfect sense from an outside party trying to analyze and judge what Aether did. However, I would not expect Aether to answer "Why did you do X" with "X isn't scummy in fact here's some other dude doing X and he was town". This just shows me that you're not thinking about what a true town response to that question is.

[pirate mollie]

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BAYBAAAAY!

I compare you to a kiss from a rose on the gray!

OOOOOOOH!

The more I get of you,
The stranger it feels, yeah!
And now that your rose is in bloom,
A light hits the gloom on the gray.

lol, you.

I am not quite sold on a kmd lynch. some of his posts have come across as really townish. what do you think of breakfast and fe. they both pinged for me but I am going to do a reread in iso and then back in the thread for context.

also what about nobody special. he is super followy and just...odd. he isn't really scumhunting, it kind of looks like he is coasting other than his big who he wants to see dead post.

[Kmd4390]

Ok I read that page in full and it looks like I already picked out the important parts.

Majiffy, call me dense but I legitimately don't see how anything in fizz's play is newbish. Until he said I was just going after the new guy, it didn't even occur to me from reading his posts that he may be new. I gave my reasons why he is scum and the fact that he is new doesn't change those reasons in my opinion. The main thing I saw originally was a nervousness that implied a thought of "I hope they don't figure me out", not "I hope I play well". Then he showed the same thing in his answer (if you can even call it an answer) to the "are you scum" question. It looked like someone not wanting to lie and avoiding the question by choosing to focus on why the question was asked rather than focusing on the answer itself. And then there's the whole thing about not wanting to expose himself as scum if he's scum. There is no reason for a townie to think like that. The closes a townie should get to that line of thinking is "I don't want someone to think I am scum" or "I don't want to be lynched". His posting just looks like it is coming from a scum mindset, new or not.

Mollie, I don't remember much of breakfast, but I do remember something standing out about fe. And while I liked Nobody at first (probably biased because he jumped on the wagon I started), I see your point on him. What do you think of director?

[Majiffy]

Nervousness seemed more like "hope I don't get lynched", which can easily be misconstrued as "hope they don't figure me out".
His answer read more like a newb thinking the Socratic Method was the proper way to scumhunt when someone asks you a question.
The whole "not wanting to expose himself" bit was clearly a hypothetical to explain why your read of him was incorrect.

There you go.

[uctriton00]

If you truly have played with "him" before then you would know "he" conciously makes sure to make it known "he" is actually a "female" and wouldn't make that mistake.

Mala caught me as scum in the game I played with her in it. I was caught in like the 3rd post in her ISO and ate her reaction test like it was a fat kid who loves cake. I was pissed at myself for that ****. Plus she looks the same this game as that game so I have her as townie. I trust her gut.

[uctriton00]

some of his posts have come across as really townish.

What's townie about it?

[Fizz]

Sorry for my lack of activity. Just had stuff to do. Was reading, but mostly on my phone, which is a pain in the ass to post from. Will have to reread some stuff, but as soon as i do, i will make a better post.

[borkjerfkin]

lol, you.

I am not quite sold on a kmd lynch. some of his posts have come across as really townish. what do you think of breakfast and fe. they both pinged for me but I am going to do a reread in iso and then back in the thread for context.

also what about nobody special. he is super followy and just...odd. he isn't really scumhunting, it kind of looks like he is coasting other than his big who he wants to see dead post.

That's honestly pretty typical for NS.

[pirate mollie]

some of his posts have come across as really townish.

What's townie about it?

- post #166 is internally consistent with post #278. if he is scum he is not misstepping in his reasoning. his explanation of an omgus is true. town freak out far more than scum cos scum have learned not to do that given it is such a common tell but he specifically highlighted that was why he was not voting for fizz, unless I read that wrong. highlighting this only closes a future option of fosing and pushing a lynch on somebody else if he were scum. what is significant about this is that there is no wking involved since his vote is still on fizz, so as scum, that would have cost him an advantage and I don't see an experienced player doing this.

-post #167 reads as genuine.

-post #190 reads as null leaning possible town.

-post #214 someone will have to explain to me the scum motivation behind this post.

-post #217 reads as he is genuinely asking this question.

to me he is sending out a clear town signal, so that is why I am leaning town on him.

[borkjerfkin]

I also think that 190 would've been a convenient way to jump off Fizz since he was getting a lot of heat for it. I don't think scum is as likely to have jumped right back on him like he did.

[Kmd4390]

Majiffy, the comment about not wanting to expose himself was his reason for not answering "no". I even just went back and read it for like the tenth time and I still don't see it the way you do.

Mollie, the OMGUS thing was actually about the Aether vs Fizz thing. My fizz vote was so early that it wouldn't make any sense at all for anyone to call that OMGUS.

[Lastsurvivor]

@LS -- I was saying that there is a plausible (dare I say likely) explanation for Fizz's nervousness other than that he must be scum. That's not an endorsement of Fizztown, it's just something that Kmd jumped on way too quickly early game.

So you're not defending Fizz...you're just providing an alternative reason for his gameplay so that he's not scum?

OKAY.....

Uct I asked you a question can you answer it please thanks

the director I also asked you a question. I'm not sure if you've answered it or not. Also that point about Uct was a joke right?

[borkjerfkin]

Dude this isn't terribly hard to understand. Being nervous is not a scumtell. End of point.

[Nobody Special]

It can be.

[uctriton00]

Lastsurvivor,

I see him as being "man everyone is mad at me, I'll just be quiet". Very newb town who isn't used to using ATE or any other kind of defense mechanism.

[Lastsurvivor]

Dude this isn't terribly hard to understand. Being nervous is not a scumtell. End of point.

Sure but that's not really my point....
I guess my issue is -- what caused Fizzy to go from just being "nervous" to being an ok wagon in your opinion?

Lastsurvivor,

I see him as being "man everyone is mad at me, I'll just be quiet". Very newb town who isn't used to using ATE or any other kind of defense mechanism.

I haven't gotten that attitude from Fizzy at all. From him, he enjoys talking a lot, even when people are mad at him. People still thought he was scum when he had his fight with Aether, so I'm not buying the line of logic that he just can't handle the game.

[borkjerfkin]

My gripes about Fizz are his providing no content save explanations of previous actions, and general thread avoidance.

[Lastsurvivor]

Alright fair enough.

My problem was that I thought your reason for the Fizz wagon was based on the nervousness you said was previously unreliable. I just noticed you already answered my question in #243 but oh well.

[Fizz]

Fizzy

It's just Fizz. No "y" in there.

I haven't gotten that attitude from Fizzy at all. From him, he enjoys talking a lot, even when people are mad at him. People still thought he was scum when he had his fight with Aether, so I'm not buying the line of logic that he just can't handle the game.

I have nothing to be mad or nervous about. I'm not scum. And yes, i enjoy talking when i have something to say. Sadly, it's kinda tough for me here, because of the experience of the players.

Kmd to me does seem like town, because i just don't see scum being eager to make a case so soon and so vigilantly, hoping for a fast lynch, especially not in a game like this. Would put too much attention on them. But i could be wrong and it's his eagerness and jumping on the first thing that he finds semi scummy (i don't buy his "didn't know he was new" excuse) Not really too sure what to think of him actually.

Mala and Mollie look like definite town to me.

Bork also seems like town. His reasoning is good. Kinda agree with him about breakfast looking scummy.

Fe absolutely made too few posts. Not too sure if that would be considered scummy but it sure doesn't help the town find scum.

LS is actively scumhunting, so he pretty much seems like town to me.

You seem to know more about Majiffy and NS. I am not that sure about either. But Majiffy has good reasoning and his general attitude is giving me a town feeling, but i dunno, too much of one thing can mean he's the other. And NS's posts have far too little substance to get anything out of them. :/

Number six did nothing apart from figuring out majiffys plan to post kiss from a rose, which i have to admit made me listen to it on youtube, such a good song. ^^

I will post my thoughts on penguin, uci and director later, running out of time atm.

[Majiffy]

Majiffy, the comment about not wanting to expose himself was his reason for not answering "no". I even just went back and read it for like the tenth time and I still don't see it the way you do.

You should probably go back and read

my

post again because you apparently didn't the first time. It had nothing to do with his reason for not just answering no.

Number six did nothing apart from figuring out majiffys plan to post kiss from a rose, which i have to admit made me listen to it on youtube, such a good song. ^^

I'nnit?

[Fizz]

To conclude my previous post.

Penguin also has posted far too little and in all of his posts just agreed with people about me, without actually providing any new info or any kind of other type of scumhunting.

Uci's first posts are a bit odd. Lots of jumping from one person to another. Not really sure what to think of that.

director, i hate you for that rick roll. Otherwise, not really sure what to think.

I'd like to see a vote count tbh.

[the director]

the director I also asked you a question. I'm not sure if you've answered it or not. Also that point about Uct was a joke right?

Lastsurvivor I did explain who I thought was scum why they are scum. I am curious why you are just, sorta fine, with me voting Breakfast but you are concerned whether or not my scum read on Utc is a joke.

You are welcome, Fizz, for the rick roll.

[Lastsurvivor]

You made a scum team list, of which you didn't explain why 2/3 of them were scum, which really was what I was curious about.

Also, your rationale for Breakfastscum at least makes sense, even if it's not really strong. Your point about uct is incomprehensible, and I think is just about a typo.

[RachMarie]

Bumping for VC