Mini 1449 - Ordinary Town

[hapahauli]

Yep. Vote ac1983fan pl0x.

Anyway, we're about 24 hours until hammer. To all those on the NC wagon, please consider the above and the complete lack of effort from ac1983fan in the last few days before making your final decision.

Also, I'll be on tomorrow to make sure we don't no-lynch. If we have to hammer NC, I will do so, but ac1983fan is definitely the scummier player at this stage.

[GoodCopBadCop]

I want to see his response first.

- GC

[Cheery Pie]

[

nails in the coffin for ac1983

]

It's too much to ignore, which spells disaster for the the WIFOMy protection in ac1983's previous lackluster posts. I've been tipped over to voting him, despite the other objections, there's too much going for this lynch.

VOTE: ac1983fan

[Jake from Rainbowdash]

1 day left, ac is at L-1

Dessex has asked for time to get caught up but has not posted since Friday.

At this point I am fine with either lynch, ac's last post doesn't come off as town at all

[Jake from Rainbowdash]

Yeah, it doesn't really make sense for him not to vote NC.

- GC

[

nails in the coffin for ac1983

]

It's too much to ignore, which spells disaster for the the WIFOMy protection in ac1983's previous lackluster posts. I've been tipped over to voting him, despite the other objections, there's too much going for this lynch.

VOTE: ac1983fan

What is wrong with both of you?

Is your argument, scum who is at L-2 and has claimed a PR is INTENTIONALLY staying off the other wagon at L-2 when there is absolutely no guarantee that they are safe? What scum does that? Really?

The only way that ac is scum is if NC is also scum and probably something he sees as more valueable than himself (even then, doesn't make much sense, grab the town points and run). Im just not seeing the point behind scum not doing any sort of self-preservation here. Really why does scum avoid that wagon in this spot? Especially when NC may very well vote ac first.

ac is almost for sure town. Indiviudally he is one of my stronger town reads just by behavior. Assuming he is town, chances are really really good that at least of of CP/GCBC are scum, regardless of NC alignment. About half the time ive ended up pushing on a PR-claim wagon that was town ive been scum, you don't do that without excellent reasoning. "He isn't doing self preservation" is not excellent reasoning.

Just kill NC. Now. I would rather lynch him claimless than lynch ac.

[hapahauli]

UNVOTE: ac1983fan

Is your argument, scum who is at L-2 and has claimed a PR is INTENTIONALLY staying off the other wagon at L-2 when there is absolutely no guarantee that they are safe? What scum does that? Really?

The only way that ac is scum is if NC is also scum and probably something he sees as more valueable than himself (even then, doesn't make much sense, grab the town points and run). Im just not seeing the point behind scum not doing any sort of self-preservation here. Really why does scum avoid that wagon in this spot? Especially when NC may very well vote ac first.

This makes sense. Really thinking about it, I can't justify the lack of self-preservation on ac1983fan's part. It makes very little sense from a scum-perspective (regardless of NC's alignment actually). At the very least, this gives me enough hesitation not to lynch AC today.

Consider this my intent to hammer NC in 3 hours.

[Cheery Pie]

ac is almost for sure town. Indiviudally he is one of my stronger town reads just by behavior.

Oh...? Any particular behaviour beyond what you described in that very post? I'd describe the rest of his behaviour - like many other players - as questionable towards either alignment.

Assuming he is town, chances are really really good that at least of of CP/GCBC are scum, regardless of NC alignment.

Do these chances invent themselves?

About half the time ive ended up pushing on a PR-claim wagon that was town ive been scum, you don't do that without excellent reasoning. "He isn't doing self preservation" is not excellent reasoning.

I don't know what that first sentence is on about? Other than looking like an attempt to give yourself town points, it strikes me as a weak statement.

I would rather lynch him claimless than lynch ac.

Yes, I agree with this and have made it clear that Varsoon or NC were preferable alternatives to ac1983. But I'm not going to defend ac1983 for no good reason, the only things I've defended are elements around his wagon and the PR claim. What bothers me is none of his behaviour raises any clear cut town stamps, I'm not sure where you're getting this from. As soon as you try to find reasons for him doing one thing and not the other, then you're only looking for answers to an open-ended question "is ac1983 town or scum?" to which the answer isn't clear cut.

I've leant town on him for a considerable time, and have let the last hours of the Day trickle by witnessing minimal activity while ac1983 still remained a nose in front of the NC wagon. I want to see a lynch rather than a no lynch. That's where my vote switch has come from. There are plenty of reasons out there for lynching ac1983, I still favour NC over him, but again that wasn't what appeared to be the choice on the table. It feels like you've ninja'd your way in to make a few town points and stated facts that simply aren't there.

Regardless, if it's NC for today then fine. Let's lynch NC. But as long as it's

someone

.

VOTE: NicCage

Consider this my intent to hammer NC in 3 hours.

Call me batty, but I don't know how you hammer someone who

still

isn't at L-1...?

[hapahauli]

Oh.

Well

now

consider it my intent hammer... blah blah... lulz.

[Cheery Pie]

He's still not at L-1...

[GoodCopBadCop]

@JFR - His actions look forced, like he's trying to look town. Also, if acfan is really a town PR he would've voted NC.
1. He knows that he himself is town %100. NC is < %100.
2. He's a town PR.
3. He was voting Varsoon for just being anti-town. NC has been anti-town.

His case on Scott is just a copy of what everyone else has already been saying and the NC waggon was more viable than the scott waggon.

- GC

[hapahauli]

@ Cheery

It feels like you've ninja'd your way in to make a few town points and stated facts that simply aren't there.

Wait... what? You just completely ignored the most important part of his post:

Is your argument, scum who is at L-2 and has claimed a PR is INTENTIONALLY staying off the other wagon at L-2 when there is absolutely no guarantee that they are safe? What scum does that? Really?

The only way that ac is scum is if NC is also scum and probably something he sees as more valueable than himself (even then, doesn't make much sense, grab the town points and run). Im just not seeing the point behind scum not doing any sort of self-preservation here. Really why does scum avoid that wagon in this spot? Especially when NC may very well vote ac f

--------------------------------------------------

He's still not at L-1...

WELP

But seriously, he effectively is at L-1. Jake/Rainbow want to kill him, but haven't placed their vote yet.

[hapahauli]

Wait a second. Fuck I'm confused.

Everything I just said is redacted. Need to think for a bit.

[GoodCopBadCop]

Hapa vote NC, there's only a few hours left.

JFR have placed their vote O_O?

[hapahauli]

Yeah I'm trying to figure out if it's L-1 or not.

Also, I want to type up a list of reads before I hammer.

[Cheery Pie]

@Hapa

Why are you speaking for Jake now? I didn't miss squat...

[...] I'd describe the rest of his behaviour - like many other players - as questionable towards either alignment. [...] What bothers me is none of his behaviour raises any clear cut town stamps, I'm not sure where you're getting this from. As soon as you try to find reasons for him doing one thing and not the other, then you're only looking for answers to an open-ended question "is ac1983 town or scum?" to which the answer isn't clear cut.

And Jake voted NC immediately after the last VC... AND he's

still

not at L-1.

(I can count right? Or am I insane?)

[GoodCopBadCop]

Someone else not on the NC waggon has to vote NC for the hammer. He's L-2 atm.
JFR is voting NC atm.

- GC

[hapahauli]

Oh I double-counted CherryPie. That was the problem.

Also GC, it sounds like you're concurrently pushing two wagons. Why is that?

@JFR - His actions look forced, like he's trying to look town. Also, if acfan is really a town PR he would've voted NC.
1. He knows that he himself is town %100. NC is < %100.
2. He's a town PR.
3. He was voting Varsoon for just being anti-town. NC has been anti-town.

His case on Scott is just a copy of what everyone else has already been saying and the NC waggon was more viable than the scott waggon.

- GC

Hapa vote NC, there's only a few hours left.

[Cheery Pie]

Strictly speaking Dessx's UNVOTE on NC didn't follow voting protocol, so I'm not quite sure why it was validated in the last VC.

I counted it as an unvote given the clear intent.

2. Anything that looks likes a vote may be counted as a vote at my discretion.

[GoodCopBadCop]

Also GC, it sounds like you're concurrently pushing two wagons. Why is that?

I was explaining my suspicion on acfan to JFR. I've been against voting acfan today. I don't deny his recent scummy actions though.

- GC

[hapahauli]

Vote: Nic Cage

Alright let's lynch him. Time's running short and we gotta lynch someone.

[hapahauli]

If NC flips scum, probably best to look at some of the ac1983fan sheepers (like Dislexicon and Daemon).

If NC flips town, my two scum-suspects would be

Cherry Pie

and

Dyslexicon

. I'm not as sure about a 3rd scum-suspect, and there's no reason for me to really force one.

Cherry Pie

is a typical scum "attempting to contribute w/out actually contributing" methinks. I think most of their hydra's posting has been them criticizing other player's logic (especially vocal players such as myself and J) rather than actively scumhunting. Unfortunately I can't make a fancy case on this, and it's up to you (the townies) to look at his filter and get a feel for it. Read his filter, and note the lack of scumhunting there. Most of his actions are based off of criticizing players (often those that are in no danger of getting lynched) rather than questioning and/or pursuing his scumreads.

Dyslexicon

just really hasn't done... anything. And this read isn't so much that he's done something blatantly scummy, but there's also nothing that he's done that would suggest he's town. To have no reason to think someone's town (game actions, filter, votes, or otherwise) is strange at this stage of the game. Likely scum blending in here. I'll do an elaborate ISO if I'm alive tomorrow.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Some thoughts on other various players on my mind:

GCBC

- BC's ragequit strikes me as townie. I'm not completely comfortable with them, but I'm leaning town here.

Scott Brosious

- ... is probably town. Similar to the logic on ac1983fan, he had a golden opportunity to hammer NC when he was the 2nd leading vote candidate and NC was at L-1. Instead, he was adamant about his suspicions against Varsoon. There's a lack of self-preservation mentality here.

Zefiend/Dessx

- Null/Wildcard. Zefiend gave me town-vibes, but 6 posts isn't enough to make a concrete read.

Daemon

- Slight town-read. He has this enthusiasm about him that feels townie. Less of a sample-size than ideal, but not someone I'd lynch tomorrow.

Toomai

- Completely null. I'll be pretty concerned about him if NC flips red though.

hp[leaves]

- His intent to hammer ac1983fan then subsequent "waiiiiit a darn minute this shit is moving too fast" makes me think he's town. Sounds very genuine, and I don't understand why scum wouldn't entertain the idea of a hammer there more (unless ac is scum, but as mentioned earlier by Rainbow, severe doubts about that).

[NicCage]

So I suppose I'm getting lynched then. That's fine. I'm claiming VT now, and I would like to give some final reads cause I think I might be onto something. But, I'm phoneposting and I can't really make a case right now.

Short version is I think Jake is scum. Remember that thing varsoon said earlier? I agree with that, that's part of it. If I get to my computer before I flip I'll tell you all the other reasons I think I saw.

[hapahauli]

If you can't post something at length, just summarize it to the best you can.

[qwints]

Vote Count 1.13

NicCage: Toomai, hp[leaves], GoodCopBadCop, Jake from Rainbowdash, Cheery Pie , Hapahauli (6)
ac1983fan: Dyslexicon, Daemon385, Varsoon, NicCage (4)
Toomai: Scott Brosius (1)
Scott Brosius: ac1983fan (1)

Not voting: Dessx (1)

With thirteen alive, it takes seven to lynch

Day One ends in (expired on 2013-05-20 12:00:00)

Prods issued to Varsson, Scott Brosius and Dessx

[Varsoon]

So I suppose I'm getting lynched then. That's fine. I'm claiming VT now, and I would like to give some final reads cause I think I might be onto something. But, I'm phoneposting and I can't really make a case right now.

Short version is I think Jake is scum. Remember that thing varsoon said earlier? I agree with that, that's part of it. If I get to my computer before I flip I'll tell you all the other reasons I think I saw.

D'aww.

I think you're town, to be fair.