[OLD] Open Setup Ideas and Discussion

[Faraday]

Yeah, I think it definitely narrows the gap between the two scum factions (and you want them as close to even as possible). It's better than any of the other options, at least.

[quadz08]

Is there a reason you can't have seer and cop be Odd-Night, and both Mafia and Werewolves have Even-Night kills?

[LlamaFluff]

Is there a reason you can't have seer and cop be Odd-Night, and both Mafia and Werewolves have Even-Night kills?

Mostly it was for removal of two kills on the same player and kill interferance with the investigations.

[quadz08]

If you want it to be balanced, I think that's the only way it's really gonna work?

[Grimgroove]

I don't know if this is the place to do it, but I have an idea for a set-up that could be fun. No idea if it's been done before either.

Paranoid Psychopaths

9 players

3 Individual Serial Killers, who every night get the choice between: Hiding (rendering them unkillable) or Killing
6 1-shot Hiders, who can during one night of their choosing hide themselves away from danger.

SK wins when he's the sole survivor.
Hiders win when SK's are dead.

Could this work?

[quadz08]

Hider is a different role here; better fit for what you're looking for is Commuter.

That said, I think this could actually work? Not sure.

[ArcAngel9]

Hello folks,

Not sure if this is going to work.. but i am thinking something like this ...

Angels V/s Demons

7 – VT – No night actions
1 – Demon Godfather ( can perform a night kill)
2 – Angels – Can choose a player and convert he/she into VT
2 – Demon Lords - can choose a player and convert he/she into Demon

Demon Godfather, Demons and Angels can't be converted to another through a night action.
Angels wins , when Demon lords and Demon God father is eliminated
Demons wins, when all Angels are dead and VT's are converted as Demons.


Note: Neither Demon Lords or God father or Angels will not know how if the convert process was successful or not. So, the game play of VT's often shift from side to another side after each night.



Please feel free to add your suggestions and let me know if this setup can workout

[IceGuy]

What stops the Demons from immediately claiming and getting the Angels to de-convert them the next day?

And I assume the Demons don't know each other, because then converted ex-Demons could just out their team after.

[JacobSavage]

Angels can be congeryed.....

Also I think this is too bastard to be really run as an Open.

You've got a mafia cult and a cult and VTs who win how?

[ArcAngel9]

What stops the Demons from immediately claiming and getting the Angels to de-convert them the next day?

Two reason why they shouldn't
A) Demon lords can target them in night and convert them back again
B) It will narrow down non-powerrole list for Demon Godfather and he/she will have best chance taking an Angel down in night kill


And I assume the Demons don't know each other, because then converted ex-Demons could just out their team after.[/quote]

Demon Godfather and Demon Lords know each other but not the Demons nor the Demon lords if they convert were the successful or if they de-converted.

[ArcAngel9]

Angels can be congeryed.....

nope, Angels can't be converted by Demon Lords

Also I think this is too bastard to be really run as an Open.

You've got a mafia cult and a cult and VTs who win how?

Sorry, I didn't understand your question.

[ArcAngel9]

So let me put the rules one more time…

7 – VT ‘s

VT’s has no powers except voting on day phase.

1 – Demon Godfather

Demon Godfather shares a QT with his demon lords
Demon Godfather can perform a night kill

2 – Demon Lords

Demon Lords shares a QT with their Demon Godfather
Demon Lords can randomly convert a player in to Demon each night, however they will not know if their night action was successful
Demon Lords can’t convert Angels

2 – Angels

Angels share a QT too ( We can negotiate this part)
Angels can randomly convert a player back to Demon if they had been corrupted by Demon Lords, and they will not know if their night action was successful or not.
Angels can’t convert Demon Lord or Demon Godfather

Angels

win

, when they take down Demon Godfather, Demon Lords and other conjured demons
Demons

win

, when they take down Angels, and all the VT’s

Or when one team out run the other.

Any more thoughts please???

[borkjerfkin]

basically either

1) converted VTs never find out scum team and therefore can't really help their new team during the day

OR

2) converted VTs do find out scum team and when converted back out all the scum and town pretty much instantly wins

[JacobSavage]

But what is the Town win condition, when all the angels and demons are dead?

Currently it appears that they are punished if they lynch all the angels

[borkjerfkin]

angels are sided with town I assume

basically it sucks ass to be a VT in this game. No one's going to be motivated to play because their alignment can just randomly change from night to night. This is kinda bad in cult games too, but it's REALLY bad here.

[ArcAngel9]

basically either

1) converted VTs never find out scum team and therefore can't really help their new team during the day

That's the point.. !!!
Its a war between Demons and Angels, Demons are increasing their strength by converting normal Town people in to Demons but not really knowing who they're converting. If Demon Lords and Demon God father dies.. the rest of Demon can still fight for their team. That is the

HELP

they will be getting by convering VT's into demons.

But what is the Town win condition, when all the angels and demons are dead?

Currently it appears that they are punished if they lynch all the angels

angels are basically town power roles.. They protect town.
If all Demons, Demon lords and Godfather dies.. the town wins along with Angels


its as similar as Town lynching their power roles.. It depends how the players put out their play... its fair chance of winning for both the parties.

[borkjerfkin]

I'm saying the the town has no real incentive to do anything but lynch randomly because whether or not they end up on the winning side is fairly random

[ArcAngel9]

Well that what makes this game a bit different to other, your allignment is not consistent neither the reads you have... so you need to build a new strategy and understanding of each player after every night..

it doesn't suck as being VT, it makes the game complicated to play. And still the voting may not be completely random. Remember we have 3 team maifa and 2 team town power roles who will be consistent in the game.. the only crowd that is not consistent are VT's which is actually very interesting part here..

[LlamaFluff]

Not sure how AAs setup would ever work since if im reading it right anyone converted will be converted right back the next night.

Also the whole "no VT win condition" part.

Cults are very bad in most situations though, when there is constant conversion threat im not sure how anyone would ever want to play this game as there is no "good VT" play. VT is going to more or less have to act like survivors unless a faction is clearly winning and even then can be luck screwed over easily. I think most cult would need to be in a "pregame draft" type scenario and even then its tricky, maybe something like

Choosing Friends and Enemies

1x Mason Recruiter
1x Mafia Recruter
11x Vanilla

Mason Recruiter picks two players that WONT be masons (two masons are chosen from remaining pool randomly)
Godfather picks two players that WONT be mafia pregame (two goons are chosen from remaining pool randomly)

Going beyond that cult is something that can be very unfair to the recruits.

[Antagon]

I don't have a better name than "Confounding Trackers." Please suggest a better one.
1x Mafia Roleblocker
1x Mafia 1-Shot Ninja
3x Mandatory Fruit Vendors (Fruit does nothing)
2x Ascetic Townies
1x Tracker
1x Watcher
If the watcher targets an ascetic townie, the watcher always receives "No Result."
If the tracker targets a player who proceeds to target an ascetic townie, the tracker always receives "No Result."

[Grimgroove]

Hider is a different role here; better fit for what you're looking for is Commuter.

That said, I think this could actually work? Not sure.

Ah yes, that's what I meant. Still getting used to the terminology here
I think it would work, maybe I should include a cop, because it gets pretty difficult for the Townies otherwise.

[Mr. Flay]

its fair chance of winning for

both

the parties.

Exactly. You're

only

looking at this from the POV of the Angel and Demon factions. Town is utterly screwed.

[quadz08]

I don't know if this is the place to do it, but I have an idea for a set-up that could be fun. No idea if it's been done before either.

Paranoid Psychopaths

9 players

3 Individual Serial Killers, who every night get the choice between: Hiding (rendering them unkillable) or Killing
6 1-shot Hiders, who can during one night of their choosing hide themselves away from danger.

SK wins when he's the sole survivor.
Hiders win when SK's are dead.

Could this work?

I want to bring this back to the fore since it's a setup that's at least reasonable. Thought from people better at this than me? (Hider really means commuter.)

[Docteur Gudsight]

I'm considering running this one soon (either in the Open or the Theme queue depending on the mood of the higher-ups). I welcome some opinions:

"Forced cooperation"

2 Mafia A Goons
2 Mafia B Goons
7 Vanilla Townie
2 Power Roles (to be determined - i'm considering a pair of masons right now)

Unusual mecanisms:

Shared Nightkill:

The two mafias share the night kill and a quicktopic. In order to perform the nightkill, both factions need to agree on it. They can post anonymously in the quicktopic (and are advised to do so )

No Kingmaking:

If at any point of the game, the number of scum equals the number of townies, game goes in night-only mode. Both scum factions gain a kill (the shared night-kill disappears) and all town powerroles are disabled. First faction to destroy the opposing one wins. In case both factions are destroyed simultaneously, game is a draw between the two scum factions and a loss for town.

[JacobSavage]

I like it ^
The only issue would be alt slips in the QT...