Newbie 1336 (OVER)

[Ms Marangal]

It was out of the Norm, usually I would think the biggest threat of the game to be the subject of the NK so you or my previous slot. I also fully expected an SE to be killed if it wasn't you.


and Reham? I think he's a mislead townie. has good intentions, but those intentions isn't the smartest thing to do. I also notice how Svental or w/e sheep you the moment he replaced in

[JasonWazza]

Lololol

Ms M are you always like this as scum?

Yes major threat is a viable kill target, it's also the main targets with a bunch of ties to people.

Less Active = Less ties

Also you failed to answer how i'm not scumhunting when i have lead the previous lynch and have been leading the current one.

[Ms Marangal]

you lead the lynch yes, but to me it looks like a scum lead lynch. I don't agree with the reasons for the MrZ lynch, and the Reham lynch seems to be based on the fact that he made a few mistakes. if anything, he's a null read

[JasonWazza]

Funny that, MrZ was thought as scummy by the majority of the player list and now it looks like a town cred leap here ^

As for Reham, why does making mistakes not mean that they could be mistakes coming from scum?

[Ms Marangal]

Scum can easily make mistakes, though Town are more likely to do such. Scum tend to be more careful with what they say then townies are, and with that care, they can easily catch any mistake before they make a post.

[JasonWazza]

Townies can take care as well, Your logic is astoundingly faulty.

What your saying is that Amount of Mistakes made is an alignment tell, it is in fact a playstyle tell.

Some people always make mistakes, Some people hardly ever, regardless of alignment, disguising it as an alignment tell is just plain stupid.

[Svenskt Stål]

It was out of the Norm, usually I would think the biggest threat of the game to be the subject of the NK so you or my previous slot. I also fully expected an SE to be killed if it wasn't you.


and Reham? I think he's a mislead townie. has good intentions, but those intentions isn't the smartest thing to do. I also notice how Svental or w/e sheep you the moment he replaced in

I like the first part, I share that thought process. If Jason is alive at the end of the game he should be considered a suspect because of it. My read on him however is that he seems pissy, he seems to want to get shit done.

For the sake of discussion, I find the distinction between asking "Are you town?" and "Are you scum?" to be entirely trivial.

You may be right.

But either way the question was asked the only obvious answer would be for Cybertronix to assert that he is town. Therefore the only way for Mr. Z’s hypothesis to be correct is for him to be scum.

Honestly the only use for a question like "are you town/scum?" is fluff which is wasteful.

Can we move into a non stupid discussion please?

We don't need your life story just read the game >.>

No offense or anything.

These post shows me an eager townie. I think if Jason is a mafia he would think twice before being rude because its a newbie game and newbies apply alot of feelings into their voting. He would more likely befriend everyone in my opinion.

[Svenskt Stål]

And what is sheeping intended to mean Marangal?

[Ms Marangal]

Sheeping means you are following someone

[Svenskt Stål]

Scum can easily make mistakes, though Town are more likely to do such.

Scum tend to be more careful with what they say then townies are

, and with that care, they can easily catch any mistake before they make a post.

This is the reason reham is a suspect to me, the following post seems very well thoughtout before he hammered MrZ.

OK, I would be hurtful to town if this goes any longer as someone may change their vote and relieve the pressure on MrZepher.
UNVOTE:
If he turns out scum, then BrightEyedFish will become a suspect. And I will ask for claim. After that will be my explanation and possibly my role.
If MrZepher flips town, then a few people will become suspects.
JasonWazza - for he was the leading man to this lynch.
Captain Ribbit - for protecting MrZepher even though the evidences were obvious.
reham008 - for being unpredictable. Yes, I will not deny it, I done some unexpected things which even led to MrZepher accusing me. (Kinda sorry for him xD)
BrightEyedFish - for the suspicious opportunist vote.

For these following reasons, you are therefore hammered...
Claiming to be a town.
Appeared to have a prior to game information.
He also suspected someone but didn't change his vote to them, which is very unlikely for a town aligned SE.
Voting without justification.
The backtrack.
Not remembering (or purposefully forgetting) where your vote is.
Posting fast and making mistakes, highly unlikely again for a SE.
Made a bad read list, even doesn't say who asked for it, or explaining it.
And for the other things that makes him look scummy.
Unclear intentions.

Please refer to Post #83.
And Post #98.

VOTE: MrZepher

[JasonWazza]

Following blindly, it's funny cause i clearly see a PoE going on in getting your scum reads, you just so happen to get one on her so it must be sheeping

I like the first part, I share that thought process. If Jason is alive at the end of the game he should be considered a suspect because of it. My read on him however is that he seems pissy, he seems to want to get shit done.

Thats kinda a shit reason to suspect me, there can be multiple reasons i would get left alive even as a strong player.

Like Nachomamma8 did in this game: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=23207 for being way off about the people who were actually scum.

P-Edit: Ninja'd

[Svenskt Stål]

Sheeping means you are following someone

Lady, do I look like a follower? I am captaining this vessel.

[Ms Marangal]

He has a read on me? really?

I was talking about him sheeping you onto Reham

Pedit: sure...

[Svenskt Stål]

You can speak to me directly, I dont bite, I have pie.

[JasonWazza]

He has a read on me? really?

I was talking about him sheeping you onto Reham

Pedit: sure...

Yeah "sheeping"

Spoiler: sheeping

The Night kill

So the wolves killed Xtian, I think that implicates Captain Ribbit. Xtian starts the game by voting him then associates him with MrZepher who would become the lynch. I can see this being a "Cop hunt" where the mafia thought Xtian had a mafia in Ribbit.

My town

BrightEyedFish
My most riliable town read, he was also the top townie for MrZepher who we know was a villager. I have been agreeing with his thoughtprocess in most posts.

MrE
Has had a more aggresive approach but I think he is a townie too. He has been suspicious with BEF this lynch day but I can see it being townie on townie violence.

Cybertronix
I liked his post where he explained concerns about loosing a power role, even if I dont agree with the content I can still see a townie doing it.

Jason Wazza
Having very little time for stupidity which I think and hope is a sign of an eager townie. I have also been agreeing with him on his case against reham, rehams vote yesterday really looked like it was a checklist for town approval. At the same time I am hesitant since he is the most experienced player in the game he would be capable of doing this as mafia. That is not fair, I know but still the thought bothers me.


Mafia
Ribbit - Is implicted by the NK
Reham - I agree with Jason on reham.

Holy crap batman he used PoE and agreed with me on a person who is scum he must be sheeping.

[Svenskt Stål]

I'm on page 7 and I'm already fairly convinced that Jason is scum. all I did was skim through, but he did a bucket load of IIoA (yeah, I get you're IC, but you do have to scum hunt too) and pushed some pretty bad stuff IMO and I'm still baffled as to why you decided to continue the claimed JK, the reason you used was intense as fuck WIFOM

The more I think about this the more I think you are right. If player A claims to be jailkeeper uncontested you dont lynch that person, the mafia will kill him at night. If player A is still alive the next day then you lynch him, an experienced player should know this.

[Svenskt Stål]

VOTE: JasonWazza

[JasonWazza]

I'm on page 7 and I'm already fairly convinced that Jason is scum. all I did was skim through, but he did a bucket load of IIoA (yeah, I get you're IC, but you do have to scum hunt too) and pushed some pretty bad stuff IMO and I'm still baffled as to why you decided to continue the claimed JK, the reason you used was intense as fuck WIFOM

The more I think about this the more I think you are right. If player A claims to be jailkeeper uncontested you dont lynch that person, the mafia will kill him at night. If player A is still alive the next day then you lynch him, an experienced player should know this.

This is Mafia WIFOM

Think of it this way, Mafia procedds to not kill the Jailkeeper and we just have a WIFOMic ball of crap and a delayed mislynch.

Not to mention even more WIFOMic crap with the fact that the "JK" may have blocked the Night Kill or saved the target and there comes a crap load more WIFOM.

Not to mention that it's the best Mafia sided fake claim cause they can cause a mislynch from a fake block and still be considered town.

And the fact that again 6/7 still wanted the lynch to go through, clearly the optimal lynch was Mr Z

[JasonWazza]

I love how people are still trying to pin the lynch solely on my head though.

[Svenskt Stål]

I'm on page 7 and I'm already fairly convinced that Jason is scum. all I did was skim through, but he did a bucket load of IIoA (yeah, I get you're IC, but you do have to scum hunt too) and pushed some pretty bad stuff IMO and I'm still baffled as to why you decided to continue the claimed JK, the reason you used was intense as fuck WIFOM

The more I think about this the more I think you are right. If player A claims to be jailkeeper uncontested you dont lynch that person, the mafia will kill him at night. If player A is still alive the next day then you lynch him, an experienced player should know this.

This is Mafia WIFOM

Think of it this way, Mafia procedds to not kill the Jailkeeper and we just have a WIFOMic ball of crap and a delayed mislynch.

Not to mention even more WIFOMic crap with the fact that the "JK" may have blocked the Night Kill or saved the target and there comes a crap load more WIFOM.

Not to mention that it's the best Mafia sided fake claim cause they can cause a mislynch from a fake block and still be considered town.

And the fact that again 6/7 still wanted the lynch to go through, clearly the optimal lynch was Mr Z

I have a hard time beliving that the mafia dont kill a claimed jailkeeper since they can block the mafia, thus claiming to know a wolf day 2 + having saved a townie. It also very convinient for the mafia to have a jailkeeper lynch for these reasons since that gives the mafia 2 kills. Anfd all this talk about WIFOM is just another way of saying that you are lazy, there is information in everything, you just have to look at it from the right angle.

[JasonWazza]

OK lets assume instead of lynching MrZ we didn't

Lynch of a VT Day 1
Night 1 no kill
Day 2 lynch JK

That's one possibility

Lynch of a VT day 1
Night 1 no kill
JK's "protect" gets lynched and flips VT
Night 2 Kill another VT
Day 3 Lynch the claimed JK

See the problem with these things?

[Svenskt Stål]

OK lets assume instead of lynching MrZ we didn't

Lynch of a VT Day 1
Night 1 no kill
Day 2 lynch JK

That's one possibility

Lynch of a VT day 1
Night 1 no kill
JK's "protect" gets lynched and flips VT
Night 2 Kill another VT
Day 3 Lynch the claimed JK

See the problem with these things?

You are basing this on the mafia chosing to not use their night kill, seems very far fetched. Ofcourse everything that is possible, is possible. But just becuase an action can have two causes dont mean you cant derive data from it. Constructing these WIFOM (I hate that word) scenarios takes away so much from the game.

Also in both your scenarios the town actually won a day because of the absence of night kill, the next day should be no lynches, so you actually can go no lynch and just have an interaction day 2.

You are also totally missing the third possibility which is that he is in fact the jailkeeper and he did save a townie and he knows one mafia, thats so fucking huge.

[JasonWazza]

Yeah and both of the scenarios we still ended up just lynching the JK just later.

[JasonWazza]

Also i'm pointing out the reasons why lynching is right.

Yes you can read things but it ends up being WIFOM.

[Svenskt Stål]

I refuse to belive that, is it certain? No. If you are looking for certainty you are playing the wrong game.

If all we have for information is absolute certainty then what are we doing here? I chose to belive, and I think I am right, that information exists in everything.