/in-vitational 12: Mafia in #YOLOville - All wrapped up!

[Zachrulez]

Now that I think about it...

Town: Zach (confirmed town via role result), Tierce, Tammy, [gap], DV, Benmage, Llamarble, OGML (maybe)

That leaves {CES, Nacho, Shadoweh}

I'm not sure the game is this easy though.

My list is actually pretty similar to this, except that I'd probably swap out Nacho and toss OGML in there, and I'd probably throw DV into the POE pile as well.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

V/LA for the weekend.

[Shadoweh]

No Shadoweh. You're supposed to townread me when no one else can!

I always townread you when you're scum too, or just in general because you're cute. To be fair I think Empire should explain where he got his new scumread on me from besides from his ass and I don't hate you, it's just a very who is left game. (If I don't give Empire a town read everyone will start yelling at me again so shhh)

That game doesn't seem interesting regarding CES, but it does have a Nacho-scum. A bit of skimming says Nacho's posts in his scum game were pretty much non-sequiters whereas here he was posing questions for discussion. So again happy with my faith in the original Innocent Child.

Also I've stopped reading Zach's posts because I don't have to and all they do is make me angrry with him.

[Empire]

No Shadoweh. You're supposed to townread me when no one else can!

To be fair I think Empire should explain where he got his new scumread on me from besides from his ass and I don't hate you, it's just a very who is left game. (If I don't give Empire a town read everyone will start yelling at me again so shhh)

It's not a scumread, it's pure PoE (you should actually try reading my posts, for real this time).

[Benmage]

TOWN:
Benmage
OhGodMyLife
DeasVail
Zachrulez
ProbsTown:
Shadoweh

Definitely 1 scum here:
Tammy
Tierce
Empire

PoEPool:
Cogito Ergo Sum
Llamarble
Nachomamma8

I guess I can see myself having to lynch CES...

@Llamarable did you quote that question of the 6 candidates you had listed for lynches... and did I miss it again

[Benmage]

Definite Pool^ If the PoE pool doesn't win the game.

[Tierce]

Definitely 1 scum here:
Tammy
Tierce
Empire

You're cute. No, sorry, being obvTown doesn't make any of us scum, and unless Empire or Tammy's scum game skyrocketed since last I saw it, they are as Town as they come. As for me, pick

any

scum game of mine and just compare. It's really sad how bad they are, but etc. I'd be whimpering in a corner with a playerlist like this if I had drawn scum, not trying to engage Empire (admittedly, I haven't done much to engage others, but also admittedly, he's the player I definitely know

could

read me if I had drawn scum, so it would be several levels of suicidal to keep doing it).

I still have to read that page I said I would, and I have to go through OGML. Oh look, a distraction wheee.

[Tierce]

Bleh. I don't like Benmage's pools at all. OGML as Town--why? And Nacho had a really lovely tidy-up work on D1 that makes a lot more sense from Town than from scum. I'm more inclined to Deas-scum than Llamarble scum, but then I look at this thing and realize that I'm getting the weaker players in the scum list and it can't be that simple.

[DeasVail]

I always townread you when you're scum too, or just in general because you're cute.

I'm town though, so this is just really unnecessary.

And Tierce, I'm a really easy person to stick in a scumlist, so if anything I think Ben's more town for it.

[Benmage]

@Tierce:
Simple comments like this tend to come from town 10X more often then scum. Period:

No Shadoweh. You're supposed to townread me when no one else can!

OGML- Misguided horrible town. He actually believes his inane "case" on me... that's why town.

As for you 3, and your abilities to read on another.. well if my PoE pool don't win it... we can look harder at you guys.

And cheah, everyone is so damn afraid to go after someone decent... Low hanging fruit more plz.

[Tierce]

OGML- Misguided horrible town. He actually believes his inane "case" on me... that's why town.

I've seen scum do it. It can be a desperate refuge in audacity. Picking the drowned fox up there, he did that with me several months ago. I still have to go through OGML stuff, but I don't think "belief" in a case is as strong a Towntell as you are painting it. They do have to fake conviction--and it's harder to fake waffly paranoia than conviction.

[Empire]

And Nacho had a really lovely tidy-up work on D1 that makes a lot more sense from Town than from scum.

I was agreeing with this until DV pointed out this post from Always On. Thoughts on this?

Also, have you ever played with scum-Benmage? What's your current read on Shadoweh?

[Shadoweh]

Maybe I don't want to see a pure PoE list from you because it doesn't jive with your mafia MO? Sorry but you seem like you take deductions too seriously to declare anyone scum without thinking they're scum.

[Empire]

Sorry but you seem like you take deductions too seriously to declare anyone scum without thinking they're scum.

I "townhunt" better than I scumhunt (see: Castle Zar as an example -- I don't think I called a single player scum that entire game). If you're just dying to see a scumread from me, especially in a game like this, well you're just going to have to deal with it?

[Tierce]

And Nacho had a really lovely tidy-up work on D1 that makes a lot more sense from Town than from scum.

I was agreeing with this until DV pointed out this post from Always On. Thoughts on this?

Also, have you ever played with scum-Benmage? What's your current read on Shadoweh?

I have never played with Benmage as scum. As for Nacho, I have no illusions that scum-Nacho would know that he is up against a decent playerlist and would play accordingly. But did his posts in Always On lead to that post, or was it a standalone thing? Because in this game, his reads post was apparently the result of prolonged analysis, and so can't be compared to Always On unless Always On has a similar situation progression. Can you check that?

I'm wavering on Shadoweh. Her posts seem natural, but she has no trouble posting naturally as scum either, so :hitoshrug:.

[Tierce]

Goddammit, it's Always On, which means we don't have all the data anyway. ._. But still, can you check if there is a natural progression in his writing, Empire?

[Shadoweh]

Wow, you're totally right, I have never ever seen you make a slam dunk case on someone being scum based on their scum meta before, I am sure no one who posted on this page can prove this statement is false. Considering I'm talking about your read on ME I would think it's obvious that I'm not looking for a scumread you daft piece of algae.

[Shadoweh]

I'm wavering on Shadoweh. Her posts seem natural, but she has no trouble posting naturally as scum either, so :hitoshrug:.

I am flattered you think my scum game has improved enough that this is true.

[DeasVail]

I'm sorry I don't know what you mean by the progression thing, but I did talk with him outside the game and I remember him seeming really natural and pro-town at the time. The thing is that he's less town here, but I don't think he's done anything here that he hasn't done as scum there/anywhere else, so I'd disagree with a townread on him for that, and there's just not much that I find likely to be coming from town-him as opposed to scum-him.

PEdit: Shadoweh, Empire

was

much like this in Castle Zar (and there are just a lot of things that make me really think he's town here).

And no offense to Shadoweh, but I thought she was fairly different (and not too difficult to catch out) as scum as well. (I've only seen a couple of games though).

[Empire]

SIGH. The meta cases have only happened twice...ever. And they only happen when I already have a strong conviction that someone is scum. Thanks for pointing out exceptions to the norm.

[Shadoweh]

<_< That wasn't the impression I got but that's probably because reading one of your cases was my first impression of you. I do think it's pretty funny that you're mad at me for expecting you to make a case on me instead of saying Everyone else is Town that's a wrap. I'm not going to stop hassling you because I know you're either wrong or scum and I really want to prove to people that you haven't got anything.

[Tierce]

I'm sorry I don't know what you mean by the progression thing, but I did talk with him outside the game and I remember him seeming really natural and pro-town at the time. The thing is that he's less town here, but I don't think he's done anything here that he hasn't done as scum there/anywhere else, so I'd disagree with a townread on him for that, and there's just not much that I find likely to be coming from town-him as opposed to scum-him.

Thanks for the contribution--I was asking Empire, though.

[Empire]

Goddammit, it's Always On, which means we don't have all the data anyway. ._. But still, can you check if there is a natural progression in his writing, Empire?

I just finished reading his ISO there and it's difficult to say conclusively since a lot of the interactions that game apparently occurred off-thread but I do think there's some development that leads to the post. My main issue with the post in that game is that his townreads do feel half-assed (in contrast, there's a lot more attention to detail in his scumreads). The townreads in this game do feel a bit more meaty but I do think he might be capable of giving that much thought and effort as scum. He was a traitor in that game though and this post suggests he had no idea who his buddies were but I haven't slept or looked at the setup yet to know for sure -- if so, it suggests the post was the product of genuine scumhunting. I also want to compare his play in our Micro too since I read him as scum rather easily there (but then waffled a lot after the D1 cop lynch :/).

[Empire]

<_< That wasn't the impression I got but that's probably because reading one of your cases was my first impression of you. I do think it's pretty funny that you're mad at me for expecting you to make a case on me instead of saying Everyone else is Town that's a wrap. I'm not going to stop hassling you because I know you're either wrong or scum and I really want to prove to people that you haven't got anything.

I've been pretty straight up with the fact that I don't have anything other than "everyone else looks townier than CES, Nacho, and you".

(P.S.: You probably think I'm way better than I actually am if your first impression of me was reading those cases.)

[Shadoweh]

See now regardless of alignment you're practically personally insulting me. Depreciating your own signifigance is scummy too btw. (Maybe that's why Benmage drives me crazy.) I don't understand from a town-motivated perspective why you don't want any strength to push lynches you want with.