Newbie 1365 - Vantasmagoria of Flower View (Game Over)

[Regfan]

Thanks for the link.

Awestfie: When you read this, can you make a special attempt to read through the thread + post your thoughts in the next 12ish or so hours because deadlines in about two days and I'd like someone to bounce thoughts of with (And it seems Thors busy / not inspired to do so).

[Tierce]

Votecount 2.13

(2)

TheIrishPope

- MontyWhittaker, Nekoko
(1)

Nekoko

- TheIrishPope
(1)

Regfan

- awestfie

(3)

Not voting

- Regfan,

(awestfie,)

Thor665, Ms Marangal

Votes

[and unvotes]

must be at the beginning of a new line

With 7 alive, it takes 4 votes to lynch.
The deadline is May 13 at 5:55 PM PDT. Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2013-05-13 17:55:00)

[Thor665]

I see what you mean. I was just curious really.
Hypothetically, if I counterclaim, would that be good for us or not?

If you're the cop - yes.
If you're the Jailkeeper - yes.
If you're Vanilla Town - no.

Ugh. I was going to say "Yeah that sounds like a good idea since Nekokos claim is likely legitimate" but guess what I found: In this scum QT she states "I think the two of us should start breadcrumbing or something, don't you think? For example, I'll breadcrumb as if I'm a cop and you will breadcrumb as if you're the seer."

"It's okay. I didn't breadcrumb too D:" ~ I didn't push through with it though so whatever.

What are you saying here?

Awestfie: When you read this, can you make a special attempt to read through the thread + post your thoughts in the next 12ish or so hours because deadlines in about two days and I'd like someone to bounce thoughts of with (And it seems Thors busy / not inspired to do so).

Hit me up - because now it's the weekend and I do have time.
I also, literally, just laid out a rather serious thought about you being the scumbuddy and you totally ignored it, so...?

[Regfan]

Hit me up - because now it's the weekend and I do have time.
I also, literally, just laid out a rather serious thought about you being the scumbuddy and you totally ignored it, so...?

Simply put your paranoia or suspicion or whatever you want to call it will fade as soon as you do a re-read of the slot so it's not worth spending a lot of time discussing (Commando was obvobvobvTown and you know my Town vs Scum meta enough to know that I'm town here without a doubt; I might have one of the weakest scum games on the entire site - difference in posting is something like 100 posts as town vs 20 as scum).

What I do want to know your thoughts on is this: I highly doubt a Nekoko + Irish scum-team, in fact I might even call it impossible (Nekoko can't win as a cop claim if she thought her partner had a serious chance of being lynched after her claim since she'd have to dodge 3 lynches and make up reports the whole way through which will lead her to being confirmed scum via process of elimination). That means that someone that isn't Nekoko or Irish is scum; Who? (I've gone into this earlier but assuming Nekoko!Town, that means Ms!Town and lets say it's Irish!Scum, that means there's a scum inside of you, awestfie and Monty and I have town-reads on all three of you (Not saying it's impossible that I have a wrong read, it's possibly the case) but I want to know

which

read you think I have wrong ie. Who am I misreading as town? Because if you think all of the reads are spot on and the reasoning legit here then we're looking at a fake-PR claim.

So help me work out what I've got wrong.

[Thor665]

I know your town v. scum meta?
News to me.

I would agree that Neko/Irish makes little sense.

I find your Monty clear weak insomuch as the Sakura logic is easily explained as 'scumpartner spotted PR softclaim'
I find your Sycorax/Dino one massively weak though. 'Oooh, he wanted to know theory PR targets in a game with a rolecop, how very pro-town of him!'
Don't see that one at all. The rest of it is 'he looks like he's scumhunting. Well whoop-de-doo.

That said, of the two I think you'd be more likely wrong about Monty because a Dino/Irish team doesn't seem very likely to me.
It's also why I think you're actually the better scumpartner match, and want to mention that again.

[Regfan]

I know your town v. scum meta? News to me.

Yes, you do? It was one of the larger talking points in Black Flag Nightless and came up on multiple occasions in ADwD.

One of the strongest town-tells by

far

is genuine scumhunting; Scum know everyones alignments and therefore don't have to decipher anything, their scumhunting is often contrived and with specific motivations behind it (Make X look scummier, buddy Y, seem contributive ect.) whereas town (Especially newer town players) are more open with their thoughts and attempts to gain reads. Both Syc and Dinos scumhunting reads very genuine and I don't think that's a 'whoop-de-doo' thing at all (If you need a specific example look at Post 758 from Dino). And I highly highly highly doubt one of the first thing scum do when replacing in is decide "Let me attempt to rolefish" - so Dinos Post 754 is him legitimately believing there's an advantage towards it. Add to that he thought we were playing Matrix6 the new Newbie Setup; that means he didn't know there was a mafia rolecop in the setup (If he was mafia that's something he'd absolutely have known). (And while I know it wasn't your intention; thanks you've actually just made me 10000% certain this town-read is right).

I will admit that the Monty town-read on the other hand is something I need spend time looking at again; Watching a cricket game at the moment and will sleep after but when I get time tomorrow I'll look through his meta.

[Thor665]

It very well might have - did I claim awareness or agreement with it in either?

Genuine scumhunting is the best town tell.
Someone is 10000% town off a theory townslip that you don't think they faked.
Okay.

Look forward to that.
Why aren't you/Irish a scumpair would also be a fun conversation for me to have.

[Regfan]

I believe you did state awareness of the meta in Black Flag Nightless? It's something that Empire/Tammy repeated over-and-over-again. And having a conversation of why Irish/I aren't a scum-team

is

a waste of time - You

should

be aware enough of my meta to know that I'm town here confidently (Or if you really really have forgotten how easy a read I am you can wait until Awestie reads-through and she'll be able to confirm to you that I'm town here) and again as I said Commando was incredibly obvious town (Don't see how you haven't' spent the 10 seconds to ISO him realize that and stop wasting time on that angle).

[Thor665]

And your counter example is that I'm supposed to believe scum has fakeclaimed cop, called their partner a confirmed innocent, and that's their plan?

[Tierce]

Votecount 2.14

(2)

TheIrishPope

- MontyWhittaker, Nekoko
(1)

Nekoko

- TheIrishPope
(1)

Regfan

- awestfie

(3)

Not voting

- Regfan, Thor665, Ms Marangal

With 7 alive, it takes 4 votes to lynch.
The deadline is May 13 at 5:55 PM PDT. Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2013-05-13 17:55:00)

[Ms Marangal]

assuming we aren't getting a counter-claim from Irish?

I don't like how he's trying to paint himself as a noob, while, at the same time, making it evident that he has played mafia before but on another site. He does have some deeper level thinking going on in a few of his posts so some of the questions on theory that he asks seems kinda odd. I still don't see his answer to his reaction to me asking him to claim, and he keeps on avoiding our requests to have him claim.

we have a day and this seems to be the best option ATM
VOTE: Irish

[Regfan]

And your counter example is that I'm supposed to believe scum has fakeclaimed cop, called their partner a confirmed innocent, and that's their plan?

I don't think scum inno'ing their partner or setting up to inno their partner is that far-fetched at all (Especially considering that Ms wasn't getting much flak from anyone and neither was Nekoko before I replaced in so I think it's very possible they'd have decided to set it up to 'clear' the both of them even more in a later game stage situation or at worst case scenario bait out a PR claim).

That said Irish's Post 789 and Post 791 read as setting up a PR claim, his posts after Nekokos claim are him claiming VT and then when it looks like he's going to be lynched again in Post 847 he sets up a PR claim again so I think he's the best lynch but I want Awestfies thoughts on everything.

[awestfie]

My bad.

UNVOTE: Regfan

Haven't had much time to read today, my apologies - although I will say that I am a bit confused as to why a PR would claim when the doctor is dead, especially with only an innocent report. Although, I haven't played much forum mafia to know if this is actually optimal to do? It seems somewhat sub-optimal to me.

[Regfan]

Carve out an hour or two now and read through the thread

please

, deadlines roughly a day away.

[Thor665]

I'm not available to hammer at deadline, if that's the game we're playing.

[Regfan]

I'm not available to hammer at deadline, if that's the game we're playing.

I will be so though so there's no risk of a no-lynch at all. Awestfie needs to hurry up and get to reading the game in the meantime.

[TheIrishPope]

So you're seriously talking about policy lynching because I'm a VT?

[MontyWhittaker]

No, from what I am seeing, the talk is more about lynching you because the assumption is that you are lying. That, at least, is where I am falling in the discussion thus far, and that will help to keep my vote firmly where it is.

[TheIrishPope]

What am I lying about?

[MontyWhittaker]

About being a Vanilla Townie. My assumption would be that the reason you have votes on you is that people believe that you are scum more than they believe your assertion that you are a Vanilla Townie...Of course, there aren't that many votes on you...

We do need to come to a consensus soon, if possible. We have just a day left.

[TheIrishPope]

So I'm being voted on because people think I'm lying about being a VT...
Isn't that the whole point of the game? I would vote every one of you because I think the same. No one is a

confirmed

townie per se, so I don't see what's wrong with me asserting it. My vote is still on Nekoko because I do not believe her claim.

That

is a good reason to vote.

[Ms Marangal]

what are you talking about? TIP is at L-1

[Ms Marangal]

Why don't you believe Nekoko's claim TIP? What about it makes you think it's false?

[TheIrishPope]

Of course, there aren't that many votes on you...

We do need to come to a consensus soon, if possible. We have just a day left.

Yeah, I'm at L-1.

Why don't you believe Nekoko's claim TIP? What about it makes you think it's false?

I don't think that it's false, I just don't believe her. It may be true, but there's no proof, after all. And I don't see the reason as to why she claimed with only two votes on her and with no Doctor alive.

[Ms Marangal]

I don't think that it's false, I just don't believe her. It may be true, but there's no proof, after all. And I don't see the reason as to why she claimed with only two votes on her and with no Doctor alive.

.... I want to lynch this shit

if you don't believe a claim, you think it's false. She stated why she claimed, like a while back. She thought that she was going to get lynched with the deadline so close. she didn't want it to happen