Newbie 1391 - Game Over - FINALLY!!!

[Fegelein]

Also, didn't mean to quote all my shit in my last post lol.

Antagon, am I leaning scum just because of IIoA.

[Miss Stranger]

Okay, everyone is either complaining about my walls o'text or about other people's "active lurking", so what is like, actually expected from me? -_-

[champinoman]

To respond to matters directly put at me first;

@Champinoman:

You are trying to imply somehow that I know I'm an obvious lynch candidate but try not to be.

I suggested nothing of the sort. You don't need to be the obvious lynch candidate to be setting these scenarios up.

Excessive survivalist attitude during Day 1 is not attributed to "I'm town and I want to win".

Pure math suggests that if he is town and he gets lynched then we are in a worse position to win than if we had lynched one of the scum. So I dare say that a townie wanting to stay alive is to our benefit. And as Antagon posted more recently, he never said not to lynch him:

People jumped on Gen_Wolf for his "fatalistic attitude," but this portion is not alignment-indicative at all. It's not "Please don't lynch me," but "Please don't

quicklynch

me." It's highly detrimental for town to lynch someone when there is still time for discussion, but his comment is null because both town and scum can easily post something like this.[/spoiler]

UNVOTE: Miss Stranger

Once again I have had a change of heart on my read of Miss Stranger. I can't help but think that the things that have made her seem scummy can also be explained by considering the fact she is just excited to be playing a new game.

VOTE: Nachomamma8

Although you have pointed out some similarities in our playstyles (which upon reflection I won't disagree with) I don't feel that you are actively trying to scum hunt. Consider this my version of trying to kick you into gear.

[champinoman]

And while I'm at it:

I can chalk up a James May and Nacho scum team here, James for saying "I'm changing my playstyle because I screwed up last time" screams scum, and Nacho's play correlates with his scum meta.

I scoffed at this statement when you posted it, and I still don't think your reasoning is great. However, looking at both players play so far and especially at James' comments towards Nacho I wouldn't be surprised if you are onto something.

[Miss Stranger]

@champinoman:

I suggested nothing of the sort. You don't need to be the obvious lynch candidate to be setting these scenarios up.

I think I misunderstood a figure of speech. In any case, that's not why I set up scenarios, I just analyse to my best. Should the rest of the town think they'll get better odds by eliminating me to narrow down suspects and to confirm my honest point of view, then they'll do so. My scenarios have little to do with who actually gets lynched.

Pure math suggests that if he is town and he gets lynched then we are in a worse position to win than if we had lynched one of the scum. So I dare say that a townie wanting to stay alive is to our benefit. And as Antagon posted more recently, he never said not to lynch him.

I agree, and I also agree with Antagon in the sense it's a null point.

Once again I have had a change of heart on my read of Miss Stranger. I can't help but think that the things that have made her seem scummy can also be explained by considering the fact she is just excited to be playing a new game.

I'm perpetually excited! (...if we exclude histology class, nvm that -_-) I suppose that's also the explanation for your excessive paranoia, right?

[Generic]

I was actually picking on you deliberately to see what happened miss stranger, but you are amusing with how much you care about how people perceieve you.

If you aren't totally fresh to mafia like you appear to me then I will applaud your brilliance in post game, because right now you are so newbie in everything you do I cant imagine anybody faking that.

unvote

As that plan didn't work but feel it you came out of it rather well in my mind. It was subtle but you were very relaxed about it all.

But although im new to this I have weirdly seen a bit of meta about someone who turned up on another site im playing mafia in. I don't think its fair to vote for them based solely on a cross site spot (imagine being found out as mafia based on accidentally meeting up with another player in a different game on a different site... this could be a first!) but I will be asking nachomamma to respond to me and explain why his strong aggressive analysis has been lacking so far here. Yes he came for me, but that was VERY tunnelled on the one person. I think he is capable of more broad strokes and has yet to do that. So meta could be his downfall here.

fos nachomamma

lets hear from you before I do pursue this further.

[Miss Stranger]

Aww you. I really have to ask post-game what's so glaringly newbie about me. But then again, I've honestly played 3 short games of forum mafia.

[Feel It]

Okay, everyone is either complaining about my walls o'text or about other people's "active lurking", so what is like, actually expected from me? -_-

The game's hit a bit of a standstill, half the players are gone and I can't tell which ones aren't posting due to being busy and which ones are trying to keep a low profile.

With that being said VOTE: Antagon he's been the most useless player so far, so even if he was lynched and flipped town it would be an inactive townie and would narrow our suspects.

[Vel-Rahn Koon]

Vote Count 1.5

James May - 1 (Antagon)
Miss Stranger - 1 (Gen_Wolf)
Gen_Wolf - 1(Nachomamma8)
Nachomamma8 - 2 (Fegelein, champinoman)
Antagon - 3 (Miss Stranger, James May, Feel It)

Not Voting - 1 (Generic)

5 to Lynch.

Deadline is in (expired on 2013-06-30 08:00:00)

.

[Generic]

Wow, one hell of a spread. Antagon I had a town read on early, can someone summarise the case against him please? Just a short reason.

[Miss Stranger]

This:

Wagons in RVS are good. Why do you think Gen_Wolf is scum? Why do you think Fegelein is town? By backseat scumhunting he meant this post. Sorry, I overlooked that other post, but it was pretty much self-explanatory. Why do you think this is town frustration and not scum frustration? Fegelein uses IIoA - scummy - but I'm not voting him because of that.

And this:

Spoiler: James May and Gen_Wolf

James May:

Feg, I'm trying to be a bit more cautious this time because the last game i played I jumped the gun on a lynch that costed me the game >_> (was town that game btw) and I don't have solid reads on anyone but the questions was merely out of curiosity to see their reasoning. Better to survey the area from afar (well for me at least since I am trying to stop jumping the bullet for long phases like this :/ Use to playing 48-96 hour day phases and it requires a bit of on your feet kind of thing...)

So people can vote me for not having reads, but James May is immune because he says he had no reads?

Guess I can give out my reads on those who I have a slight feeling on, skimming through this because I have finals on two of my classes this week so I do apologize for not being active.

Miss Stranger: Aside from that minor derp up on the editing part, it seems like your leaning towards town atm, but I feel like you're being insistent on starting a wagon on gen wolf (although I may not be as experienced in this sort of scumreading/hunting as most people here) but we'll see how gen wolf goes on from this point.

Is that a problem? Both town and scum tunnel. Does wanting to start a wagon on Gen_Wolf automatically make her town?

Nacho: Aside from the "backseat scumhunting" that Fegelin pointed out, I can't point out exactly where to place you in atm, leaning slightly towards town maybe.

What do you think about Fegelein's comments that he hasn't

actually

scumhunt but is only asking questions?

Generic: So far providing interesting analysis upon other players on his first few posts, it looks like he's town at the moment but who knows, he could be playing a good scum cover-up, we'll see how it goes from there, as I haven't seen how his playstyle is, might look into previous games to find a good meta on him unless if its his first.

Why do you seem overly paranoid? It's very hard to fake scumhunting, so therefore providing logical analysis is more likely to be town. Anyone who acts town could be, according to your read on Generic, extremely good scum.

Gen wolf: Heh. Nice sarcastic remark in regards to simply lynching Miss Stranger. Not sure where Feel It (Was it Feel It? Might need to look through it again, but I think it was Feel It. if not was was Feglin) is going on with champin "buddying" you just for the compliment on that remark but i see little to no association with buddying/white knighting involving with that little agreement.

So what read did that give you? All you did was say that you thought that Gen_Wolf was not buddying championman. That "read" just seems like a paragraph to say that Gen_Wolf didn't buddy anyone.

James May:

he made an odd waltz-in in the middle of the game and got immediately picked on this line: "I'm trying to be a bit more cautious this time", pointed as a heavy scumtell by Fegelein and Champ and apparently Feel It. Afraid to jump to conclusions because last game he was wrong and lost (isn't that what happens everytime when town loses?). He currently has no scumreads on anyone and plans on relying on meta once he has more time. Why meta and not the current game? (I admit I use meta a little, but only to see if a certain Mr. Busy is really busy or just bluffing). I think his cautiousness is more about the (newbie / just-hammered-bad-and-still-sore?) fear of lynching the wrong person rather than fear of getting more involved, and I currently don't think he's as scummy as people make him seem to be. He admits to being busy, but did a little bit of reads, which IMO speaks more good than bad about him and I'm interested to see what more he has to say once he finishes his finals. What I personally don't like is the fact I notice a very subtle reliance on my trust in him and that in post

141

he explained his reads on everybody except on me. It makes me uncomfortable and I feel at a future point he might try to talk me into/lean on me for defence should he become more heavily suspected. For now I'd say he's more likely town than scum, but can easily go the other way around.

Reason why I'm relying on meta is to get a general idea of everyone that's playing in this game, of course I'm looking into the nulls since I'm uncertain on how their town/scum gameplays are since for me just basing it on the first phase of this game doesn't suffice enough to get solid reads. But once it gets onto the later phases (mainly after Day 2) I can get better info on the players in this current game rather than relying on past games. Luckily, today's my last final so I'll be able to have a bit more free time afterward (still gotta finish up two more classes, yay for summer terms being ridiculously wonky @_@). Also, on post 141, I was more inclined on explaining the players in the null area (with the exception of Generic) and to be quite honest, I haven't spotted on anything really suspecting about you so far in this game.

So you're saying that meta is the main way for you to get solid reads on Day 1?

Gen_Wolf:

Why bother with day 1. Lets just lynch Miss Stranger now and go from there? We are already onto our first scum.

Yeah...um...no.

I hope you realize I wasn't being serious?

I don't see how changing votes in RVS is scummy in any way. Ignoring my obvious joke vote on Gen_Wolf, I simply voted Antagon for starting a wagon on someone who's afk. I don't see how a wagon on an afk person would make them less afk. Game's just started. Sheesh.

And yes, I simply forgot to add my VOTE: tag in my previous post. I thought I could edit instead of doublepost, but apparently I can't. Apologies, rookie mistake. But tell me, Gen_Wolf, what could I possibly hide in my single, straightforward sentence that I would want to edit away? Just asking for your opinion as to why you think is scummy.

Feel It, same question to you. What's exactly wrong with changing an obvious joke vote, during RVS at that, that would make YOU switch vote?

Its a reaction test and it also allows RVS to come to an end. I don't like RVS, the longer it lasts the more crap that gets posted then it gets over analysed. By me changing my vote so early and raising an issue over something as stupid as you editing it allows for you to answer to it and it also gets the game out of RVS by creating suspicions such as the ones we have now.

Why bother with day 1. Lets just lynch Miss Stranger now and go from there? We are already onto our first scum.

Lynching anybody this early would be silly, we need to poke and prod and talk and get reactions, see who seems scummiest before making a decision. Not sure if I should give you benefit of the doubt due to your newness or change my vote now tbh.

Feel it, thank you for the explanation I do understand. I did not really intend to lynch Miss Stranger this early. Firstly, I did it for the reaction to see how she responded. Secondly, I did it to end RVS which I think I achieved.

VOTE: UNVOTE

I suppose you're right. While your behavior and reaction was odd, it's not as alarming as Gene_Wolf suggesting to lynch you already.

Answered above. Don't want to lynch her.

Town points for trying to end RVS. Jumping on him for that obviously non-serious post will not make you look town.

She's fine at L-2.

Antagon is probably Town.

Agreed, Miss Strangers' wish to edit posts, changing votes on a joke bw could be newness or perhaps an early scumtell?

Her wish to edit posts is probably based on the site she comes from which allows that sort of thing.
Changing votes from a joke bandwagon to a serious one is always a good move.

No point in making specific thoughts on comments made at this stage as most will say it was a joke. Best to include it with anything later when it truly begins to matter.

Why are you so worried with how others will perceive you? If it's not a joke, then it will help us get into that stage where things WILL start to matter.

Vote: Generic

I never said I was worried with how people perceive me? I explained why I did it. Why you putting words in my mouth?

Don't like this post from Nacho. Generic's 30 didn't suggest that he was worried about people perceiving him badly. It's just that reads on people during RVS could just be shrugged off as "It's just RVS."

Are you serious? I'm one the more involved posters so far, and retorting my scum claim with an accusation against me only makes you look even worse, look how quickly and desperate you latched on to champinoman backing you up before you accuse me of buddying.

Yes I am very serious. Just because you have more posts does not make you more involved. It could just mean your posting more fluff. And yes, why thank you for making me look good as I did not latch on to Champinoman, he agreed with my post and liked it. Is that a scum tell now?

@Feel It: Please show me where I have "desperately latched on to champinoman"?

Feel It seems slightly overeager to call out Gen_Wolf for his buddying.
Gen_Wolf

was not buddying championman.

Buddying him would involve calling championman town for making that post in the first place.

(snip)

The only thing I ask that as townie players please do not lynch me anytime soon. We have 12 days to lynch someone. Within those 12 days if you still feel the need to lynch me that is mellow but at least take the other 12 days for scum to talk there way into trouble.

(snip)

People jumped on Gen_Wolf for his "fatalistic attitude," but this portion is not alignment-indicative at all. It's not "Please don't lynch me," but "Please don't

quicklynch

me." It's highly detrimental for town to lynch someone when there is still time for discussion, but his comment is null because both town and scum can easily post something like this.

So, reads.
TOWN:
Gen_Wolf

NULL/LEANING TOWN:

NULL:
Everyone else.

NULL/LEANING SCUM:
Fegelein
James May

SCUM:

Summarises his entire activity. That and the fact his posts have been odd and superficial throughout the game, and he's only responded whenever his name was mentioned. I'm not sure if he's scum, busy, or uninvolved, but it's ... suspicious.

[Feel It]

Wow, one hell of a spread. Antagon I had a town read on early, can someone summarise the case against him please? Just a short reason.

Selective reading, backseat scumhunting, lurking etc.

[Nachomamma8]

I was a bit weary of Champ buddying up a bit

I wouldn't have guessed that based on your reaction.

I think to center a game around this one post, made on day 1 is silly. I don't feel that there is much of a case against me but rather a few opportunists. They speak of how I didn't respond well under pressure yet I was frustrated by how they failed to see the joke in it all.

You talk about how you don't think how the entire game is being centered around one post, but it really isn't. If you don't want to be in the spotlight, maybe comment on different things that you've been noticing, hmm?

So people can vote me for not having reads, but James May is immune because he says he had no reads?

No one is immune, but you acting like someone is immune is a bit strange.

What do you think about Fegelein's comments that he hasn't actually scumhunt but is only asking questions?

Mmm, this didn't click for me before. James May, you agree with Fegelein about me being a backseat scumhunter?

Don't like this post from Nacho. Generic's 30 didn't suggest that he was worried about people perceiving him badly. It's just that reads on people during RVS could just be shrugged off as "It's just RVS."

It could be interpreted two ways, yes. I was interested in pressing him on the latter.

Okay, everyone is either complaining about my walls o'text or about other people's "active lurking", so what is like, actually expected from me? -_-

My advice to you would be just to post. I don't necessarily agree with VRK's assertion that you're a particularly egregious waller; everyone has their playstyles, and we just happened to roll a very wall-happy group in this newbie section. You need to be careful that you're not overwhelming people and they aren't just ignoring your walls, and you need to be able to back away from wall-battles so you don't cause huge distractions, but you're perfectly fine for now.

especially at James' comments towards Nacho I wouldn't be surprised if you are onto something.

Explain.

but I will be asking nachomamma to respond to me and explain why his strong aggressive analysis has been lacking so far here.

It's page 8.

[Antagon]

Antagon, am I leaning scum just because of IIoA.

Only partially and partially because I'm not done reading ISOs yet. As I read more, you'll have a more solid place on my reads list.

[Generic]

Strange how when I point out meta nacho mamma starts to analyse things.

The antagon case is well summarised there by miss stranger.
I am choosing between a gut vote on nacho a d a head vote on antagon.

[Feel It]

Site lives on!

[Miss Stranger]

We can get 2 days extension if needed right?

You have 6+ days left, so no. If you can't make a decision in a week another two days isn't going to do anything, crash or no.


-Vel

[champinoman]

Did we lose anything?

And I apologise for the site breaking. This is my 2nd game on this site and the first game was early last year when the site broke for 3 weeks. I think it's me...

[Miss Stranger]

3-4 posts or so.

[Feel It]

Did we lose anything?

And I apologise for the site breaking. This is my 2nd game on this site and the first game was early last year when the site broke for 3 weeks. I think it's me...

I made a post saying not to hammer Antagon without giving intent that was lost, not sure if there were more.

[Generic]

I shall hold off my vote on antagon since he is at L-2. Does he want to claim at this stage cos my vote is currently earmarked for him.

[Miss Stranger]

Aw, the post where Generic voted Antagon is also gone. Anyway, I had pointed out how in his latest post Nachomamma asks James a question but only James. In the same post he quotes champ who accuses him of a link with James. I don't understand.

[Feel It]

Aw, the post where Generic voted Antagon is also gone.

Eager to get rid of him?

[Miss Stranger]

No, that was in response to your mentioning the hammer vote. Since the vote is gone, no hammer.

[Antagon]

I shall hold off my vote on antagon since he is at L-2. Does he want to claim at this stage cos my vote is currently earmarked for him.

I will only claim if intent is stated.
Nobody should hammer without claiming intent.