Open 503 - POLYGAMY IS EVIL. GAME OVER

[Nachomamma8]

Dude there's no advantage for the town in claiming. It gives the advantage to SCUM knowing what the pairs are so that they can know who they can lynch easier.

what
if town can't read one player, it also links that player to another.

Compare that to scum knowing beforehand that said player is paired with you. They won't push him at all. They will go for pairs that are lynchable.

town pushed scummy looking scum
claims lover with townie looking scum


VV and TAM-Core seem town as fuck.

don't really like Voodoo Lady, Absta, Marangal

[Nachomamma8]

and yeah, I like keeping the mystery for a little while
but people who want to claim aren't putting forth crazy bad ideas, they're just putting forth ideas
so the hammering and complete disbelief and suspicion of people for wanting to claim early is stupid

[Nachomamma8]

Ok, I can entertain with the idea of Vigilante-scum, but I won't have time to do anything until tomorrow and if someone get's run up to L-3 before then I will freak out on everyone

Why is L-3 that big of a deal? 8 town lovers, 4 polygamist mafia lovers. Meaning they all aren't going to quickhammer on D1 when they have another day to worry about, no?

I also want to be able to talk to Nacho before anything drastic happens

<3
talk to me

Yes Mutts, it's because it's because of the type of game.

I would say L-4 but I'm hoping that scum is smart enough to not quick-lynch

I think you're being a little paranoid. I'm excited to see what you think about things.

[Wisdom]

Yeah Nacho I guess there are upsides and downsides to either claiming or not claiming. I just think we're better off not handing information to scum.

[Nachomamma8]

TAM, do you believe that I thought/think that claiming pairs benefits scum?

wtf is this question, are you asking him what he believes you think?

Yes.

TAM, generally, I don't think that asking for a lover claim is a scumtell. Anyone who hasn't thought about the setup match may come up with this idea, thinking that it will be useful. But Vig is scum for other reasons, so you're most likely correct that it's coming from scum again.

I'm confused about those "other reasons".

This was so stupid that I have no doubts that it came from town

Quote is irrelevant, but what do you think about Mutley around this area? He latched onto you pretty fucking hard.

This assumes that Voodoo indeed found the playerlist good. Who is to say that the whole sentence wasn't just made up by scum-Voodoo and she didn't really mean any of it?

I think the thought process is clear enough at this point.

Mara stop being paranoid, ffs. Scum are not stupid to quickhammer.

Do you think this paranoia is real or fake?

I remember you said that you were scumreading VV, what made him town now?

That's what the "easy lynch" bit was meant to convey.

a) Why Voodoo's statement is unlikely to come from scum
b) Why you changed your townread on Voodoo to a scumread
c) What are your reasons for scumreading me other than your obvious disliking me as a person

a) This has been explained.
b) This could be answered, probably.
c) Your question is poorly worded and a misrepresentation of reasons.

[Nachomamma8]

You started looking very town near the end of your ISO, but I don't like how you aren't working with any reads. What are you thinking right now?

[Nachomamma8]

VV is scum in THIS set up, because out of a sample size of 3 games... 2 for sure, and one possibly (I'll have to check that) The first person to suggest early name claim has been scum.

This is the Gambler's Fallacy, which isn't doing TOO much for convincing me.

I'm going to be making it an official tell instead of a personal tell.

This seemed like a strong towntell for you, but it also seemed like you have more the desire to prove your tell correct or false than actually believing VV is scum. A case is a multitude of things, not just one tell.

[Wisdom]

Quote is irrelevant, but what do you think about Mutley around this area? He latched onto you pretty fucking hard.

No clue. It kind of felt townish but he could just be buddying me.

Mara stop being paranoid, ffs. Scum are not stupid to quickhammer.

Do you think this paranoia is real or fake?

Real

c) Your question is poorly worded and a misrepresentation of reasons.

How can I misrep reasons when there were none given?

[Nachomamma8]

No clue. It kind of felt townish but he could just be buddying me.

Is he?

Real

Why?

How can I misrep reasons when there were none given?

By adding reasons of your own.

[Wisdom]

You started looking very town near the end of your ISO, but I don't like how you aren't working with any reads. What are you thinking right now?

Is that directed to me?

[Nachomamma8]

Yes.

[Wisdom]

How can I misrep reasons when there were none given?

By adding reasons of your own.

Well he gave no reasons and then starting spamming that he doesn't like me and that I'm a jerk. And then he refused to give reasons again. What am I to assume?

[Nachomamma8]

That he's OMGUSing because you're biting into him too hard and he's flailing.
Then you analyze whether it's townflail or scumflail.

[Wisdom]

I still don't like mujie's unvote without any followup scumhunting.
I have a bad feeling about Voodoo too, even though I disagree that her first post means anything either way. It's not likely that scum would slip like that in their first posts.

[Wisdom]

That he's OMGUSing because you're biting into him too hard and he's flailing.
Then you analyze whether it's townflail or scumflail.

It didn't really look like OMGUS; I was expecting him to OMGUS me when I was first accusing him yet he didn't, he only voted me after the argument about the claiming.

[Nachomamma8]

(rather than them trying to pair scummy scum with townish scum later to make it harder to choose a scumpair)

I'm actually not afraid of this at all.

Thank you for that post, mujie.

Unvote: enomis

Vote: mujie

I liked your earlier aggression. Where did THIS go?

I like hearing myself speak (and type, because keyboards turn me on), so I'm going to try to guess at a possible answer: Suggesting a claim strategy is scummy because it's a way for scum to appear useful without harming their win condition (if they truly believe their claim strategy is correct, they would think someone else would suggest it anyway). If that's what you think of it, how do you feel about the context of my suggestion within my post? Surely you wouldn't be calling something scummy in a vacuum, so how does the post containing my suggestion influence your view of the suggestion?

This got horribly convoluted near the end and I wasn't sure what I was reading. Are you asking him to read your post in a way like he hadn't seen those past two games, or...?

Using "townie" to mean "player in the game" isn't unusual. I doubt it's a scum slip.

It's not unusual, but I did a little digging and Voodoo Lady uses "townie" to refer to town-aligned players in her first game and did not use it in any other context (=20546&user_select[]=0&user_select[]=0&user_sort=Go]link). What do you think of that?

think Mara is scum for her recent series of posts (unrelated to the L-x thing).

And here I thought the L-x point was pretty interesting. What did you find?

I don't remember exactly when I posted that, but it was whenever I no longer felt like it would be useful to have him think it was a serious vote.

This was an honest response to a shitty question.

I thought and think that he's scum. That is my reason for voting him.

That's a nice reason, I bet you'll get lots of support.
It's funny that you were able to make a detailed case on Marangal yet you cannot give a single reason for the person you're voting.

You voted me without a reason. I extended the same honor~

Here are reasons you were looking for, Wisdom.

Who says that there's no answer that might affect my read?
If you just choose to ignore all of my questions how do you expect me to change my read?

...but I did answer the question you're referring to. Like, a legit straight answer. But I think you're scum anyway, so I figure you'll change your read on me if and when you need to. If I'm wrong about you being scum, you'll change your read on me if and when I seem townish to you, which I can do without answering questions that I feel get us nowhere.

This seemed very genuine.

That was PoE. I have a notepad document up with (slightly) more information, but considering it has me paired off with my lover, I'm not posting it.

I will never post or share my personal notes ever. I suggest you do the same.

[Nachomamma8]

4. Ms Marangal
5. Voodoo Lady
6. absta101
12. mujie

^current scumspects

[Wisdom]

Also Viomi needs to give reads on people that aren't Voodoo Lady

[Core_H86]

So currently I see -as a possibility- VV being an easy town lynch and scum tunneling. Mostly posting this to hear opinions on the matter from anyone other than wisdom and absta
wow 4x's i get a post preview..
5x's..
6x's..

I remember you said that you were scumreading VV, what made him town now?

o don't call it a town read, I see alot of pressure going her direction and in this setup wagons make me nervous no reads on it just digging for more information and opinions on the idea, specially if i may consider to be that wagon later.

[Core_H86]

UNVOTE:
for now. VV just seems too suicidal to be scum.

catching up you guys play fast but do agree with this^

[Core_H86]

One thought out lynch comparing all the data of 2 persons vs one can lead to a victory one mislynch and its LYLO

Think of the scenario that you're a very obvtown player paired with someone who acts scummy.
Scum try to push your lover's lynch until he claims at L-1 that you're his lover.
The town knows that you're obvtown so they don't lynch them and those that pushed him are scrutinized.

Compare that to scum knowing beforehand that said player is paired with you. They won't push him at all. They will go for pairs that are lynchable.

rereading this has me thinking this strategy works more for a scum safety net, saving scum before the lynch. still prefer the claim. with my FOS on you I would be able to analyze your lover's play to know if my energies should be focused in a different direction.

[Wisdom]

How does it save scum?

[Core_H86]

ooo
so scum is at L1 claims their scum partner(who has played much better) and town votes fall off saving the "scummy scum"
on the other hand-- all claim, one appears super scummy pressure can be added to the pair and not waste town time pursuing a scummy townie.
but you guys say there are statistics that prove me wrong, I guess I learn this with more experience.

[Wisdom]

In the same way town at L-1 that claims a partner who is obvtown can be saved
Youre correct that town can pressure pairs but scum can also pressure the pairs that are most easily lynchable.
Both claiming and not claiming have good and bad points.
Like I told you, double-edged.

[Nachomamma8]

but you guys say there are statistics that prove me wrong, I guess I learn this with more experience.

There aren't. I'm just decently confident that we're going to win regardless of whether we claim or not, and I sort of want to form my reads without the crutch of lovers first.