Newbie 1336 (OVER)

[Mr E Roll]

Jason if you were scum what claim would you make? I bet you wouldn’t claim VT.

[Captain Ribbit]

I see what you're saying, Mr E, but I'm not sure what to do about it. Should we wait for MrZepher to claim, as I'm sure he will when he reappears, and risk a counter claim and outing of any actual PRs, or should we quick lynch and hope that the evidence thus far plays out as hoped?

[Mr E Roll]

I'm not being part of a quick lynch. I actually don't think this day is moving slow at all. We have already identified a probable lynch candidate. And we are beginning to get some discussion going. Why end it now before giving others a chance for input?

Do we really want to get into another RVS tomomorrow as Jason suggests?

What if we are all wrong about MrZ wouldn't you like to have a little more content to base your decisions on tomorrow?

[JasonWazza]

Jason if you were scum what claim would you make? I bet you wouldn’t claim VT.

I will answer this after MrZ claims and i will explain when he does.

Once he claims i will discuss everything about this, can we actually not talk about MrZ claiming until he claims thanks guys.

I'm not being part of a quick lynch. I actually don't think this day is moving slow at all. We have already identified a probable lynch candidate. And we are beginning to get some discussion going. Why end it now before giving others a chance for input?

Do we really want to get into another RVS tomomorrow as Jason suggests?

What if we are all wrong about MrZ wouldn't you like to have a little more content to base your decisions on tomorrow?

I seriously doubt we are all that wrong to be honest, and maybe it's just me thinking it's moving slow.

and honestly the RVS thing was me just saying that'd be better then letting this day continue, it wouldn't actually be an RVS as we already do have (very minor) connections going around.

[MrZepher]

omg merked. I one off'd my last post so bad that I didn't even put everyone in the correct place.
Piss.
Mr E Roll should be null near the bottom and BrightEyedFish should be scum (opportunist voting) and JasonWazza should be scum as well (stretching and misrepresenting basically all over the place). Sorry :/ I was really in a rush to get out of the house but I felt like it was pertinent for me to show that I'm still around. I honestly should have just waited until I had more time to not rush through a post but oh well.
The vote on Mr E Roll is for his his post after Ribbit came in to help point out the flaws in Jason's case. The logic in his post didn't seem entirely sound so I was going to pressure him on it.

Also, the vote on reham over cybertronix or Xtian was purely because I had a neutral read on him. Some of the wording beforehand had come off as way too self-preservative (caring about opinions in such a way that's not indicative of a PR) and that concerned me so I wanted to get a reaction to see how he would handle being randomly voted. Scum in his position (being new to the game) tend to react overly defensive but he shrugged off my vote rather unexpectedly...
The execution was poor, I realized immediately after the fact, but I was hoping to get some sort of reaction out of the whole thing so I could better read specifically Reham. I didn't so I don't have much to show for that little stunt. Oh well.
Besides at the time I was pointing out that either Cyber or Xtian could be scum merely as a move to begin to push us out of RVS(as I've already stated). That by itself is not enough to substantiate a vote.

Xtian's last 2 posts are incredibly scummy by throwing around random suspicion on Ribbit and myself.

Also I don't need to claim until there's an explicit intention to hammer so no I won't be claiming just yet.
If you're going to insist on lynching me today then when I flip town you need to lynch Jasonwazza immediately going into day 2
There's no arguing this. If I'm scum then my flip means Jason has absolutely nothing to worry about since a scum flip will completely invalidate this point .

Where is Cybertronix?

[JasonWazza]

Lol nice try, you failed and you know it, also if your town, your the worst town ever, you being town =/= me scum AT ALL.

More votes lets see what he fake claims.

[Captain Ribbit]

I'm sorry MrZepher, but I don't much care if you were in a rush; if you don't have time to post, then don't post. At this point, I really hope that you are scum, because if not then you have really hurt the town.

The logic in post 98 wasn't sound? Can you elaborate on why you believe this? I find no problems with the reasoning that Mr E Roll laid out, and I found that the logic flowed very easily.

You pressured reham008 by placing one random throw-away vote on him without any explanation? This makes no sense to me, especially during RVS, when everyone expects to be voted randomly. You are precise: your execution of this "stunt" was very poor. Again, I really hope that you are scum.

I find nothing scummy in Xtian's last two posts. He contributed some to discussion and pointed out another inconsistency in your actions, namely your condemnation of Xtian or Cybertronix voting for me in RVS, while the exact same sheepish voting had happened to Mr E Roll when AssMuffin mimicked your vote. You called out Xtian and Cybertronix for the same action that you condoned from AssMuffin.

My opinion of JasonWazza will stand on his own merits if you flip town, and if you flip scum I will be entirely confident in JasonWazza's innocence. However, I will feel slightly more suspicious of BrightEyedFish if you flip scum.

On The Faint Affiliation Between MrZepher and BrightEyedFish:

I would like to move the discussion along to other players. I'm fairly certain that we all agree that MrZepher is at this moment the most suspicious, but there is one thing in post 129 with which I do agree. This is MrZepher's claim regarding BrightEyedFish's opportunist voting.

BrightEyedFish, I feel like your L-1 vote for MrZepher could be an attempt to throw off any future suspicion of your subtle affiliation with MrZepher. In post 18, you passively agreed with MrZepher regarding the apparent suspicious votes of Xtian and Cybertronix. However, in this same post you unvoted your then present option, AssMuffin, who was guilty of the same actions for which you changed your vote to Xtian. Why is this? I don't understand your vote change at all, given that, if Xtian's activity was at that time sufficient for your vote, wouldn't AssMuffin's be as well?

By post 72, the trial against MrZepher had commenced and you made your first action that contradicted his. You gave very little reasoning other than a very concise agreement with JasonWazza, and left no elaboration. You unvoted Xtian, who had been called out by MrZepher for silly reasons, and after JasonWazza's tirade on MrZepher in post 83, you decided that it was safe to put MrZepher at L-1, again with very little elaboration. FoS would have been entirely sufficient at this point to put pressure on him, given that you had already unvoted due to the claims against him. FoS would have also kept MrZepher from being hammered.

MrZepher's read list also lends credence to this theory, as we've seen your alignment in his eyes go from town to scum, which would effectively sever any connection between the two of you. Please note how passively MrZepher mentioned that you, BrightEyedFish, should have been under scum on his list, severing the connection in a manner incredulous enough to be ignored by the majority of players.


I understand that these accusations are rather flimsy and based on the assumption that MrZepher is in fact scum, which is yet to be seen. This is my attempt to move discussion along, as I feel that any discussion regarding MrZepher's alignment will only go in circles until more tells come to light.

BrightEyedFish, could you provide for us more of your opinions regarding the game as whole up to this point? You have said very little of substance so far, and I would really like your take on the events surrounding MrZepher, the claims against him, and my defense of him.

[JasonWazza]

Just a point i'd like to make, if MrZ is scum and we are going to lynch him no matter what you are giving a road map right now to the remaining scum on who to kill.

This is not productive if we are likely to lynch someone giving scum a road map right now is NOT helpful.

[Captain Ribbit]

Ah, I get your point. I'm hard pressed to find anything else to discuss, but really want to push the game along.

[JasonWazza]

vote MrZ put him to L-1 and get someone to claim intent?

[JasonWazza]

Ummm just for everyone's knowledge i am going to contact SingerSigner as our mod hasn't posted anywhere on site since he last did a VC (over 2 days ago)

[Mr E Roll]

The vote on Mr E Roll is for his his post after Ribbit came in to help point out the flaws in Jason's case. The logic in his post didn't seem entirely sound so I was going to pressure him on it.

It’s incredible that the vote on me was based on something I posted because I got it before I even replaced into the game! Lynch all liars.

Also, the vote on reham over cybertronix or Xtian was purely because I had a neutral read on him.

Wait I thought you voted against him because of a bad and scum motivated post?

My vote on Reham was based on a bad and potentially scum motivated post.

Yeah that’s what you said earlier. Were you lying then or are you lying now? Doesn’t matter--lynch all liars.

Vote:MrZepher

This is placing MrZ one vote away from being lynched do not vote for him unless you want to see him dead. Claims of accidental hammering will not be believed

[JasonWazza]

hey Ribbit come in and claim intent, but no-one is to hammer until he claims and then i explain why i didn't explain to MrE the best claim for MrZ

[Captain Ribbit]

I think you know why I'm here. I've come for your claim, MrZepher.

[JasonWazza]

Best intent ever lol

[Cybertronix]

Hey all. It was a busy weekend for me. One of my good friends got married. I'll catch up this afternoon.

[BrightEyedFish]

Hi! Weekends are always bad for me to get any constructive post in.

BrightEyedFish

, can you explain this "overkill" vibe that you mentioned in a little more detail? I do not find gut feelings to be of much help. It is natural to sound defensive when one is defending themselves; I dare say that if you were defending yourself, you would seem defensive as well.

What I meant is that, his "defensiveness" was causing me to read his posts as "forced" and not "genuine" Meaning, I think his post come out of a necessity to clear his name instead of being truthful.

BrightEyedFish, I feel like your L-1 vote for MrZepher could be an attempt to throw off any future suspicion of your subtle affiliation with MrZepher. In post 18, you passively agreed with MrZepher regarding the apparent suspicious votes of Xtian and Cybertronix. However, in this same post you unvoted your then present option, AssMuffin, who was guilty of the same actions for which you changed your vote to Xtian. Why is this? I don't understand your vote change at all, given that, if Xtian's activity was at that time sufficient for your vote, wouldn't AssMuffin's be as well?

By post 72, the trial against MrZepher had commenced and you made your first action that contradicted his. You gave very little reasoning other than a very concise agreement with JasonWazza, and left no elaboration. You unvoted Xtian, who had been called out by MrZepher for silly reasons, and after JasonWazza's tirade on MrZepher in post 83, you decided that it was safe to put MrZepher at L-1, again with very little elaboration. FoS would have been entirely sufficient at this point to put pressure on him, given that you had already unvoted due to the claims against him. FoS would have also kept MrZepher from being hammered.

MrZepher's read list also lends credence to this theory, as we've seen your alignment in his eyes go from town to scum, which would effectively sever any connection between the two of you. Please note how passively MrZepher mentioned that you, BrightEyedFish, should have been under scum on his list, severing the connection in a manner incredulous enough to be ignored by the majority of players.

BrightEyedFish, could you provide for us more of your opinions regarding the game as whole up to this point? You have said very little of substance so far, and I would really like your take on the events surrounding MrZepher, the claims against him, and my defense of him.

Ok, hopefully I will answer all of your thoughts on my actions, let me know if I miss anything.
Ok My vote on AssMuffin was purely 100% RVS and based on nothing substantial at all, so my vote change to Xitan was my first vote based on the first "vibe" I received at those early stages. I really had nothing to go on except of the double vote.
My next vote switch to MrZep was honestly swayed my Jason's post, I really add nothing to add at that time, as I feel he summed up basically how I felt.

I still think MrZep is scum and why he has me listed as Town, but later (Post 129) he said I "should be scum" and citing "opportunist voting" as his reasoning.

Now for my thoughts on MrZep from my vote on him until the present:
Nothing really has changed, he has only posted twice since. The first was his Town/Null/Scum list and his second post was (I guess) just and elaboration on the previous list, with some alterations. Nothing to change my stance on him.

As Far as the rest of the dialogue in the game.
Apart from MrZep, I do not have a solid read on any other player. And if MrZep is lynched, then depending on how he flips. My reads will change and D2 should be very interesting.

Since MrZep has been called out to give a claim, I will wait until that happens before I take try to do some more scumhunting.

[Messiah]

Newbie 1336 - Vote Count 1.5

---

MrZepher [L-1] - AssMuffin, JasonWazza, BrightEyedFish, Mr E Roll

Captain Ribbit [L-2] - Cybertronix, Xtian, reham008
reham008 [L-4] - MrZepher

Not Voting (1):

Captain Ribbit

With nine alive it takes five to lynch.

---

Phase Deadline:

(expired on 2013-03-18 20:00:00)

[Xtian]

Your suspicions of me are based entirely around the fact that you have accepted that MrZepher is scum.

Well yeah basically, it's a soft fos based on association, by you defending him, when he's already landed on his face a couple of times. But I won't think of it much for now, seeing as we haven't even seen what Zepher has flipped as.

Anyways I've left my vote for way too long now that I realize it.

UNVOTE: Captain Ribbit

Xtian's last 2 posts are incredibly scummy by throwing around random suspicion on Ribbit and myself.

Random suspicion? You make it sound like I'm pulling it out of my ass.

[JasonWazza]

Seriously i am nearly certain that if MrZ is scum that Ribbit isn't.

Major difference between him and everyone else is he is looking back and going through everything and actually using HIS OWN logic to be convinced of town/scum, not to mention do you see scum defending a partner;
a) this early
b) that hard
c) and one that already has like 5-6 votes prone on him.

I think his actions thus far is more likely to be town.

[MrZepher]

Jailkeeper

[Captain Ribbit]

And what would you have chosen, JasonWazza?

[JasonWazza]

OK now for my explaination and why i don't believe that

Best claim for scum to make is in fact JailKeeper, why?

Because they always have a reason not to die overnight, they can fake roleblocking a scum player.

Only claim i would have considered MrZ being town with, Doctor, because there is no use claiming doctor as a scum player.

Let's lynch him.

[MrZepher]

lol. Best scum claim is Cop.

Doctors and Jailkeepers are garunteed nightkills after they've claimed (unless they both exist in the same game) so you mind as well lynch me today

and YES me flipping town = Jasonwazza is scum.
He literally suggested going BACK into RVS after flip information is presented. How is that not scummy as fuck?
He hasn't even tried to shed ANY light on any other player in the game
He tunneled me into what now seems to be my lynch by using a pretty weak case but w/e
He's disorienting to town and he needs to not be present if you want any chance at winning this game.

I'm not going to hammer myself since that's an incredibly stupid thing to do if you're not scum.

[JasonWazza]

lol. Best scum claim is Cop.

Doctors and Jailkeepers are garunteed nightkills after they've claimed (unless they both exist in the same game) so you mind as well lynch me today

and YES me flipping town = Jasonwazza is scum.
He literally suggested going BACK into RVS after flip information is presented. How is that not scummy as fuck?
He hasn't even tried to shed ANY light on any other player in the game
He tunneled me into what now seems to be my lynch by using a pretty weak case but w/e
He's disorienting to town and he needs to not be present if you want any chance at winning this game.

I'm not going to hammer myself since that's an incredibly stupid thing to do if you're not scum.

Lets see how many times you just lied.

Best scum claim being cop, no because a cop has to give results each night and not being night killed is shifty.

JK is not guaranteed if you are scum and can fake claim a block on someone.

I suggested lynching you now and going back into RVS would be better then not lynching you now.

I have shed light on both Ribbit and MrE being town, the rest just makes the kill WIFOM based.

It's apparently such a weak case that everyone in this town believes you are scum just as firmly as me

This last one is just crap, i brought the town together to lynch you sorry scum ass.

So lets see that is 5 lies. Please Lynch All Liars.

But lets look at what i have actually done;
Tried my best to help the town avoid a fuck ton of WIFOM
Proven your either retarded town or Flailing like wild as scum.
Called Ribbit and MrE town as long as you are scum.
Brought you to the brink of a lynch.

So yeah keep flailing scum.