Open 480 - C9++ Game Over!

[implosion]

pieceofpecanpie. When you quote the first line from my post several times, pretending that i said it more than once, then yes, you are refusing to partake in actual discourse about what has been said.

I find arguments about things like "tone" highly subjective, easy to misinterpret, and poorly representative of one's alignment.

Agree, agree, disagree. They're usually subtle, but they can be some of the most telling things. If someone is inconsistent in tone, that can often reflect scumminess because they're trying too hard.

[pieceofpecanpie]

pieceofpecanpie. When you quote the first line from my post several times, pretending that i said it more than once [...]

That's not what I did. I used your own words against you to present a fallacy in your argument.

[...] then yes, you are refusing to partake in actual discourse about what has been said.

Not agreeing with your reasoning, logic and judgement is not the same as refusing to partake in actual discourse. I am partaking in discourse right now. I have been, and will continue to do so. Including with people beyond yourself. That you don't enjoy the "discourse" coming from me doesn't phase me one iota.

[implosion]

if by "fallacy" you mean "thing that wasn't said" then you're right.

And I'm absolutely fine with having my reasoning, logic or judgment called into question. I am markedly NOT okay with having reasoning, logic and judgment that is not mine called into question under my name.

[pieceofpecanpie]

What???

I copy-pasted. You said it.

Are you accusing me of falsely quoting you? Have you read your own words? Do you understand the points you are making at all? (since they make little sense, I doubt this last one)

[pieceofpecanpie]

I am markedly NOT okay with being called a liar or a cheat.

I have taken what you said, quoted it and represented how it is contradictory to (at least) 3 other statements in your #343.

Maybe it's time you pulled your act together and did something this game rather than needlessly troll me with idiotic banter and illogical statements.

[implosion]

I copy-pasted. You said it.

now you're just asking me to rage at you

i said it once. in 347 you copy-pasted it in three separate locations as if i responded to all of your points with it.

i'm not even going to continue this discussion if you're just going to be like this

i'm not trolling, you're just literally pulling shit out of the ether and pretending that it's legitimate, and it's beginning to piss me off a little

[pieceofpecanpie]

I copied ALL of it out of your post.

I countered

your

points with

your own

contradictory statement.

Who cares anyway. Rage at me all you like. You cannot seem to grasp what is going on and it's beginning to piss me off a little.

[implosion]

*sigh*.

Dropping that argument.

What's your read on me?

[Cub Daigoro]

This is so town v town.

Can we find scum now? Implosion, forgetting the fact that it aligns with your read on him, what is your reaction to GM's vote on PPP?

[Cub Daigoro]

Two and a half days now, and our biggest wagons are L-4...

[pieceofpecanpie]

What's your read on me?

I guess that was directed at me?

Currently I consider you VI material, although I can conceive your defence of Safety and needless tunneling in ignorance of other notable players to be scummy.

Two and a half days now, and our biggest wagons are L-4...

This wouldn't be concerning if there wasn't an air of passivity about the game. I'll put some concise general reads out as soon as possible, but I really feel Apozzle is a good choice for Day 1 lynch and will be pushing this.

There are quite a few players who haven't said much and/or posted in quite a while. It would be nice to hear from them.

[Cub Daigoro]

This wouldn't be concerning if there wasn't an air of passivity about the game.

^This.

Who else are you looking at besides Apozzle?

I'm currently favoring goodmorning, SafetyDance, or failing either of those, Nobody Special.

[pieceofpecanpie]

I'm currently favoring goodmorning, SafetyDance, or failing either of those, Nobody Special.

That list checks out just fine by me, but I need to take my blinders off and summarise where I'm at with all players before I'm more certain on favourites (which I won't be doing right now, as it's 3:30am).

[Cub Daigoro]

@MOD, Requesting a prod of Zaicon (I think rule 14 means I can request this now?)

[Apozzle]

Welcome HD. You already have a higher post count than your predecessor. Good job. I can tell we are going to be friends.

Wow, good job ignoring questions asked directly of you

Apozzle, do you have any thoughts yet on ac983fan, Belisarius, or Zaicon?

Ooh a good vote

VOTE: Apozzle

Actually, it is not. My post was obviously token activity to avoid a prod.

I am halfway through rereading everyone right now - I just wanted to point out an instance of how ac rolls.

[Zaicon]

I didn't realize it had been so long since my last post... sorry.

pieceofpecanpie

At this point, I agree with Cub Daigoro:

This is so town v town.

I'm willing to believe that PoPP's reaction (the one I originally voted for him about) might have been more based on playstyle than alignment, so I don't think it's worthy of a vote anymore.

Nobody Special

I dislike the fact that he isn't contributing much, but for a Day 1 lynch, there are better lynches. Reasons have been explained by various users already.

Apozzle

I don't like the fact that he hasn't done much for the game. I have no idea what the point of post 162 was about, and I don't like that fact. I'm going to hope that Apozzle posts something productive soon (as in, not NS-related), which his last post implied he would do.

goodmorning

I really, really dislike your "explanations" of your reads. You did the same thing in our last game where you were scum. You are not providing any of your reasoning: "that's good/bad" is absolutely useless to anyone other than yourself. I would appreciate it if you clearly explained your thoughts on anyone you find particularly scummy (or particularly townie, for that matter).

VOTE: goodmorning

[Human Destroyer]

Welcome HD. You already have a higher post count than your predecessor. Good job. I can tell we are going to be friends.

Wow, good job ignoring questions asked directly of you

Apozzle, do you have any thoughts yet on ac983fan, Belisarius, or Zaicon?

Ooh a good vote

VOTE: Apozzle

Actually, it is not. My post was obviously token activity to avoid a prod.

I am halfway through rereading everyone right now - I just wanted to point out an instance of how ac rolls.

A post which simultaneously buddies me, avoids a question, AND doesn't provide content? Right, why shouldn't you be lynched?

[Human Destroyer]

@Cub Daigoro:

Tell me why you don't want to lynch Apozzle, my first impression of him was that he was scum.

[Cub Daigoro]

I'd rather not divulge the reasons behind all my town reads at this time, but when the time comes I will. In the meantime, do you have any other scum reads?

[Human Destroyer]

I'd rather you did; if you want to convince me not to lynch someone, you should probably tell me why so they don't get lynched.

Saying they're town for *reasons* is kinda weaksauce and doesn't really convince me to unvote.

I'm probably going to read the game and form some reads at some point though, so expect that sometime.

[Cub Daigoro]

I'm trying to convince you to unvote at the moment, just to keep your options open.

[Cub Daigoro]

EBWOP: not

[Nobody Special]

obviously

I don't think this word means what you think it means.

unvote

Vote: Apozzle

[goodmorning]

DAMMIT IT'S LION TIME
Alright, here we go. Beli, your answer will be in this post. Cub, stop making me question my read on you. Zai, you're silly.

POST-BY-POST CASE ON PPP GOOOO
101: FoS on NS.
Why it's scummy: NS was being talked about as a potential lynch candidate. FoSing the easy target is scummy.
107: Suspicion of Safety for jumping votes. Also says NS's playstyle is less suspicious than it would be for others due to meta.
Why it's scummy: Two hours elapsed between what basically amounts to calling NS your scummiest player and calling his playstyle not that suspicious. With the amount of content he posted (hint: none) playstyle is the only estimator you could possibly have based either read on. Why the inconsistency?
110: Point-by-point on Safety's jump.
Why it's scummy: Besides the misrepping of Safety? Maybe I'm taking semantics too far, but "Can you tell a different

story

?" implies that you are making it up.
113: Questions Cheery's assessment of meta.
Why it's scummy: Those are the kinds of questions Scum asks. Town would either disagree or admit a mistake plainly rather than frolicking through words to try and veil the real purpose of them.
120 and 121: Same stuff on Safety.
Why it's scummy: Why did it take so long? The timing here is incredibly strange.
129: Asks Safety whether his given reason for the vote switch was the best one.
Why it's scummy: Besides the negative language (which I'm not sure is deliberate) and the general dickishness (which I'm sure is), mainly it's referring to Safety's vote switch as "alarming".
130: "My reaction has been towards your reasons and who you took it off"
Why it's scummy: Besides more weirdness on the NS front, the idea that agreeing with someone means you shouldn't vote them.
Some Null one-liners follow, then there's
171: Calls implosion scummy for being flippant.
Why it's scummy: Besides even more NS weirdness, flippant =/= scummy.
179: Calls Apozzle scummy for that stupid stunt he did.
Why it's scummy: Fourth lynch candidate in 80 hours? Bit quick to set up lynches, sir.
185: Some questions.
Why it's scummy: They're useless questions.
190: Response to Zai.
Why it's scummy: A complete shift in reasoning as to why Safety's jump looked scummy to him.

I'll do 212 onwards tonight because CASES ARE SO GODDAMNED BORING AND I CAN'T DO ANY MORE RIGHT NOW

Also let me rephrase my 337:
You want a specific critique of your points? THEY ARE SPECIFICALLY FUCKING DESPERATE, THERE'S YOUR FUCKING CRITIQUE

[goodmorning]

Oh, @Zai: I try to avoid going too in depth on reasoning unless nobody else sees what I am talking about. I don't want scums stealing my precious points.