Open 480 - C9++ Game Over!

[pieceofpecanpie]

It wasn't a request. "Case incoming". Means you had something tangible. If you didn't write it up, if you have no case....well, it's just another nail in the coffin to your credibility.

What planet are you on? Keep on ego-tripping. You've indicated no interest in voting Belisarius or reading any of my reasoning. You continue to make snide remarks between others about how I make no sense, as if this backslapping is somehow a key element to the game. Forget it.

[Cheery Dog]

So other/actual scum reads?

I'm still using PoE, so the list of people I'm not willing to lynch constitutes my reads.

Looking forward to Susan's case, though. I've got me Spock ears all ready to go.

So you have a total of two high town reads and other 7 are null..
That's surely helpful with 11 players alive
(and for those that can count but not use logic, I've removed the "of course"s out of the equation. I believe beli only added them so the reads list looks better, and lack of scum reads shows lack of scum hunting.

PoE doesn't help when it's still relatively early game. It's an excuse to not commit to reads.

[Belisarius]

You can cut the smarmy crap. I switched votes to implosion, haven't switched back yet, have clearly stated my preferences and will assess what's happening vis-à-vis replacement and deadline to determine what I do. For the time being consider your request for me to devote my time drafting a more detailed case on Belisarius denied.

Where is it written that the case and vote must come together? Has your wit deserted you? As to mine, 'tis in my scabbard. Shall I draw it?

Melenkurion abatha!

You are a villain; I jest not: I will make it good how you dare, with what you dare, and when you dare. Do me right, or I will protest your cowardice.

[implosion]

1) To-may-to, to-mah-to. Most of us are saying one, you are saying the other.

No, I'd agree with both.

We're playing cautiously, you'd prefer to be reckless. Yes, he could be a scum RB, it was mentioned a couple of times but why take the chance IF he's town?

You're using this word, cautiously. I do not think it means what you think it means.

How's this.

Yes, he could be a town RB, it was mentioned a couple of times but why take the chance IF he's scum? We could wind up letting him as a scum RB live another day.

both ways of doing it are risky.

I'm not advocating that we throw caution to the wind, i'm advocating that we lynch someone who i think is scum.

It leaves us on a wing and a prayer with the other side holding all the chips.

*sigh*.
see my third point. It denies us of a nearly-useless power role.

If we lynch town

at all

it leaves us on a wing and a prayer with the other side holding all the chips. Hence, i'm advocating that we try to lynch

scum

.

2) It's not being afraid, it's postponing till tomorrow at worst case scenario.

I haven't seen any valid justification. Again, my third point defeats the justification of "but we get a day of use of the roleblocker" because the roleblocker is nearly as bad as useless, and can in fact have negative utility if it hits another town PR.

I'm certainly not afraid to lynch him. The fact he claimed RB makes me more comfortable to lynch him over a doc/cop claim.

*sigh*.

3) I don't disagree with the start of this but the rest is just pre-nk spec. It's just as bad as pop in #789.

Okay, let's refine it a bit then. Instead of speculating, let's list out every possibility if we leave him alive and he's town, as well as if he's scum.

If he's town:
-NS blocks killing scum, no kill.
-NS blocks a vanilla townie/nonkilling scum, scum kill.
-NS blocks a vanilla townie/nonkilling scum, no kill.
-NS blocks a town power role, scum kill.
-NS blocks a town power role, no kill.

If he's scum:
-NS blocks a vanilla townie, scum kill.
-NS blocks a vanilla townie, no kill.
-NS blocks a town power role, scum kill.
-NS blocks a town power role, no kill.

You'll notice that each of the first situations is indistinguishable from at least one of the second situations, and vice versa - so letting NS block gives us little or no information about his alignment. Additionally, you'll notice that no matter what NS's alignment is, and no matter whether or not there is a kill, the blocked person may be town or scum.

I'm not saying that any particular thing

will

happen. I'm saying that since any of these could happen, we gain no info.

I think you should consider HD.

I did consider him; i gave a weak townread on him a bit back.

[Gammagooey]

Thurhame is replacing Zaicon! votecount will go up after I send him the role PM.

[Gammagooey]

Votecount #21

Belisarius (2) Edosurist, Cheery Dog
Edosurist (2) Thurhame, ac1983fan
Nobody Special (1) implosion
Human Destroyer(1) SafetyDance
SafetyDance (1) Human Destroyer
ac1983fan (1) Nobody Special
implosion (1) pieceofpecanpie
Cheery Dog (0)
pieceofpecanpie (0)
Apozzle (0)
Thurhame(0)
Not Voting: Apozzle, Belisarius

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch!

BRAND NEW Deadline: March 29th 11:59pm EST

[Belisarius]

'm advocating that we lynch someone who i think is scum.

What the Christ? The push on NS remains essentially a policy lynch.

Let's hear a real case for NS as scum.

[Thurhame]

Hello! I'll start catching up in between classes tomorrow. This is my first non-Newbie game; I'm looking forward to it!

[Thurhame]

...Not looking forward to 33 pages of catchup, though. Only the second day and there's already more posts than the entirety of the longest game I've played

[Belisarius]

I'm willing to be the asshole here: catchup wall prz.

We're way too close to deadline with no clear leading wagon, and I fear a no-lynch, but I'm nae willing to vote for myself or Edos.

My vote is probably going to Implosion for advocating a lynch of a claimed PR, but I'm more than willing to vote Susan an he fails to deliver on his case on me

[Cheery Dog]

...Not looking forward to 33 pages of catchup, though. Only the second day and there's already more posts than the entirety of the longest game I've played

Coming in sprouting lies? I see two games you played (excluding one you replaced out of) that are longer that this (which also happen to be first two games if you're interested in where I looked), one of which you stayed the whole way in from start to finish.

I don't know how you benefit from that, but I'm watching you.

[Belisarius]

Shit.

OK, Cheery, you can be town for now

[implosion]

My vote is probably going to Implosion for advocating a lynch of a claimed PR

did you read the whole me explaining how he's useless thing

because yeah

[Belisarius]

Aye, I did. What of it?

[implosion]

it kind of explains why i'm advocating a lynch of a claimed PR from a town perspective

[implosion]

if you're unilaterally declaring "those who advocate the lynches of power roles are scum" then i'm sorry, but you're just objectively wrong and you should look at some completed games.

[pieceofpecanpie]

UNVOTE:

[Nobody Special]

Prod dodge.

Will get to this in the morning.

[Human Destroyer]

Could someone give me the rundown on why Edosurist/Belisarius are scum (or at the very least link to a post explaining it)?

I have to think about NS more; RB is such an easy scum claim (because, as implosion showed, it's pretty much unconfirmabe, AND could be a scum RB). I'd personally rather we flip a different scum though, because when such is done we might be able to analyze associative tells.

For now, I'm quite comfortable with a SafetyDance vote.

[Thurhame]

...Not looking forward to 33 pages of catchup, though. Only the second day and there's already more posts than the entirety of the longest game I've played

Coming in sprouting lies? I see two games you played (excluding one you replaced out of) that are longer that this (which also happen to be first two games if you're interested in where I looked), one of which you stayed the whole way in from start to finish.

I don't know how you benefit from that, but I'm watching you.

I'm sure my first game was only seven hundred and some posts

...oh wait, that was just day one. Sorry; my bad.

[Thurhame]

Ok, here's my analysis of the first few pages.

Spoiler: Page 1

• Nobody Special's reply to Cub in 9 strikes me as a little over-the-top for mere modesty. I don't want to say it's alignment-indicative, though, since I know nothing about his style. It could be sarcasm, or a dig at Cub's own over-the-topness.
  
• Implosion's 12 strikes me as Town. It's something I could easily see him looking at as an information-deprived scumhunter, but not something I could see scum latching onto.
  
• 15: Beli's only contribution on this page is some joke image? How am I going to take him seriously now?
  
• Cheery Dog spends this page critiquing others rather than putting forth his own contributions. Could be an honest attempt to participate in discussion; could be lazy scum. Null for now, but keep it in mind later.
  
• @Nobody Special: 23 is irrelevant and useless. Don't do this.

Spoiler: Page 2

• implosion's belligerent style seems like just his style; not going to pull alignment from it.
  
• Cheery Dog still does nothing but critique others; doesn't look like he's trying to use it to scumhunt or anything. Seems a lot like what I did in my scum game.
  
• 36 Belisarius starts the first 3+ wagon; let's see how people respond.
  
• 37,42 NS doesn't seem to care about doing anything.
  
• 44 SafetyDance's intro feels Town.
  
• 47 implosion's first reasoned vote. Unfortunately switching kills the NS wagon; I wanted to see where that would go.

Spoiler: Page 3

• 54 SafetyDance's reasoning for his vote here is pathetic. I think scum would be more careful than this.
  
• 59 Completely agree with the last point here. I do the same thing regardless of alignment.
  
• Belisarius continues to be short and to-the-point. Could be cautiousness scumtell, more likely just personal style.
  
• 65 Defensive much, NS?
  
• 70 Cheery Dog's first non-rvs vote. Too bad it's based on a miscommunication (minor newbtown or null in my book).
  
• 73 Very true. All good cases come from intuition (i.e. gut).

Spoiler: Page 4

• 76 ...and what do you think of Cheery's thought processes, Beli?
  
• 80 Apozzle returns! I believe he's the only one here I've played with before.
  
• 89 This post pretty much solidifies implosion as Town in my book.
  
• 98 SafetyDance restarts the NS wagon. Let's see if it gets him to stop active lurking.

Spoiler: Page 5

• 100,101 Two of our latecomers show up; nothing special in their intro posts.
  
• 106 ...and there goes the NS wagon. Is it too much to ask to be able to maintain some pressure here?
  
• 107 Overreaction much, PPP?
  
• 110 Apparently PPP thinks there's no such thing as overreacting.
  
• 112 Strong opening post from Messiah, though I don't agree with his reasoning.
  
• 117 Beli's second non-rvs vote; again jumping on someone else's wagon.

Spoiler: Page 6

• Safety-PPP continues to look like a childish town-v-town.
  
• 140 NS's first post of analysis.
  
• 148 Not sure what Beli means here. Is he scum trying to suppress whatever NS saw?

tl;dr
Townreads on Safety and implosion; potential Scum in Belisarius and/or Cheery.

More pages to come. I'll probably focus on individual pages/posts less and trends from skimming more.

[SafetyDance]

'm advocating that we lynch someone who i think is scum.

What the Christ? The push on NS remains essentially a policy lynch.

Let's hear a real case for NS as scum.

I did make a case against him. You obviously missed it.

And voting someone for lurking is not a policy lynch, it's a valid reason. Lurking can be a strategy used by scum and therefore a tell. If you don't lynch because of it, or at the least consider it a point towards why they could be scum, you're essentially letting people get away with it and giving scum more opportunity to hide.

Prod dodge.

Will get to this in the morning.

For now, I'm quite comfortable with a SafetyDance vote.

I'm sure my first game was only seven hundred and some posts

...oh wait, that was just day one. Sorry; my bad.

[SafetyDance]

~Thurhame, read the next 4-5 pages and then skip to the end to about ~27 onwards. Give reads, vote then read the rest during the night. Sorta what i did last game I replaced in and had to make a decision quick.

And ffs, why are people here happy with going towards a NL? This is |________________________________________________________| this much worse than lynching a PR.

HD atm, is no better than NS now. Goes awol for 4 days, including over the actual deadline and then comes back to just spec-fill and leave his vote.

[Human Destroyer]

Hey, hey Safety

Could someone give me the rundown on why Edosurist/Belisarius are scum (or at the very least link to a post explaining it)?

This totally has nothing to do with me trying to avoid a no lynch

Nope, nuh uh

Definitely not for that purpose

[Human Destroyer]

And ffs, why are people here happy with going towards a NL? This is |________________________________________________________| this much worse than lynching a PR.

No, lynching a town PR is FAR worse than a no lynch.

HD atm, is no better than NS now. Goes awol for 4 days, including over the actual deadline and then comes back to just spec-fill and leave his vote.

"OMG he was lurking and came back and just left his vote on me WTF SCUM!!!"